Is the "Pelosi Step Down" thing a right wing trick?

[Prefer]

While one one had I am like "what the fuck is this guy not getting impeached for??", on the other hand I am wary of the right wing using their powerful funded astroturf machine to play to our every disadvantage. No doubt there is some parallel effort to impersonate the democratic electorate and steer us into the the worst decisions. You can pretend that is just paranoid, but that's just how the machinery works. There an unlimited supply of grease to butter up the gears and get them to whirr in any direction that helps.

To me there is just something a little too obvious and quick about this Pelosi spin. Just like it was a little quick that the whole typewriter meme developed online withing 15 minutes of the 60 Minutes episode story on the Killeen letters.

But on the flip side... Hello Democrats? You're about to get tossed out on your asses along with everyone else on board the SS Status Quo. There won't be much effort expended to pare out the pieces of this fruit that are not rotten...

[Blue-Jay]

1. hahahahahaha!

You're new at this, aren't you?

[davidwparker]

2. No. I want her to step down and if not, I want the CA liberals in her district

to vote her out.

It's going to interesting in 2008 to see what her district does.

[grasswire]

36. that's pretty arrogant

Do you believe in the representation of a district by the person THEY elect? Or not?

[Perry Logan]

3. Yup. DUers fall for it every time.

[rucky]

4. Cindy Sheehan. n/t

[Blue-Jay]

6. Ross Perot

[liberalmuse]

5. It will be called as such...

and to be fair, if Pelosi ends up stepping down over this, all Republicans should also step down or leave office. She's certainly lost my trust. I'm more pissed off that someone I thought would help stop this madness is helping to perpetuate it, than I am that people are asking her to step down (whether they be right wingers pretending to be DUers, or actual DUers who think it would be a good idea if she stepped down). Now that her dirty little secret is out, it's time Nancy Pelosi sends that long-awaited dinner invitation to Bush and Cheney. Or step down and let the next heinous Bush enabler have a go at it. I mean really, would Hoyer be any worse? And if so, does it really matter at this point?

[Bitwit1234]

7. I think there were eight people at least

who were told about water boarding. If they call for one to go they should all go and the TURD IN CHIEF.....MOSTLY.

[Breeze54]

8. You think this 'just' happened here at DU?

:P

"To me there is just something a little too obvious and quick about this Pelosi spin."

Uh, I think the whole "impeachment is off the table" meme was the catalyst months (a year) ago!?!

Are you asking if there are rethugs here at DU or did I read that wrong? :shrug:

At any rate... to DU!! :hi:

[IsItJustMe]

14. Of course there are Repuke trolls here. Any fool can sign up on a blog. To think otherwise would

be extremely naive.

[Breeze54]

20. Yeah but it was a question

meant for the new member.

You are a seasoned member and of course you'd understand that, as do I.

But the OP may not be as seasoned. We have a lot of new members joining daily, it seems.

My question wasn't meant to demean the OP but to provoke thought. ;)

:hi:

[IsItJustMe]

33. Gotcha, It's the nature of the medium.

[grasswire]

9. there are people on DU whose mission it is...

...to destroy the Democratic Party. And only a minority of them are Republicans.

[peacetalksforall]

10. Let's set things straight...

People on DU and others who could be are already angry because she continues to refuse to explore impeachment for all the crimes that were revealed to us before this one - and this one is really serious in a scale of historical humanity, regards for humanity, laws for humanity, abuse of humans..

People on DU are on DU because they want integrity in our government leaders.

People on DU will not start excusing and twisting things like Republicans do when faced with the misdeeds of their own leaders.

[gaiilonfong]

15. BRAVO...Well said!!!!! n/t

[Individualist]

27. Hear, hear!

If individual posts could be recommended for greatest, I'd recommend yours. :applause:

[Hydra]

11. Pelosi really stepped in it

She knew about the torture, and may have disallowed impeachment so that her part in it would not be revealed. That's inexcusable from someone in our party.

Sheehan can have her spot if we can't find someone better.

[L. Coyote]

13. BULLSHIT ALERT: "may have" is inexcusable. What crap.

HELLO! We all knew about torture. But, was anyone actually informed of waterboarding?

The real question is, "Did the Intelligence Community fail to abide by the law and properly inform Congress?"

[Hydra]

24. Apparently, Nancy and a few others were

I said "may have" about her reason for taking impeachment off the table. The reason I stated would be a good incentive for her to keep it quiet and preventing real investigation, but it may not have been the reason she choose.

[KittyWampus]

16. PROVE she knew about the torture. PROVE IT.

[Hydra]

22. You didn't see this yet, I take it?

In September 2002, four members of Congress met in secret for a first look at a unique CIA program designed to wring vital information from reticent terrorism suspects in U.S. custody. For more than an hour, the bipartisan group, which included current House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), was given a virtual tour of the CIA's overseas detention sites and the harsh techniques interrogators had devised to try to make their prisoners talk.

Among the techniques described, said two officials present, was waterboarding, a practice that years later would be condemned as torture by Democrats and some Republicans on Capitol Hill. But on that day, no objections were raised. Instead, at least two lawmakers in the room asked the CIA to push harder, two U.S. officials said.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3813141

I say to you, prove otherwise. If indeed this is a complete lie, then she's off my hook. I rather doubt it, though.

[KittyWampus]

26. There's no sourced info there. Just anonymous bullshit. Two anonymous officials

and you just believe "two officials"?

Why?

No, it's up to you to prove it.

Using more than a bullshit WaPo story that has already been debunked.

[Hydra]

29. I've seen you bopping along saying this is untrue

which is fine- it's also your opinion unless you were there at the time.

As I said, if this is debunked, that's fine. I rather doubt that it is, though, given all of the other facts in the matter.

[grasswire]

35. what are the other facts?

