Assistance from fellow DU'ers..i hope I am posting it in a right area =)

[Wiccan Warrior]

OK here it goes...............

I live on the western side of Michigan and my daughter lives near Detroit with my Ex-Wife, we get along fine btw, my daughter is 12 starting high school this year, graduating at 16 and wanting to start college than as well, and very adult and smart for her age. Recently after talking to her on the phone she informed me that a man next door (50yo) told her one day that when she turns 18 to come see him he would have something for her. Then on her birthday this year in May he gave her a birthday card with $50 in it. after hearing this I did a search and found out he is a two time convicted offender for indecent exposure. My Ex has already turned the card and the verbal conversation he had with my daughter over to the police. I called the police to find out what's being done and what they plan on doing, they told me we ill not and cannot talk about it. So I told them if that's the case I want you to know you are not the only one who is going to keep an eye on him, I may be across the state, but I do have friends in Detroit that will check by once and a while. They in turn told me not to go near him or talk to him about anything.

Now seriously any normal American would say ok I'll let the police handle it, well not me....bullheaded here..... I told them he has been convicted two times for indecent exposure and he has showed interest in my 12 yo daughter and she had to take down her pool in the backyard because when she would play in it he would be in his back yard commenting her on her dressing for that day while occasionally touching himself and I am not going to sit by and let this man build himself up every day with lust and temptation for my daughter accelerate until he can't control himself and he acts on his urges, their answer, don't worry about that we'll watch him.

After that I notified the Local F.B.I. Dept in Detroit and told them I don't trust the local police of that city she lives in to take care of it in due time and the F.B.I. took my information and the officer I spoke too and what city and he then gave me his name and his office and personal cell # to keep in touch and he said he would look into it that if anything else occurs to call him and not the locals.

Again after talking to him I called Granholms office and spoke to an Assistant to the Lt.Gov. and expressed my concern about the police in the area and that I turned to the F.B.I. for help and I was now pleading to the Gov. office to keep informed on the conduct of the "investigation" that is "taking place", she told me that I could give the names of all involved and to call back in a week.

Now heres the thing I might be going to spend time with my daughter in the next few months and if I see that so called man on his porch or outside I will so want to let him know..Dude you're being watched not only by PD and FBI and the Gov. office, but you have to worry more about me and leave my daughter alone. I just wanted to know what you're thought are about if I should confront him and how I can keep a cool head and not do it with all the adrenaline running through me and all my hatred that he did that to my daughter.

I appreciate any advice.

[virginia mountainman]

1. Their really is not too much you can do...

Besides teach your daughter to protect herself, and to be street smart. I have a daughter about the same age as yours, and we have a "offender" living up the road from us.

So we made her aware of him, and she knows what to do, even if we are no where to be found.

And most importantly, the offender KNOWS, that we (I am a very protective father) know about him....

[Wiccan Warrior]

3. Don't get me wrong about felons

I think they deserve another chance and if they carry on with their lives and not show any interest in what they did or what they were accused of that's great. But this man obviously does not want to stray from his path.

[Why Syzygy]

2. Your daughter

shouldn't accept any more gifts from him or talk to him any more. Why is a 12 y/o talking to a 50 y/o man anyway? Is your ex re-married? I don't blame you for being concerned about your daughter. But acting big mouth hero won't do her any good. Will it.

[Wiccan Warrior]

4. No she didn't re marry

in my post he lives next door and he approached her. Second I wasn't going to be a BIG MOUTH I was going to simply tell him I'm aware.

[Why Syzygy]

5. Okay.

That sounds reasonable. Let him know you know. But mentioning the agencies also watching him would put you in the big mouth category. See the difference? Don't show your hand, dude.

[Wiccan Warrior]

8. Good enough...

[virginia mountainman]

11. Your comments about the police are spot on..

They tend to only show up, with plastic bags, report forms, and chalk...

If I where you, I would encourage your ex-wife to take proven effective measures....to insure their safety. Remember, the police are RE-active, be PRO-active

[windbreeze]

67. Karate lessons for the kid...

so that she is capable of protecting herself from him at any time, starting now..and don't tell him what agencies you have contacted...he's a felon..and chances are he will know you've talked to someone, if you talk to him, so don't confirm it...he also knows what he isn't supposed to do...but it seems as though he is choosing to forget...so have someone teach that kid how to protect herself...she is 12...he ain't waiting until she's 18...that takes the fun out of it, for him...sex offenders are just that...and someone of age, doesn't feed into what they get a thrill out of...jmo....talk to her mother asap, so she doesn't leave that kid there at home alone at any time...
wb

[windbreeze]

68. ok, forget the karate lessons....

sorry she has a disability...but so does he...teach her how to fire a weapon...if that is possible...a shotgun should make a believer out of him...or plaster his face/name/history on every telephone pole, fence, anything standing still...in the neighborhood...make his life miserable too...out here they have to publish it in the paper...and notify the public what their physical address is...you are right to be concerned...I hope the child's mother is on the ball too...
wb...

