US News: Even college grads might want to consider blue-collar careers

[flashl]

Last year, because U.S. News readers tend to be college educated, we included only careers that typically require at least a bachelor's degree. This year we've added four careers that don't. Why? More and more students are graduating from college at the same time that employers are offshoring more professional jobs. So, many holders of a bachelor's degree are having trouble finding jobs that require college-graduate skills. Meanwhile, society has been telling high school students that college is the way, so there's an accelerating shortage of skilled people in jobs that don't require college. (Why else do you think you have to pay $100 an hour for a plumber?)

U.S. News

Older Forbes article:

Five Reasons To Skip College

College is expensive. Four years at an elite university like Princeton or Harvard will set you back around $160,000.

That’s a lot of money, but consider the benefits: The professors, the coursework, the people you’ll meet and the invaluable experiences you’ll have. And, of course, the bottom line: You’ll earn more money afterward. In fact, on average, the holder of a four-year college degree will earn 62% more over their lifetimes than a typical high-school graduate. And that’s just on average. The return on investment for attending one of the nation’s 25 or so most selective colleges is far more impressive. Money well spent, right?

Well, not necessarily.

...

Economists like Robert Reischauer ruffled feathers several years ago by pointing out that talented, driven kids are more likely to go to college in the first place--that they succeed, in other words, because of their innate abilities, not because of their formal education.

...

College-skippers could invest the $144,000 savings and have a nice nest-egg built up by the time they are in their mid-30s. And they could use their formative years between 18 and 22 to learn an actual trade.

The reasons:

1. You'll be losing four working years.

There's an opportunity cost associated with going to college: Not only will you lose the money you'll have spent on tuition, you'll also be out the amount of money that you could have made if you'd worked during those four years. And if your family isn't wealthy enough to pay for your education on their own, you'll also owe a hefty amount in interest payments for your student loans. Perhaps more importantly, with four years of experience on your resume, you’ll be far better off when looking for work than the average 22-year-old college graduate.

2. You won't necessarily earn less money.
College grads earn an average 62% more over the course of their careers than high school grads. But economist Robert Reischauer of the Brookings Institution in Washington, D.C., argues that those numbers are skewed by the fact that smarter kids are more likely to go to college in the first place. In other words, the profitability of higher education is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

3. In fact, you could probably make more money if you invested your tuition.
Put $160,000--the approximate cost of a Harvard education--into municipal bonds that pay a conservative 5%, and you'll have saved more than $500,000 in 30 years. That's far more than the average college grad will accumulate in the same amount of time.

4. You don't need to be in a classroom in order to learn something.
Truly motivated learners can teach themselves almost anything with a couple of books and an Internet connection. Want to learn a hands-on skill or trade? Consider an apprenticeship.

5. Plenty of other people did fine
Bill Gates, Larry Ellison, Quentin Tarantino, David Geffen, and Thomas Edison, among others, never graduated from college. Peter Jennings and John D. Rockefeller never finished high school.

Forbes

[marmar]

1. It's a sad state of affairs.....

..... It's getting to the point where a B.S. isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

[ThomWV]

2. In order to persue Blue Collar jobs there in fact have to be some Blue Collar jobs

Cause its real hard to have a paying career in an industry that does not exist.

[zabet]

4. Exactly...

My DIL, 4 year degree, can only
find a job being a waitress. She
studied for 4 years for that?!?!

[alarimer]

3. Sorry. Most people are not Bill Gates or Larry Ellison

College is a good place. It is usually the first time people live on their own or with roommates. OR at least away from the folks. And most colleges are fairly diverse places so you are forced to interact with others who are not like you.

That Forbes advice is bullshit. I agree that college is expensive but it is most certainly NOT a waste of time. It can open doors that might not otherwise be open to you.

And blue-collar jobs pay shit generally. How many unionized factory jobs are left in this country? Not too damn many. And I know I would be miserable in a job that had no intellectual stimulation. Bored out of my fucking mind putting widgets together or some damn thing.

