SUPREME COURT REJECTS SCHOOL DIVERSITY PLANS

[DeepModem Mom]

LAT/AP: Supreme Court Rejects School Race Plans
By MARK SHERMAN, Associated Press Writer
7:27 AM PDT, June 28, 2007

WASHINGTON -- The Supreme Court on Thursday rejected school diversity plans that take account of students' race in two major public school districts.

The decision in cases affecting schools in Louisville, Ky., and Seattle could imperil similar plans in hundreds of districts nationwide, and it leaves public school systems with a limited arsenal to maintain racial diversity.

The court split, 5-4, with Chief Justice John Roberts announcing the court's judgment. Justice Stephen Breyer wrote a dissent that was joined by the court's other three liberals.

Justice Anthony Kennedy wrote a concurring opinion in which he said race may be a component of school district plans designed to achieve diversity.

But he agreed with Roberts that the plans in Louisville and Seattle went too far.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/wire/ats-ap_top13jun28,0,1951478.story?coll=la-ap-topnews-headlines

[aquart]

1. Justice Kennedy knows he'll burn in hell no matter what for 2000.

So it really doesn't matter what he does now.

[ourbluenation]

2. this is such an unfortunate development. what a shame. n/t

[Solo_in_MD]

5. I'd like to read Kennedy's reasoning before I come to that conclusion

[ClintonTyree]

3. 5-4......

Gee, it seems like every decision is coming down the Republicans' way in a 5-4 decision. Sure glad the Dems kept their powder dry. :grr: They gave away the entire Judicial system by doing so.

[global1]

4. The Effects Of *Co Will Be Felt Long After *Co Is Gone.........nt

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

6. I feel so sick. I am crying.

:cry: This is such an aweful decision,...I just can't believe it!! :cry:

[Raskolnik]

11. I'm just reading the opinion now, but what do you think the Court got wrong here?

Frankly, I was a little surprised this case ended up being 5-4.

[RaleighNCDUer]

7. Now, to get to the job of reversing Brown vs Board of Education. nt

[Bill McBlueState]

28. that's starting to seem like their next step

This five-vote majority seems to have an understanding of race that went out of style 50 years ago.

...I suppose that's a polite way of saying they're racist...

[BurtWorm]

8. All these horrible rulings are on Kennedy's head.

:insert smiley yelling BOO! and throwing rotten tomatoes:

[BurtWorm]

9. Ooops

:blush:

Double post.

[deminks]

10. Racism Wins! Aren't you proud of Amerika now? You who voted for Bush. Live with this.

/sarcasm off. Between this and the immigration bill soundly defeated 'cause Smirky called it amnesty the other day, I am so ashamed of this country. Ashamed. For many other reasons, but also for this affirmation of racism. A continuation of what was done to New Orleans.

[cgrindley]

12. Good

it was a good decision. As a parent, I live in the neighborhood I live in so that I can send my children to the school of my choice. If some pinhead wanted to bus my child to some other school based on the color of our skin, I'd have no choice but to pay good money for an expensive private school. Racism in all of its guises is always wrong.

[TnDem]

14. Exactly right.....

I agree with you 100%. It appears to me to be a good decision as well.

Choice is always better than no choice whether it's a liberal or conservative issue.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

21. OMG!!! "CHOICE"?????!!!! Have you forgotten the shit that was happening,...

,...just thirty some years ago???!

OMG!!!

I can not believe ANY ONE would dismiss this decision as 'no big deal' or affirmative action activities as some kind of imposition upon "choice" when affirmative action IS ALL ABOUT "CHOICE",...a choice that nefarious people will now take away: THE CHOICE OF LIVING IN A COUNTRY THAT LIVES UNDER ONE LAW FOR ALL PEOPLE, A COUNTRY THAT OFFERS OPPORTUNITY FOR A-L-L!!

That "choice" isn't available if the nation doesn't offer it WHICH WAS THE CASE JUST THIRTY SOME YEARS AGO,...AND IS STILL THE CASE TO THIS DAY.