[Wiccan Warrior]

69. My ex isn't that stupid to leave her alone =)

and I want him to know the FBI, Locals and the GOV office ARE aware of him it will make him think twice..

[LoZoccolo]

6. This is not a slam on you, but I think the reason they are not telling you anything...

...is that over the phone they have no way of confirming that you are the father. So think of it as them protecting your daughter even further.

[Wiccan Warrior]

12. I should have told you LOL my bad

when I was living in that area I got to know the officers in the force really well they knew it was me hahaha Trust me. I know half the force by name.

[madokie]

7. probably not the right thing to do but I'd whip his fuching ass and love doing it

up one side of the street and down the other. simple as that, no questions asked.

[madrchsod]

9. do not confront him.

how far does he live from a school or playground? what restrictions does he have? check with the local disrict attorneys`s office division that deals with sex offenders. the local cops really can`t do anything unless someone files a complaint and usually that would come from the da`s office. find out if he can even live where he is...
did you check the michigan data base on offenders? his name, cases, and restrictions should be in it

[Wiccan Warrior]

13. Yes I have

I checked everything I am very educated in Michigan Law and took every avenue in that area, he has no restrictions as well I spoke to the Dept of corrections about him as well.

[madrchsod]

21. that sucks....

he`s going to get caught again...these guys never learn

[madokie]

32. as I said earlier whip his ass and do it good and let him know that you'll come back again and again

if thats what it takes. piss on the he'll get caught again argument. I think we all know someone who preys on our children will continue to do so until they are stopped so stop him now. is my advice

[wakeme2008]

10. Cleaning guns out by the pool one day with your daugher in it probably

would get the point across :)

The main thing is your daughter and ex know about this guy.

[virginia mountainman]

16. EXACTLY....

Make the costs of a "thrill" to high for him to even consider....

Since the state of Michigan evidently thinks he is "safe", and wont "lock him up and throw away the key" at least make him go look for "easier pickings"

As horrid as that sounded, at least your daughter will be safer because of it.

[Saturday]

14. Your DD should not be accepting gifts from him. Period.

IMO it encourages him. She needs to be taught defensive measures against all those who would harm her too.

[Wiccan Warrior]

15. I should teach her to use a .45.........sarcasm there... n/t

[virginia mountainman]

18. Actually...

An 1911 .45 is part of my daughter's protection..

She has used it since she was strong enough to work the slide, and she is a deft shot with it.

Sadly, there will be a day, when I, her father and mother, will NOT be their to protect her, she needs to know how to protect herself.

If I don't teach her how to keep herself alive, I have failed as a parent.

[Wiccan Warrior]

20. I just hope that

the FBI, Locals, and the Gov. office knows I am serious about this man at least the FBI took it more seriously enough to give me his personal cell #.

[virginia mountainman]

22. That is a good sign.

I really hope this works out for the best, as I said before I know the worry your going thru.

[Warpy]

17. At least you know who the creep is

because the most dangerous offenders out there are the ones who are pillars of the church, good family men, scout leaders and haven't been caught--yet.

Yes, do let your daughter know how to stay safe. 12 is awfully young to get to know the background fear that all women have to live with, and that's the part that's too bad, but learning how to be vigilant early will be an advantage for her.

In the meantime, if you can manage it, I suggest a spite fence, a privacy fence that is too high for the asshole to see over and certainly too high for him to strike up conversations with her. Tell your daughter that he is the one grownup she doesn't have to respect, obey, or even be polite to. If your wife doesn't have a dog, suggest she get a mid sized mutt from the pound.

Do talk to this creep. Knowing there is a father out there who knows what is going on and will rip off his balls and shove them down his throat if he does anything at all might cool his enthusiasm and send him back indoors for solitary wanking.

Your wife is doing all the right things, alerting the cops and keeping a paper trail going. The statistics are still on your daughter's side, though, and your daughter showed wonderful judgment in reporting this stuff to her mother immediately. She doesn't sound like an easy target and likely this creep will move on.

[Wiccan Warrior]

19. Moving on is what I'm afraid of to be honest...

I believe some offenders can be rehabilitated and never do it again, but obviously he was SWEPT into the cracks.

