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Sgent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:32 PM
Original message
Why is Dennis wasting our time?
What possible purpose does this stunt serve? The chances the Senate would ever approve this is nill.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
1. it becomes part of the Congressional record. That is worth something.
someone tried.
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #1
34. I agree. Makes it clear that the GOP is supporting these activities
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tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
2. The Senate? This will never get a hearing in the House.
This is just the setup for his 2012 run for president.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
37. Unless a lot of us call our reps and tell them to GIVE IT A HEARING
That's where WE're as much to blame as our "spineless
Congresspeople" for what DOESN'T happen on the Hill.
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. Well said. n/t
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Individualist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
3. DLC sucks!
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
4. He's not wasting my time
#26 - let's go Dennis.
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Echo In Light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 06:32 AM
Response to Reply #4
118. Exactly. Speak for yourself, I say. Go Dennis!
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
5. It gets it into the RECORD ... so President Obama can carry on the investigation
If no one SAYS IT, it's like it NEVER HAPPENED. We
need someone -- a "Good German" -- to speak the TRUTH
even, if no one's listening.
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Neecy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:36 PM
Original message
exactly
He's putting a catalogue of crimes into the record, and I think that's important.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Original message
Did you just hear him mention all the subpoenas that have been disregarded?
This sounds like a pre-emptive strike in case WH tries
to keep SCOTTY from testifying, as he's agreed to do...
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KudosMan Donating Member (26 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #5
115. Kudos
Probably this is the right reason, those who say its wastage of time don't realize that its a democracy and every public official should be held responsible for his deeds, good or bad.
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 06:32 AM
Response to Reply #5
119. It didn't happen - the media didn't report on it!
:eyes:

I totally get what you're saying, but has the media even peeped on this issue?
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
6. I wouldn't say it is a waste of time, this is on record.
and let him list everything that this thuggish regime has done to this country.
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Wizard777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
7. The Senate doesn't approve this. The House does. Then the Senate is seated for Impeachment.
Edited on Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM by Wizard777
With the Chief Justice of SCOTUS presiding.
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
8. Yeah, upholding the constitution is such a waste of time...
:eyes: :sarcasm:
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tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Is it about upholding the Constitution, or is it a too little too late political stunt
in the lead up to his next and imminent presidential campaign.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #10
22. For once, can we think FIRST OF THE COUNTRY and not the next election?
Yes, we all want Obama (well most of us do) in the WH
come January 2009, but this is about OUR COUNTRY, people.
This is about whether we call criminal officials out on
their crimes ... Quit sounding like Nancy "Impeachment
Is Off The Table So I Can Be The First Woman Speaker"
Pelosi, for Pete's sake!
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #10
23. considering that all elected representatives take an oath to uphold
the constitution, I'd say he's doing his job. He's one of the ONLY people on Capitol Hill who is doing his job.
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newmajority Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #10
45. A Hillbot accusing Dennis Kucinich of a "political stunt"??
After crying over a campaign that died in Wisconsin, but refused to be buried for 4 months?

God damn, that's just too much!! :eyes:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #10
48. When Bush introduces martial law you'll know n/t
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tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. I'll be waiting.
For that not to happen.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #10
53. Dumb. n/t
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StarryNite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #10
109. Well I guess to some people
the Constitution is just a goddamn piece of paper.

But not to most of us on here. Go get 'em Dennis!:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 06:25 AM
Response to Reply #10
117. Political Stunt: "Impeachment is off the table"
Edited on Tue Jun-10-08 06:26 AM by rucky
That's a political stunt.

A political stunt is ignoring the impeachable offenses for the sake of political expediency. You gotta admit, Pelosi can act like a dictator sometimes.
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tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
9. He's doing his job, his Consitutional duty. NOT a waste of time. nt
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Lint Head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
11. Any time the fascist criminal traitor that has taken over the
White House is called out is a GREAT TIME! Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Hooooooooooooooo! Hey Cheney go fuck yourself! :dem:
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Sparkly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
12. It's required.
Under law.

Why is the rest of Congress not acting on it? That's the real waste.
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elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #12
61. That "it's required" is an opinion. My Senator Feingold has a different opinion.
From: http://feingold.senate.gov/opinion/07/20070616blog.htm

UPDATE: I know that many of you disagree with my approach to this issue, but I thought it was important to make it clear where I’m coming from and explain why I am not calling for impeachment.

