Wal-Mart's Black Friday Machinations

[GrpCaptMandrake]

remind me of the late, great Prophet Bill Hicks (peace be upon his squeegeed-clean third eye):

Are you in marketing or advertising? Kill yourself. No comedy here. No bit. Kill yourself. Just plantin' seeds.

Yesterday's Wal-Mart stampede may have happened in Valley Stream, NY, but it was conceived and executed in Bentonville, Arkansas by marketing fiends whose sole purpose in life is to get people to want, to fairly ACHE, to yearn, to stand for hours in freezing cold, just to have shit they don't even need in the first place in order to satisfy the marketing-driven fiasco known as "Christmas."

I read where the detective investigating the scene said it would be hard to press charges. He was apparently thinking in terms of the crowd itself, but it wouldn't be a stretch against WallyWorld. From the Store Manager on up, there's criminal intent to go around for everything from Negligent Homicide to Conspiracy to Commit to Incitement to Riot. The WallyWorld CEO needs to do some Stir time and maybe we'd finally see an end to this insane transmogrification of human beings into rabid "consumers." God, I hate that word: "consumers." No different from those cattle standing on the frozen Nebraska feedlots, up to their briskets in their own feces, "consuming" stuff they aren't constituted to "consume." Hey! Look at us! We're human! We've got opposable thumbs! But we'll still behave like musk oxen if given the opportunity to get something "for cheap."

"Herd mentality," indeed. But who was the shepherd conditioning the herd to behave that way? It almost always takes external stimuli to stampede an otherwise peaceful herd, be it a gunshot, the appearance of a predator or, in this case, the incessant cry of "Cheap Shit From China!" There is plenty of evidence from years past to make it more than reasonably foreseeable that this kind of conduct was bound to lead to this kind of tragedy. If the county prosecutor doesn't have the resources for a prosection, then the Attorney General needs to step up and start one himself. Name the WallyWorld CEO, Vice-President of Marketing/Advertising, Regional Manager and Store Manager. No Chiquita-style plea bargains. Trial. Straight-up. Get the verdict and let the public DEMAND the bastards go to wherever New York sends the worst of its felons.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Orwellian_Ghost]

1. K&R

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3072291302771620276

[Locrian]

2. instigating a riot

There was a spot on the local news about Best Buy "early shopping". They had the "crew" standing at the door shouting down the seconds (10,9, 8. 7 ....) GO GO GO! To the shoppers as the doors open. They everyone running in for the cheap bargins. All portrayed as Great Fun...

Yeah, these guys know what they want: hyped up mind controlled zombie shoppers.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

3. Every direct-mail flyer

every radio ad, every television ad, every news story on the TeeVee and radio boxes are evidence of WallyWorld's intent.

Now all we need is a willing, fearless prosecutor.

Put the bastards away.


Get On The H.O.R.N.
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[ColbertWatcher]

42. I agree 100%. I posted pics of the Wal-Mart before & after the death. (DU link inside)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4554275&mesg_id=4554814

[lame54]

7. Walmart did everything but hand out Red-Bull

[GrpCaptMandrake]

13. I'm waiting to see how long it takes

before Wal-Mart blames the victim. Or the crowd. Or both.

Evil bastards.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
wwww.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[lame54]

16. they're already reviewing the video tapes for scapegoats

[NashVegas]

18. Like the Invisible Security Wal-Mart Hired?

Some interesting posts in reaction here:

http://blogs.wsj.com/holidaysales/2008/11/28/man-killed-in-wal-mart-stampede/




This was absolutely, completely Walmart’s fault. We were at the Riverhead store, also on Long Island. Walmart provided NO SECURITY whatsoever. We began waiting in line at approx 2 am. The crowd was amicable until around 4am, when line-jumpers began coming up from the side of building. We called the Walmart store and the local police. Walmart did NOT answer the phone, and the police were too late to help. At this point, the crowd pushed in closer… and closer… Once the doors opened, we basically were pushed through by the people behind us. The scariest part was once you were in the building, the crowd broke up & we risked falling and being trampled!!
EVERY other store in the area had multiple forms of security- bodyguards, police, line arrangers…. WALMART failed completely at this. So much so, even the police were amazed (on the phone). 200 people going into one store… with the lowest deals out there… what do they expect!
Comment by Lauren - November 28, 2008 at 2:04 pm

[ColbertWatcher]

43. And, apparently, they're paying "concerned citizens" to post on forums everywhere.

I guess one cannot muddy the jury pool soon enough.