The RW is winning its war AGAINST the thoughts and ideals of the American people. I just can't believe it. It's like living in 1930's Germany,...except worse because I KNOW this corporate-totalitarian regime is making my people 'patsies' for power AGAINST democracy.

:cry:

OMG!!!!

[cgrindley]

24. That didn't make any sense

what's your argument?

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

27. What part didn't you understand? The part about a nation must PROVIDE opportunity for those who,...

,...HAVE NO "CHOICE"? Is that the part you don't understand?

Let me know. Let's be sure to include FACTS about people existing in UNEQUAL POSITIONS of opportunity and work from there.

[cgrindley]

34. That still doesn't make any sense

I honestly don't know what you're arguing. Could you try without all caps? I'm not following.

[ProudDad]

46. cgrindley "I'm not following"

I'm not surprised...

[mondo joe]

26. A different perspective: I advocate a strong emphasis on diversity,

but by incentivizing it and giving families both encouragement and support to integraet.

I don't like seeing any kids being told they CAN'T go to the school in their own neighborhood, which I consider an undue hardship on the child as well as a disincentive for parental involvement.

Creating new oppotrunities that encourage more integrated schools, and providing support to use them, is my preference.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

29. Again,...the issue of FINANCIAL RESOURCES is separate from affirmative action.

If the decision were merely about financial resources that would be completely different.

IT WASN'T. The decision DIRECTLY IMPACTED AFFIRMATIVE ACTION and I am so angry and so goddamned sad,...

:cry:

,...that people are being so gullible as to confuse the real life problems with budgetary constraints rather than acknowledging that this decision effectively DECONSTRUCTS one of the most important decisions EVER RENDERED in this country AFTER SO MANY PEOPLE SACRIFICED THEIR VERY LIVES to promote an equal nation,...EQUAL NATION.

If you don't see it coming, Joe,...there is going to be a great deal of activity by people who HAVE HATED DIVERSITY OR EQUALITY. If you haven't acknowledged it, yet, there has been a battle against every social development towards a truer democratic nation for the last forty years.

I am just warning you that,...this is a humongous step backwards. Sadly. I just can't believe it actually occurred in my lifetime,..and people are blowing this decision off as if it's,...no big deal. IT IS A BIG DAMN DEAL!!!

WTF is wrong with people's center of reason, these days?

[mondo joe]

30. Possible abuse of a fair decision does not invalidate a fair decision.

I don't believe in denying kids access to their community schools. I do believe in creating access for people who want other choices.

I don't think forcing a 12 year old to bus around for an hour to and from school creates a more democratic society.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

32. I guess you didn't know: kids all over this country have to do that bus trip because,...

,...schools have HAD to shut down for the option of a 'central' school due to economic issues. It's not like,...an isolated event,...having to be bussed an hour or more. Kids are bussed an hour or more all over the country. AND, THAT IS THE POINT!!!

You seem to be avoiding the issue of money. This Court ruled against affirmative action and never addressed the issue of MONEY,...AFFLUENCE!

I just do not understand what part of the foregoing you can't understand.

[mondo joe]

33. And kids shouldn't have to be bussed around for hours a day to get

to and from school. What don't YOU understand about that?

There were kids denied access to nearby schools because they were the wrong color.

[cgrindley]

35. Hear hear

I'll just quote your words:

"There were kids denied access to nearby schools because they were the wrong color."

It doesn't get any more simple than that.

[ProudDad]

47. Ah

"There were kids denied access to nearby schools because they were the wrong color."

So in your world this is ok if the kids are black but when it passed that a few of them were white then WOAH!!!

[cgrindley]

48. You misunderstand

It is always wrong to deny anyone access to anything based on color. Always.

I have no problem with affirmative programs, but only where they give the disadvantaged a leg up, and never where such programs push anyone else down.

