AT&T engineer says Bush sought domestic spying within two weeks of taking office

[deminks]

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/ATT_engineer_says_Bush_Administration_sought_1216.html

Nearly 1,300 words into Sunday's New York Times article revealing new details of the National Security Agency's domestic eavesdropping program, the lawyer for an AT&T engineer alleges that "within two weeks of taking office, the Bush administration was planning a comprehensive effort of spying on Americans’ phone usage.”

In a New Jersey federal court case, the engineer claims that AT&T sought to create a phone center that would give the NSA access to "all the global phone and e-mail traffic that ran through" a New Jersey network hub.

The former AT&T employee, who spoke on condition of anonymity to the Times said he took part in several discussions with agency officials about the plan.

"The officials, he said, discussed ways to duplicate the Bedminster system in Maryland so the agency “could listen in” with unfettered access to communications that it believed had intelligence value and store them for later review," Times reporters Eric Lichtblau, James Risen and Scott Shane wrote. "There was no discussion of limiting the monitoring to international communications, he said."

“At some point,” he told the paper, “I started feeling something isn’t right.”

(end snip)

Link to NYT article

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/washington/16nsa.html?ei=5065&en=03d7b2d9209d9d7d&ex=1198472400&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print

2 weeks after taking office. It musta been the eggs.

[seemslikeadream]

1. maybe he thought something might happen

[L. Coyote]

25. ALL = ALL fiber optic traffic sent outside USA to circumvent LAW, Constitution

I was told by an informant years ago, ALL Interent traffic is sent outside the jurisdiction of US law so ALL communications between EVERYONE can be stored and spied on. Apparently, the equipment that enables this is the duplication of fiber optics in a "splitter" that turns an optical stream into two streams, creating a mirror of the original. The mirror is routed outside jurisdiction.

This means that e-mail, phone calls, web traffic, everything is captured and stored.

[L. Coyote]

43. Check all the VIDEO links in this thread: KEITH Olbermann, et.al.

Are ALL COMMUNICATIONS routed overseas to circumvent US law and the Constitution?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2245762

AT&T Whistleblower Mark Klein On Olbermann

VIDEO: Domestic Spying Story: Mark Klein on Washington Journal

VIDEO: ABC News: AT&T Whistle-blower - NSA Internet spying

VIDEO: NSA Pressured LA Times To Kill Domestic Spying Story

VIDEO: How Many Illegal Wiretapping Programs Does Bush Have?

VIDEO: Interview: AT&T Mark Klein on Bush's Illegal Surveillance and Retroactive Immunity

[leveymg]

58. "everything is captured and stored" and then run through several computer systems,

in several countries, and has been since before 9/11. You can bet on it.

[havocmom]

2. Fax it to Harry & Nancy

along with instructions to do their fucking job.

[robinlynne]

7. hear hear

[Botany]

10. They are gonna send him letter ASAP

And that will fix everything.

[Individualist]

66. ...a strongly worded letter

That'll do it!

[L. Coyote]

36. Create havoc and prove you are ill-informed at the same time.

Man, what is wrong with DUers? Are they really so stupid?

[leftchick]

51. like they even read faxes from us

"the little people". She ain't Marie Antoinette Pelosi for nothin!

[HughMoran]

3. K&R

This scumbag was planning his takeover from the beginning.

[JohnnyLib2]

4. Frightening. The more we hear, the worse it gets.

:grr: Gotta check my *countdown calendar.

[The Backlash Cometh]

50. We should not tolerate it.

[SpiralHawk]

5. The republicons stole the elections, then they stole America's freedom tradition

and they had it PLANNED from the gitgo...

Mighty damn low.

K & R

[robinlynne]

6. And yet Reid considers putting immunity up for a vote? For god's sake, don't his people

read?

[Selatius]

17. Either they have a literacy problem, or they can read and introduced the immunity bill anyway.

Somebody big got to Harry Reid. I can feel it.

[kestrel91316]

32. They got to Reid and Pelosi. And if you go back, you can probably

figure about when they did, based on their demeanors and actions and speech.