I will be quite happy to see Wal-Mart pay for their negligence.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

45. You noticed it, too? n/t

[blondeatlast]

46. Yep; LBN was rife with them this morning (and many had their pizza for breakfast). nt

[ColbertWatcher]

47. Good. n/t

[blondeatlast]

4. "Blitz Line Starts Here." The store manager who was okay with that sign (even if s/he didn't know

about it, s/he OWNS it) is all this ex-retailer needs to know about what happened.

The crowd was encouraged to get roused up; no doubt.

I so fucking hate Wal-Mart (and I almost never use THAT word, that's how much I hate them).

[GrpCaptMandrake]

5. Wally World got a lot of the "stimulus" last go-round

and they still want more.

This is the apotheosis of our "consumer culture."


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[CaliforniaPeggy]

6. To the Greatest Page with you!

Superbly written!

I loathe those rat bastards...

:nuke: :grr: :nuke: :grr: :nuke:

[GrpCaptMandrake]

8. Why thank-you, Peggy! n/t

[formercia]

9. Send them to Attica

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attica_Correctional_Facility

[GrpCaptMandrake]

10. Hear, hear!

Didn't know if Sing-Sing was still a possiblity, so I opted for a generic reference. If the Angola prison in Louisiana was a possibility, I'd suggest that. Attica's plenty nasty enough, though.

WallyWorld's CEO would learn a WHOLE new meaning for "Action Alley" in Attica.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[formercia]

15. "Action Alley"

Where solitary is considered a reward for good behavior.

[ananda]

11. What does it say about the lives and mentality of the shoppers?

Is life so empty and futile that just the
chance for a large screen tv will fill it
and make it worthwhile?

It looks to me as though society has failed
people on a huge scale.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

12. It's marketing

A constant barrage of marketing and advertising to condition people to pine for that garbage is what MAKES life so empty.

Nonetheless, even in our deliberate consumer culture (which is, in fact, a failure), WallyWorld's intentional conduct is so egregious that it rises to the level of the criminal. To say "society has failed . . . " is not to absolve a corporation like Wal-Mart of its liabilities within that society.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
wwww.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[TahitiNut]

19. "__________ will make you HAPPY!"

They're not unlike the folks in thei forum ... and everywhere in our brain-washed culture where "happiness" is something we "pursue" instead of possess.

"Someday your Prince will come."
"He makes me happy."
"She makes me happy."
We're told to find someone who "fulfills our needs" ... or more than one such someone.

We're told that all our happiness and anger comes from outside ourselves ... that we're obliged to EARN happiness. We must deserve it. We must find it. We must PURSUE it. (It runs away.)

Happiness in our culture is in short supply. Scarcity. The price is going up. If you don't beat out someone else, you won't get yours. Win-lose.

:shrug:

[GrpCaptMandrake]

23. Your thoughts remind me

of the quote that Tom Robbins attributes to Franz Kafka, and with which he opens "Still Life With Woodpecker," to-wit:

You don’t need to leave your room.
Remain sitting at your table and listen.
Don’t even listen, simply wait.
Don’t even wait.
Be quite still and solitary.
The world will freely offer itself to you.
To be unmasked, it has no choice.
It will roll in ecstasy at your feet.

You're quite right. Happiness is in short supply. Applying some godawful economic principle or another, we know that when supply is short, demand goes up. True here. Lots of folks "demanding" happiness that is in apparent short supply.