[dysfunctional press]

6. there are still some very good blue-collar jobs...

i'd be a lot more bored sitting on my ass all day doing accounting, or selling insurance- just getting fatter and older and looking at the same four walls day in and day out.

construction jobs let you work outside in the fresh air, and with the constant physical activity it keeps you in terrific shape- and the union pay and benefits are better than what most office workers get.

[MindPilot]

13. I think everyone should work construction at least once in their life

For the very reasons you mention and it exposes one to so many different skills.

There is no greater satisfaction than driving past some structure and being able to say "I helped build that."

[alarimer]

29. No thanks

I work outside. I am a biologist. It's either too hot (Texas in the summer- blech) or in some places it's too cold.

I don't want to ever build or repair anything.

[Warren Stupidity]

14. Bill Gates: trust fund baby.

I have no idea re Ellison. Bill is the opposite of a good example.

[awoke_in_2003]

16. "That Forbes advice is bullshit"

Bingo. The people who really run this country want an uneducated workforce for 2 reasons: they make less money, and a good education tends to liberalize people.

[alarimer]

31. I didn't say it very well but that was what I was trying to say.

There is a definite correlation with the amount of higher education a person has and the degree to which they identify as liberals. Why do you think the right complains so much about all those liberal professors? Many of them are in fact liberals, both because of their broader education and for the fact that liberals are more likely to go into teaching than conservatives. I am sure I had some conservative professors but I don't recall a whole lot of them.

If a high school education was as thorough as it once was, you could probably safely skip college and be as well read as anyone. But even when I was in high school 20 years ago, they were becoming more concerned with standardized tests and teaching that material. And then there is the whole fight over evolution. There is NO such fight on college campuses. You are likely not to pass college level biology classes if you profess a belief in evolution (on an exam or paper or something), except maybe at Liberty, which I do not consider a "real" university.

[aikoaiko]

5. Its true, going into big time college debt for a low-paying job makes no sense what so ever

unless you have a passion and a willingness to endure the financial hardships.

On the other hand, I've seen a lot of my friends who wrecked their bodies doing hard labor (albeit still skilled).

One still needs to be smart about choosing career paths whether it be through college or not.

eta: I always like to add that if your a GA high school student with a b average, you're college tuition is free plus a little book money at any GA college. If you move to GA after high school, you pay for your first year and then get free tuition if you have a B average.

[dmallind]

7. The point about the lack of skilled tradespeople is correct

The rest is feel good crap. That cost of a Harvard education is full boat no grant/scholarship/aid level. Few indeed pay that rate, and when they do it's not in a lump sum - false dichotomy there. The huge pay difference is not just because the smarter kids go on to college, because pure intellect and demonstrated earning power are only loosely correlated anyway. Not picking on MBAs (I am one after all) but the big money in, say, pharma companies is for the ones who can sell either ideas or things well in a business setting, not the ones who come up with the hard science. I know if my life depended on picking out a genius IQ at random I'd be doing it in the pokey labs not the mahogany offices. I also know the pay difference between the two. College gives an earning advantage because the labor market values PROVEN ability to learn and assimilate (questionable though that may be in many cases). Factory workers and semi-skilled blue collar types may be stark raving geniuses, but they will not be paid like them - ever. Plumbers et al have similarly proven they can learn and assimilate, just in a different way, and are similarly valued in the work place. Given the choice for me? I'd rather move a mouse than a wrench and I'd rather be surrounded by computer screens than shit, so I'll keep on taking the business route. Given the choice for a kid just coming up? I'd say think long and hard about whether you can handle the wrench and the shit, because you'll probably be more secure and not that less well off if you can.

[OHdem10]

8. Blue Collar Jobs Now---Hairdressers, Cosmetologists,

Lawn Services, Better Paying Mfg jobs are gone or soon will be.

Think about it. If College Grad are forced to take these jobs
the Middle Class and Poor will resemble Third World Country.

This is what the next President faces. Most Candidates on both
sides are so cautious when it comes to Globalization and Trade
Policy. Cannot afford to offend the Elites and Corporates.

If a person such as myself sitting in a home in Ohio, saw all
of this coming---Our Senators and Representatives (have much
more access to information) should have seen it coming. Some
did. Others must be so in debt to Big Business that they are
willing to throw the Middle Class and Poor under the bus. Yes,
this is harsh. I love this Country and it pains me to see
it harmonize downward to the point of Third World Status.

