If corporations were people, we'd be second class citizens

[ck4829]

Government gives them bailouts, we have to sink or swim

Their profits are privatized, their losses are socialized

Their right to privacy is guaranteed, we have some Republicans saying that privacy is not a right for the people to have

So, if corporations were considered people, would that make us second class citizens?

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. They are and we are.

[ixion]

7. yep, very true

despite the fact that it's patently unconstitutional for it to be thus.

[GreenPartyVoter]

9. Meh. What's a little constitutional bending now and then between friends?

:sarcasm:

[formercia]

20. I can feel the warm pee on the back of my neck

thanks to St. Ronnie and his trickle down theory.

[GreenPartyVoter]

28. I'd laugh if I wasn't already too busy crying

[Kitty Herder]

24. That's exactly what I was going to say. nt

[zanne]

26. Don't you remember? They were given personhood.

The Bush administration gave them personhood so they could lie to us and call it "First Amendment Rights".

And, by the way, we are second-class citizens.

[stray cat]

2. we are second class citizens....

[BridgeTheGap]

3. By law, corporations are considered as "persons" and $=free speech

The less money you have, the less impact your "speech" has.
You're right - we're 2nd class citizens.

[Freddie Stubbs]

14. Not entirely

Corporations are not permitted to exercise that speech in the form of contributions to federal political campaigns.

[BridgeTheGap]

16. It's done through PACs instead, right? n.t

[Freddie Stubbs]

19. No, unions and corporations may not contribute to federal PACs

Union members and employees of corporations may contribute to PACs themselves.

[BridgeTheGap]

21. What about all the contributions listed at Opensecrets.org?

Commercial Banks: Long-Term Contribution Trends
2008* 11 $24,087,560 $16,538,945 $7,548,615 N/A $11,660,942 $12,420,217 48% 52%
2006* 10 $25,956,927 $14,186,756 $11,770,171 N/A $9,725,896 $15,981,878 37% 62%
2004* 12 $31,031,562 $20,294,786 $10,736,776 N/A $11,155,174 $19,794,531 36% 64%
2002 17 $20,416,839 $7,874,217 $8,669,773 $3,872,849 $7,289,686 $13,067,025 36% 64%
2000 14 $25,912,405 $11,036,600 $9,619,581 $5,256,224 $9,389,944 $16,445,424 36% 63%
1998 10 $17,736,657 $5,612,096 $8,759,627 $3,364,934 $6,106,145 $11,471,053 34% 65%
1996 10 $19,227,948 $6,765,487 $9,394,731 $3,067,730 $6,464,100 $12,709,548 34% 66%
1994 9 $13,357,949 $4,411,391 $8,029,818 $916,740 $6,459,487 $6,887,562 48% 52%
1992 8 $14,779,470 $5,481,544 $8,234,315 $1,063,611 $7,429,236 $7,314,787 50% 49%
1990 9 $9,769,910 $2,867,784 $6,902,126 N/A $5,159,968 $4,609,142 53% 47%
Total 11 $202,277,227 $95,069,606 $89,665,533 $17,542,088 $80,840,578 $120,701,167 40% 60%

†These numbers show how the industry ranks in total campaign giving as compared to more than 80 other industries. Rankings are shown only for industries (such as the Automotive industry) -- not for widely encompassing "sectors" (such as Transportation) or more detailed "categories" (like car dealers).

*These figures do not include donations of "Levin" funds to state and local party committees. Levin funds were created by the Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act of 2002.

[Freddie Stubbs]

22. Those either refer to donations by employees in those industries or

PAC which were set up by those industries.

[zanne]

27. So it's all "perfectly legal", right?

[Freddie Stubbs]

29. Yes. Should you be barred from political activity because of who you employer is?

:shrug:

[Clovis Sangrail]

4. and they'd be easier to eliminate /nt

[dbonds]

5. The government do view corporations as people.

I forgot the ruling, but it was around the turn of the last century. I think that was a horrible mistake. And yes we middle and lower class people are second class citizens to the corporations.