Somebody (gee, I wonder who) is threatening their lives and reputations and family safety/security. Just my guess.

[L. Coyote]

35. Maybe you could replace guessing with the facts. They are in this thread already.

[L. Coyote]

27. Read the details. Wyden makes a valid point.

From: RESTORE: Warrantless Spying Showdown Postponed to Monday -- UPDATED
Dec-14-07 - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2472375

Wyden:

I want to say a word about the process which the distinguished senate majority leader has jus touched on. I was one of two in the senate intelligence committee to oppose the intelligence committee's version of the legislation. I am strongly opposed to granting telecommunications companies total retroactive immunity when they have been accused of wrongdoing in the president's wireless wiretapping legislation. It was the major reasonable why i opposed the legislation.

I do, however, respect Senator Reid's decision to hold the debate on this legislation under the regular senate rules. certainly, the distinguished majority leader has been under a lot of pressure from all sides to change the rules that in one way might favor one side or the other, but i think the majority leader has made the right decision by insisting that this debate go by the book.

I've had the chance now to work with the distinguished majority leader for more than a quarter of a century. I know how much respect he has for the senate and for this institution. He firmly believes in the committee process. He firmly believes in the senate rules and traditions, and he worked to carry those beliefs out as both the minority whip and the minority leader.

[robinlynne]

28. which is what? Leahy sent in a bill with no immunity. Feinstein sent in a bill with

immunity. and your point is?

[L. Coyote]

33. Did you read it or not? JUMP the GUN analysis can backfire is my point.

Which version is introduced is due to Senate procedures and tradition, not which version Reid favors.

What is so damn difficult to understand about that? Nothing.
Some people mindlessly bash a Dem without knowing the facts!

You asked.

[robinlynne]

57. Pls explain what procedure obliges Reid to put this version forward.

[leftchick]

52. um, yes they do but.....

the fact remains they do not care.

[MadMaddie]

8. So I have a question for my fellow DUers.

Why? Why would those newly in power have a need to spy on everyday Americans if all was good when they first got into office?

The * says it was to track Drug Crimes....but we know better don't we?

Maybe and I am just throwing it out there....maybe they knew something was coming before they got into office?

Maybe they were putting the foundation in place....in case some catastrophic event happened on American soil? If this is true this is the greatest crime committed by a sitting * Troll and all of his henchmen.

We know that they were going into Iraq if he got into office...he had already committed to that.

I don't know about you but I have a feeling more than ever that they had something to do with 9/11. I am not a conspiracy kind of person but when more facts keep getting outed....as with all theories....they are proven or disproven, In this case they are being proven with each passing day.....

[NJCher]

15. if you'd just stolen an election

Wouldn't you want the power to tap into the communications of people who were questioning you?

That's what I think it was.m

Cement the coup.



Cher

[L. Coyote]

42. If your Dad might go to jail without an effective cover-up. George Bush Sr.

George Bush Sr. May Face Charges: Conspiring to Kidnap and Murder Political Activists
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2459135&mesg_id=2459135

One of the first things Junior did was cover-up Daddy's files, so they would remain secret...

[kestrel91316]

34. BFEE and friends have been planning revenge and a fascist takeover

SINCE NIXON GOT THROWN OUT. Mark my words.

[malaise]

54. Bingo

and the coup began on election night 2000.

[MadMaddie]

65. I have no doubt

[L. Coyote]

40. Simple $$$$$$$$ and lots and lots of it. Corporate intelligence, stock trading,

you name it, information is knowledge, knowledge is money.

How would you like to know about mergers before they are announced, etc.

How about politics?

[kentuck]

9. ITMFA !

Impeach the Mother F**ker Already!

[MadMaddie]

11. Yes....ITMFA....what the hell is Reid and Pelosi waiting for?

[L. Coyote]

47. Your signature on this petition?

http://www.wexlerwantshearings.com/

[Selatius]

12. If this happened in France, there would be another French Revolution. n/t

[spanone]

13. the neocons took control after the supreme court appointed junior dictator

[cornermouse]

14. You know. When you stop to think about it.

Spying on those who he is in charge of is probably not anything Dubya hasn't done before at one or all of the companies who were unfortunate enough to have him as either the owner or the CEO.