[durrrty libby]

9. Higher education is never a waste and one can attend a state university

quite reasonably and often at no cost.

Concentrating heavily on math and sciences can be a valuable track to follow

[madrchsod]

10. there are a lot of blue collar tech jobs

most start at 15 per hour and usually top out at 20-25 depending on location. two year degree and if your employee pays for continuing education even more money or management position.

[OHdem10]

17. As was explained, grab a tech job if you can-- but understand

these are the jobs most likely taken by countries where workers
can be hired at much lower wages. The point: You cannot depend
on Hi Tech. Unless we drop the wages in this country in order
to compete with China, India, Asian Countries and some Slovakian
countries.

The point is: It is not education that is being bargained.
It is who works for the least amount of money. Companies
are in search of cheapest labor.

College education always are a good thing for your growth as
individual. No one argues that. The point is do not believe
that because you have a college education, you are headed upward
on Socioeconomic Scale.

[kitkat65]

11. They just don't want people to learn how to think or reason -

Something you don't really get in K-12.

[OHdem10]

19. Newsweek, Vanity Fair CNN would never discourage people

from getting an education. They are simply giving information
on the state of our country.

Everyone should get as much education as you can. You cannot
count on your education getting you a high paying job. That
is their only point.

[MindPilot]

12. OK. Fine well and good. BUUUUUUT...

I get the feeling the article was written by someone who's closest encounter with "blue collar work" is buying a car. Especially since they are looking at a raw return on investing tuition like someone going off to college has 160k just lying around waiting for a trip to the stock market.

Used to be a time when someone who wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer could make it through high school (or not), go to work at the local factory and earn a comfortable living; those days are gone. And I don't think those are the jobs the authors are referring to.

I think they are talking about the skilled trades and those require every bit as much background knowledge and experience as the wall street broker or the marketing analyst. Problem is there are very few trade schools, and even fewer apprenticeship programs. Most high schools have cut way back on vocational programs and we live in a culture that for decades has denigrated anyone who works with their hands.

Maybe now that we have hit a point were it's near impossible to get anything built or fixed with any degree of quality, the "economists" will see the error of their ways.

[Nay]

15. What's funny is that few ppl "invest" $160,000 in college--they BORROW

it, and expect their higher earning power to help them pay it back. A person who does not go to college doesn't have that $160,000 to invest -- he simply hasn't borrowed it. That's good, don't get me wrong, but this article acts like pple have that money to work with if they just don't waste it on college. They don't. At best, they haven't gone into debt.

[BadgerLaw2010]

24. Yeah...what the hell was that Forbes writer smoking?

Sure, it's great if you can invest $160,000 for a newly minted 18 year-old, but that doesn't mean, oh, that most people HAVE that money.

Just about everyone who isn't filthy rich or going to their in-state public university pays for college with debt. And out-of-state public is almost as expensive as Ivy League. Certainly the same order of magnitude.

[Romulox]

25. 18 y.o.s have to borrow to "invest"--whether in an Education or a mutual fund

Either way, they don't have the money, so they will have to borrow. There's no intrinsic reason borrowing money for college "makes more sense" (from an economic standpoint) than borrowing for any other "investment".

So the question is not whether the average 18 has $160,000 to "invest" (in an education or elsewhere.) The question in the OP is: Which "investment" provides the greatest return?

[blogslut]

18. FYI

In order to qualify for a cosmetology license, one must complete an average of 1500 hours of accredited training, plus pass written and practical exams.

[LostInAnomie]

20. The Forbes article is a load of elitist shit, but that does not change the fact....

... that a BS is rapidly becoming worthless, and in many cases people are going to college because they have been led to believe that it is a guarantee of better finances in the future. This is not even close to the truth. In many cases (if not an even 50/50 split), it would have been better if these people would have pursued a trade, or entered factory work.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

32. You are right.

My B.A. and J.D. were worthless in getting me a job, even as a legal assistant.

