Why would Sarah Palin have undergone prenatal genetic testing...

[misanthrope]

..on Trig if abortion was not a choice? What's the point?

[malta blue]

1. to metally prepare herself

Oh. Wait. :spray:

[aikoaiko]

2. Being prepared.

[elleng]

13. Amnio tests for LOTS of things,

and many docs want to be prepared; mine did.

[Epiphany4z]

3. it is standard testing

for most you just go get your blood work and that test in there.

[WindRiverMan]

4. Good question

On our last baby, they asked if we wanted it due to wife being 35. We both agreed there was no point, we would not have aborted the baby anyway. Doctor said then no reason to risk it.


Thankfully, he is seven and just a-okay

[misanthrope]

12. That was what I was wondering about...

...I know someone who recently lost a child as a result of amniocentesis.

[hedgehog]

15. Same here.

[rzemanfl]

5. So that she could decide to fly in labor? Would she have done

that otherwise? I put nothing past this sick excuse for a parent, but I still can't buy her story.

[global1]

8. Bingo!!!!!!!!!! nt

[misanthrope]

9. I can't say that didn't cross my mind...

...Especially the way she quickly used Bristol as a shield.

[TheDebbieDee]

6. Good point!

However, something can always be said about being emotionally prepared to handle a difficult medical situation.

[KharmaTrain]

7. High Risk Pregnancy

Amnio is usually ordered for someone who is considered a high risk...and being preggers at 43 or 44 would do that. That's how they found out about the Downs. This was done for her health as much as for the baby's.

What I find interesting...FWIW...is I've known several women who had late pregnancies and they were all but ordered off their feet and carefully monitored instead of running all over the country delivering speeches.

[tblue]

10. I wonder if that's why Sarah stayed in Texas to give a speech after her water broke

Somehow I don't get the feeling she's all that devoted to her children. Presumptuous of me, I know. But that's MHO.

[KharmaTrain]

18. Ya Think?

But if we discuss this we're soooooooo cruel...we're picking on the children. To me and my wife, we're both appauled at the arrogance of this woman...who AFAIK has neglected her children and we're seeing it in many ways. She's using little Trig as a prop...is parading her older son's military service (unlike Biden) and dare we go into what kind of mother she was to Bristol? My wife and I put our careers on hold to care for our children...always having a parent around and always involved in their lives. We lucked out...both kids have done great...one is a college graduate and teacher...the other is excelling in college...and making us very proud.

Parenting is not a hobby...as I tell my daughter, who is thinking about starting her family, to be prepared to lock away 20 years to care for your child and never put any conditions on it.

If Palin had any scruples, she would have either taken an extended leave or resigned her office to care for her special needs child...and not put her other daughter through what is now a worldwide humilitation. I really feel for Bristol...this kid must be freaking out seeing/hearing her private life being used as political fodder. What kind of mother would put her child through that?

Cheers...

[misanthrope]

19. I've known of a few...

...hard core fundamentalist types who believe in large broods and basically use the older ones to raise the younger ones, kind of a self-replicating sub-parenting system. As a ZPGer, it disgusts me. I wonder if that is the mindset at work here considering the only time I've seen Trig out of Bristol's clutch has been the photo shoot for People magazine.

I wonder if that responsibility will be passed to the next oldest daughter in a few months?

[tnlefty]

11. There's a peranatologist (hope that's correct) in town

who won't do them in those circumstances because his stance is that the cost of amnio is pointless if the decision has already been made. I see his point.

[moriah]

14. Preparation and wanting the best for her baby, I hope.

I posted in another thread about the experience a pro-life coworker and his wife had, but to make a long story short, they had done the quad-screen and other testing anyway, not amniocentesis at that point but just the blood screens that can help tell if there is a problem.

A thorough ultrasound when the tests came back showed their baby had no kidneys -- would not live long once the cord was cut, and would die of toxin overload similarly to the way a person dies from kidney failure.

They said they never considered terminating the pregnancy, used the fact they got the news in advance to get some of their grieving done, prepare their daughters for the fact that their little brother wouldn't be coming home from the hospital, and made plans about how they wanted to spend the short life he would have.

He came two months early, lived 12 hours, was held and rocked and loved his entire life.

I personally don't think I could have done it. I've had two grandparents die of kidney failure and it is a very painful nasty death. I likely would have had an abortion in that case. I'm sorry, but I believe in quality of life over quantity.

But they believed it wasn't their right to decide their son didn't deserve those 12 hours, even if they would be painful.

[cynatnite]

17. Who am I to say they were wrong?

I don't know if I would have done the same thing if I were in their shoes.

I can't be in their shoes choosing to have that baby any more than they can be in mine when I opted for an abortion.

This is why abortion is a personal choice and the government has no business being involved.

[moriah]

27. Exactly, it is a personal choice.

I admire that coworker more than I can express in words. If ANYONE can be said to "walk their talk" when it comes to being pro-life, it's them in my opinion. I mean, it wasn't a question like in Down's Syndrome -- where while a child with it may suffer problems, they can live a long life and be reasonably healthy. This was a case where they knew there was *no* hope for a happy outcome. I don't even think their pro-life relatives or friends would have criticized them if they decided to terminate.

But he and his wife did what they believed was right, and I respect them greatly for it.

He has the picture of him holding his son in his hands, framed, on his desk. He was so small. He was even smaller than most babies two months premature because the lack of kidneys meant that there was not enough amniotic fluid -- causing growth restriction.

I don't think I would have had the strength to do it, even if I believed it was right. It was their faith that got them through it, he said.

[misanthrope]

20. That's heartbreaking**nm

**

[moriah]

29. I cried when I heard the news, and cried even harder when the time came...

Our "big boss" sent us all the obituary -- it was truly beautifully written and very touching.

