I just saw the most irritating Navy commercial

[margotb822]

They showed pictures of Tomahawks and unmanned vehicles, and then the super-manly, extra deep voice: "Working every day to unman the front lines. Navy."

WTF?!? Ok, what is their tactic? Are they not supporting the war? Are they trying to lure people in with the fact that they probably won't get killed? Are technological weapons somehow better than guns with people behind them? I'm totally confused.

And, I'm in the Navy, so I don't know how I feel about it. Every day, people are getting pulled from their non-front line jobs to go to Iraq. They are working there to free up Army and Marine Corps personnel to go to the front-front lines. So, I can say with certainty that they are working every day to send more people to the front lines.

This commercial sucks!

[Bigmack]

1. A friend's son...

was a Navy helo pilot. Then he got sent for infantry training in Kansas or someplace, and now he's in Afghanistan. Not flying helos.

"Join the Navy and see the world.... faaaaar from the water."

Of course, we all know that all recruiters might just stretch the truth a tad.

[soup]

5. "volunteers and voluntolds"

is how a friend of my son put it when he came over last fall to say his goodbyes.

A Navy helicopter mechanic - also sent for infantry training - he's now serving in Afghanistan, too.

[defendandprotect]

2. Are you in danger of being sent to Iraq?

[margotb822]

3. We all are

They ask for people of every rank and rate. And when we give our inputs for orders, we also have to give our inputs for global war on terrorism duty (as in: I prefer Bahrain over Qatar over Afghanistan). It is better than the Army though. My friend is deploying for her second 15 month tour. I'm not upset about having gone to the Naval Academy, but I definitely don't think the administration is using the military effectively. People are so burned out and everyone is getting redirected into this quagmire. They are losing a lot of good people due to bad policies.

[jmowreader]

4. They're trying to sell the concept of long-range mass destruction

As in, "Hey! Look at all the shit we are working on/with! You can sit in a nice cozy Combat Information Center on a ship parked in Bahrain, push buttons and kill bad guys in Baghdad without worrying about the bad guys being able to shoot back!"

Which beats the Army's "up close and personal" way of dealing with the problem, ya gotta admit.

Unfortunately, they don't tell you about the paragraph in the enlistment contract which basically says the military reserves the right to hand you an M-16 and put you on a truck headed straight into Indian Country.

[Echo In Light]

6. There was a disturbing Boeing TV commercial a few yrs ago...

That interspersed clips of typical brainwashed Americana posturing alongside blatantly pro-military suggestions to reinforce the idea of militarism being equated with being ALL AMURIKAN. The really creepy shots show what appeared to be missiles/ICBMs being launched from underground, cut with "normal" Americans smiling, planning weddings {with guys in military gear, of course}, shit like that. It was pretty easy to see they had quite an investment on their hands.

[B Calm]

7. Maybe the US Navy is saying they unman the front lines of the enemy. . .

[Orsino]

8. Yeah.

Their promises of antiseptic war only apply to Americans, if at all. It's the neocon wet dream of endless war without loss of American lives to drive the hippies into the streets.

[LibertyLover]

9. My 24 year old stepson just joined the Naval Reserve

and leaves for basic training in early April. He's been told that because of where he placed on the exams he could pick his specialty. He wants to be Shore Patrol. The problem is that he is 5 foot 4 inches, weighs approximately 110 pounds and has chronic back and shoulder problems, at least to hear him tell it. Not to mention a distinct lack of personal hygiene and a problem with authority. If he lasts, it might be the making of him, but frankly I'm worried that he won't make it into the SPs but will be retained as cannon fodder, with Iraq or Afghanistan his first trip ever overseas. There's nothing I can do of course, but still, every time I see a Navy commercial especially this kind, I think about the Navy personnel who far from water and ships, fighting the ground war.

[B Calm]

10. Having spent 4 years in the Navy during the Vietnam war, I

doubt very much he'll see any part of Iraq. The Navy is probably one of the better branches to get in. He'll eat three good meals a day, always have a bed, and shower. SP is no big deal. On board ship everyone, Electricians, Damage Control, Gunners Mates, Pipe Fitters, etc. etc. take their turn standing shore patrol watches.

[abninf14]

11. I joined DU to respond to this thread

I lurk around here quite often and finally had to commit to making a comment.

First, I am an Active Duty Army Infantry Officer and would like to clear up the comments about people getting "infantry training" and deploying. The "simple basic soldier tasks" that your Navy friends receiving is not "Infantry" training. It is basic marksmanship and other COE training that Non-combat arms personnel receive (because they don't get it at flight school). And when they arrive in country, they are most likely NOT doing the Infantry's mission. Are they out on patrol with the Infantry? Probly. But they aren't kicking in doors. Unless they volunteer for a MTT.


