Prepare your family for the hard times ahead. (Sadly, more relevant NOW)

[SoCalDem]

I was asked to repost this.. so here it is..:)

Prepare your family for the hard times ahead.


Posted by SoCalDem in General Discussion
Sat Mar 10th 2007, 08:06 AM

No one is immune from the hard landing ahead.

Even with a democratic congress, we will still have almost 2 years left of this mal-adminstration to screw things up even more than they have.

As a boomer, I have lived through many recessions, and they are no fun..

The mini-recession (was it really even a real recession) in the post-Clinton /early Bush years was NOTHING compared to what may be looming on the horizon.

Many people are in way over their heads and a few missed paychecks can send them right onto the streets.

We all think that our family budget is carved in stone and there's no room for "adjustments", but in most cases that's not entirely true.



Easy stuff first:

1. Learn to cook:

......a) Even with higher grocery prices, it's still cheaper (and better for you ) to cook , than to order in, nuke a frozen dinner, or use prepared mixes
......b) grow some fresh veggies if you have some yard space
......c) stock up on bargains at the store when you see them
......d) shop with a list, and stick to it
......e) buy store brands whenever possible
......f) use coupons if they are for things you already buy
......g) Cook several meals at the same time and package your own "frozen dinners" for the rest of the week


2. GET RID OF YOUR CREDIT CARDS

.......a) If you cannot pay them off, please consider filing bankruptcy (if you qualify, and can do it). The deck is stacked against consumers, and it's only going to get worse, folks. The sooner you get "out from under", the sooner you can start rebuilding your financial stability .
........b) Keep ONE credit card with the lowest interest rate possible, and use it once a month (to keep it active)..and pay it in full BEFORE the due date..(If you need to rent a car or reserve a hotel room, you will need a credit card to avoid paying a large cash deposit.
.........c) If your bank offers it, use the online bill-paying service. This eliminates the cost of writing/mailing checks, and it provides a detailed record of what (and where) you are spending your money. It saves on postage too and gas..and time.
........d) Ask your bank for a checking account that comes with over-draft protection (ours has $1k) so if you ever screw up, you will not be charged a bunch of bank fees...or keep a savings account where you have your checking, so you could transfer (online) between accounts.
.......e) Buy a shredder and USE IT. Shred all papers that have any identifying information on them.
.......f) Pay your bills EARLY and pay extra if you can.

3. Examine your "extras".

.......a) Do you really "need" that cell phone package? Are your calls on it, the yak-yak killing-time calls or is it truly for "emergencies" like people tell themselves? Could you get by with a prepaid cheapo-phone that "lives in the car", and a cheaper "frill-free" land line for the yak-yak calls? (People managed this way for over 100 years)
.......b) Cut the cable bill by going to the bare-bones package and have friends tape the HBO stuff for you.
.......c) Take your lunch to work. Even $4-5 a day ends up being close to a Benjamin a month.
.......d) Send kids to school with a lunch too, It's better for them than what they get in the cafeteria. let them make their own, and they might accept it more.
........e) Shop the sales at upscale department stores, and you can often find better clothing/accessories than at Walmart/KMart/Target..and there is no stigma for shopping at resale shops/flea markets/yard sales.
.......f) PAY OFF YOUR VEHICLES (if you can) and figure out exactly what those extra cars are costing you. You have to consider insurance, gasoline, repairs, tires, finance charges.. the whole enchilada
.......g) Take a hard look at the secondary income job (usually the wife's). What are you actually getting to KEEP from that job, after the daycare costs, lunches at work, extra car expenses, extra costs associated with the job, and any income tax implications. Now figure out if it's actually worth the trouble. remember that you only get to spend what's left over, and often that part-time job ends up costing the family money in the long run.
......h) Start saying "We cannot afford that" to your kids. SHOW them the family budget and make them a part of the financial team.
......i) Cancel magazine subscriptions.. (Most probably don't even get read..or when family asks what you want for your birthday/xmas/etc , let THEM subscribe to your favorite magazine as your gift
.....j) When you eat out, go early and use coupons for meals if you get them

