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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:15 PM
Original message
Top Dems cool to FISA deal
Top Dems cool to FISA deal


Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) said Thursday he could not support a compromise on controversial electronic surveillance legislation, and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) is also cool to the proposal, making it unclear how much support the legislation will get in the Senate.

While nobody is suggesting the bipartisan breakthrough on an update to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act is in trouble, it’s clear that many liberal Democrats will be disappointed in a measure that provides a modest level of lawsuit immunity to telecommunications firms that helped the Bush administration with warrantless wiretaps. While Republicans and Democrats are hailing the compromise, privately some GOP staffers are crowing that they won more concessions in the negotiations.

“I have said since the beginning of this debate that I would oppose a bill that did not provide accountability for this administration’s six years of illegal, warrantless wiretapping,” said Leahy. “This bill would dismiss ongoing cases against the telecommunications carriers that participated in that program without allowing a judicial review of the legality of the program. Therefore, it lacks accountability measures that I believe are crucial.”

Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wisc.) said what other liberal Democrats are saying privately: Democrats "capitulated" to the White House.

"The proposed FISA deal is not a compromise; it is a capitulation," Feingold said. "The House and Senate should not be taking up this bill, which effectively guarantees immunity for telecom companies alleged to have participated in the president’s illegal program, and which fails to protect the privacy of law-abiding Americans at home. Allowing courts to review the question of immunity is meaningless when the same legislation essentially requires the court to grant immunity."

But House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.), risking backlash from the liberals in his caucus, defended the compromise that he negotiated with Republicans.

more...

http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0608/Top_Dem_Senators_Cool_to_FISA_deal.html
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Now, THAT'S more like it!
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hoyer must be getting something
If this bill does pas as is I would keep an eye out to see who the telecoms make donations to. We know that Rockefeller was receiving payoffs, I mean donations last year that were far more then what he had received prior to his support for immunity!

So, what might Hoyer be getting for being a yes man, and claiming that it's about being bipartisan.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Telecoms keep coughing up big bucks for 49 votes. It is hilarious all the way to
Edited on Thu Jun-19-08 02:26 PM by L. Coyote
the bank!!
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warren pease Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. Opensecrets.org has everything you could possibly want about the bribocracy...
Go here and just start clicking on stuff. Pretty amazing compilation of data. If you look at this stuff for awhile, it's virtually impossible to not "get it," meaning that every thing these conniving fuckers do is based on pleasing their real bosses -- corporate zillionaires, old money elites, a few nouveau billionaires needing a place to launder drug money, international banking cartels fronted by some little "John Smith's First Statewide Bank and Trust" type of nondescript single-branch mall-based bank.

They seem to have three main reasons to toss all that money in Congress' direction:

- Friendly revisions to the federal tax code that further reduce the investment class' tax liability from a lousy 15 percent they're paying now down as close to zero as possible. I doubt the greedy fuckos will be satisfied until the feds pay them instead of the other way round.

- A favorable regulatory environment is maybe the top prize. They can save money in any number of ways if they can stay under the oversight radar. This has never been easier or more profitable than under the current regime, but there's always more money to be made by doing things even cheaper. So whether it's screwing employees out of the pensions or reducing their benefits packages to near zero, disposing of toxics as cheaply as possible -- which usually means hiring a couple of guys with a van equipped with a lift gate, loading a few 55 gallon drums into the van and then watching all those disposal problems drive away forever.

- Corporados increasingly need a get out of jail free card. CEOs are actually doing time, which is definitely not the way god intended thins to work. So the third big reason for bribing congress is creating an ad hoc insurance policy against prosecution and prison. And since the corporate boards these days are more like the A-list of Al Capone's inner circle than a respectable groups of honest businessmen, these bribers know they're going to do all kinds of illegal or quasi-legal stuff in the course of their congressional employee's term.

Might as well invest heavily in prison protection. Can't make any money from a cell, except that $.22 a day the prison/industrial complex has decided to pay their slaves to pitch stocks, act like telemarketers pitching everything from time shares to those coupon books that promise two dinners for the price of one.