I certainly do believe in holding this Administration accountable and upholding the Constitution and the rule of law. That’s why last year I called for the President to be censured for his authorization of the illegal wiretapping program. I thought that was the appropriate course because it would have put the Senate on record in condemning the President’s wrongdoing. I still think that the censure resolution played an important role in focusing the public and the media’s attention on the issue. And I am working to make sure that Congress finally exercises its oversight responsibility by holding hearings and demanding information about the wiretapping program, the U.S. attorney firings and other abuses of power.

Many of you also wrote that if I recognize that the President and Vice President may have committed impeachable offenses, than it is our responsibility to impeach. As I pointed out, it is the role of the House to impeach, and it is the role of the Senate to try impeachments. But the Constitution left it up to the judgment of members of Congress whether or not moving forward with impeachment is best for the country.

Please keep the comments coming. I’ll do my best to read them all. I very much appreciate your honesty and directness. This exchange is very important to me.


I think that Senator Feingold has a lot of respect and admiration here at DU and even if his opinion concerning impeachment is different than many here I still believe it is a valid and reasoned opinion.


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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
13. Stunt?
Go watch some cartoons instead. You aren't worthy of listening to Kucinich.
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Sgent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
14. Fair enough
I just thought articles had been introduced earlier (by Cynthia McKinney?), so this seems to be repetitive.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. this should happen everyday, it will never be repetitive enough.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #14
30. McKinney's been gone since '06 at least ...
and there are PLENTY of other skeletons that have come
out of the closet since then. And even on the ones we
were already aware, we have mounting PROOF thanks to
Don Siegelman, Dan Comey, Scott McClellan, et al.
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blue sky at night Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
16. wasting our time....wasting our time.......
wasting who's time, they haven't done shit over the last eight years and you are bitching about wasting our time!!!! Fuck that, he's not wasting my time, I am so fucking sick of Bush and Cheney getting away with everything, that this is just what EVERYONE needs to hear, to know, to face. You are wasting our time, not Dennis.
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
17. I got plenty of time
Edited on Mon Jun-09-08 09:40 PM by Moochy
just saying.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
18. The amount of research
and impressive body of work Dennis Kucinich has done for all Americans, even the ungrateful ones, will make it into the history books and all those wimpy and/or corrupt Democrats who didn't back this patriotic and honorable man will not look good in those history books not so far in the future.
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Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
19. This is my take.
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global1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
20. A Permanent Part Of The Congressional Record So That If *Co Tries To Rewrite History.......
and sweep clean files, internet sites, news articles, etc, - we will have an official point of reference to check. However, there seems to be a 'perfect storm' of reports, books, testimony, etc that has hit in the last 2 or so that are very damning of *Co and all appear to be collaborative.
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mainman232 Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
21. shut up!
Hes doing the right thing, unlike the other Democratic leaders! God bless him.
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
24. Don't watch if you don't think it's worth your time
simple, isn't it?

As for the rest of us ... I can't think of a more important thing to do with my time then to listen to someone giving life support to our constitution.

#28 ... Go Dennis Go!
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underseasurveyor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
25. not wasting my time
speak only for yourself.

since when has the United States Constitution become a 'waste of time'?

this is a "stunt"???? geezuss whatever:eyes:

how sad is that:wtf:
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
26. What does that tell you of our Senate?
Stunt nothing. Dennis is upholding the Constitution. You call that a waste of time? He's doing his fucking job.
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IDemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
27. Here's why -->
Congressional Oath of Office - I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.


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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. Exactly!
:thumbsup:
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Wiley50 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. So why is the OP wasting our time for that matter n/t
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Wizard777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #27
40. Right now Dennis is the only one Washington taking that oath seriously.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #27
58. Oh that ONE!
There are days I wonder if congress critters, let alone regular private citizens, understand this any longer
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #27
63. That's a pretty darn good reason.
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #27
105. Nailed it there. And thanks, Congressman Kucinich.
I think many will remember this.
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StarryNite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #27
108. Right on!
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. Oh God, you mean people are still repeating that "stunt" lie? Executive breaking the law is just a
matter of "votes" and a "stunt"?

Congratulations.