4. Maintain your appliances, cars & equipment. An annual "check-up" is cheaper than a complete breakdown.

5. Network and barter casually

.....a) Everyone has a special skill, so trade services within your group. (be careful how you do this, because the IRS is "interested" in bartering .)..
......b) When you buy something pricey, show them cash and ask for a cash discount
......c) Shop in your community, with privately owned businesses, if you can. Often they deliver free and are eager to please you
......d) Ask your friends for referrals for things you need done (if you cannot do them yourself).
......e) If you have young kids, set up an "exchange" with other families..for clothes & toys.
......f) Set up or join a babysitting co-op (It's easy, fun and it's FREE babysitting (as in no money paid..just your time)

6. Consider "shared-housing" . If you are an empty-nester with a big house, you could "rent a room" to a single who cannot afford the high cost of an apartment..or you could incorporate a parent/grandparent into your home (cue fingernails on a chalkboard here)..but if it's the difference between losing your home or keeping it, you may need to consider this

7. Energy use can be cut down

....a) Obviously the new lightbulbs help, but there are other things you can do.
.....b) Do laundry & dishes at off-peak times
.....c) Close off registers in unused rooms
.....d) Set the turn-off timers on tvs incase you fall asleep
....e) Replace washers in faucets so they don't drip
.....f) Plan your shopping /errands in a circular trip.
.....g) Make sure your car has a locking gas cap




I've droned on long enough, but let me tell you, that when a REAL recession hits, and hits hard, many families will be hit hard. Most young folks have never experienced wage-freezes or 15% mortgage loans .. But when WE endured those things, there were no killer health care premiums or $25K cars or all the expenses we have today.

Start now and if it doesn't come to pass, you mightr only end up with a savings account & some good habits.. Wait too long, and you might be homeless and broke.
Read entry | Discuss (298 comments) | Remove from Journal | Add/Edit intro

[laylah]

1. Some very sage advice! TYVM! n/t

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

2. K & R.

:kick: MKJ

[Bobbieo]

4. Great advice - I am so close to paying off my mortgage -

by the end of the year!!! Have ony one credit card which I pay off every month.

[1932]

3. SoCalDem, weren't you the person who fought so bitterly with (was it?) unlawfulcombat about the

direction of the real estate market about a year ago? Didn't you say that everything was going to be fine and that unlawfulcombat was an alarmist and using misleading statistics?

[SoCalDem]

7. Not me.. To me, every silver lining has a BIG black cloud attached

A professor once told me that I was an enlightened pessimist :rofl:

[Yael]

5. Excellent advice!

I purchased a counter-top personal shredder about a year ago. EVERYTHING goes in it now. All junk mail and even the page of catalogues with my name and address on it. Anything with my name and address -- straight to the ripper. Then, into brown bags and off to the recycle bin.

This is an often overlooked item in a 'preparedness' list, but with identity theft being so prevalent (and the recent credit crunch), it is extremely important to protect yourselves against this.

Thank you for including that in your list!

[SoCalDem]

9. We shred only the part that contains the names & account numbers

and recycle the rest..

All that shreddo-stuff makes for great packing material for Christmas boxes mailed off to moved-away grown kids too :)

[Yael]

10. OOOH! Hadn't thought of that. Nice!

[TalkingDog]

25. Our shredded paper goes into the compost bin. But only use that for

plants, never food please.



My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[kath]

34. Pretty much anybody can link your name with your address, so I don't worry much about

that, re: catalogs, etc. It's the stuff with account numbers on it, birthdate, SS#, and those credit card offers that you need to worry about.

I recycle all the junk mail (after tearing off what I mentioned above). DOn't have a shredder yet. I'm not sure if we can recycle shredded paper here with our curbside stuff...

[SoCalDem]

36. We just put it in with the other recycle stuff.. No one's refused it yet

we also flatten cardboard boxes and after the kitties have "scratched" it up, we recycle that too.. Why pay for "scratchers" at Petsmart :)

[DKRC]

72. Our cats help out with the shreds

I mix the shredded credit card apps, etc. in with their litter. I figure anyone desperate enough to go through used cat litter to find my info probably deserves the mess they get.

:evilgrin:

[no_hypocrisy]

6. I've learned to not turn on the heat during the winter and walk around in

sweators and use 3-4 blankets on my bed. It's a little chilly in the beginning (60 degrees usually) but you get used to it. To be fair, I have some residual heat being on the second floor of a four-unit home.

[SoCalDem]

8. A few years back our furnace conked out..In October, so we just did without it

that winter.. We have plenty of blankets, I'm menopausal, and our cats all sport fur coats..

