The next time people demand "Call Your Representative!", Remember this Bailout...

[Junkdrawer]

and save your dime.

Calls AGAINST this were 100-to-1.

Great democracy we got going here, huh? :shrug:

[liberalmuse]

1. Deja Vù.

It was similar with IWR. We called, wrote letters, emailed, faxed, 'Please, PLEASE don't give Bush a blank check on this!' and were completely ignored. "Representatives", my ass.

[Junkdrawer]

2. They treat us like Kindergarten students...only with more condescension.

:mad:

[avaistheone1]

3. and more outright disdain.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. I wish they did, so all the misconceptions

would go out the window

By the by, you know the ones truly opposed to this plan..s the economists, are all Friedman students

Those forty five are chicago boys... and the radical right, like Senator Shelby, love them.

Read the Shock Doctrine recently? Why do you think they are opposed?

Now if you choose to stop participating in your government, your issue

I guess you will not vite either and urge others not to either now huh?

[Junkdrawer]

6. Naomi Klein: Now is the Time to Resist Wall Street's Shock Doctrine

I wrote The Shock Doctrine in the hopes that it would make us all better prepared for the next big shock. Well, that shock has certainly arrived, along with gloves-off attempts to use it to push through radical pro-corporate policies (which of course will further enrich the very players who created the market crisis in the first place...).

The best summary of how the right plans to use the economic crisis to push through their policy wish list comes from Former Republican House Speaker Newt Gingrich. On Sunday, Gingrich laid out 18 policy prescriptions for Congress to take in order to "return to a Reagan-Thatcher policy of economic growth through fundamental reforms." In the midst of this economic crisis, he is actually demanding the repeal of the Sarbanes-Oxley Act, which would lead to further deregulation of the financial industry. Gingrich is also calling for reforming the education system to allow "competition" (a.k.a. vouchers), strengthening border enforcement, cutting corporate taxes and his signature move: allowing offshore drilling.


It would be a grave mistake to underestimate the right's ability to use this crisis -- created by deregulation and privatization -- to demand more of the same. Don't forget that Newt Gingrich's 527 organization, American Solutions for Winning the Future, is still riding the wave of success from its offshore drilling campaign, "Drill Here, Drill Now!" Just four months ago, offshore drilling was not even on the political radar and now the U.S. House of Representatives has passed supportive legislation. Gingrich is holding an event this Saturday, September 27 that will be broadcast on satellite television to shore up public support for these controversial policies.


What Gingrich's wish list tells us is that the dumping of private debt into the public coffers is only stage one of the current shock. The second comes when the debt crisis currently being created by this bailout becomes the excuse to privatize social security, lower corporate taxes and cut spending on the poor. A President McCain would embrace these policies willingly. A President Obama would come under huge pressure from the think tanks and the corporate media to abandon his campaign promises and embrace austerity and "free-market stimulus."

...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/naomi-klein/now-is-the-time-to-resist_b_128433.html

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. Having LIVED through it, she's wrong

she needs to READ the proposed legislation

Or care to POINT to me the end of subsidies

How bout the end of social security?

Other social programs like oh food stamps or medicare?

Austerity program

Financial controls

THAT is what the shock doctrine looks like

LIVED IT IN THE FLESH

The DOdd plan is far from that... why do you think the economists are saying no? What do they all have in common? They are Friedman students

[sendero]

9. I don't think you are reading her correctly..

... the other shit doesn't happen until the BAILOUT FAILS. Several months down the road.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. I've lived through it

and I can tell you how it goes

You use this time to imposse it, not wait for that money to go into the system and work its way in

What part of LIVED through it are people missing?

What is happening is the shock doctrine, the way it went down in 1932

[Junkdrawer]

11. I read Dodd's plan. It sucks. Here's the heart of Dodd's plan:

(d) PROGRAM GUIDELINES.—Before the earlier of
the end of the 2-business day period beginning on the date
of the first exercise of the authority under this section or
the end of the 30-day period beginning on the date of the
enactment of this Act, the Secretary shall publish program
guidelines, including the following:
(1) Mechanisms for purchasing troubled assets.
(2) Methods for pricing and valuing troubled
assets.
(3) Procedures for selecting asset managers.
(4) Criteria for identifying troubled assets for
purchase.


http://banking.senate.gov/public/_files/LegislativeTextofChairmansDoddsproposalfortheTreasuryBailoutplanAYO08B68_xml.pdf

Hank Paulson makes the important decisions, then TELLS Congress what he decided.


Now I'm looking for the compromise legislation.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. So you tihnk the Congress should take on EXECUTIVE duties now

read the constition lately?

[Junkdrawer]

14. Yes. I think the Congress should CONTROL the purse strings...

But they keep delegating that responsibility to the Executive.

They keep issuing BLANK CHECKS.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. They are... that is what is called the reporting clauses of th4e

act

You think Congress should also micromanage DoD?

Controlling purse string does not mean controlling the money on a day to day... it means reporting to proper committees.. it is in the plan

Read it... as is people are pissed (rightly so) but people don't bother even trying to understand how things work

[Junkdrawer]

18. So, you're a big Unitary Executive fan too now?

I post links to actual legislation, you condescend with the kind of unitary executive nonsense that one might expect from John Yoo.

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. I have read the projected law

but this has LITTLE to do with the unitary executive

That is unless we have had one for the last 280 years

Jeebus age, departments of the executive use the money alloted to them by the senate and house and REPORT back to prop per committees, this is the way its been done since the foundation of the country

The House and Senate have NEVER ever micromanaged ANY department, which is what you are asking for

Now if you want it to absolutely fail on constitutional grounds go for it

Oh and by the way what do you thing the Inspector General and Assistant Inspector General roles are in this? DIRECT SUPERVISION

This follows a historical pattern going back to 1787

[Junkdrawer]

21. AT THE VERY LEAST they should have had Paulson submit guidelines...

before they appropriated the money.

Under Dodd's plan (and the final plan I'll bet), Paulson provides that AFTER he begins spending $250 Billion.

Before we give him that much money, shouldn't We, The People know where he will spend it first and exactly how he will determine prices?

Or would that create a Constitutional Crisis? :sarcasm:

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. You read the law... you know that for the first time in US history

what they spend and how will be made transparent by publishing it every week or so

Don't pretend you don't

You are just angry and it does not matter what they passed, you'd still be against it.

[Junkdrawer]

23. Paulson can't possibly spend that much money by himself. He will...

create a bureaucracy to do that. That bureaucracy, in turn, will be run under Guidelines he will publish.

What are those Guidelines? Hank and Ben know, they're just not telling us until we fork over the dough.

My conclusion is that our "representatives" like it that way.

[nadinbrzezinski]

25. You do know it is not even 700B any more

oh never mind

You're right, they should all just step away from the table and wait for the crash to occur

After all this is just an october surprise

This is truly a case of the kid who screamed wolf one too many times, and like that story... the wolf is real, but people don't believe him (with good reason)

As to our reps

You really NEED to take a poli sci and US Government class... perhaps then you'll understand how the purse is really controlled

I am done trying to talk reason

Anger is so deep that it does not matter what they passed or didn't passed

It really doesn't matter

[Junkdrawer]

26. *shakes head* More condescension... Do you even read my posts?

two replies up I said $250 billion.

Never mind.

[MadrasT]

5. Yeah, how 'bout that?

They're trying to beat us down until we give in.

Fuck that. I'm not giving up. Ever.

I'm already planning to vote my Rep. out of office this time around. Neither of my Senators are up this time, but paybacks are a bitch.

[dana_b]

8. that's what I was thinking!!

why bother? they do what they want to do anyway.

[EFerrari]

10. I don't bother calling Nancy. She's impervious.

Thank God George Bush didn't ask her for my first born son.

[Arugula Latte]

15. They don't give a crap about us. We're not who they serve, obviously.

[Subdivisions]

17. You're right. Why bother? If they pass this bailout, there will no longer be

any reason to call representatives' offices ever again. It's a waste of everyone's time and energy. Simply vote them out. And keep voting them out until they get it.

[wundermaus]

19. Evidence:

Once and for all, let this "bailout" (better described as extortion) be irrefutable proof that the US Congress represents their Corporate constituencies. That We, the People of the United States of America may elect them, petition them, and exchange them with their political rivals, they are nevertheless, regardless of party affiliations, beholden to the wealthy power base of the elite upper 1% of the world's population. The powers that control our government (and the allocation of our fund as collected taxes) exclusively serve the elite power base and their fascist objectives. Calling our representatives, writing them letters, protesting in the streets, and getting thrown in jail will not change this fact. They do not reflect our best interests nor do they respond to democratic process. We are no longer a nation based upon our founding principles: "That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."

Thus, there is only one way to alter our descent into Despotism:
"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

Citizens: although Congress has not declared it against us (for they are cowards), they have by their criminal actions and pending insurrections (Suspension of Habeas Corpus, Martial Law, and suspension of Posse Comitatus) threatened our democratic authority and rule of law. It is, therefore crystal clear, that we are in a state of war.

[ShortnFiery]

30. Let's throw it back to Pelosi, in particular, "A Wall Street Bail-Out is off of the table!!!" eom

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

24. In fascism the bosses rule. In democracy the people rule.

In this "democracy" the bosses rule.

[Enrique]

29. in a representative democracy, the elected representatives rule

and the people have a right to petition them and vote them out.

A decent system, I'd say. Probably better than "American Idol" style voting by the public, sorry if that sounds elitist.

[Orsino]

27. Calls against which bailout, exactly?

The details are still being worked out, and whatever bones we are eventually tossed, we should thank the thousands who took the time to call. This is the piece of our democracy that still works, a little, especially at election time.

[ShortnFiery]

28. *Any* democrat who votes for this should be voted out in their next Primary?

Don't vote out any Democrats now, but dammit, let's get rid of the corporate democrats staring 2 years from now.

We need to tell them that when we call D.C.

[Individualist]

31. I remembered IWR

and knew better than to waste my time.

[ShortnFiery]

34. Hey, waste your time. Tell any democrat that they'll lose to their next democratic challenger.

I take this very personally and will do everything I can to get the "Corporate FIRST" democratic representatives OUT of our beloved party.

[tbyg52]

32. Yep. You only matter when they want your vote. nt

[Pastiche423]

33. My rep, Pete DeFazio just sent me an email

He began w/...

"I am vehemently opposed to this bailout."

and ended w/...

"I will continue to challenge this bailout every step of the way."

He also voted against the IWR.

There are some good people in Congress.