[Warpy]

35. Moving on can mean back to his stash of porn we really don't

want to know about combined with self abuse, or perhaps back to his old habit of weenie wagging in public, in which case he'll be off th street again.

In any case, the cops know this is one guy rehab never touched.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

24. Unfortunately I don't believe that 12 is too young. I have two sons and from the time

they started to walk home from the bus stop alone (aged 7) I started to make them aware of predators. It wasn't something I wanted to do, but knew it was a must.

[Evergreen Emerald]

23. I think you should back off and let them investigate.

Once the police finish their investigation, they will send the information to the prosecutor who will make a determination as to whether there is a crime sufficient for charging. It takes lots longer than you imagine.

I do not know how I would react if that happened to my daughter, likely I would be sleeping on the door of the police station, so I am not faulting you. But I do know that when families call and complain continuously, they are considered less credibile and trouble makers. Don't do that.

The behavior you described when your daughter was at the pool, is very concerning. If she has any other incidents like that, she should tell the police. Your daughter needs to stay a mile away from him. He is dangerous. In fact, I would consider getting a protection order keeping him away from contacting her and your wife in any way. He is grooming her. I would not want my daughter unsupervised around that area.

If your wife knows any neighbors who have had similar incidents, they should go to the police too. I would doubt that your daughter is the only one he is grooming.

I am so glad your daughter and her mom recognized the behavior for what it is. Good luck to you.

[Wiccan Warrior]

25. Yeah I am aware of how long it takes lol sadly

I worked in the court system as a Private investigator in that same area I just don't want him to have the time to burst a bubble so to speak.. and I did tell my daughter what to do. His house is REALLY close to hers I mean when I lived there and a friend of mine lived next door we could hand each other a cup of sugar to each other from the bedroom window. So she has thick curtains now and my Ex father in law installed privacy glass in the bathroom.

[Evergreen Emerald]

30. Good, so you know the drill!

I do think a protection order is not a bad idea. It would send him the message that you are on to him, and will be watching his behavior. It will also let him know that the police are watching. (A violation of the order would be a crime). Of course, because they live so close the terms might be difficult to outline.

[virginia mountainman]

26. Protective orders...

Are nothing more than pieces of paper....IF someone WANTS to commit a crime. A piece of paper will not stop them.

[Evergreen Emerald]

34. I know that is true

but in this case, he is not an angry stalker of domestic violence bent on attacking his ex. He is a sick man who is slowly grooming a 12 year old girl. He needs a wake up call. And the protection order will do that. And if he violates it, it will be a crime. At this point, the violation will likely be more grooming. He will then be in the system, in probation, and his behavior can be restricted a bit more to protect 12 year old girls in the neighborhood.

[malaise]

27. Enroll your daughter in a self defense class

for starters.

[Wiccan Warrior]

28. I would, but she has no joints in her elbows and

does not have full range of her arms.

[stellanoir]

29. Is your daughter the sort of girl that might be interested in some

martial arts training. . .?

Just a thought.

[Wiccan Warrior]

31. I would, but medical condition won't let her.. n/t

[stellanoir]

36. Ahhh okay.

I've taught this technique to much younger ones. . .

I tell 'em that they own the space at least a foot around their bodies. If anyone enters that space and they don't want the person that close to them they have full permission to scream at the top of their lungs "personal space invasion !!! personal space invasion !!! personal space invasion !!!"

The little ones not only enjoy being given full permission to scream but it also tends to give them a sense of autonomy.

Not sure a 12 year old would think that it's cool though.

Maybe just keep sending protection around her in your mind's eye along with all the rest of the things you're doing.

[Rosemary2205]

61. IMHO even more reason to teach her how to defend herself.

She'll need to learn several ways to work around her disability to try and protect herself -- even if that mean carrying mace and knowing how to use it.

I am in a wheelchair and while my ability to defend myself is severely limited, I don't feel completely powerless. I know how to scream my ass off, poke an eye out with my keys, confront someone before it gets out of control etc. Sometimes just showing you will defend yourself is enough but that takes practice.

[undeterred]

33. She's not too young to carry pepper spray

I'm 50 and I'm not comfortable carrying a gun, but pepper spray can be a mighty weapon...

[canetoad]

37. I think what I would be doing

given that he has already made an approach of sorts with the card and money, is letting him know that you are aware of his interest and his history.