Of course we are in So Cal, so it was not brutal, but there were nights when it was 50-something in the mornings when we woke up (inside the house )

We all survived, and in the spring when prices were down, we got a new HVAC system installed :)

[Neoma]

11. Thank you for the advice.

Everyone is going to need it.

[w8liftinglady]

12. This is a great post.as one of the shrinking middle class-

I find my paycheck barely covers the bills.I wish I could find or afford a commune in Texas.

[SoCalDem]

13. Start one up.

Invite a friend to share expenses :) Companionship and frugality :)

[w8liftinglady]

16. I kind of do that now...I envision something much larger

[crispini]

41. You serious?

Check your PM... I know someone I can introduce you to....

[conscious evolution]

14. I followed a lot of this advice

I recommend it.
When things fall apart I know that I will be able to weather it a lot better than many people that I know.

A couple of places have saved is by completely killing my tv.I have also canceled my internet service and pay a neighbor ten bucks a month to ride his wireless.These two things alone have resulted in a nice little savings every month.
Another place I have saved money is with my entertainment budget.Instead of going to movies and dinner or to big concerts I get together with friends and we make our own music and entertainment.We also do a lot of potluck type of meals.Since so many of my friends are into gardening we are always getting some kind of fresh produce from someones garden.(Growing a vegetable garden is yet another way to save money.)

I sure hate having to be so pessimistic about the future but I feel I have no other choice.I have come to believe things are going to be getting a lot worse before long.There is a storm coming and people would be well advised to prepare for it.

[SoCalDem]

15. Yep.. and even if "cash-money" is worth less in the future,

it's still better to HAVE some, than to OWE it to credit card companies :)

[nedbal]

43. when possible make the "cash-money" stash Euros

[Manifestor_of_Light]

54. YES!! Making your own music is a blast!

Playing and singing and recording your stuff is so much more fun than being passively entertained, if you've got an instrument and a bit of training.

Even without an instrument you can still join in and sing!

If you can't carry a tune in an armored car, you can still APPLAUD!!!

[Xenotime]

17. I disagree with getting rid of ALL your credit cards..

That will damage your FICO score by doing that. Good luck trying to get a job or insurance then.

Second, there's no mention of buying gold. If you buy gold, then when the economy failes you will have something valuable to buy stuff with.

[SoCalDem]

18. Buying gold when it's high, may be out of most people's budget

and A (as on ONE) credit card, well-managed and paid off every month is not a bad idea (It's what we have), but having access to thousands of dollars of credit can affect your credit rating, and can tempt people into using them, only making their circumstances worse..

[TalkingDog]

26. Sorry, laughing so hard my computer glitched....n/t

My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[TalkingDog]

27. Gold....bwahahahaha! Besides the fact that it just broke 800 an oz.

If you came to my door with gold in your hand wanting to buy some of my stores...Well, you'd get pretty much the same response as the Subject Line.

Manual Labor, that I'll trade.
Vet Services and supplies ditto.

Otherwise, we're in exceptionally good shape.

Gold is not edible, which is pretty much my "gold standard". It's only value is in that people think it has value.

I've got a God Shamgod basketball card I think is priceless. That, I'll take gold for.


My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[MattSh]

57. Many knowledgable people think it's going to 3000 an oz.

Hmm, now 800, in a couple of years, 3000, or even half of that.

Seems to me a lot of people think it has value. In fact, it's the only thing that's consistently had value throughout the history of money.

[TalkingDog]

70. When it comes down to cases, can you eat it?

Let's just go with the worst possible scenario. I mean rock bottom. Natural Disasters or Mis-Administration interrupt the supply chain to your city. Think Katrina, except you know it's going to last for months, possibly years.

Will people think your gold has value then? Or will they think 5 lbs. of rice is more valuable?

I'll stick with food and services thanks.



My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[jpgray]

60. Is it too much to ask that you read the whole post before strongly disagreeing?

Because she clearly noted that keeping one card is a good idea.

[Peggy Day]

19. They wanted $8 for 2 cucumbers and a pint of tomatoes

at the farmer's market. I couldn't see paying that for them. The best that I have found is to buy food so that it doesn't spoil and gets used up.