[Clovis Sangrail]

10. 1886 and railroads I believe

the way I see it, corporations can't vote so they're can't be citizens.

[dbonds]

11. After that, around 1900 ish there was a supreme court ruling that did grant them the rights

There are consider citizens after that.

On edit: you are right, it was 1886

In 1886 the U.S. Supreme Court decreed that corporations are "persons" under the 14th amendment, thus granting them protection under the Bill of Rights. <6>Such guarantees of free speech, due process, and equal protection under the law were long considered to apply to human persons. This ruling gave corporations unprecedented "rights" to question almost any law applied to them, and frustrated the ability of the people to direct corporate action in service of the public good.

[RufusTFirefly]

12. Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad (1886)

"The defendant Corporations are persons within the intent of the clause in section 1 of the Fourteen Amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

The beginning of the end.

[CrispyQ]

13. Our Hidden Corporate History

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/corporate_accountability/history_corporations_us.html


snip...

Government spending during the Civil War brought these corporations fantastic wealth. Corporate executives paid "borers" to infest Congress and state capitals, bribing elected and appointed officials alike. They pried loose an avalanche of government financial largesse. During this time, legislators were persuaded to give corporations limited liability, decreased citizen authority over them, and extended durations of charters. Attempts were made to keep strong charter laws in place, but with the courts applying legal doctrines that made protection of corporations and corporate property the center of constitutional law, citizen sovereignty was undermined. As corporations grew stronger, government and the courts became easier prey. They freely reinterpreted the U.S. Constitution and transformed common law doctrines.

One of the most severe blows to citizen authority arose out of the 1886 Supreme Court case of Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad. Though the court did not make a ruling on the question of "corporate personhood," thanks to misleading notes of a clerk, the decision subsequently was used as precedent to hold that a corporation was a "natural person."

From that point on, the 14th Amendment, enacted to protect rights of freed slaves, was used routinely to grant corporations constitutional "personhood." Justices have since struck down hundreds of local, state and federal laws enacted to protect people from corporate harm based on this illegitimate premise. Armed with these "rights," corporations increased control over resources, jobs, commerce, politicians, even judges and the law.

A United States Congressional committee concluded in 1941, "The principal instrument of the concentration of economic power and wealth has been the corporate charter with unlimited power...."


===

Reclaim Democracy is a great site for lots of info & links to other sites on Corporate Personhood.

[dbonds]

15. That is a good site and a good cause.

[Raster]

30. "...thanks to misleading notes of a clerk..."

That "clerk" was also a previous employee of the Southern Pacific Railroad.

"A United States Congressional committee concluded in 1941...". 1941, eh? Just in time for a war.

[Heidi]

6. If? (nt)

[MrsBrady]

18. yea, that's what i thought n/t

[liberal N proud]

8. We have been second class to corporations for a long time

[DailyGrind51]

17. The main purpose of incorporation is to shield guilty individuals from accountability.

Which is why it is so damn hard to convict CEOs for criminal acts. Seven "Big Tobacco" CEOs committed perjury, proven by documented evidence recovered by B & W Tobacco Co. whistle-blower, Dr. Jeffrey Wigand, yet NONE went to jail. You or I lie on the witness stand or to a federal agent, and we face jail time and/or a stiff fine. Equal justice before the law? BULLSHIT!

[unblock]

23. we pay taxes on everything we buy (sales tax); they get to deduct everything they spend (expenses)

have to get new driver's licenses and registration when we move to a different state; they get a tax break just for coming to town.

[Triana]

25. Umm - they are - and WE are. Have been for years...

..there are the robber barons (the plutocracy, made up of corporations and their corporate-friendly gov't who represents THEM) - then there are the working folks, whose backs and lives they glomb off of for power, control, and profit - and who are largely represented by - well, NO one.