Oh, and no wonder we're so fucked.
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DailyGrind51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
29. Anything that that diminishes Bush
will impact McCain's chances in November. Every little bit helps.
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Tatiana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
31. It's not a waste of time. It's a reminder of our Constitutional duty.
If the House or Senate choose not to act on this compelling duty, that is their problem.

But even if a couple of newspapers, even if a few media outlets pick up on this story and a minor portion of the enormous research Dennis has compiled gets out into the mainstream, Mr. Kucinich has done this country a great service.

People need to know about the crimes this administration has committed. The people DESERVE to know.
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libnnc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
32. go soak your head
:eyes:
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Sgent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
36. Ok, a few more thoughts:
1) The House (and Senate) will not convict/remove * from office. Not gonna happen with all the repugs in the the Senate.

2) Putting articles in the record for posterity's sake seems to be a little self aggrandizing -- seeing how articles have already been introduced (by Cynthia McKinney).

Therefore, it seems that DK is mostly just doing this for attention -- which isn't surprising I guess coming from him.

I guess it doesn't hurt anything, but I don't see it being this great turning point in the war against Bush. I want to see indictment's when he gets out of office, but it seems like a lot of emotional energy is being spent over a gesture.
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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #36
47. Scott McClellan has just agreed to testify, maybe this is pre-emptive
in case, once again, the WH steps in and claims
"Executive Privilege." During the final months
of this God-forsaken administration, they're going
to try BIG TIME to re-write history; we need to
get as much of the TRUTH on the record as possible
before they send all this stuff down the "memory
hole."
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underseasurveyor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #36
91. Dennis does NOTHING to gain attention solely for himself
or for his own glory.. You obviously don't know the man or what he's about and what he stands for. What would be surprising is if he DID do this just to gain attention.. if you knew him you'd know that.

Man you have a negative, downer attitude. eewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww:puke:
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #36
99. He should just go sailing
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #36
100. Couple points:
As to 1): I too doubt this will end in his removal. What it does do is enter all these crimes into the official record for use later. I'm thinking lots and lots of the material that could be presented in any articles of impeachment would be very useful after they are out of office, in terms of a basis for evidence for the prosecution. In that sense, it's very important that the information is there, in public view, accessible to everyone.

2) Rinse and repeat #1. Furthermore, Bush didn't do these things without help, and I'm sure some of his people will come up for some appointment or other in the future. These Articles will serve as a template upon which to pass or reject a Bushie nomination to anything for a good, long time.

Finally, my own 3). Is it just me, or (as I stated in another thread somewhere tonight) does the whole Scotty tellall-book-yeah-I'll-testify thing smell a little funny? What if he didn't tell everything in his book, but only enough to prompt a Congressional subpoena? After all, the WH had the book for a month before it was published, and let it go as it was. Suppose he gets on the stand and spills the real beans, and oh yeah, there are these bright, shiny new Articles of Impeachment just over here....

Just some food for thought on that last. It would be the most brilliant setup I've ever seen, if it's true.
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
38. We get to see the votes???
and its a reminder to Bush Impeachment is out there
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
39. There is NO more important public business than holding these war criminals accountable. nt
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blonndee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
41. "Our" time? What are you doing to defend the Constitution?
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maryf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
43. ITS The PRECEDENCE!!
and the constitution says in the case of high crimes and misdemeanors you Will impeach!!! Not you may impeach, you should impeach, you can impeach if you find it politically expedient, its you will impeach!! Will equals mandate!!

To just start impeachment proceedings stops this gd precedence that anyone can get away with this kind of traitorous behavior!
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
44. :sigh: Some people are NEVER pleased.
It's not a waste of time.

It is never a waste of time to list out, for the record, the crimes of a President of the United States.

Just because it didn't happen in your time frame doesn't mean it's useless now.

GAK! Sorry, but OP's like this just piss me off. :banghead:

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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
46. I wish more elected officials were 'wasting our time' instead
of lives and money being wasted.

Iraqi's displaced - 5 million or 20% of their population

Millions dead and wounded.

Estimates for the invasion - One to Three Trillion

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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #46
65. This is very important
Even their electoral fraud is now on the record and I dare then to try it again.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #65
71. Yes he is including everything. n/t
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Prisoner_Number_Six Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
49. Turn over and go back to sleep if you're bored with it.
The rest of us plan to continue watching history being made. :shrug:
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johnnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
50. You sound like some repukes I know
And sadly, many Americans think the way that you do. That's why a blowjob is big news and real crimes are a waste of time.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
52. When people in the future
study this disgusting 8 year period in the history of our country they will find that not all of us were clueless and passive.