The con, of course, lies in the notion of externalized happiness; that, like everything else in consumer culture, it is a commodity to be bought and sold. Ultimately, that is the eeeeevilllll genius of consumerism.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Tigress DEM]

30. Back to Walden, anyone?

To hell with $tuff. Let's all go somewhere and BE happy with our families. Invest in travel to small communities and shop unique stores that Wally's trying to gobble up. Wrap up silly stuff, start new traditions.

THERE has GOT to be a way to take back Christmas from the Corporate States of America. We got the White House back.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

32. It's not just Christmas we have to take back

It's the whole economy. Quite a job, and the holiday season would be a great place to start.

"Consumer culture" was a deliberate invention.

www.storyofstuff.com Well worth the 20 minutes if you've never seen it.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com

[Tigress DEM]

34. True. One thing at a time, though.

Yeah, I had a great marketing instructor back when I was a small business major in college. I found out that anyone can be targeted and marketed. I'm a tough nut to crack, though. I avoid ads like the plague. Then they invented generics. Same stuff, same price, no fancy label and it's stuff I have to buy anyway, OK FINE.

I am hoping there is a way to build community culture that topples consumer culture. Communities buying wind turines together for instance to get off the energy merry-go-round. Like the food co-ops in a way, but a percentage buy in so that people can decrease their energy bills with initial or ongoing investments in clean energy.

Focus on traveling and seeing small towns instead of spending mucho bucks going to all the tourist traps. Go natural. Go green. Just get up and go.

DO something, don't just shop your brains out.

You STILL wind up spending money and moving the economy, but just not at the beck and call of Wal-Mart or Wall Street.

We need a NEW rebel symbol.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

59. Speaking of wind turbines . . .

Have a look: www.coalriverwind.org We're trying to transform West Virginia. We're fighting uphill. The mountain that could provide 100,000 homes with electricity and fifty or more good, green, long-term union jobs with benefits and healthcare is slated for destruction.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[BR_Parkway]

33. Thank you much, from a small town retailer, trying to keep our wine

shop going. You're right, big boxes are killing people - in more ways than just trampled at the door.

[Tigress DEM]

35. Air America Radio keeps reminding me about shopping local.

It's a lot more fun. I buy less but I enjoy more.

[BR_Parkway]

37. We try to as often as possible. Not only do we get to support our neighbors

but we also find things that just aren't out there in a mass produced world. Even our shop, we carry things that aren't generally going to be in the big box places, supporting small producers who bottle a couple hundred cases of wine every year rather than the behemoths out there. And it's really special for one of the winemakers to come in selling us his product rather than the Associate Assistant Sales Director of the Middle Southeastern territory blah blah blah of Gigantic Brands Ltd, a wholly owned subsidiary of Bloated Enterprises Inc

[Tigress DEM]

27. I heard happiness is an inside job, no one can do it for you.

I think this is a great stepping point as a nation to say "NEVER again should someone die in a stampede to buy more $tuff."

AND I think we should ALL be the ones to make the change.

Boycott FRIDAY shopping at chain stores entirely until Jan 15th or just on general principal. AND ridicule anyone who does go as being not only UN-American, but a lousy human.

I think we should use this tragedy to pull the plug on all this forced hype about shopping our way out of depression into prosperity.

Go in as communities and buy wind-turbines so we can get control of our lives through energy independence.

I love Jesus and I used to love Christmas, but I hate this commercialism gone wild.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

14. reports from previous Black Fridays... this was bound to happen

Once the doors opened just before 5 a.m., hundreds of people poured through, breaking down the police tape. Dozens of others cut the line and ran through the exit door before Wal-Mart employees were able to stop them.

Inside, Wal-Mart workers were throwing boxes with laptops and portable DVD players to the people who were pushing and shoving to get the merchandise. A lone sneaker lay on the floor, lost by an anxious shopper in the scrum.
http://workbench.cadenhead.org/news/2814/black-friday-more-than-i-bargained


Black Friday injury
http://www.katc.com/global/story.asp?s=5726038


Black Friday:

Date & time: The day after American Thanksgiving, across the United States.