[mondo joe]

49. No, it's NOT okay if the kids are black. I think it's a terrible decision on the part of the court.

I don't think anyone should be denied access to schools in their neighborhood because of race.

I also think - as I've said elsewhere in this thread - that racial diversity is an important goal. I believe it is in the interest of the state, and the state should have the authority to encourage and support diversity.

I think the Seattle situation was a bad one - but this decision was the only way to address it.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

31. Please, do not take my question as personal rather than an inquiry into your experience.

How old are you? Did you live in a segregated school during the 70's?

I'm not asking to challenge your intellectual skills. Just wondering if you experienced a racially divided nation in your life.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

16. Unfortunately...

there's all sorts of people out there who move out of a neighborhood because there are minorities moving in, or would send their kids to a private school to avoid sending them to a predominately minority school.

Fucking segregationists.

[mondo joe]

17. Yeah, but this was a very poor system - per the Seattle PI:

In schools that were considered "racially imbalanced," preference was given to students who would bring the school closer to the district-wide ratio of whites to nonwhites, 40 percent to 60 percent. It helped whites get into predominantly minority schools, and vice versa.

The parents group noted that under the Seattle School District's program, a school that was 25 percent white, 25 percent black, 25 percent Asian and 25 percent Hispanic would be considered racially imbalanced.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/6420AP_WA_Schools_Race_Seattle.html

[cgrindley]

19. I judge schools by test scores

that's all I care about in a school. I don't care about extra curricular programs. I don't care about the scenic beauty of facilities. I don't care about the quality of their kitchen. And I certainly don't care about the color of any student's skin. None of that shit is important. It's all about test scores and grades.

I don't give a shit if the school is in a white neighborhood, a black neighborhood or what the fuck. Presently, I'm really really happy in that the local elementary school is an excellent one and it's only two blocks away from our house. We live in a zip code with only a few sex offenders (and only 3 low level offenders within a one mile radius). We have a low crime rate and so on. It's perfect. I don't give a shit who lives around me just as long as they keep quiet, keep their yards neat and clean, and try not to make anything worse.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. Tests scores is all you care about?

Yeesh.

[cgrindley]

22. Yep

A diverse student body, a winning fencing team, beautiful grounds, an active PTA, regular field trips, a volunteer program, excellent driver's ed... none of that will get a child into a good college. Test scores and grades, on the other hand...

[IndyJones]

39. Amen to that. We had to move to get out of a bad school district

so if after moving we were told my kids would be bussed to fill some racial quotas, I'd be pissed. And I would not allow my kids to be bussed.

[ProudDad]

50. I heard stuff exactly like that in the Jim Crow South.

I knew that shit was still around but it's startling to see it posted on DU...

You haven't a clue about the true nature and pervasiveness of racism in the U.S.

You also haven't a fucking clue about what the REAL GOAL of a school in a Democracy is. The training centers you describe would fit much better in a totalitarian dictatorship than a democracy -- oh, yeah, that's what the U.S. is heading for thanks to the repukes and attitudes like you are displaying.

"Extra curricular" programs in the school in a Democracy are MORE IMPORTANT than your precious test scores. Getting to know people from various other ethnic groups and cultures is MORE IMPORTANT than your precious test scores. Learning to Learn is much more important than your precious test scores. Music, Art, Physical activity and social interactions are much more the purpose of school than your precious test scores.

But just crawl back into your little hole and pull the top up over it to block out the rest of the world.

Ignorance is bliss, I guess.

[cgrindley]

57. In all free countries, the goals of education are the same

To produce an educated and informed citizenry who can fully participate in a nation's democratic institutions, perform in its economy, and provide service to everything from a local neighborhood to the planet as a whole. Ideally, these citizens should be equiped with the skills they require for a lifetime of learning and be taught be importance of sound progressive values.

There is nothing more important to this process than quantifiable academic achievement. Music, Art, Physical Education... these are legitimate academic subjects and should be treated as such. They are also easy to evaluate and have a rich history of being taught and evaluated.