He is upholding our constitution and doing the people's work.

A stunt? God, no wonder we are where we are.
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Dark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
54. It's pandering, and a poor attempt at that.
n/t
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. How so? Please, be specific.
Take your time, too.
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Dark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #55
70. Well, for starters, he knows it won't go anywhere.
Secondly, it's divisive, as you'll have more liberal Dems in favor of it, while more moderate Dems opposed.

Thirdly, and I can't count how many times I've said this, WE DON'T HAVE THE VOTES. It will fail and the Dems will have egg on their faces going into what should be a cakewalk election.

Fourthly, WE DON'T HAVE THE TIME. Seven months is hardly long enough to investigate and charge him, especially since Congress has enough to do.

Fifthly, Obama will have enough on his plate, without having to deal with this. (Remember Ford & Nixon.)

Also, we have enough shit to do to repair Bush's damage. The world is responding positively to Obama already, so this is pointless in courting international goodwill.

America doesn't need to be divided any further. If, and that's a huge if, this proposal moves forward, it could cost the Dems the election. I remember when impeachment was last brought up, after the 2006 elections, Republicans were encouraging the legislation. They know it's the one way to make the Dems look vindictive and foolish, garnering enough votes for them to hold on for another election cycle.



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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #70
74. I don't think he knows that.
Divisive? Fuck Dems that can't/won't/refuse to uphold the Constitution for partisan reasons. If we don't have the votes, it's because we've failed to elect any form of worthy leadership.

Let 'em walk. Maybe we'll get another Katrina, another Iraq...because there are no consequences.

Last one out, just set the fucking Constitution on fire and be done with it.

Sorry, I just don't think that America is, at her core, just that bloody fucking stupid. Call me naive. Oh, but if she is, it's because we've allowed it. We didn't lose the last election, we let them steal it.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #74
79. !
:applause:

I can't believe this actually needs to be said! I guess it really is all about winning now isn't it? :shrug:

Thank you flvegan, you always say it well. This is an outstanding evening.
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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #74
89. So the idea is that the next time we elect a sociopath to the White House
he/she will be deterred from wrongdoing by the remote possibility that they'll spend a couple of years in a country club prison?

If we don't have the votes because we don't have worthy leadership, doesn't that include Kucinich? Shouldn't he have forged a consensus on this by now?

If this is about defending the Constitution, then shouldn't have Kucinich done this a while back? What's different now versus 6 months ago or two years ago?

Kucinich's grandstanding might provide a nice contrast to Pelosi-Reid style thumb-twiddling, but neither approach is yielding any results.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #89
92. Funny you should mention "6 months ago"
Because he tabled it...in January.

http://blog.cleveland.com/openers/2008/01/kucinich_puts_off_effort_to_im.html

Why? Well...no, I'll let you stew over that answer.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #74
101. What he said.
Smart AND hot. :loveya:
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #70
88. Who are these moderate Democrats who don't believe in justice and accountability?
I was at the Maine convention last week and one of the unifying points seemed to be a consensus that Bush should be impeached.

Bush has a 22% unfavorability rating...does this sound like a ringing endorsement for the Bush pResidency? No...the only people I know that thinks impeachment would be divisive are the Republicans who'd like to avoid having to go on the record about this vote. I sincerely doubt that that it's an issue with most Democrats and Independents. Anyone voting for the articles are on safe ground. Those that vote against best have a better excuse than it's "divisive". It's only divisive if you choose to support this criminal administration.

Lets have the vote and see where the chips fall. Democrats who support Bush are going to face future primariy opposition. Republicans who vote for Bush can add that to their resume when they lose in November.

I regret that this didn't get on the table earlier, but given the recent drumming for war with Iran, this might be a message to Bush that impeachment could be fast tracked if he's stupid enough to start another unilateral and baseless war with a country that poses no threat to us.