Origin: Most sources state that "Black Friday" is a reference to the chaos and heavy-traffic of the shopping holiday that slowly emerged in the latter 20th century and harkens back to when the stock market crashed in 1929-"Black Tuesday." The first concrete reference to Black Friday came in a 1975 New York Times article.

Purpose: Gluttonous consumerism!

Projected level of violence: High. Black Friday is legendary for the pushing, shoving and general disorder that characterizes stores as they open their doors to a flood of eager consumers. Between stampedes, fist fights and general anarchy, Black Friday is a notoriously violent day of disarray and confusion. Several blogs have even run recurring features with colorful titles such as, "Black Friday Injury Update."
http://media.www.mcgilltribune.com/media/storage/paper234/news/2007/12/04/StudentLiving/X.Vs-Y.Boxing.Day.Vs.Black.Friday-3129466.shtml

[GrpCaptMandrake]

17. The very essence of "foreseeability"

New Yorkers need to demand an investigation, indcitment and prosecution of Wal-Mart, not just the corporation, but the executives.

I guarantee you Wal-Mart's already working on it from their end.

Any wagers on whether the Bastards From Bentonville fight the workers comp claim?


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
wwww.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Tigress DEM]

20. Hello? Personal responsibility anyone?

Instead of trying to get people out of the store the police should have just locked them in and took down every name.


I think the people who should be shamed are the people who did the trampling.


People can turn the fucking TV off and listen to Air America or HORN radio instead of stupid shit.

People can get off junk mail lists and shop selectively.

Opposable thumbs are great, but what about brains? Um, dust them off and use them would be a good plan for anyone who is so addicted to shopping they will kill to get there first.


AND I think we should start a Boycott Black Friday for Humanity instead of trying to kill Wal-Mart. I'm not a fan of Wal-Mart, but personal responsibility is our own. No government, no chain store, no marketing guru can MAKE us kill one another without our willing consent.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

24. I'm all for personal responsibility

I just wish our "betters" would take some of it once in awhile.

Even had one corralled the herd and held them, proving intent or agency, let alone causation, would be very difficult. In the case of Wal-Mart's executives, intent and culpability would be more than apparent from their corporate sales strategy, especially where Incitement To Riot and similar crimes are concerned. When you've got ten specifically advertised items for sale and a thousand people are waiting to buy it, you've moved into "incitement" territory and holding the people inciting the riot personally responsible is basic stuff within our judicial framework.

When you've got Wal-Mart doing this sort of thing, coupled with Home Depot's founder threatening to shoot other companies' CEOs, you've got the indicia of a real problem brewing.

Additionally, absent such a criminal action, there will likely be no justice at all either for the victim or his family. Most states' workers comp laws preclude civil actions in favor of the comp scheme, whether it be a public or a private one.

The best way to get rid of "Black Friday" is to show corporate America that it costs them money instead of making it for them. Jury verdicts are quite effective in that way.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Tigress DEM]

26. I'd be a lot more for boycotting all FRIDAY shopping any major chain til Jan 15th

Like you said, it isn't just Wally, it's all of them.

We could go on a "Shopper's Strike Back for Jdimytai Damour" and carry signs saying:

"REAL American's don't trample other's to death to get to the sale rack."

"DO you really NEED more stupid $TUFF for Christmas?"

"Where is the Christmas in $tuff?"

"Here's a thought, GO HOME and spend time with your family instead of buying more $tuff!"

"Who would JESUS trample to get that last laptop?"

[Hannah Bell]

51. bs. you see how your "consent" works when you're stuck in the middle of

a mob - can't see what's in front or behind you, can only move in the direction people are pushing, can't bend down to pick someone up because you'll be trampled yourself.

walmart offered super-low prices ONLY from 5 - 11 am, guaranteeing there'd be a huge crowd, then did nothing to control it.

why? to get people jacked up to sell more stuff = profit for walmart.

they like people fighting over stuff because people buy more.

[MadHound]

53. We all know that such sales are a mob scene,

Why deliberately make yourself part of that scene. Exercise your personal responsibility and stay away altogether:shrug: After all, it's not like you won't be able to get the same sale prices here in a couple of weeks.