I had an associate's degree in a vocational field (court reporting--the stenographer that takes down all the trial testimony in shorthand on a Stenograph machine). I did that for quite a few years, but the job stress got to me. There were many grumpy, nasty lawyers and judges that griped at me when I was doing absolutely perfect work. I assume they did this just because they enjoyed their power over other people and got off on bullying subordinates. I was burned out in less than twenty years because I couldn't handle it anymore. I had high blood pressure, which endangered my health, and was turning into a very grumpy person.

The B.A. was good for expanding my mind, which college does to people. I'm glad I have the knowledge I acquired with the B.A. and the J.D. (law degree), but it was a cruel farce that I believed that my earning power would increase with those degrees.

[flashl]

21. Continuation of US News article ...

NonCollege Careers

The four noncollege careers we added would be rewarding even to many college graduates, especially because college grads are likely to stand out against the competition. Those added careers are: biomedical equipment technician, firefighter, hairstylist/cosmetologist, and locksmith/security system technician. Other skilled blue-collar careers that scored well on our selection criteria: machinist (manufacturers report a shortage), nuclear plant technician (few people are entering the field, yet plans are on the books for building more plants), and electrician/electronics tech (above-average pay, and it's easier on the body than many other blue-collar careers). The takeaway: Many college graduates should consider skilled-trade careers.

Government

Government is becoming an employer of choice. Corporations, fueled by pressures to compete globally, continue to get ever leaner. Nonprofits are increasingly strapped because of donor fatigue and continued scandals. Government, beneficiary of increased tax revenues in good times and often able to raise taxes in bad times, has the luxury of continually paying employees well, whether it's an economically sound practice or not. As the last bastion of job security, government offers good pay, ample sick days, holidays, vacation days, health insurance, and retirement benefits. With signs pointing to the Democrats taking control of the White House plus both houses of Congress, government hiring of nonmilitary personnel can be expected to increase. So, we have added government manager to the list of Best Careers.


Career resistance to Offshoring
Consider a career's resistance to offshoring. Well-publicized failures of offshoring may have led the public to think that companies are reducing its use. In fact, companies are quietly increasing offshoring efforts, even jobs previously considered to be better left in the United States: innovation and marketing research, for example. So, we have added offshore resistance to the criteria we used in selecting the Best Careers. Offshore resistance was one of the factors that led to adding these careers to this year's list: curriculum/training specialist, genetic counselor, ghostwriter, investment banker, mediator, and usability/user experience specialist.

[ThePowerofWill]

22. I kinda agree with the article.

I make more money than most college grads($64,000 a yr). I am well invested, and soon to retire at around 40yrs old. I do nothing more than work on a shipping dock. Been working for the same man for over 20yrs. I've stuck a $100 a wk in my retirement account, matched dollar for dollar by the company. My home is paid for, i owe no money, kids are gone.

At a time when many folks are really just getting started, feeling stable, and starting a family. I am pretty much finished, and can enjoy my older years.

Also i would like to add that somehow or another people have been fooled into thinking there is no pride to be found in a manual labor job. For some reason so many folks see it as beneath them, and look down on those of us who do perform these jobs. That one reason they got away with off shoring many jobs, "we didn't want them", "we are to good to work with our hands".

We need blue collar jobs, good ones. Not everyone is suited, nor wants to go to college. Do we just abandon these people? Thats what i heard a talking head say the other week on NPR. He said off shoring ans immigration only effect those of us in the blue collar area with a Hs diploma or less. He was saying we should just toss off these worries because it only effects a 1/3rd of us. So a full 1/3rd of our population is expendable so the rest of you can have your cheap ass t.v.'s, and dvd players.

Also just because you choose to work in a blue collar job and skip college does not mean you are dumb, or ignorant. One can always choose to take the time and make the effort to educate themselves as i have done. You could ask either of my sisters who both went to college who is the smarter in the family. They'll both tell you i am the smarter, and the more well informed outside of their prospective specialties.