[SoCalDem]

20. Maybe that's because the season's ending?

That sucks though.. We love cukes :) Next year, you should grow some.. They are so prolific and easy to grow..(don't plant too many though :scared: )

If there's a costco near you, split a flat of tomatoes with a friend and it's cheaper than in the stores :)

I do this with my friend.. we share a 20# bag opf great potatoes & do the same for boxes of oranges & apples :)

[knitter4democracy]

68. Wow!

Those are high prices, even at the end of the season.

[Donnachaidh]

21. An addition for the cable example --

Many of the HBO and other movies and shows wind up on the torrents. I know some folks don't like to use the torrents, but if you really REALLY want to see something and do not have someone who can tape things for you it is an option.

[Whisp]

22. and Do Not forget to make fun of the Poor.

I've seen that here. by people that feel 'it can't happen to Me Me me'.
yes, it can. it did, it does.

[Rex]

23. We are moving down the line from butter for bullets.

To aircraft carriers and tanks.

[madrchsod]

24. been doing this for over two years...

[derby378]

28. Don't forget to allocate money for firearms and ammunition...

...just in case the hard times ahead turn into what is referred to as a SHTF scenario.

[TalkingDog]

29. And because I'm a catastrophic thinker (thanks PTSD) here's a few books

in the event of Dire Straits. (no not the band)

The link is to the free download page, but consider sending them a few bucks. They seem like a decent Org.

http://www.hesperian.org/publications_download.php#wtnd

Books for 3rd world countries like:

Where there is no Doctor.
Where there is no Dentist.
Where women have no Doctor.


Not that we are a third world country....yet.


My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[w8liftinglady]

30. too bad you don't live in texas.

My boyfriend and I are thinking along those lines.He owns 2 acres with a double-wide.we may have a commune before this all ends.I am a liberal,but totally for 2nd amendment rights

[Manifestor_of_Light]

55. Yes, communal living will be our salvation.

I agree with you about 2nd amendment,although I have never owned a gun.

I want all my arty friends to show up and do their arty things like write, paint, play music, cook, sew, weld, fix cars, whatever.

[eridani]

31. Also check out freecycle.com n/t

[DKRC]

74. Love Freecycle

Here's the link:

Freecycle.org

[Arugula Latte]

32. Amazing you should re-post this today ... I was JUST recalling this thread.

I think maybe the budget-stretching recipe thread reminded me...

:toast:

[SoCalDem]

37. We had a mind-meld

:hi:

[Individualist]

33. ...and don't forget to stock up on pet food for your family pets n/t

[SoCalDem]

35. Although, since the recall, I would almost be afraid to

and the dry foods have "use by" dates on them ..:scared:

[Lydia Leftcoast]

38. Learn to walk, bike, or take transit instead of driving if at all possible

A healthy adult should be able to walk a mile or bike three miles in 20 minutes.

If you're moving, move to a city neighborhood OR, if you must have those open spaces, to a genuine small town, NOT to a jerry-built subdivision that forces you to drive two miles to get a carton of milk.

[SoCalDem]

39. I wish that dairy delivery was still the norm..

When we lived in NM, the dairy guy always had "extras", and many mornings I could catch him, and buy milk, eggs, cottage cheese from HIM, and NOT have to drag 3 whiny kids to the store:)

[seabeyond]

40. good to know, i do so many of the things you suggest and take it a step further

i HATE spending money, llol. i dont like shopping. i have no needs. no wants, and really cant think of many desires. most of the desires are free anyway.

actually a couple years into bush's adm i was really concerned with the economy. i started hording. the fall hasnt happened, but i am adept at the hording.

[SoCalDem]

42. We buy very little too.. I hate shopping too.

Sometimes hoarding defeats the purpose though. Products sometimes come with insect larvae (the allowable amount :eyes: ) and if you have it too long, they hatch and contaminate everything.. I found this ort one time when I bought "extra" flour :grr:

[seabeyond]

44. funny. i got to experience it will mealmoths. didnt have a clue what

those little suckers were and man were they hard to get rid of. the only thing i do not pay a lot of attention to is grocery shopping. i go when i want and get what i want and dont feel guilty about it. my husband works so hard, lol and does so well and doesnt spend a lot of his money, but man... does he like good tasting food. so, in order for me to get thru the grocery store without putting back on the shelf or not buying is make my list for the week, buy it, without looking at prices.