I agree with you that getting to know people from various other ethnic groups and cultures is valuable but is only one small component of good quality general education. Ideally, that skill too should be contained within an academic field, perhaps through courses on world history, comparative religions, cultural anthropology and so on.

Telling kids what schools they can attend based on the color of their skins doesn't help any of this.

And non-academic extra curricular programs are not going to get anyone into a quality university. Sure they might tip the balance when a student has a straight A average and a perfect SAT and is fighting others with similar backgrounds for a full scholarship to an Ivy League school, but grades and exam scores will also be the most important considerations.

[mondo joe]

18. I knew one of the families that was among the original complaintants.

Her daughter was denied the schools in her neighborhood and was going to have to do an hour commute every morning to go to a school in a different neighborhood.

The mom in this family didn't want her daughter having to take a long commute out and in every day. And since she herself didn't drive, she knew having a far away school would make it a lot harder for her to be involved.

[ProudDad]

51. For nearly all of my elementary school years

and my high school years I took a bus to school.

But since I am white and was lucky enough to be born in the mid 1940s to lower middle class parents, the schools were excellent. They were designed to teach kids how to learn not how to take standardized tests. There were ample extracurricular activities to develop the whole person. They weren't yet factories to train kids how to memorize and regurgitate the state's boiler plate idea of what EVERYONE MUST LEARN to do well at their little McJobs. When it came time to go to college the WHOLE me was evaluated not just my "grades" -- so I got in and got on the Dean's List.

Of course, this was during the ascendancy of the middle class -- no expense was spared when it came to funding (white) schools.

I was also VERY lucky because I lived for 3 years in Hawai'i. I went to Junior High School there. Unlike a white kid in nearly all of the rest of segregated Amerika, I had the opportunity to spend some time at a school where I was in the racial minority. The most important lesson I learned was that the White World was a shallow sham, that the racism I was immersed in (and couldn't accept) in the Deep South (and from many of the other military brats) WAS bullshit and that there were some good and some not so good folks and that skin color had little to do with it.

It's that last opportunity that is being denied kids of ALL ethnic backgrounds in the re-segregated Amerika...

That's pretty fucking sad...

[cgrindley]

59. The grades thing

Look, the world has changed drastically since you were a child. Nowadays, you aren't going to amount to anything without a college education that probably includes the letters BA, MA after your name. Grades and tests are essential. Scores are what counts. Of course, if you're looking to blame a generation for this situation, I know who you can blame.

[mediawatch]

44. I was part of bussing in Boston

Took Kennedy over 20 years to admit his plan failed. We at one time had our neighborhood schools that we attended. The commonwealth decided we needed diversity. This was in the early 70s. Those who could leave Boston and surrounding citys like cambridge moved out to the suburbs. Others who stayed grew to hate. Lots of fights that never ended. I know I was there. Mind you the fighting and hate never stopped. No one wanted to travel to go to school and the numbers were off. You didn't have a 50 50 class room.
There was talk that bussing was going to hit the suburbs, so towns chose METCO. Metco came about in 1966
http://www.doe.mass.edu/metco/

That at least allowed those who lived in the town to attend their own schools and gave others an opportunity to go to these schools. Winchester, back in the 70s refused METCO, but took on a program called ABC (A better chance) This was where they housed minorities from the south, mostly, and gave them an education. I remember going over their house. It was huge and beautiful. There was no anger towards the ABC students at least not that I remember or was a part of. Then again I had had a taste of Boston so this was a piece of cake to me.

[ProudDad]

45. Ah, You're a worthy successor to Jim Crow

Of course the fact that 500 years of slavery followed by segregation and brutal economic and racial discrimination being perpetuated right up to the present moment should have any bearing on the question I suppose.

Ah, but that was all fixed up in the last 40 years in your world??? No further remedies needed...

Well, it appears that with this court your right to reestablish segregation as it was in the glorious days before Brown is being restored.