[iris27]

66. There's already a bit of a movement going re: boycotting Black Friday.

Buy Nothing Day was started by AdBusters in 1992, and encourages people to avoid any purchases on Black Friday itself in conjunction with examining their holiday celebrations and looking for ways to focus less on STUFF.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buy_Nothing_Day

[bain_sidhe]

21. It's not just the "wanting" that they manipulate...

they also limit supplies of their sale items, and make that fact known so that the herd knows that if they're not one of the first, they won't get the item.

Complete and undeniable culpability. Throw the book at them, then throw away the key.

**edited for typo**

[slay]

22. Great Bill Hicks quote. Everyone should check him out - for philosophy as well as comedy

Oh yeah - nice post too. :smoke:

[GrpCaptMandrake]

28. Thanks!

Bill Hicks is as close to enlightenment/sainthood as any person I know of in recent memory.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com

[aikoaiko]

25. I just can't see a store sale as a negligent behavior.

[Midlodemocrat]

29. Me, neither. And I wouldn't go if you paid me.

Wal Mart isn't the only one who has these door busters every year. I fail to see how executing what has been in the past a successful marketing strategy is their sole fault.

Whatever happened to not participating in the riotous behavior? And, what in GOD's name was the 8 month pregnant woman thinking?????? I'm not blaming the victim here, I'm no friend of Wal Mart for various reasons, but what was she thinking? At the very least, she should have been concerned about depriving the baby of some needed rest as well as herself.

I don't think I'll ever understand this mentality. All to save a few bucks.

[Tigress DEM]

38. I don't know the last time I shopped on a "Black Friday" turns my stomach.

But Wally and the rest target our kids and make ads that tell us we're bad parents if we don't get them the latest "whatever" because the stores need this buying surge to survive financially.

I don't think anyone in the crowd planned this, but we all need to take a step back and make it stop.

I feel the same way I did when the deaths in Iraq started happening, "NOT in MY NAME." I just don't want to see useless death and destruction in any form here in America if we can get creative and squash whatever mentallity is causing it.

[PatSeg]

39. That bothered me too

When I was pregnant, I was very self-protective and there were places I would not go. I certainly would have avoided any crowds. There are some situations that a person can't avoid, but Black Friday is not a required activity.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

31. Negligence or Intentional Act

In the case of negligence, it's doing or not doing that which a reasonable, prudent store-owner would do or not do in the same or similar circumstances. In other words, is it reasonable to expect one person to hold off an mob that you've whipped into a frenzy and expect that person not to be hurt in the crush?

As to incitment, Wal-Mart knew, by virtue of its own past actions, as well as that of others, that people reach a fever pitch over what they call their "Black Friday" sale.

Please bear in mind that I'm talking about criminal charges. I'm not talking about a civil lawsuit, since that is likely precluded under New York's workers comp laws. In other words, a criminal action is the only way the victim and his family can receive justice for what Wal-Mart obviously knew was a dangerous situation.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com

[Scooter24]

40. Nothing they did was criminal...

99.9% of the Walmart's across the nation had a mostly uneventful Black Friday. One store has a serious problem and you are somehow concluding that Walmart was criminally negligent because they hosted a sale that they "obviously knew was a dangerous situation."

I assume this action will be brought up against the thousands of other retailers, both big and small, who hosted similar sales and who were just as liable in this matter given your logic.

I am not going to blame a company because of the actions of several idiots who couldn't act in a civil manner. It's neither criminal nor bad business to advertise a sale. There is practically a zero chance of a criminal lawsuit.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

41. Then there will be no justice for the victim

Workers Compensation creates immunity from civil suit for employers. That means the man's estate won't be able to seek compensation for his wrongful death. That means Wal-Mart gets away with it.