Please list.

[blondeatlast]

17. Did you read the story? Did you note the lack of ANY direct quotes?

Just curious. A little critical thinking puts many, many holes in the story.

[Hydra]

25. As much as I had to cringe reading the Washington Post

The information is hardly surprising, and fits with the "tough on terror" image our reps have been trying to take.

I'm waiting for Pelosi and the others mentioned to refute this. The previous set of briefings on domestic spying were revealed to be hazy and generally uninformative...but I somehow doubt that was the case, here. Hazy and uninformative would hardly have covered over the fact that we were violating the Geneva Conventions.

[grasswire]

37. they CAN'T DISCUSS IT!!!!!!!!

They're boxed in. They can't refute it. Because they can't discuss it. Period. Get it?

[Hydra]

39. As someone else correctly pointed out

Some of them are on record as protesting the behavior, so I see this as "finger in the wind" politics for the ones who kept silent. Either they didn't care, or they thought even secretly protesting might hurt their image later.

Care to refute that part?

Also, illegal behavior has legal remedy, despite classified nature of said illegality.

Oh, well. Laws are for stupid people like us who vote, right?

[terisan]

12. Democrats can be such hungry little doggies. Rove throws out a bone & they beat up their own.

The Bush people have all the propaganda skills. They have studied Adolf and all the masters. Most dems are illiterates in the propaganda war.

Two years ago I read on the internet (you don't even have to go to the library) the Department of Defense class outlines on how to propagandize civilian populations.

You paid for their reseach, please get it and read it.

[lapfog_1]

18. I've seen a lot of anti Pelosi things here today

mostly having to do with the "gang of 4" or "gang of 8" and the CIA torture program.

Pelosi and Reid were "briefed" on the torture program (at least the story goes) and the news article goes on to state the some congress critters were not only acquiescent but enthusiastic about the torture (the implication is that Jane or Nancy or even Harry were counted in that category).

DUers here have been quick to jump all over Nancy (especially) about this because of the anger over the "impeachment is off the table" remark by Nancy.

Of course, all we have is ONE source for this, plus a number of leaked accounts from others that say that the disclosure was very minimal and incomplete... and what of the author of that story? Did they get their facts right.

One of the great ironies (and perhaps something the RW echo chamber is counting on) is that Nancy and Harry and the rest CAN'T say anything about what they were briefed on or how complete it was without breaking laws on national security.

So they are deflecting attention away from the destruction of the torture tapes AND having us eat our own... which they are very good at.

I'm not happy that Nancy took impeachment "off the table" nor am I happy that the Dems have been unable to stop the BFEE and their evil plans very effectively, starting with the war in Iraq. OTOH, Nancy is still a hell of a lot better than Hastert or Tom Delay or their ilk.

And I remember what was written here when Nancy first was elected to be Speaker of the House...

Yes, I'm disappointed with her, and with Harry, and with the Dems in general. But they really DON'T HAVE VOTES to make anything stick. They are one person away from losing the leadership of the Senate and, right now, have to count on JoeMentum to keep their chairmanships. So what the hell do people expect?

Let's cut them some slack until they can explain things. And quit listening to suspect newspaper reports and the echo chamber.

Just my humble opinion. If it really makes you feel better to purge the party of Nancy Pelosi (never mind Jane Harmon)...

[EFerrari]

19. I think you put it very well. It's a negotiation we have to mind:

:While one one had I am like "what the fuck is this guy not getting impeached for??", on the other hand I am wary of the right wing using their powerful funded astroturf machine to play to our every disadvantage.:

[Occam Bandage]

21. No. Ritual murder-suicide pacts are a central pillar of the Democratic party.

[stranger81]

23. No, but coopting the party from the inside like they have with Pelosi very well might be . . . .

[brentspeak]

28. One thing is for sure: a lot of dumb people have been willing to knee-jerk against Pelosi.

[Individualist]

30. Is defense of complicity a DLC trick?

"The Democratic Leadership Council's agenda is indistinguishable from the Republican Neoconservative agenda," http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Kucinich_DLC_agenda_undistinguishable_from_Neocon_0813.html

[Swamp Rat]

31. No, but it's a damned good idea.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

32. That NIE leak set off a whole lot of ripples....

Our Democratic reps have let themselves be punked. They'd better come clean and just bear the consequences.

And, if this is the worst that's out there, they can survive it by learning from it and actually f***ing representing their constituents!

Don't forget the prize...our president tried to go to war based on nothing, except the VP's demand for more, more, more.

MKJ

[warren pease]

34. Of course it's right wing disinfo...

They're scared to hell of her and want her gone because she's been so spectacularly successful at withholding funds for Operation Iraqi Genocide.

And because she viciously contests each and every piece of unconstitutional BushCo legislation -- at least until she caves a few minutes later.

And because she's so dangerously unpredictable on impeachment; you just never know if she's going to wake up with bad hair one day and decide, "To hell with it. Somebody's going to pay for these split ends and it might as well be that snarling fucker in the bunker."

And because she's so good at prioritizing that she readily admits she can't walk and chew gum at the same time when it comes to deciding whether to deal with impeachment or another high priority issue, like which unknown dead white guy to name the new post branch building in rural Nebraska for.

But I should talk; I can't walk and chew gum at the same time either so I've completely forgotten about the NIE already. In just a few short hours, reports of Ms. Nancy's little sneak preview have completely wiped my memory clean of anything that happened earlier than this morning.

Yeah, it's all that damn Rove screwing with everything again. Better rally around Ms. Nancy or Rove wins again.


wp


Oh, and for the ironically challenged: :sarcasm:

[proud2BlibKansan]

38. I think it is funny that the right wingers thought there was nothing wrong with waterboarding

until they found out Pelosi may be involved. Now it's torture! Gotta love it.