Second, there is no cannon fodder in the USN. Yes, Corpsman serve with the Marine Corps, but they are beloved, as are all combat medics. Hardly cannon fodder. Yes, EOD personnel are running around out there, but hardly cannon fodder.

Lastly, as a USN Officer, you should be embarrassed that you put Bahrain and Qatar above A-stan and Iraq when there are some junior enlisted men and women who are on their 2nd or 3rd (maybe even 4th) tour to either theater. Way to lead from the from the front.

[margotb822]

12. I'm glad you responded

I agree that people in the Navy are not getting sent out into combat situations (except in the very rare instances). My original post questioned the tactic of the Navy. What are they trying to sell? A "safer" branch of the military?

And regarding the Navy personnel sent to Iraq or Afghanistan, I said this in the original post: They are working there to free up Army and Marine Corps personnel to go to the front-front lines. So, I can say with certainty that they are working every day to send more people to the front lines.

While the sailor isn't clearing buildings, they are enabling more people to be sent there, so in fact, the Navy is working to man the front lines. So I think that the message that they are portraying isn't the truth. I guess recruiting videos never are.

As far as ranking locations, you probably know that those are the places where the Navy works out of in the gulf. Obviously, they are closer to the Pesian Gulf (the water). Iraq and Afghanistan duties are mostly joint opportunities for officers. And, I'f be lying if I said that I'd rather go to Iraq than Bahrain (most people would be). Obviously, people who join the Navy have different expectations of their military career than people who join the Army or Marine Corps. My best friend is in the Army and is going to Iraq for 15 months. I hate the thought of her (anyone) over there, in danger for something that, IMO, is crap. I'll do what they tell me to because I have to, but there is nothing that says I have to agree with, believe in or actively support terrible foreign policy.

[nealmhughes]

13. When I was in the Navy, we thought the world would end had we eaten up all the Victoria cookies.

"Rigged for reduced electrial" due to a reactor scram from a drill or "Loss of shore power imminent, rig ship for reduced electrical, top side maneuvering, raise the snorkel mast 30 feet, prepare to snorkel, station the shutdown electrical operator and diesel watch, make reports to maneuvering" was akin to being awakened to "Torpedo in the water! This not a drill! Snapshot, tube 4! Man battle stations torpedo!"

Now I am not saying that we grew lazy and complacent of our safety, but we were lazy and complacent for our continued safety. Not that there were not tremendous stress from removal from family, friends, a system that promoted continuous study and qualifications in addition to the normal rhythm of daily shipboard life, but there was no overwhelming fear for one's safety -- unlike on an aircraft carrier's flight deck or having people who were out to kill you daily, hourly, every moment as in the infantry.

What was the worse that could happen on a submarine? (Besides catastrophic flooding, of course) The 8K gpd still go down and no shower for a few days? (Like that would have bothered most of us!) No fresh baked bread or birthday cakes because you were on "rig for silent running?" Actually, probably slipping going up the ladder from the control room to the bridge when surfaced and transiting or line handling, and that was largely for lower rated very junior petty officers and seamen/firemen; we nuclear trained petty officers and most officers were "safe" from the travails of such odious duties . . . In short, unless in a naval war, the USN expects life to be "safe" and rather mundane, waiting for a swim call, the Grateful Dead Movie to be replaced at midrats, a port call, and fresh milk and fruit and veggies for explosive bowels.

This is the life pictured by recruiters, and it doesn't always work out that way. Infantry support for the Marines and Army needs to be picked up by the Navy, and I wonder how those except for the greenest recruit who has never been at sea handle this? The idea of not having a rack, a coffee pot going continually and 4 hot meals a day is anathema to the Navy -- how would old salts deal with no coffee, an open bay barracks, reville, etc.? Probably not even any lumpia! Probably not well! I would be a fish out of water, no pun intended.

God, keep the infantry and Marines safe and at home or in Europe soon!

[margotb822]

14. Haha, lumpia!

That's like a Navy mess code word :)

Yes, I agree that many people join the Navy because they won't go to the front lines. Probably. I just think it's a non sequitur for the Navy to be selling that, especially when they are sending people to Iraq and Afghanistan. The Navy does a lot of the joint work so that more Army and Marine Corps personnel can go to the front lines. It's a sad situation. The USA and USMC are so overworked and for what? BushCo's personal fantasies. I hate that people are putting their lives on the line for this administration. I hope that this will be over soon and that our troops will be home soon, too!