Actually, it's your logic that's faulty. Those "thousands of other retailers" didn't solicit a mob in the wee hours of the morning AND provide minimal or non-existent security AND offer only a few of the advertised bargains AND send a pair of lone employees to handle what had obviously become an overwrought mass of human beings whipped into an aggressive herd mentality. And while "it's neither criminal nor bad business to advertise a sale," it is culpable to do so in a totality of circumstances that has a reasonable likelihood of creating the problem that transpired. These things are done to generate free advertising via coverage by the For-Prifit-Only media and to deliberately make shoppers struggle for intentionally inequitably offered bargains. Among other things, Wal-Mart offered only a very few of the items at the deep discounts which drew people. Those kinds of circumstances bring out the worst in people, i.e. create the reasonable foreseeability of such a tragedy as this and the criminal culpability which should attach to such conduct.

At some point in this country, we must begin to hold corporations to the same "personal" standards of conduct to which we, as persons, are held. That's what "personhood" is all about.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Scooter24]

49. ...

Those "thousands of other retailers" didn't solicit a mob in the wee hours of the morning AND provide minimal or non-existent security

Advertising a sale is NOT soliciting a mob. If I get 50 LCD TV's and decide to sell them for $100 starting at 5am at my store, that is NOT saying "Please come and riot and kill whoever is in your way." Like I said, 99.9% of the stores didn't have any problems with their security situation or staffing. One did and there is no evidence that the store's own policies or procedures were the cause of this tragedy. There is no justification for company-wide criminal charge.

AND offer only a few of the advertised bargains

Are you privy to their actual inventory? A friend of mine was able to get a laptop and a Nintendo Wii and said they had a good 40 of them. I'm not sure what you think is "a few" but I wouldn't expect any retailer to have a huge inventory on loss-leading items that are a one-time special buy. Obviously retail or economic mechanics isn't your strong suit.

AND send a pair of lone employees to handle what had obviously become an overwrought mass of human beings whipped into an aggressive herd mentality.

The people busted through the doors and glass. It wasn't like there was just one guy unlocking the doors in front of several thousand people. The man was probably there emptying trash or cleaning the floor while they busted through. Surely you aren't expecting to see a few dozen Walmart employees dressed in riot gear ready to handle the crowds?

These things are done to generate free advertising via coverage by the For-Prifit-Only media and to deliberately make shoppers struggle for intentionally inequitably offered bargains. Among other things, Wal-Mart offered only a very few of the items at the deep discounts which drew people.

Again, this was done for almost every retailer. It wasn't just Walmart who ran ads. It wasn't just Walmart who had limited supplies on their hottest bargains. The media might have played a role in the hype, but still is far from meeting a criminal threshold.

Those kinds of circumstances bring out the worst in people, i.e. create the reasonable foreseeability of such a tragedy as this and the criminal culpability which should attach to such conduct.

Again, 99.9% of retail stores had no serious problems yesterday, so the odds of any "foreseeable" problem must be quite low- low enough to not justify the added expense of staffing a store for a potential riot.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

58. Your response makes your lack of comprehension clear

Wal-Mart is open 24/7 in most locations. They locked down in order to gin up a frenzy for the "sale' in question. Was that an accident, or was it a deliberate, intentional act?

Your reasoning is flawed by your pro-WalMart bias. The doors weren't "busted." Photos put paid to that bit of corporate spin. See upthread. Your assertion that the victim "was probably there emptying the trash or cleaning the floor" displays your lack of knowledge of the situation:

"This was utter chaos as these men tried to open the door this morning," (detective) Fleming said.

"A few dozen Walmart employees dressed in riot gear" wouldn't be needed if the crowd hadn't been kept in queue overnight in the cold, huddled next to a sign that said "Blitz Line Starts Here." "Blitz Line?" Nah, that couldn't be intentional conduct, now could it?

Your standard of "99% of stores had no serious problems" is not the standard for judging the individual situation. Upon indictment, the query for a Grand Jury is roughly "Is it more likely than not that the charged crime has been committed?" If the answer is in the affirmative, then the next query for the Grand Jury is "Is it more likely than not that the person(s) charged were the ones who committed the crime?" If that question is answered affirmatively, then the indictment issues.