We need this political discussion and I am quite happy to support a Democrat on the record that acknowledges the impeachable offenses of this administration.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #70
94. You forgot your other complaint, that mrbush is out of the country and can't defend himself
don't forget that argument. See if it flies with this group here either.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #54
68. Pandering??
to whom?
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Dark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #68
72. The left, especially the liberals who love to hate Pelosi and Reid.
Surf through the impeachment threads. You'll see plenty of attacks on the pair because they aren't crazy enough to introduce controversial legislation that won't go anywhere.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #72
76. Dennis does not have to pander to the Left.
Dennis already has our support.
Dennis is being consistent and honest.
Dennis is doing what he has always done. He earned our support long ago.

Now if Dennis suddenly came out and said that "Impeachment should be off the table", now THAT would be pandering (to the conservative semi-Democrats).
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #72
87. how about the liberals who love the constitution?
how do they sit with you?
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:54 PM
Response to Original message
56. It is NOW part of the Record.. you think History has no value?
Why we are in this pickle... that short historical memory and the pride in it
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mikelgb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
57. not wasting my time
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RB TexLa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
59. It goes in his fund raising letters.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
60. Why are you wasting ours?
:shrug:

Get over yourself....

HE'S DOING HIS JOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #60
95. Thank you!
Every time that I saw the subject line to this thread your response is what kept coming to my mind. Thanks for expressing it for many of us. :toast:
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:11 AM
Response to Reply #95
98. LOL... Happy to oblige! I can't stand naysayers!!
:hug:

They complain about the "Do-Nothing_Dems_in_Congress" all the time

and then when one of "them" DOES something, (like his job!); they complain!

:grr:
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
62. "if you do`t say it`s wrong then that say it`s right"
he`s standing up for every one who thinks george bush usurped his powers and our Constitution. it maybe to little to late but history will judge who stood up for our Constitution and judge those who refused to.
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postulater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
64. This is one of the most important uses of my time he could make
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
66. How can reciting the crimes of this administration be "wasting anyone's time" ??????
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0rganism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
67. You're blaming the wrong guy for the wrong reasons
Bush lying at his state of the union addresses wastes our time.

Congress passing the "patriot" act wastes our time.

Colin Powell waving fake anthrax and showing computer-generated bullshit about mobile weapons labs in Iraq wastes our time.

The broadcast media running spinoff shows about American Idol wastes our time.

Newspapers repeating without question whatever propaganda the administration feeds them to print wastes our time.

Rep Kucinich reading into the congressional record during off-hours articles of impeachment against the treasonous bastards who've hijacked our democracy? No, that's the best possible thing that can be done in congress, given the circumstances. I don't consider it a waste of time in the slightest.
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yellowdogintexas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #67
80. Priceless, that's what it is. Priceless nt
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
69. If someone is going to fight for Busco impeachment, like I'm not going to support them...
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New Dawn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
73. He is doing what we, the majority of voters, are demanding that Congress to do.
Representing our interests, rather than the interests of the tiny class of millionaires and billionaires that has bought of most of Congress.
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jimshoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
75. Not wasting my time either, That's exactly why
I voted for him. He fights for we the people.
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eleny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
77. Speak for yourself
This is a good way for me to spend my evening.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
78. wasting whose time?
I can't fucking believe I read this stuff. One lone Congressman sets the record straight and it's a 'waste of time'? Reading crime after crime into the Congressional record is a waste of time? I wish more members of Congress would waste their time upholding the Constitution and the rule of law. What a country that would be.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
81. Someone at Cspan thinks what he has to say is relevant, obviously McClellan
testifying about Cheney telling him to go out and lie about scooter Libby
s role in Plame case next week won't hurt him...
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
82. It's tricky becuase on principle, Dennis is right
But we know that never in a million years would the Senate vote to convict Bush.

So it will do absolutely nothing but it's not going to hurt us either. I'm pretty sure every president has one congressman introduce the articles of impeachment at some point.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:39 PM
Response to Original message
83. By all means, change channels. I think "Dancing with the NASCAR Bachelorettes" is on. nt
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
84. Are you kidding? I've been waiting for this for YEARS.
He can't talk frickin' long ENOUGH.

Kick ass, Dennis! :woohoo:
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
85. Good question
Why did he waste our time by taking so long to get to this?