[SoCalDem]

45. When we had them, we basically tossed anything that was open

and put anything that had any grain in it, in ziplocs from then on.. Our cupboards were nice and tidy ...for a while at least :)

[seabeyond]

46. i got there eventually, but took me a while to realize all that.

it has been like two years since i have seen one but still... all stuff is in zip lock and i dont keep any unsealed stuff in pantry for long. still put on my granny glasses to look in the chip bag.

trippy experience.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

58. this is what I do when I buy a new bag of flour.

Take it out of the bag, put it in a big pyrex baking dish and turn it to about 250 degrees for about 15 minutes to kill the eggs.

Nobody taught me this, I figured it out after seeing too many mealmoths and weevils in stuff.

[Kool Kitty]

59. You know what else works for flour and other grains?

Bring the package home from the supermarket, slap it into a ziploc bag and throw it in the freezer for a day or two. No mealies or pantry moths.

[girl gone mad]

63. I do that with my rice..

after buying one of those giant bags of basmati from costco only to open it up a couple of months later and see it was infested with boll weevils.

[seabeyond]

65. it all started in the back of my rice and bean drawer that i rarely go thru

i didnt even know such a thing could happen. every year at a certain season we get moths for a while. i can't kill. not a killer. and reserve hubby killing instincts for all the bugs i really dont like. so i generally let the moths live out their lives. these little suckers were so small and odd. i had never seen such a thing. and they would multi. even watched two mating as i finally got hold of killer mode and going at them with flyswatter. i would kill and kill, and kill some more. then was a duh... look for the source. really was pathetic

[DKRC]

73. Flour, sugar, & rice live in our freezer just for this reason

cans go in the pantry.

[seabeyond]

64. thanks for the tip with the cooking or the freezing. good idea. i put mine

in a zealed container and throw the bag immediately, but i cook do this prior

[renie408]

76. OMG!! Thank you! Nobody taught me either. I hate those damn little moths. n/t

[Catherine Vincent]

47. Bookmarking to read later.

:kick:

[roguevalley]

48. everything that is plugged in has an electrical surge protector that

I pull out at the end of the day. They aren't on all night sucking electricity. I'm down from $192 a month to an average of 25-30$. A couple of months I had a credit.

[Lorien]

62. That's a great hint. Does turning the switch off on the surge protector

help at all or must it be pulled out of the socket? Some of mine are plugged in behind huge pieces of unmovable furniture.

[roguevalley]

77. I yank it from the wall because I don't know if they are effective if

they are switched off in protecting the machinery. Two months I got a credit on my bill. :evilgrin: Ha! I love striking back against The Man.

[roguevalley]

49. everything that is plugged in has an electrical surge protector that

I pull out at the end of the day. They aren't on all night sucking electricity. I'm down from $192 a month to an average of 25-30$. A couple of months I had a credit.

[tomreedtoon]

50. Buy guns. Learn to butcher pets for food...then humans.

Or be like my sister and ask around for a copy of "The Anarchist's Cookbook" so she can make nerve gas bombs to bury in her lawn, so that when the Negroes come boiling out of the Saint Louis ghetto to rape and kill all the white women, she can kill them before they get to her door.

Yes, my sister DID ask for the above information. And she's not alone in her paranoia.

How paranoid do you want to make people, anyway? So far you're doing a good job, but you have to take it all the way to the Minutemen level if you want to be considered honest.

Seriously...you're almost as good at spreading fear as the Republicans. Please stop.

[SoCalDem]

51. Tom Tancredo, is that you?

The name sounds similar... being prepared for a downturn should not be fearful..

Forewarned is forearmed :)

[tomreedtoon]

52. No, just someone tired of Goddamned PARANOIA.

I refuse to live in fear. I have lived in fear before. I was damn near raped during a robbery years ago, where I lost a car, my computer and most of my self-respect. I am not going to surrender my self-esteem, slowly built despite a permanent case of PTSD, to anybody who wants to spread fear. Not Bush and not you.

Go peddle your plastic tarp and duct tape to someone else.

[TalkingDog]

53. I am neither afraid nor paranoid despite doing most of the OP list for years

To me, preparing for an emergency is simply that.

I also have an evac plan for me and my critters in case the house catches fire. Likelyhood? Very low. Should I refuse to plan because of it?