I think those are the main reasons, but there may be a few more I'm completely unaware of.

No matter what else, though, it's impossible to look at their money source and voting records and not get the point. It's unusual to find a pol with a voting history that doesn't correlate closely with the interests of whoever's giving them the most money during any given election cycle.

And the goddamn hypocrites are still yammering on about how this is the world's longest running democracy and how citizen participation is key to preserving the American way of life.

Translation: You're living in a rapidly declining failed state with pretensions of empire and no real way to enforce it. The world hates the US and is becoming quite active in creating or supporting policies specifically designed to fuck this country over. Using the Euro rather than the dollar as the currency of record for buying oil in the Middle East is one of the biggest raised middle fingers in the history of US foreign policy failures.

The economy's shot and the debt load's too heavy to enable any significant improvement for many years -- possibly never. In any case, the Bushies have succeeded beyond even Norquist's dreams in not only destroying the few remaining scraps of the social safety net, but impoverishing the country to the point where even enlightened, well-intentioned leadership in DC won't be able to resurrect those programs, much less add new ones.

So say goodbye to any possibility of an enlightened health care system in this country. We're probably too stupid to deserve one anyway, but it would have been nice to have the option.

Anybody who claims the Bushies are complete fuck-ups and that everything they touched turned to merde is missing the entire point. They didn't stage their right wing coup to improve this country or the lives of its people. The exact opposite was the objective, and they've done a pretty good job of it. You'll notice that everything they touch does in fact turn to merde... But not for them or their cronies and war profiteers and corporate criminals and the rest of the crooked to the core ruling class bastards whose only loyalty is to money and whose sole bit of dogma is: "All for us, and fuck anybody who doesn't like it."

And that's exactly what America looks like today: A nation at the brink of civil war because nobody has figured out who the real enemy is. A country so polarized that it's easier than ever to get involved in a fist fight if you want to.

A workforce that's finally had its faith in the American system destroyed such that all they can do is lie awake every night and hope and pray and whimper that they'll still have that shitty little job without benefits at the end of the week. Wage slavery combined with debt slavery makes for a highly insecure population. So not only are they underpaid and overworked, they're scared shitless that even that hideous existence will be taken away and shipped to the latest fad country for cheap labor. Then what... Farther into debt slavery because the cards are all that's standing between this nouveau broke guy and a shopping cart and cardboard refrigerator box under a prime local overpass conveniently close to schools and shopping and in one of the homeless community's safest neighborhoods.

Yup... USA! USA! USA! We're Number One!

Well, I don't know about number one, but we're definitely in the running for the top spot in the "fastest slide from solvency to poverty to bankruptcy in the history of the industrialized world." Now that's worth striving for. Not that there's fuck all else we stand a chance of winning these days, except world's most obscenely bloated war department. I think we're looking pretty good there, too.


wp
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tbyg52 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. What he's getting right now is a lot of screaming to his voicemail, apparently
because it's full.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. So THAT's where Harry Reid's balls are! Patrick Leahy must have them.
He's gotta have at least six or seven pair.
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Leopolds Ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. He keeps them on a jar on his nightstand
Along with his mother's eyes.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
4. Do'h! Maybe after the 10th time, the R's will realize that. Dems aren't part of their crime!!!
We don't need no stinkin' cover-up!!! :rofl:
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
5. 68 Senators voted for the first FISA bill, we need to keep the
pressure up if there is any chance of this bill being defeated.
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tkmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
7. Voting "no". and making a public statement isn't enough
They could stop this bill if they wanted to. They don't want to. This is all just theater.
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:34 PM
Response to Original message
8. Maybe a strategy to soft-kill FISA?
Without ability to completely vote down the bill and having Bush bitch and moan and tell everyone they're SOFT ON TERRAR, maybe they're going about this more subtlely.

Obnoxious bill goes into Senate, has a long and nasty fight before finally coming to a vote. Passes by a hair, gets sent to the House.

Bill goes to House. House amends it before the long and nasty fight that ends up with it passing narrowly. But since the bill was changed, it goes back to the Senate.