[Frustratedlady]

16. Spying was their way of getting enough "goods" on those they wanted to control.

Congress, for instance.

[Blackhatjack]

18. The 'rot' will come out, and it will be worse than we imagined....

I predict this will be the era to which historians will point out as the most corrupt and criminal in the history of our country.

[balantz]

59. Let's pray it's the last.

[balantz]

60. Meaning the last of the worst eras.

[hfojvt]

19. it's hard to tell that this came from Bush

Sounds like an NSA thing unless Bush/Cheney a) hit the ground running and b) were micromanaging the NSA. Given the way governments operate, I cannot believe you set something like this up in two weeks. Bush was still nominating his cabinet and the NSA was presumably still being run by somebody left from the Clinton administration.

[deminks]

20. Read the NYT article, please.

(snip)

But lawyers for the plaintiffs say that if the suit were allowed to proceed, internal AT&T documents would verify the engineer’s account.

“What he saw,” said Bruce Afran, a New Jersey lawyer representing the plaintiffs along with Carl Mayer, “was decisive evidence that within two weeks of taking office, the Bush administration was planning a comprehensive effort of spying on Americans’ phone usage.”

(end snip)

Doesn't say anything about Clinton, now does it?

[hfojvt]

24. that was what a lawyer said

the article said this:

"The N.S.A., though, wanted to extend its reach even earlier. In December 2000, agency officials wrote a transition report to the incoming Bush administration, saying the agency must become a “powerful, permanent presence” on the commercial communications network, a goal that they acknowledged would raise legal and privacy issues."

December of 2000. Who was President then?

According to this information, Michael Hayden was head of the NSA from March 1999 until August 2005.

http://www.nsa.gov/about/about00015.cfm

Meaning, apparently that Clinton appointed him and he was still in charge of the NSA in December 2000. It is the NSA driving this process, not the Bush Administration.

[deminks]

26. The NSA wrote that letter to the incoming Bush administration,

not the Clinton administration, about becoming "powerful". The NSA clearly thought the Bush administration would accommodate them as the Clinton administration had not. And, the NSA brings up the legal and privacy issues with their new "goal" to the incoming Bush administration. This letter, I would like to see the date, must have been written before the Supreme Court ink had dried. Looks to me as if the NSA is begging Bush to let loose the dogs of war.

Clinton, contrary to popular freeper belief, did not do everything.

[hfojvt]

41. they may have made the same request to Gore

that's my point. It's not the Bush Administration driving in this case, it is the NSA, and Clinton certainly had some impact on this because he is the one who made Hayden the head of the NSA.

[Beetwasher]

21. We've Always Been At War W/ Terror

Only traitors don't remember 9/11.

[L. Coyote]

37. We have always terrorized other countries, creating enemies who attack us.

Read --and study-- this thread:

George Bush Sr. May Face Charges: Conspiring to Kidnap and Murder Political Activists
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2459135&mesg_id=2459135

When they come to your village and carry away the liberals, you will get it, especially if the disappear from an airplane over the wilderness!

[Beetwasher]

56. Umm, I Was Being Facetious

You know, Orwell. "We've always been at war w/ Eurasia."

[Junkdrawer]

22. Next you're going to tell me that this whole "War on Terror" is a sham...

to allow our ruling elite to start wars that would allow them to control the world's only large under-utilized oil reserves.

*holds hands over ears* La La La La La La La La La La

[marmar]

23. Proof that the PNAC fascist coup was in the works well before 2000.....

.... Shrub was their mule. ...... The enabler of their "Shock Doctrine."