[MadHound]

23. One thing that they're failing to mention here

Is that blue-collar jobs are generally harder on the worker health-wise than jobs you obtain with a college degree. I've worked in blue collar jobs for the past quarter century, everything from roofing to fire fighter to a nuclear plant tech, and it has taken a serious toll on my health. My knees especially, along with other joints, are shot, my back is not in good shape, etc. etc. Wouldn't surprise me if I didn't pick up some sort of carcinogen or three during the way either. It's a big reason that I've now gone into college, to get a degree, get me out of blue collar, and save the rest of my body's resources for working in my orchard rather than working for the man.

I agree that there are is a shortage of certain tradespeople, and that you can acquire an education on your own. But the fact of the matter is that a lot of blue collar jobs have been and are being offshored. In addition, blue collar pay is lower, benefits are lower, and your position is much more expendable than white collar, college grad jobs.

One thing that they fail to mention is that if you can get on at most colleges and universities, they generally have either discounted or free tuition for employees and their immediate family. Sure, it takes longer working full time and going to school, but you also don't have that huge debt facing you at the end.

[THUNDER HANDS]

26. after attending a 4-year college

I got a job that paid $22,000 a year.

after going back to school at a 2-year techinical school, I have a job that now pays $60,000 a year.


Universities are a rip-off.

[flashl]

28. Have you read this? Ehrenreich makes her case ...

BAIT & SWITCH: The (Futile) Pursuit of the American Dream

In Bait and Switch, Barbara Ehrenreich takes on the problems of the college-educated worker facing lay-offs, outsourcings, and downsizings. Going undercover as a white collar job seeker with a plausible résumé, she attempts to land a middle-class job—undergoing career coaching and personality testing, then trawling a series of EST-like boot camps, job fairs, networking events, and evangelical job-search ministries. She gets an image makeover, works to project a winning attitude, yet is proselytized, scammed, lectured, and—again and again—rejected.

Bait and Switch highlights the people who’ve done everything right—gotten college degrees, developed marketable skills, and built up impressive résumés—yet have become repeatedly vulnerable to financial disaster, and not simply due to the vagaries of the business cycle. Today’s ultra-lean corporations take pride in shedding their “surplus” employees—plunging them, for months or years at a stretch, into the twilight zone of white-collar unemployment, where job searching becomes a full-time job in itself. As Ehrenreich discovers, there are few social supports for these newly disposable workers—and little security even for those who have jobs.

[Swamp Rat]

27. Bad advice.

"There's an opportunity cost associated with going to college." - More bad advice from an MBA who equates life with market economics.

1. You'll be losing four working years. - No. You'll be gaining four years of intellectual training that will make you much smarter, and open the doors to many other careers.

2. You won't necessarily earn less money. - But you will likely earn a lot less money, working very long hours as a manual laborer.

3. In fact, you could probably make more money if you invested your tuition. - Right, just think if you invested in Enron. Lacking critical thinking skills makes one rely upon the bad advice of others. Plus, 500k will not have the same purchasing power in 30 years, if it is not lost due to some unforeseen event, whereas no one can take away your education.

4. You don't need to be in a classroom in order to learn something. - Truism. We all do, but those of us who go to college learn a hell of a lot more.

5. Plenty of other people did fine. - Fallacy. Just a few individuals did "fine." The other billions of us will not, especially those with little or no education.


The dumbing down of America continues...

[Elspeth]

30. Who has tuition money to invest except for the rich who WON'T be working blue collar?

"3. In fact, you could probably make more money if you invested your tuition. - Right, just think if you invested in Enron. Lacking critical thinking skills makes one rely upon the bad advice of others. Plus, 500k will not have the same purchasing power in 30 years, if it is not lost due to some unforeseen event, whereas no one can take away your education."

Everyone I have known in school is on student loans which can't be borrowed for investment purposes.


This is propaganda from TPTB who know we have no economy left and wish to keep as many as people as possible on the bottom rung.

[Swamp Rat]

33. Sure a lot of people are suffering from loan-itis,

including myself, but that does not preclude what I said.

At least, since I now speak foreign languages (thanks to my university education and scholarships to study abroad), I can leave the USA if I have to in order to find a job where I will also receive universal healthcare.

How many poor, uneducated, monolingual blue collar workers can immigrate to Germany? Belgium? Spain? Even though I am poor right now, and have been for many years (I have worked blue collar jobs most of my life), due to my education I have at least some mobility.