If you are really torn about voting for the Dem nominee (no haters, please), check in here:

[blondeatlast]

I WANT to believe in my party--and it's candidates, I really, truly do. There was a time I believed I could.

After the insanity of the K/L vote, this 4th genration, up till now true blue, yellow dog (not quite, but very close) Democrat, has to think twice--and it is GODDAMN PAINFUL. It truly is.

How ANY Democrat could have voted for it--much less one of our presidential contenders (and I'm disgusted that the other didn't show--keep in mind that one of my senators is McCain) is appalling to me.

Have we, as a party, actually embraced the idea of a pre-emptive war--when the man in charge has proven to be corrupt with intelligence, an outright liar, and unconcerned with sacrificing American lives, and civilian lives of our "enemy"?

Do we not for a moment consider that the bombs being prepped for Iran may fall on a relative's head--as they will for me if we do end up over there?

I'll confess--with the precious little I knew then--even less than what the Senate knew at the time--I supported the IWR. I, like the vast majority of the american people, are not so easily fooled anymore. And I want my party to very publicly DEMAND diplomacy first. Is that really so much to ask?

I've given my time, my money, my most treasured civil liberty and responsibilty--now I want something. I want to know that talk will come before bombs. With another president, even Bush Sr., I would be more comfortable with the K/L vote even if it is just "symbolic".

But this man has to be STOPPED, dammit.

[EFerrari]

1. I think that "man" will be Guiliani. He's raising money

from oilmen. Looks like a deal has been cut to me. :tinfoilhat:

[saracat]

2. I agree with you 100% and that is another reason why I cannot promote Hillary in any way.

I am stunned that George McGovern could endorse her. This whole thing just makes me ill and I am sickened by those in our party that are giving this a pass and find it defensible when it is not, Sigh.

[blondeatlast]

3. I still don't believe HC will win the nomination, but I can no longer be blindly loyal.

I cannot PLEDGE my vote now and am disgusted by the suggestion I should.

[saracat]

5. I can only say that I will have great difficulties voting for president if she is the nominee.

I have been able to support every Democratic presidential candidate for over 30 years with pride and I was happy to cast my vote for them. Should Hillary be the nominee, that will not be the case. I will not be proud of the nominee. I will not vote for any other party but I will have difficuty voting for president at all.

[blondeatlast]

"I will not be proud of the nominee." Bingo. nt

[Warpy]

4. The problem is that any incumbent has a tremendous advantage

so voting GOP to get rid of a Blue Dog means you will likely have a GOP in his place for a very long time. You have to look at the Blue Dog's record very carefully to decide whether or not this will be a noticeable difference.

The best bet for getting rid of Blue Dogs lies in voting them out in primaries, and that means convincing the local party to allow primaries to be run. Most local parties have limited funds and don't like to "waste" them trying to get rid of powerful DINOs who count toward a majority and are in a position to bring home the pork.

I'm lucky in that my own Senator seems to have taken a slight turn to the left after he voted for cloture on the Alito nomination and got several new orifices reamed by his constituents, myself included. The other Senator is a GOP nightmare who is embroiled in the state attorney firing fiasco and is up for re election so just maybe we can dream of losing him.

[blondeatlast]

7. My problem is that after a lifetime (and a heritage) of yello-doggery,

I'm just so damn disgusted by the fact that K/L passed I can't even see straight.

I want to know why the Dem Senate leadership didn't see it the way I did--as a veiled IWR, with an N replacing the Q.

It's really not just Hillary I have problems with, but she's the contender--and Obama's no-show (as I say, McCain is legendary for that behavior) disgusts me.

I know that any Dem is generally better than any RRR--but if Lugar were running against Clinton I seriously would be in the booth for several hours. The K/L vote mattered that much to me.

[smiley_glad_hands]

6. Stay home or vote for a repub then.

I'll take HRC, even though she is not my first choice, over any repub anyday.

[blondeatlast]

8. I don't plan on doing either--but I'm goddamned sickened and disgusted that

ANY Dem voted for this (and worse, that one wouldn't be bothered).

Your answer is quick and easy, but you don't seem to sense that I'm really, truly struggling here. I want to believe that and D is better than any R--but I'm not sure any D who can so easily drop bombs on a relative's country is.

Hate me all you want--but I've never been in this position. I want to believe, but I no longer can.

[Egnever]

9. My vote is not a given.

And it horrifies me that so many are willing to lay down for whatever is offered to them. I have serious issues with corporate america and what it is doing to our country. And a corporate candidate is exactly what I don't want.

Unfortunately I don't know that there will be a choice. If I am forced to chose one corporatist over another i will have3 to take the one with a d by their name but I sure as hell wont be happy about it.

[blondeatlast]

10. Our issues are different, but it's good to see someone understands the difficulty I feel

being asked to pledge.

SCOTUS alone will push the lever for me--but I'm not even sure that is a given anymore.

[Egnever]

11. Neither am I

And I worry about the damage that can be done to the party in general simply by electing our wholly paid for candidate.

I have heard whispers of a replacement of howard dean with harold ford. That alone is reason enough for me not to want hillary as president. But theres tons of others including the recent Iran vote that worries me greatly.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

12. I don't sign loyalty oaths.

And I'm not going to sell out.

[bullwinkle428]

13. Yes - I'm okay with admitting that if push comes to shove,

I'll be willing to cast the vote for HRC come Election Day 2008.

BUT, I'll promise everyone this - I don't see any way in which I'll have my heart in all of the canvassing and phone-banking work I'm willing to do in the weeks leading up to the election like I did last fall for the mid-terms. I'm guessing many others will feel that way as well, and I don't think that bodes well at all for the results...