Without being emotional, threatening, irrational, I would send a succinct registered letter stating that you have noted his actions (including watching through the fence), that you would like them to cease and that appropriate authorities have been alerted in case of a repeat of this behaviour. No need to go into any further detail at all. Be polite and distant. The whole letter need not be more than a paragraph or two. Do not say what you will or might do in the future, just set out what you have already done.

If you can strike the right tone without overt threats, is this likely to make him back off? I guess the point I'm making is to make damn sure he expects the full weight of the law comes down on him if he ever sets a foot wrong again.

[Wiccan Warrior]

38. If I did that

I would send a registered copy of the letter to the locals, FBI, and the Gov. office as well not a bad idea.

[canetoad]

40. Exactly

Paper trail, though I hope to hell you never need to use it.

I can't stress enough that it must be a concise statement of facts, nothing else. Maybe draft the letter, sit on it for a day or two, get someone else to look over it before sending.

[Wiccan Warrior]

41. Or post it on here for you all to view.. n./t

[canetoad]

46. If you decide on this

I'm sure there are plenty of folk here who can cast an eye over it.

[Wiccan Warrior]

47. Thanks n/t

[Wiccan Warrior]

44. cause once I send it out to everyone

it could be used to help convict and be used against him or if I word it wrong it could be used against me..

[canetoad]

48. Yep. I'm a great believer of words on paper

as both a record of events and a pro-active measure of prevention. As long as they can never come back to bite you on the bum.....
The last thing you need is a charge of making threats.

[Wiccan Warrior]

49. I'll post the letter for review in here once I'm done with it. n/t

[canetoad]

52. Dates and times would be good too.

for example date of the card and money, when he was observed watching through fence. All helps to show you are aware of what he is doing.

[marions ghost]

57. right if he writes this there should be

no inflammatory language & NO threats. Just tell him that the Dad and others are aware of this guy's suspicious behavior.

Others can read and give feedback, yes. And after this is sent, no need for immediate follow-up. No need for discussion. Just put it out there. Avoid confrontation.

[canetoad]

50. And make sure you mark on the letter

a list of who it is copied to, including Department, position etc. so each recipient knows who all the other recipients are.

[Wiccan Warrior]

51. Good Call CC:everything I would not have thought of it.. n/t

[Midlodemocrat]

39. Okay, what's wrong with your ex?

As a mom of an eleven year old, if some creep was in his backyard watching my daughter, I would pepper spray his fucking ass to hell and back.

Why isn't she complaining loud and long and rallying the neighbors? :wtf:

[Wiccan Warrior]

42. Near detroit neighbors

hear nothing, see nothing, know nothing.

[Midlodemocrat]

43. I bet their tunes would change markedly if they new he was a sexual offender.

[Wiccan Warrior]

45. You would think

but with a whore house next street over and a meth lab down the road I don't think they will care.

[virginia mountainman]

60. Yea People tend to frown upon that in their neighborhoods NT

[Midlodemocrat]

72. A guy in one of our local subdivisions is listed on the sex offender

website. He's an older guy, maybe late 60s. Raped his own daughters. Wife, mother of said daughters is still with him. :wtf:

Anyway, he moved into a neighborhood absolutely loaded with kids. We found out right away and he's essentially a pariah, no one even speaks to him.

But, :wtf: is wrong with wifey? I can't imagine staying with someone after they did that to my children.

[Wiccan Warrior]

73. Whatever floats you're boat I guess? n/t

[Wiccan Warrior]

53. First draft.....

Sir,

I am giving you this letter to let you know a few things about the little girl that lives next door to you, on the side you're driveway is not on, she has a father that is aware of you're actions toward her, giving her money on her birthday in May and telling her in her yard that when she turns 18 to come and see you, watching her in her pool in the backyard, and I am not very happy about it. I realize you probably enjoy you're freedom at this time being able to go outside and goto the store as well as goto the bathroom with the door shut, if you wish to keep these things and be able to sleep in a nice comfortable bed I suggest you leave her alone and keep to you're self cause you're actions have not gone unnoticed.

Thank you for you're time in reading this letter I pray you get better and consider yourself as well don't lose what you have right now, freedom, and give it up cause of an urge.



Signature
Date
CC:Federal Bureau of Investigations (Agent)
CC: (Local Police Dept. Name) (Investigating officer)
CC:Governor Granholm's Office Att:Lt. Governor
CC:Ex-Wifes Name

[canetoad]

54. Far too personal and emotional

I was thinking of something more like this:

To:
xxxxxx xxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear Mr.xxxxxxxx

On (Date), without solicitation, you gave a birthday card and $50 cash to XXXXXX XXXXXX, the daughter of your neighbour (wife's name) at (street address)and myself. On (date) you were seen to be observing her as she played in the back yard pool.