At trial, the level of proof rises to "beyond a reasonable doubt." Wal-Mart's internal marketing memos would likely prove the charges almost by themselves. The company is known for some of the most mercenary tactics in the retail world.

The young man and his family deserve justice, and even Wal-Mart should be amenable to it. If they're not guilty, let a jury declare it. If they're guilty, let them be personally punished. After all, Wal-Mart is a "person" within the meaning of American law.



Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[RetiredTrotskyite]

67. There Is Never Justice FWal-Mart Workers

Wal-Mart uses every LEGAL and UNDERHANDED method available to screw the workers. I don't know how it works for Walmart assistant managers (my DH works for Wally World and he said the night shift was told it was an assistant manager who was killed), but for regular workers, the life insurance policy--assuming the person could AFFORD to pay in for it, and one year's wages is what is available for hourly "associates" (what a nice term for screwed-over employees).

When DH was sick earlier this year, he was screwed out of the insurance he paid for...they didn't pay a dime to the hospital, and he didn't get dime one of workman's comp either (apparently Indiana is adept at screwing people out of benefits0, and then, to add insult to injury, the short-term disability wouldn't pay, either (the doctor didn't specify that DH was completely unable to work, which he was). Once he went back to work, the human resources department said he could not challenge the non-payment of short term benefits because he was now back to work). Walmart does this routinely. They find every fucking way they can to screw their workers. It's not just an isolated thing...I have seen it happen to other workers there as well.

Unfortunately work is hard to find so my DH is waiting to find something else before he quits. You are so right, though, GrpCaptMandrake, there will likely be no justice or recourse for this man's family. So much for Wally World and their fucking family values!! What family values? For the Waltons?

[creature of habit]

44. Oh I strongly disagree with that

There was 4000 persons at the Wal Mart location I went to that morning. One of the cops on detail said they started lining up at 11 the previous night. There were three uniformed cops there that I could see, and 1 canine unit in the back seat of the cruiser parked right out front who looked and sounded like he meant business. I've been to other black friday sales before but this is the first time I've seen people lined up in front of a store,..... down the side,..... and out back and into the woods and back up the side again.
The front was roped off - there were more people there and more arriving than the capacity of the store could hold.

The big cop out front joked he was about to leash the dog up to the post out front in a minute. They seemed to have the situation under control. I observed for a few minutes , turned around came home and ordered online. for under $10 more than the super duper sale price I bought what i intended too and didn't have to deal with the crowd afterall.



Wal-Mart Stores Inc. (WMT), based in Bentonville, Ark., called the incident a "tragic situation" and said the employee came from a temporary agency and was doing maintenance work at the store. It said it tried to prepare for the crowd by adding staffers and outside security workers, putting up barricades and consulting police.
"Despite all of our precautions, this unfortunate event occurred," senior Vice President Hank Mullany said in a statement. "Our thoughts and prayers go out to the families of those impacted."



There were no precautions according to the photos I've seen of the crowd outside the door. There were no barricades. There were no police on duty. Shoppers were allowed to swarm the entrance area and enter the doorway like a herd of cattle. Allowing the crowd to bunch together like that was negligent.

This store should not be allowed to re-open until a criminal investigation is done.


shoppers should have been let in single file - there was mismanagement and malfeasance and no crowd control

[blondeatlast]

48. Did you see the sign "Blitz Line Starts Here?" When I was in retailing,

a store manager would never carry keys again for not only having a handwritten sign (unthinkable to most retailers) but one that was so disrespectful of customers as well.

[creature of habit]

50. the doors were opened not broken down

Wal Mart is trying to change the facts after the case by saying the doors were broken down - they were not.

the video I viewed clearly showed the doors sliding open and the store worker running for cover.

[GrpCaptMandrake]

52. You can rest assured

the "Risk Management" Department lights have burned 24/7 in Bentonville since Wal-Mart created this little slice of Hell on Earth. By the time they're done with it, the facts will be utterly unrecognizable and the crowd will have been reduced to a mob of pitchfork-and-torch wielding hooligans.


