Great question for an investigative reporter: Where did Ivins get the Tylenol with Codeine

[skip fox]

that he use to kill himself? (Presumably.)

There should be a trial leading to a doctor or dentist thru a pharmacist. (If he was eliminated, I'm sure that some backstory on this has already be fabricated, but it gives more traction for investigation.)

[truedelphi]

1. Is that how he killed himself? Really??

I have a friend who is bi-polar, and she tried to kill herself twice tht way.

You throw it all up, within two to five hours of consuming it, if its tablets. Now if it's injectable - but I don't think they have injectable codeine. Uh that would be heroin.

Now maybe if you washed the pills down with a litre of Jack Daniels.

[skip fox]

2. I've been investigating on the net, and what you write is noted elsewhere.

"Ivins was found passed out on his bathroom floor. When they got him to the hospital he was still alive. He died 2 days later. An overdose causing death from Tylenol w/ codeine is extremely rare, especially if you're still alive when you get to the hospital."

If this is so, would a smart researcher in his field have chosen something difficult and iffy????

[librechik]

4. I just don't buy this theory. Esp. without an autopsy.

Here's the theory I like.

FBI agents, angry after being burned by Hatfill, confront Ivins and try to force him to confess. In the heightened atmosphere of enhanced interrogation, suddenly the man dies on them. Uh, oh. Now they have to run around and build an ex post facto case against him. They get a couple of weak witnesses they can pressure into discrediting Ivins at the last minute, a cooperative doctor and take advantage of the fact that he has been acting harried and unusual lately to convince the family that he killed himself. They hurriedly scrape some kind of case together, (most of it bad, since they blew their wad on Hatfill and have nothing really on anybody else--except for the guy who actually did it, on orders from the White House, whose identity they of course need to keep secret.)So they burn Ivins, their man is safe, and they never have to answer questions, because they are the FBI!

They keep almost all of their case secret, and merely assert the truth they wish to -- like they have done so many times before.

[Prefer]

3. Rush Limbaugh?

http://www.medicinenet.com/oxycodone_and_acetaminophen/article.htm
OxyCodone - same stuff Rush gobbles.
I got some with my wisdom tooth extraction, kid of horrible stuff, pretty nauseating. I can't see wanting to take that stuff.

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. Some pills with lower strengths of codeine are available without prescription in some countries

eg the UK:

Four strengths are available:

* 8mg of codeine phosphate per tablet
* 12.8mg of codeine phosphate per tablet
* 15mg of codeine phosphate per tablet*
* 30mg of codeine phosphate per tablet (available in capsules as Tylex, available in tablets/caplets as Solpadol and Kapake).

Formulations contain from 300 mg to 1000 mg of paracetamol per tablet<1>. In the United Kingdom the 15/500 and 30/500 tablets are available only with a prescription, and the 8/500 12.8/500 strength is available over the counter. This is also the case in Australia, however 15/500 tablets in packs of 12 or less are Schedule 3 (Pharmacist Only Medicine).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-codamol

It might be easy to obtain by mail order, then.

[emilyg]

6. You can get anything you want on net.

[spanone]

7. what's an investigative reporter?

:shrug: :sarcasm:

[DeepBlueC]

8. killer combo = Tylenol and alcohol

With that combination the codeine is irrelevant. I once knew both a hematologist and a codeine fancier. In Canada the 8 mg codeine 325 mg acetaminophen combination is available without a prescription. I knew that Coco was in the hospital and I knew the hematologist (my g.p.'s husband) who told me that they had found codeine in her but could not figure out why she had NO LIVER because the codeine would not have done that. I had heard that in order to get a buzz she simply took a whole bunch of the OTC tablets and with a couple of drinks that is enough to cause liver failure. Plain acetaminophen and booze is sufficient to kill. With that explanation the docs were able to stop looking for exotic agents or viruses to explain the catastrophic result and getting her off the booze and massive doses of acetaminophen was enough to give her liver a chance to regenerate.