It should have been done a year ago.
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sweet baby jesus Donating Member (59 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
86. don't you get it... it's repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition....
repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, repetition, reposition,
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
90. I'm glad he's FINALLY doing this, but is he for real or is this just about money?
He knows he can get a quick 3 million or so from MoveOn and various groups, but he also knows that none of his colleagues will support his efforts (and I doubt he spent much time trying to convince them). Then again, maybe he really feels strongly about holding Bushco accountable for all their crimes (many of which have been revealed in the past few weeks). I don't know... I just get irritated when I think of all BushCo has gotten away with...
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #90
102. Given he FILED Chenney's impeachment papers
six months ago... I'd say he cares
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-09-08 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
93. JFC!!! You're from New Orleans?!?
Maybe Kenner, Metairie, Harahan, River Ridge, or the Westbank.



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Ichingcarpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #93
96. He's from New Orleans like George Bush is from Texas
Biggest load of crap I've seen and he runs away like Bush from the thread


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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
97. I'm calling my rep and say he should get on board....
Sigh, I don't have too...

DK's my rep...
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Fox Mulder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:27 AM
Response to Original message
103. That's very idiotic...
Edited on Tue Jun-10-08 12:29 AM by Fox Mulder
thinking Dennis is wasting our time.

:eyes:
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magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 12:30 AM
Response to Original message
104. Wasting time. Stunt. Don't have the votes.
Would you be saying those things if it was YOUR loved one Bush** had murdered?
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 01:27 AM
Response to Original message
106. why are YOU wasting our time? n/t
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Old Hickory Fan Donating Member (133 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 02:44 AM
Response to Reply #106
107. Can Congress and Senate Ignore this, and not be
Edited on Tue Jun-10-08 03:09 AM by Old Hickory Fan
violating their own oath to the American people? This was apparently done IN SESSION.

I think many people who get this sent to them via a link to a full presentation and/or the actual video emailed and/or the C-span playback

schedule sent to them with "hot alert" "must see" to them will likely agree and it could groundswell. I want a full video/podcast link PLEASE.


I love America and my country means a lot to me, and I am very concerned because I have observed

many Americans in the last few months who appear very frustrated and upset.


This so so very sad, but if not followed thru with then it could appear that

the Democrats and Republicans both agree with and/or condone the potential alleged violations

as formally outlined by Congressman Kucinich and .


I am fearful too many have already lost confidence in the Congress and/or the White House and it bothers me greatly

when people seem to be fearful while living in the last great bastion of freedom in the world.

So very sad but it seems that it had to be addressed so maybe those in the future can have confidence

in this great nation.


If a national news organization replayed this in its entire unedited form as a "Hyped like special" they would be

vindicated for obvious past failures and beloved by the people. The ratings could go thru the roof if they hyped it as a special.

Can this be put on a bit torrent or similar type file? Will C-span allow that or a file of some sort which could be downloaded?


I am just sad so many citizens seem to have lost confidence in the elected leadership on both sides of the aisle.

This should not be politicized it should be americanized as it could affect all and the future generations.

This could also help our foreign relationships.

This is bigger than any partisan party --- this is an AMERICAN ISSUE.

I pray for all Americans, and our leaders.

Mostly I pray for our future.




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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #107
110. AWESOME
now repost this replying to the original post so they see it - yes INDEED :thumbsup:
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Old Hickory Fan Donating Member (133 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:24 AM
Response to Reply #110
111. I corrected it some and started it as new thread. Thanks!
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Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:36 AM
Response to Original message
112. Especially when there are other wars to start
So many other ways *we* could be spending our time isn't there?

I so hope you were being sarcastic, otherwise I say FU if you don't think democracy is worth fighting for.
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TheWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:54 AM
Response to Original message
113. Why are you wasting our time?
Edited on Tue Jun-10-08 03:55 AM by TheWatcher
Not to mention precious bandwidth.

No Reality TV or Playoffs on the Cathode Slave Box tonight to keep you sedated?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 03:58 AM
Response to Original message
114. Stunt?
Holding these war criminals accountable is a STUNT?

Good grief.
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
116. Because he likes being the center of attention.
He likes being on TV. And he likes manipulating the base of the party to follow him on pointless endeavors that are specifically designed to fail so that he can claim that some unspecific "they" are against him.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-10-08 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
120. A statement of intent. A declaration of belief.
"What possible purpose does this stunt serve?"


A statement of intent. A declaration of belief.

And if done in the name of a worthy cause (as I believe this to be), are never wastes of time, and are worthy of our pride, respect and admiration.
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