I wear seat belts in spite of the fact that I am an exceptional driver and have only bumped a bumper once. No ticket, no damage to either car. Should I just assume that nothing bad is ever going to happen to me?

I don't think anybody here is advocating bomb shelters. (well, not so far)
If it tweaks your PTSD to read this stuff, just blow us off instead of being somewhat insulting.

Sorry this is frustrating for you. My mother was similar to your sister. Carried a gun everywhere because "crime is horrible". Her big trips out of the house were to her PO box (because people "stole her mail") and to Wal-Mart. Woo- crime rampant in those places, tell ya what.

And when the "robot cat" walked through the yard at night, sent by the neighbors that were always spying on her and sending her messages by tapping on the outer walls of her bedroom...well, it worried me that she even owned a gun. Of course after they started blowing drugs in her open bedroom window to ramp her up and "fuck with her mind" and then the TV started shooting rays at her because they hooked something up under her house......well, you get the gist.

I know what paranoia is. Trust me sister, This here....AIN'T it.



My Favorite Master Artist: Karen Parker GhostWoman Studios

[Lorien]

61. Sheesh, just use the "hide thread" feature if the very sensible OP

threatens you and makes you feel fearful and paranoid. I didn't get that at all from her post. Let's look at the facts:

1.) the dollar is falling against all major currencies. It's at a record low against the Euro.

2.) Oil prices are rising to record highs (did you live through the 70's and have any memory of it)?

3.) Our jobs are being outsourced as never before.

4.) Retail sales are dropping significantly

5.) Climate change is causing crop failures in many states. Ethanol is driving up the cost of corn. Grocery prices are rising significantly.

6.) Lowering interest rates may drive up inflation.

7.) The credit and housing crisis are having a negative impact on the economy

8.) the BushCo wars of choice have looted the U.S. Treasury. Our National Debt has skyrocketed.


Given these FACTS, not hype, SoCalDem's advice, imho, is very thoughtful, reasonable, and timely.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

56. Steal This Book by Abbie Hoffman is also useful in that respect.

[renie408]

67. I am usually the first to roll my eyes at the alarmists..

but the economy really is in deep shit. I hope you are right and we don't go into a recession, but the last time we barely avoided that, construction propped up the economy. That isn't happening again. So what is going to keep us afloat this time around?

[femrap]

66. I wonder if most people will be able

to reduce their Consumerist Lifestyle w/o being angry, annoying, and annihilating. Long ago I learned that things do not bring happiness. I've been on consumerist strike for a long time. Plus I buy nothing made in China...so I save lots of $ right there.

I shop for clothes at the most twice a year....after summer and winter sales (75% off plus another 30 to 50% off) is the time I buy.

I think people will be amazed at how much better they feel by not eating so much processed foods....which is just filled with chemicals.

Thanks for the tips...we're going to need them. The fall of the American Empire is underway.

[tom_paine]

69. Sage advice.

n/t

[Neshanic]

71. That's an excellent posting of advice. I remember the 1987 crash, then

the subsequent drop in everything here in Phoenix. In the years 1988 to 1992 you could not get arrested for a job. Luckily I was in a firm that had work and was very good at what we did, but it still was a struggle. The credit card thing is the most important I think. I paid more than the minimum, and then when one was paid off cut it up and then used the money that was for the paid off card to add to the payment of the next.

I am not en economic expert, but the field I work in I am in on the front line of the engine of growth that keeps/kept Phoenix going. I knew from what was in the pipeline last year at this time that around this fall the wheels would start falling off. It seems here in Arizona, there is only two wheels left on the wagon, as the developers are in a panic mode. The samller ones are just dissapearing. The far flung Pluto ring of developments that were so hot, now have unbelievable forclosure, bank owned amounts of property.

Arms will not peak I think until March of 2008, and from talking to some insiders, the first time I posted on this a very long time ago, I was told 2010 was when the bottom would be reached. That has now been pushed to 2013. This is now the whispered theory of when homes will final stop dropping in price, and stability will be reached. In the meantime, Craigslist has many home that have never been lived in and are renting for less than my apartment, the only problem would be the one hour commute.

We will get through this, but it will take time, as the last cycle.

[Kurovski]

75. Unfortunately, cooking at home means lost income to the restaurant workers.

But..well, what are you going to do?

[Le Taz Hot]

78. Extremely timely post.

Thank you.