WH CLAIMS FISA Legislation Is "Just Advisory" So-Doesn't Matter If Dems Are Wimps Or Not

[kpete]

The White House considers the legislation “just advisory,” so it doesn’t much matter whether or not lawmakers gave up too much authority to the president. Yes, The Dems were Wimps for giving Bush everything he wanted (fooled again) - but just as striking as the sloppy lawmaking was the administration's response.


...Bush administration officials have already signaled that, in their view, the president retains his constitutional authority to do whatever it takes to protect the country, regardless of any action Congress takes. At a tense meeting last week with lawyers from a range of private groups active in the wiretapping issue, senior Justice Department officials refused to commit the administration to adhering to the limits laid out in the new legislation and left open the possibility that the president could once again use what they have said in other instances is his constitutional authority to act outside the regulations set by Congress.

At the meeting, Bruce Fein, a Justice Department lawyer in the Reagan administration, along with other critics of the legislation, pressed Justice Department officials repeatedly for an assurance that the administration considered itself bound by the restrictions imposed by Congress. The Justice Department, led by Ken Wainstein, the assistant attorney general for national security, refused to do so, according to three participants in the meeting. That stance angered Mr. Fein and others. It sent the message, Mr. Fein said in an interview, that the new legislation, though it is already broadly worded, "is just advisory. The president can still do whatever he wants to do. They have not changed their position that the president's Article II powers trump any ability by Congress to regulate the collection of foreign intelligence."
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/19/washington/19fisa.html?pagewanted=2&ei=5090&en=2e7a7948ff52f9fe&ex=1345176000&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss

more at:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/024639.php

[Kagemusha]

1. Funny, the part that bothers everyone is collection of domestic intelligence

during the act of collecting "foreign" intelligence.

[AndyTiedye]

2. So It's Official Now. Bush Has Declared Himself Dictator

…and you think we are going to have elections next year? Bush and his gang are :rofl:

[JDPriestly]

3. Here are the ground rules set forth in the Constitution

The power of Congress is broad. Congress alone has the power to legislate. The president's role in the legislative process is limited to the veto and pocket veto. He or she has no power beyond that. The power of Congress includes the power to regulate the conduct of the military and the handling of prisoners. In other words, Congress establishes the rules for the military and the militia.

Article I

Section 1. All legislative powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.

. . . .

Section 7. All bills for raising revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with amendments as on other Bills.

Every bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a law, be presented to the President of the United States; if he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the objections at large on their journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the bill, it shall be sent, together with the objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a law. But in all such cases the votes of both Houses shall be determined by yeas and nays, and the names of the persons voting for and against the bill shall be entered on the journal of each House respectively. If any bill shall not be returned by the President within ten days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the same shall be a law, in like manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their adjournment prevent its return, in which case it shall not be a law.

Every order, resolution, or vote to which the concurrence of the Senate and House of Representatives may be necessary (except on a question of adjournment) shall be presented to the President of the United States; and before the same shall take effect, shall be approved by him, or being disapproved by him, shall be repassed by two thirds of the Senate and House of Representatives, according to the rules and limitations prescribed in the case of a bill.

Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

. . .

To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;

To establish a uniform rule of naturalization . . . ;

. . .

To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;

To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;

To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;

To provide and maintain a navy;

To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;

To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And

To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.


Article II,
Section 1: . . .
Before he enter on the execution of his office, he shall take the following oath or affirmation:--"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

. . .

Section 3
he shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed, and shall commission all the officers of the United States.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.articleii.html#section3



Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.



I do not know what Constitution Bush reads, but the one I read does not give him the power to amend legislation or to ignore the Constitution. In fact, the Constitution of my country provides that the president's only roles are to sign or veto laws and to execute faithfully the laws that are passed. Bush's amendment of laws through signing statements and selective enforcement of the law violates not only the laws passed by Congress and signed by him, but the Constitution.

It seems to me that this is grounds for impeachment.

[The Backlash Cometh]

4. I wish I was born a white man!

Oh, I can only dream what it must be like living in a world where you can ask for do-overs and get them, just because you say so.

[Hydra]

6. you forgot to mention

born in the right family.

[JDPriestly]

5. Congress betrayed us.

[MissWaverly]

7. the president can do what he wants

we have had this scenario a hundred times, the answer is always, but we will send this bill through, then he will understand,
he does not want to understand, compromise or negotiate. He considers himself the decider. Why do they not
impeach him.

[Vincardog]

8. Did anybody break out and Laugh at those comedians? That is the only correct response to their joke ...

[wtmusic]

9. Of course it matters if Dems are wimps

Whatever the president says, he must be challenged. If he's not challenged, there is no hope.

[struggle4progress]

10. Really? A few weeks ago, BushCo was threatening an extraordinary session of Congress

to get that FISA legislation passed.

And now they claim they didn't need it?

:crazy:

[Rex]

11. 911 changed everything.

'...the president retains his constitutional authority to do whatever it takes to protect the country, regardless of any action Congress takes.'

[OneBlueSky]

12. since when is legislation passed by Congress and signed by the president -- . . .

otherwise known as "the law of the land" -- just advisory? . . . by what torturous stretch of legal precedence (or common sense) could anyone arrive at such a conclusion? . . . when is Congress going to impeach his ass for breaking more U.S. and international laws than probably all previous presidents combined? . . .