Senate takes the amended bill tosses in its own amendments, has a long and nasty fight before passing it narrowly, but since the bill changed again, it has to go back to the House.

See where I'm going on this?

It's not that long until November, so maybe this is the way to drag things out - looking like they're trying to address the TERRAR so Bush and the repukes can't scream too loudly about TEH HOMELAND SECRUITY, but they still don't get their telco immunity.

Of course, people like Hoyer and Pelosi and Reid would have to have enough spine to play this sort of tactic without selling out, and I'm definitely not confident of that.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
9. They'll warm up when Bush shows them what he's got on 'em.
Dirt is cheap, except for the people who get it on themselves.
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Zodiak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
10. Check out the wording in the article
Every senator that opposes the bill is labeled "liberal". I believe that there is a deliberate attempt to marginalize these senators by using this term to describe each one

Feingold and Leahy are moderates....there are no "liberal" senators. Kucinich is liberal, but he is in the House.

No one seems to make mention that Hoyer is a corporate Democrat, a DLC Democrat, or a conservative Democrat, but that distinction could just as easily have been made.
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jtrockville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
11. Where's DODD? Will he FILIBUSTER as promised?
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warren pease Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. He's taken $23,950 in telecom bribes during this election cycle...
That places him 14th out of 100 in the senate telecom largesse and bribery sweepstakes.

Dodd's $23,950 is chump change compared with what these high priced alleged democrats took them off for:

Clinton ($517.6K), Obama ($315.5K), Rockefeller ($59K), Durbin ($50K), Pryor ($58K) and Baucus ($30.6K) have extorted from their employers in the telecom industry.

But it's still more than 86 other senators took. So I'm unconvinced that he's going to step up and try to kill this hideous bill through a filibuster or any other parliamentary move.

What he really needs to do is put Reid up against the wall and tell him he's going to get his ass kicked all the way to Baltimore if he even considers bringing it up for a vote. But that's not going to happen either.

What WILL happen is the telecoms will recoup their investments in their trained seals in congress, immunity will pass overwhelmingly and about 40 lawsuits will be tossed out of court because this blatantly unamerican bill kills the 4th amendment deader than Edgar Allen Poe.

Which means that there's no longer any right to privacy whatsoever here in the land of the free unless you're one of those fictitious corporate "persons." In that case you can get away with damn near anything as long as you claim you were acting under the direct authority of our supreme commander. It's also helpful to be able to afford top tier legal counsel to sell the judge and jury on that hilarious concept.

Another sneaky little clause buried deep in the fine print grants The Little Lord de facto power to rule on the constitutionality of any of his "requests" for private sector assistance in committing yet another act of treason. And of course since the same guy issues the order and determines its legality, I've got a pretty good sense that any private company Bushie decides to co-opt will be said to be acting legally and in good faith.

Bad enough that congress has for years been an enthusiastic accomplice in the syndicate's worldwide crime wave. Now he's eliminated the need for the supreme court, too. And while I'm not completely sorry to see Tony's Fascist Review get canceled, watching The Commander Guy add power over the judiciary to his ownership of congress is pretty damn hard to take. Unitary executive, indeed.

This constant collaboration has become so tiresome and predictable that I swear if these lying scum hiding behind the little "d" after their names actually stood on their hind legs just one time, healthy people all over the world would keel over on the spot and die of shock.

Money is obviously the only thing that gets their attention any more, good government being so out of fashion that it's now a kind of quaint vestigial anachronism that has no place in the 21st century. Since it's plain that we live in a pure bribocracy, we're idiots if we don't acknowledge it and act accordingly.

So that leads me to think the only defense against the Money Party and its two mirror image divisions is to pool our money and buy some of these tools for ourselves.

I found a few quarters behind the couch cushions the other day and I'll be glad to toss them into the pot. Next?


wp
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-19-08 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
12. What are they getting out of this? It seems like if we put another WELL FUNDED candidate in their...
..place they wouldn't do this shit anymore
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-20-08 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
17. Not bad, but it would be a lot better to not call it a "compromise" in the first place.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-20-08 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
18. Geaux Feingold!!!
:kick:


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