Politics as usual. Accusations and mudslinging as usual.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

It's not like there are real issues to debate other than how campaigns are run. Which is how they're always run. Like a bitter divorce or a bar brawl. Who wins these little shit slinging contests? Don't know. But we lose.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070221/ap_on_el_pr/clinton_obama_1

Clinton, Obama trade barbs over donor

WASHINGTON - Two Democratic presidential campaigns angrily accused the other of nasty politics on Wednesday over a Hollywood donor who once backed Hillary Rodham Clinton's husband but now backs her top rival.

The Clinton campaign sent out a testy news release after DreamWorks movie studio founder David Geffen, a fan of Sen. Barack Obama told The New York Times that Sen. Clinton was ambitious and polarizing.

"CLINTON CAMP TO OBAMA: CUT TIES & RETURN CASH AFTER TOP BOOSTERS VICIOUS ATTACKS," screamed the headline of the news release.

Geffen was once a top donor to former President Clinton, but said in the interview that Clinton is "a reckless guy" and he doesn't think Sen. Clinton can bring the country together during a time of war, no matter how smart or ambitious she is. Clinton communications director Howard Wolfson said there is no room in the campaign for such "personal insults." "If Senator Obama is indeed sincere about his repeated claims to change the tone of our politics, he should immediately denounce these remarks, remove Mr. Geffen from his campaign and return his money," Wolfson said.

"It is also ironic that Senator Clinton lavished praise on Monday and is fully willing to accept today the support of South Carolina state Sen. Robert Ford, who said if Barack Obama were to win the nomination, he would drag down the rest of the Democratic Party because 'he's black,'" Gibbs' statement said.

[hobbit709]

1. "Sen. Clinton was ambitious"

So what's new about that. You have to be ambitious to want a job that nobody in their right mind would want. As for the polarizing part-name one political figure that isn't. Methinks the Clinton camp doth protest too much.

[cali]

2. Seems to me this is very one sided mudslinging

so Hillary's demanding that Obama give back the money raised for him by Geffen and others, because Geffen said some mean things about the Clintons. Please. Obama is hardly responsible for what someone OUTSIDE his campaign says about her. I read the Dowd column and all Clinton is doing is proving Geffen right. He predicted that the Clinton machine would go into overtime slamming Obama. My, she sure has started early.

[DemKR]

3. Gaffen started it

I cannot believe that the anti-Hillary crowd is defending comments made against not only her, but Bill as well. I like and respect my Senator (Obama) but on this one he's wrong. The first thing I said about this campaign was I did not want Democrats attacking eachother. Admittedly, Wolfson isn't holding any punches--but let's remember who instigated it first.

Stop the fighting and work together

[blm]

4. Geffen is not part of Obama's campaign team. Clinton didn't scold Jackson for his

remark that a black would hold down the ticket right after he finished being talked into supporting Hillary by BILL.

Sorry, but Bill is making himself part of the campaign.

Obama shouldn't have brought up the Lincoln Bedroom charge but Geffen WAS RIGHT about bringing up Marc Rich as many issues going on today are linked to Rich's dealings for the BFEE for so many years, including the Plame outing.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x252817

[cali]

10. Gee, didn't an important Hillary endorser, Sen. Ford of S.

Carolina say that Obama would be bad news as the nominee because he's black? Did Hillary repudiate that statement? No. So, yes. Let's remember who started this first: The Clinton campaign.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. "He said, she said" They'll be sticking their tongues out each other next.

My complaint isn't about the who's right-who's wrong, who started it, who didn't.

It's about the lack of substance in the campaigns which everyone who has followed politics for any period of time knows damned well will be based upon "personal attacks" and the usual tripe that political campaigns engender.

I mean, everyone acts like, "Dirty politics" is a new invention every election when it's been around since Egyption Pharaohs slit each others throats for the throne.

[jobycom]

12. Just damage control, and a bit of strategy

Typical politics. She's just trying to look tough after a damaging comment from a big donor. Her demand is ridiculous, but her real intent, I suspect, is to make people link Geffen's comments to Obama's campaign so that Geffen's comments seem politically motivated rather than personal. Also, to set a standard. Obama won't do anything about this donor, obviously, but he may tell the next donor to cool it, to avoid possible negative press. There's the danger to Obama that if a series of donors attack Hillary, people will start to think Obama is encouraging them to lash out for him. At least, Hillary is setting it up for people to wonder that. Obama doesn't want to be labeled as the one who started the dirty campaigning.

Minor positioning struggle in the early part of a long campaign. Obama wins this one, but Hillary has tried to position herself for future battles.

Maybe. Or maybe they are both whiney-babies! :rofl:

[jobycom]

6. Opening jabs in the beginning of the first round. Testing the other's defenses.

Pretty standard. Right now it's still all about the footwork.

[RestoreGore]

7. Politics in general sucks

And people wonder why so many are disillusioned and don't vote... or don't run.

[Double T]

8. NOW DEMOCRATS are at each others throats............

WTF are 'WE' doing PEOPLE?!?!? Time to tone down the backbiting rhetoric!!

[KoKo]

11. The Mainstream Corporate Media will crawl on it like Flies to Honey...

Make it about the Dem Candidates and not the Dem Issues. The Repugs will sit back and laugh as the top two destroy each other.

Meanwhile Al Gore plays to full house in Toronto...and Dennis Kucinich and Bill Richardson and Joe Biden and Chris Dodd...stand back and watch...

And our Dem issues go drifting.... Perfect for the Repugs and the DLC.

[Double T]

13. I WAS worried about rethuglic 'swift boating'............

NOW I'm worried about 'OUR' own self destruction.

[KoKo]

9. Yes...Campaigns calling themselves "Teams" and going at each

other using RW Talking Points. I thought we'd gotten beyond that kind of trash and it makes me think less of both Obama and Clinton for engaging in it. Obama the new JFK and Superstar opposing the Powerhouse Clintons....who will be left standing when the battle is won.

I suspect neither of them are going to be the last standing because people are sick of this and don't want to see Dems using RW Talking Points from Fox/Limbaugh/ and the rest of the Wingers continue.

It makes Obama look bad and reminds folks of what the Clinton years were like.... NO MORE OF THIS! Focus on Bush instead of on these attacts on each other.

Amazing the DU'ers who buy into this and start cheering for their candidates team in who can better "smackdown" the other.

[KoKo]

14. Good Minds like "Digby" are verifying what you say...Kick! n/t

[mod mom]

15. Wolfson looks like he has sour grapes (that Obama is doing so well) and is doing

damage to the Clinton campaign. WTF? Return the $ for something Geffen says? Tweety is asking him about whether this is a strategy of theirs-first they attacked Edwards now Obama. Wolfson also said Hillary will NEVER (tweety repeated asked Never?) apologize for her vote. (Guess she doesn't want to admit she was wrong. Hmmh...who does that remind me of?

Sounds desperate to me! I'm no Hilary fan but I'd get rid of this guy, fast.

[Thothmes]

16. As usual

And to think its only starting. Going to last for another year and a half.