[Disturbed]

30. Michael Vincent Hayden, USAF

Michael Vincent Hayden, USAF (born March 17, 1945 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania) is the current Director of the Central Intelligence Agency. From April 21, 2005–May 26, 2006 he was the Principal Deputy Director of National Intelligence, a position which made him "the highest-ranking military intelligence officer in the armed forces," and he is currently the only non-rated Air Force four-star general.<1>

He was director of the National Security Agency (NSA) from 1999–2005. During his tenure as director, the longest in the history of the agency, he oversaw the controversial NSA surveillance of technological communications between persons in the United States and alleged foreign terrorist groups.

[babylonsister]

39. It's funny he pleads ignorance to so much with such a background.

And IIRC, the Dems loved him and confirmed him easily.

[L. Coyote]

46. Bush's illegal spying was done by Hayden. So now, the CIA Director is a co-conspirator

in the illegal surveillance. That explains a lot of obfuscation, not to mention promotion to that job.

[williesgirl]

29. Send to Keith, maybe he can interview the lawyer for this guy. rec'd

[L. Coyote]

44. AT&T Whistleblower Mark Klein On Olbermann

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x68136

[wiggs]

31. Careful. NYT should talk to Rather about double and triple checking sources

and verifying that they are provable. If the story can be discredited or smeared, the underlying truth disappears.

Why anonymous? Does the tipster think the FBI doesn't know who talked with reporters? Or is it anonymous because it is a planned leak?

[L. Coyote]

38. There are numerous sources for this now, and numerous instances.

Study this case:

Nacchio and Qwest: Another Political Prosecution?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2051298

[dysfunctional press]

45. they wanted to be ready for when 9/11 happened.

seems to me...

[Kansas Wyatt]

49. There went their excuse that they need it to protect America....

Just like every other excuse they've blathered.

[The Backlash Cometh]

48. At this point, I would be happy to allow Bush to serve out his time as president,

if,afterwards, we could escort him to jail so he can serve out his time in prison.

[balantz]

61. I'm afraid to leave THEM in office. It would be best if we could impeach & etc..

[malaise]

53. And then 9/11 conveniently happened

I believe in Santa Claus NOT!

[SpiralHawk]

55. "Smirk, smirk, smirk/" - Commander AWOL

[Pavulon]

69. Dont feed the morons

the tlas have been doing this for 60 years or more. It spans generations.

[lovuian]

62. I wonder if they listened in on Diana's phones???

I bet they did and I bet they listened in on businesses too

[deminks]

67. Actually, the NSA specifically denied targeting her,

although they had 39 documents that referenced her.

(from 1 year ago)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/11/AR2006121101374.html

LONDON, Dec. 11 -- In a rare public comment on its intelligence operations, the National Security Agency said Monday that it had 39 documents containing references to the late Princess Diana but had never targeted her telephone communications for monitoring.

The statement came in response to British media reports that U.S. intelligence officials had intercepted Diana's calls on the day she died in a car crash in Paris in 1997. According to the reports, the officials had assured Scotland Yard investigators working on a pending report that 39 classified documents about her final conversations revealed no sign that her death was anything but an accident.

In its statement Monday, the agency said it had released information about the documents earlier. "The 39 NSA-originated and NSA-controlled documents referenced in a response to a Freedom of Information Act request in 1998 only contained references to the Princess, and she was never the communicant," the statement said. "NSA did not target Princess Diana's communications."

The agency declined further comment pending release of the Scotland Yard report, which is due out Thursday. "NSA has cooperated with the investigations into this tragic incident to the full extent of the law," it said.

[deacon]

63. k + r n/t

[downindixie]

64. I'll bet they listen in on

Senators and congressmen.They probably hit them early so they would have dirt on them.Thats why so many are sitting on their hands!

[Pavulon]

68. Psst. New technology, OLD METHOD

western union redirected ALL telegrams, the email of its day, to be decoded. These functions span administrations.

Please do not delude yourself into believing this will stop.

Disclosing operational information about any this activity is directly illegal. Not civil illegal, criminal illegal.

BTW it is legal to intercept foreign traffic. Spooling data may be different than decoding it.

There are plenty of aspects of how handling this data could work that may not be clear.

It is not like one wire is domestic and one is foreign. Going after powers that span administrations is very stupid.

[L. Coyote]

70. visibility kick