Your actions have been noted. I request that they cease immediately and that in future you observe the following:

1. No gifts, goods or money shall be given to (daughter)
2. Her privacy shall be observed at all times
3. You will not initiate any contact whatsoever between yourself and (daughters name)

A search of relevant authorities and databases has provided information about your previous convictions.

Yours faithfully,



(your name)

CC:
Your list here

[virginia mountainman]

55. I would make a SIGN out of it..and nail it too the fence...NT

[marions ghost]

58. yes this hits the right tone...

however I would get rid of the phrase, "her privacy shall be observed"....He's already proven himself to be an observer...and he does not understand the meaning of privacy.

I would say clearly "2. You will stay off the property."

[canetoad]

59. Correct

I'd missed the ambiguity.
Thanks

[Rosemary2205]

63. Very good. nt

[marions ghost]

56. yikes...my sympathies, WW dad...

yours is not an unusual story. OK here's some thoughts, for what they're worth.

Yes the guy is dangerous, and it would be better to overestimate that than underestimate it. By giving the daughter the $50 he is testing the reactions of both daughter and mother. No "nice guy" gives such unsolicited gifts to neighborhood kids. That alone would be enough to have me concerned even without the swimming pool voyeurism. So many people are gullible and allow this kind of thing to happen. That's what he was looking for, but he has already been thwarted in this approach. The line has been drawn and he knows it.

So now at this point, take a deep breath. Pat yourself on the back. You ARE doing everything you legally can to get attention to him. The restraining order may be an idea to explore--it won't stop a crime but it notifies him & others that you will use all the legal means available. Also do what you can to alert neighbors and that will further make you feel more in control. Safety in numbers. You & yours need some support from sympathetic people in the neighborhood to counter this negative entity in your midst. Other kids are at risk too, obviously. (It takes a village, y'know).

Finally, realize (accept and process) that your daughter is never absolutely safe unless she never leaves the house. You cannot have perfection in this. No parent can. Unfortunately we live in a world full of predators of all kinds. Get rid of the idea that YOU are personally responsible for creating a risk-free world for your daughter. She has to learn how to navigate in it. Already she's learned an important lesson about boundaries that all kids must learn. Take heart that your daughter is more savvy now. This loss of innocence & trust is a hard moment for all parents. Try to relax and not go into hypervigilance. Keep your blood pressure down.

When visiting I would TRY --and I know it would be very hard--not to confront this guy directly. I know I'd want to do that too. But it could backfire and you don't want to be seen as making trouble or taunting him. You don't want escalation. Of course if you witness anything even slightly suspicious again, expect the authorities to take immediate action. Without resorting to confrontation you can still give him a negative vibe. I agree with those who say to beef up the fence so that your daughter and friends can enjoy the pool. Maybe you could put up a copy of one of those neighborhood watch signs on the fence (the one with the watchful eye)--facing his house. Or put one of those bird-scare big eyes on the fence. Something symbolic. No need to brandish guns--he already knows you might have one. "Wiccan Warrior"-- you of all people should know how to psych this guy out without any more words being necessary. Above all, stay cool and calm. Determine to enjoy your visit and present a strong front--ie. "we're NOT afraid of you & we're going on with our lives"--attitude. This is the position of strength to convey to your daughter. I'm willing to bet that the guy already has the message about your daughter being off limits. It's others who are at risk now.

[supernova]

62. I don't have any advice

(no kids)

But you are a great Dad, WW. :hug:

[rug]

64. Is he on this list?

http://www.mipsor.state.mi.us/

[Wiccan Warrior]

70. Yes as I said in my Post I have went through everything

as a former PI and knowing 2 Fed Agents and half the police force and Granholms office is getting to know me real well....hehehehe

[AZBlue]

65. I would definitely talk to him.

You seem to be up on the law, so you'll know what you can and can't say without going over the line and not getting in trouble yourself. But, even just telling him you're aware of his attention to your daughter and you don't appreciate and think it's improper will hopefully scare him off. And, talk to your daughter too - unfortunately, these days 12 is not too young to gently hear about who to avoid.

[Catherine Vincent]

66. That is scary!

I would do the same thing you're doing. Keep an eye on that perv! And it's really sad the police can't do anything until something happens. That's just not right.

[Wiccan Warrior]

71. Yes right now the police and I have an understanding..

Since I'm not a stranger to the Law enforcement in that area Local and Federal they know I won't let go, they know I'm like a Pit that grabs on and won't let go till it is taken care of.. =)