They had both a service at the church, and then a private family ceremony at the burial. Every coworker but one went to the service -- the one who had to stay and man the 24x7 helpdesk we ran. Even the ones of us who worked nights skipped out on sleep to go and support them.

The company insisted he take as much time off as he and his wife needed, and our boss personally got a waiver from HR to ensure that he got paid the entire time without having to use any sick leave or vacation.

He and his wife are such sweet people, too... they are pro-life and very Christian, but neither of them make a big issue of it. They just do what they believe is right -- and by doing so, they are much better witnesses for Christ than if they actively proselytized.

[tavalon]

16. All mothers, whether 16 or 44, get a triple screen

It's part of the routine blood work. Any triple screen that comes back positive warrants further screening. The further screening is an advanced sonogram and amnio. Standard operating procedure and while Alaska is pretty backwards, I'm sure their doctors practice the same standard of care.

[Ilsa]

21. Alot of docs skip the triple screen if the mother is over a certain age.

It will almost always come back positive, so why bother -- go straight to amnio or CVS.

[tavalon]

23. Really?

Not in my neck of the woods.

[Nikia]

32. I was given the option of a triple screen

I was going to have an ultrasound during that time though so I didn't see the point (I don't really like having more blood than necessary drawn anyway).

[CatsDogsBabies]

36. I declined the triple screen

because it was likely to be positive based on my age alone (in my forties). I also declined the amnio and cvs because I was unwilling to take any risk with what was my only pregnancy. I only had ultrasounds with the complete support of my doctor. My child has no special needs or health issues. People make all sorts of decisions about pre-natal genetic screening.

[Breeze54]

22. SOP for pregnant women over 40 years old!

:eyes:

They test the amniotic fluid for anything abnormal with the pregnancy.

[lostnfound]

24. Further, IIRC, there's a 1 in 200 chance of miscarriage associated with amnio

which is why I refused to have one.
The doc said there's a 1 in 200 chance of Down syndrome at my age.
I said there's a 1 in 200 chance of a miscarriage with amnio. So no thanks. Besides, I had no intention of having an abortion based on such a finding of Down syndrome anyway.

The doctor was actually quite angry with me over it. I was rather perturbed with her, too, and ended up switching to a new doc.

[Ilsa]

26. A doc that does amnio frequently has a better statistic.nt

[enki23]

31. er... no. that is actually a (questionable) stat from the 1970's

a large (35000) woman study recently showed it to be more like 1 in 1600. and that's without controlling at all for the fact that women in higher risk categories are more likely to seek out the procedure. in other words, it's almost certainly far lower than 1 in 1600.

http://www.parents.com/pregnancy/second-trimester/tests/risk-of-miscarriage-from-amnio-low/

[lostnfound]

35. Perhaps the stats available 8 or 9 years ago..

were different.
I'm sure that I was googling at the time. The doctor didn't particularly argue when I mentioned "1 in 200".

I'm glad to hear that it's not as bad as that.

[Dorian Gray]

25. To prepare....

It is common to test women after 35, even if they would choose not to abort.

[DCKit]

28. Making sure she wouldn't have to do the otherwise unthinkable:

[enki23]

30. because, all else aside, there are things worse than trisomy 21

and abortion is, in fact, a choice. for now.

[LisaL]

33. But not for Sarah Palin.

She opposes abortion unless life of the mother is in danger.

[moriah]

34. Yeah... like 13 and 18.

I think prenatal testing helps the parents not just decide whether or not they will terminate, but also helps them decide how they will prepare if there is a problem.

If they already know what is likely to happen, they get the shock out of the way before the birth, so they can focus only on their child, no matter what the problem might be.

And an advanced sonogram can also help predict other things -- like velamentous cord insertion.

My parents were terrified that I was going to be retarded or suffer from CP, because Mom had a very scary birth with me. The cord broke -- we don't know if it was actually velamentous cord insertion or if the cord was just wrapped around my legs and I kicked so hard it broke, but Mom and I both lost quite a bit of blood, and they know I had no oxygen for five minutes. We both had blood transfusions. The hospital was VERY good, fortunately -- Mom's last memory as they were putting her out for the c-section was the doctor saying "Give me a sharper scalpel!"

My dad's memories are a bit different - this was when the dads weren't encouraged to be in the delivery room.

He and my grandfather were out in the waiting room, when the doctor literally RAN to him, and started speaking very fast as he handed him a pen and paper. He was Korean, and my father couldn't understand anything other than "cesarean", "transfusion", and "sign". The moment Dad had finished signing the doctor yanked the paper back, forgetting about the pen, and ran back through a different door toward the OR.

My grandfather had health problems, and took Valium as a muscle relaxer (he had spasmodic torticollis). Grandpa reached into his pocket, dug out his bottle of Valium, handed my dad a 10 mg Valium, and said "I think you're going to need that." Then he took two himself. And they waited.

-----

The funny part of the story -- okay, my mom had an affair in the marriage. My dad had cheated so my mother decided to cheat back to get back at him. (Yeah, not intelligent at all, but ...) The guy was a redhead. My parents are both dark-haired, although my grandfather was strawberry-blonde and on that side we have a whole crop of redheads. My dad had never met his father, so he didn't know that his father had a crop of redheads in his family too.

So when they brought Dad back and let him hold me, he started counting fingers and toes, etc... then looked at my hair. I'm a redhead.

He immediately asked the nurse "What's this baby's blood type?" "B+". Dad knew both Mom and the other guy were O+, and he was B+. Dad was under the impression that blood type was always inherited from the father, so he thought I would have had B+ no matter what. (I'm really glad that either Dad was homozygous for type B, or that nature let me inherit the B gene from him... because O is recessive, and it was possible for me to have been O if Dad was heterozygous for B.)