[cgrindley]

58. What?

Where do you get this 500 years of slavery figure from? As far as I can tell, slavery in the American colonies started sometime in the first half of the 17th century and ended in 1865, making for about 220 years of slavery in all. Of course, some states such as Rhode Island never had slavery.

and it would be great if you could explain why stopping a black child from attending a school is somehow different than stopping a white child from attending a school because in my opinion, discrimination is discrimination.

[Aptastik]

13. If I remember my Con. Law. class correctly

Kennedys opinion means that race can still be used as a factor in determining school diversity, just not in the cases of these particular schools. Whoevers opinion is the closest to the middle and concurring with the majority gets the decision.

It seems to me that what was the "O'Connor Court" has become the "Kennedy Court".

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

23. It is the "Roberts Court". IT IS THE "ROBERTS COURT".

The "Roberts Court" just imposed DECONSTRUCTION upon one of the most impactful decisions in our nation.

DECONSTRUCTION. That's what those 'federalists' want is deconstruction of the last century of progress towards a REAL democratic institution. That is what they are getting. They are getting back the days of the robber freakin barrons.

[YvonneCa]

15. Incrementalism...

...to undo Brown...Roe...etc. A sad day.

[pscot]

25. The Seattle Plan was an incredibly wrongheaded boondogle

It cost a fortune and actually increased racial separation by fueling white flight to the suburbs. As the number of white kids declined, the idea of what constituted racial balance became increasingly convoluted and mendacious. Basically the district kept redefining integration down until it matched the mess they had created. The whole thing was perpetuated by self-serving bureaucrats whose jobs depended on the system. I'm sure they meant well, but they got it hopelessly wrong.

[IndyJones]

40. Of course that is what would happen.

[ProudDad]

52. Racism fuels white flight

That's why the Seattle school district would have been doomed no matter what they tried.

Racism makes the U.S. go round.

Racism is a useful tool of your capitalist masters -- as is obvious by some posts on this thread, they use it well.

Racism is the reason why "black schools" don't get shit for funding and "white schools" can raise extra money from their student's more affluent parents.

[mondo joe]

54. But the Seattle system WAS very problematic.

In addition to being unduly burdensome, it didn't even properly address diversity. It broke all students into 2 categories - white and non white.

If you had a school that was 60% white and 40% Asian, it would have passed.

Even worse, as I understand it, if you had a school that was 25% white, black, asian and latino it wouldn't have passed because it would have been the wrong ration.

[ProudDad]

56. It probably was...

Until the FACTS of institutionalized racism and economic injustice are recognized and vigorously opposed by a critical mass of the population (which I don't expect to see in my lifetime, certainly NOT in the belly of the beast - the Amerikan Empire) any attempt by well meaning people to right the wrongs of the previous centuries will be nothing more than a band aid on the festering wound.

[aikoaiko]

36. It only rejected a specific plan -- not diversity goals or using race as an admission factor.

Fortunately.

[moondust]

37. The Nader court does it again.

Thanks Ralph. :puke:

[ProudDad]

53. My God, You're Right

Nader invented Racism.

Nader invented Slavery.

Nader invented Jim Crow.

Nader invented Barry Goldwater and Joseph Coors and the Pew Trust and Rush LimpBalls and Rupert Murdock.

Nader invented Sandra Day O'Conner - the swing vote in bush V Gore.

What a powerful guy that Nader is...

Wow!!!!

[mondo joe]

55. The "there's no difference between the parties" people can choke on this.

[ellisonz]

38. White America wins again.

:grr:

[Rex]

41. Hey, they fucked the whole thing up in 2000.

What the hell is unwinding a few centuries of law? Fuck, why not just toss it all aside and go back to a feudal system? Who needs law? Habeas Corpus Fuckus That.

[BlooInBloo]

42. (shrug) "Even" DUers don't believe in "black causes" - how can this be a surprise?

[ellisonz]

43. Fairness is not a black cause, it is THE American cause.

I'm white and I'm furious at the way White America treats "the Others."

;)

:kick: