Are long waits to vote the equivalent of a Poll Tax?

[Bandit]

Time is money and some of these people had to wait up to eight hours.. What is eight hours pay worth these days? We have to have "Vote By Mail" just as Oregon has had for over a Decade and everyone Republican, Democrat, Independent, Green , Everyone LOVES it..You vote at your kitchen table where you can discuss the issues and people on the ballot with family members and others and then let the Mailman take your ballot away. You don't need to wait in any lines or find any parking spots or risk running into that obnoxious person you have been avoiding. Plus it is a PAPER BALLOT..

[crikkett]

1. It's not a secret ballot

that option should be preserved.

[Bandit]

2. I take it you have never voted Absentee.

It is indeed a secret ballot, your name is no where on the ballot.

[crikkett]

6. Ahem:

I HAVE A CHOICE TO VOTE ABSENTEE.

My comment was that the option for casting a secret ballot should be preserved.

Thank you.

[Bandit]

12. The choice is still there

Remember there are many Americans that don't have a kitchen table or a home address. There are still voting booths in Oregon and people can still cast ballots there.

[drm604]

3. Yes it is.

If it's done right. You have two envelopes. The inner one contains no identifying information. The voter seals the ballot in this envelope. This envelope is then placed in the outer mailing envelope which has an identifying serial number or something similar.

You need to have observers available from all parties present when the envelopes are opened. The serial number is checked to make sure that it was issued to a valid voter, and that they haven't already voted, and is recorded. It is then opened and the inner envelope is place, unopened, in a separate container from the outer envelopes. The inner envelopes are opened and tallied later.

There is however another weakness to this system. Votes can be sold or coerced since you can show someone else how you voted before you mail the ballot.

[Bandit]

4. Yes that is exactly how it is done

The ballot is enclosed in a sealed envelope with no markings, so the ballot has no identification. The outer envelope has your address and identifying number so it can be checked against the voter registration list. As far as coercing votes, IMO the risk is far less than voter intimdation that is existent today and back to the point of the original post a HUGE Poll Tax placed on the voter by causing such long delays to cast their vote. Time is Money....Not to mention how it causes the impatient to just give up if the line is too long..Also remeber Oregon has been doing this for over a Decade now and had plenty of opportunity to work out the bugs if any. The people in Oregon are virtually unanimous in their delight with this system..

[Goblinmonger]

7. I like going to the polls to vote.

Makes it more real in my experience. We are so disconnected from so many things today, I like being connected to the political process.

Plus, do you have to pay for the stamp to mail that bad boy in?

[drm604]

9. They could use postage paid envelopes.

But, even if you have to pay for a stamp, that still costs less than giving up half a day of work to stand in line.

Of course, the real solution is to provide adequate polling locations and resources.

[cherokeeprogressive]

19. We had a guy stomp into the Orange County Registrar of Voters office screaming that

having to put a stamp on the envelope was the equivelant of a poll tax.

[crikkett]

8. "virtually unanimous in their delight"

okay then, and thanks for telling me how it works.

Hypothetically, what happens when abusive spouse or caretaker withholds my mail?

What happens if my ballot gets lost or ruined?

[drm604]

10. What happens if an abusive spouse or caretaker keeps you away from the polling place?

Just to play devil's advocate.

[crikkett]

14. I like to play devil's advocate too when I can't come up with an answer.

(Which is upthread in Bandit's response - Yes, Oregon has public polling places for people to vote if they don't want to mail in their ballot)

:evilgrin:

[cherokeeprogressive]

I really don't think the gubmint can be held accountable for abusive spouses.

My registrar's office will replace lost or ruined absentee ballots though.

[Goblinmonger]

5. No it's not. n/t

[suston96]

11. I voted absentee mail-in-ballot. I checked yesterday and it was received .......

...and the county recorder told me my signature was verified.

My signature was on the outer envelope. On Tuesday, the envelope will be opened and my pink or red envelope inside, with nothing on it to indicate where it came from, will be put on the pile to be opened and counted - by Optiscan equipment.

I approve this method and this message.

[FormerDittoHead]

13. I think the REAL question is: why aren't Democratic leaders pushing for reforms?

Before you say, "It's a States issue", I'll point out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help_America_Vote_Act

The premise is that it's NOT strictly a States issue. OK, done. Going forward.

My point here is that Republicans are MAKING HAY WHILE THE SUN SHINES on "voter fraud" issues and the like, but the Democrats (in the news, at least) are only taking a reactionary stance, rather than going after the big kahuna - electronic machine fraud, Diebold, etc. and addressing workarounds both short and long term (short term: paper / mail in; long term: open source software).

My personal take is that, as the Democrats are winning, they have no motivation to tinker with the system which will be working in their favor anyway.

The problem I have, however, is that we have yet to see it work, and I don't like the idea of incrementally addressing this issue, rather than looking forward, seeing what the ultimate solution will look like, and work toward that end.

[justiceischeap]

16. IMO, most politicians don't want everyone to vote

That's why election day isn't a national holiday, that's why they make it so difficult to vote, that's why urban areas have less polls and more broken machines. It's easier to game the system when the system is already broken.

[dkofos]

15. We should all be that civilized!!

[Joe Chi Minh]

17. I woud say they are more like a "white" pogrom, in the sense of a "white" martyrdom,

i.e. without the actual shedding of blood.

One use of the term can be found in this article:

http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/features/f0000323.shtml

Although I would consider the white martyrdom of Afro-Saxons in our respective countries, the UK and US, immeasurably more painful than the marginalisation of Christian clergy in our societies; which is, nevertheles, not intended to demean the sacrifice of Christian clergy.

[Iggo]

18. Only if the long waits are intentionally inflicted. (n/t)

[yodoobo]

20. It's worse.

Long lines discourage people who even have the money.

Long lines eliminate people who cannot take off work, but might still be willing to spend their grocery money to vote.