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Tigress DEM]

36. Think of it as a whore and a John. Takes two to get the job done.

Wal-Mart spreading their legs behind glass doors, moaning and grinding and attracting the crowd of dicks ready and eager to be turned into a frenzied mob.

[Hannah Bell]

61. If there's no crowd control, it's negligent.

People have been trampled at Walmart sales in the past. Almost every year, in fact.

That it continues to happen with no apparent change in policy = culpable.

[Rabrrrrrr]

54. While corporate America has much to atone for, this tragedy is simple: it's stupid fucking people

that's all it is.

Really fucking ignorant low-life stupid pathetic jackasses.

America society is much to blame; not so much advertisers, but the society that so easily and quickly believes them instead of thinking for themselves.

[Midlodemocrat]

55. Dude. I LOVE you.

:thumbsup:

[Rabrrrrrr]

56. Thanks! I hate the knee-jerk anti-corporatism that sees all business as evil, ipso facto.

Annoys the living shit out of me.

If WalMart were negligent in this case, then why wasn't I there? If there tactics are so goddamned good at inciting riots and mobs and forcing people to do evil things, then how come I stayed home?

Oh, that's right - because I'm not a pathetic pile of useless shit, and I think.

[Midlodemocrat]

57. This has been two ridiculous days on DU. Do the people

who needed 'crowd control' to purchase a Wii deserve a free pass? Rabrrrrrr, I ask you, when was the last time you were shopping and the store was so negligent that you needed police protection so as not to get trampled?

For me? Never. I don't go to Black Friday events because I'm lazy and don't want to get up that early. And, I feel fervently that if the only way you can purchase a flat screen is to get in line at 3AM and trample others, you can't afford it.

[Rabrrrrrr]

60. And I think that if you get in line at 3 am (or the day before ) to buy anything, you are a shitpile

To say nothing of whether or not one can afford something.

Standing in line to buy anything, more than say a few minutes in line at the movie theater, is a sign of total pathetic loserness.

I feel very sad that an employee got killed - that poor chap had to be there.

Had it been customer, I would have had a moment of "oh, gee" and then a kind of schadenfreude of "well, seriously, is the world really gonna miss another pathetic jackass loser shitpile? No, not really."

Standing in line in November weather for hours - some lining up beginning on Thanksgiving morning! - just to save $10 or $30 on a $500 or $1000 item is fucking pathetic. Really, really, really fucking pathetic.

[Midlodemocrat]

63. I agree, I'm very sorry that man was killed

but I think a lot of the blame rests with the idiots who lined up that early to purchase an item they couldn't afford.

I remember getting in line at a Hill's when my son was a baby because Power Rangers toys were in very, very short supply.

It was a completely different mood. All of the moms in line, there were probably 200 or so, were actually HELPING each other find things for their children.

You need a Sabra Sword? Hey, I'll take one!

That kind of thing.

The behavior that led to that man's death in NY makes me sick. NOTHING is worth that. NOTHING.

[creature of habit]

64. it's pathetic but Wal Mart is still negligent

the one I went to had 4000 persons lined up around it and there was no no stampede - why because the front entrance was cordoned off to prohibit exactly what had happened in NY. Shoppers were let in by an organized line. If the local police are not responding on their own because of public safety then it it is up to Wal Mart to pay for the detail.


oH YEAH, THERE WAS A CANINE IN THE BACK SEAT OF THE PATROL CAR READY AT CALL

[GrpCaptMandrake]

65. Don't feel so bad for the fellow

After all, Wal-Mart has already made clear he wasn't "an employee." He was a temp. That means Wal-Mart doesn't even have to pay workers comp.

Wonder why Wal-Mart sent a temp to open the doors in front of that mob? Wouldn't want to inconvenience Wal-Mart by asking that question in front of a jury, now would we? Oh, well. No great loss. Nothing to pay for the dead guy and a little damage at the doorway. You get that dealing with all those "pathetic jackass shitpile(s)."


Get On The H.O.R.N.!
www.headonradionetwork.com
America's Liberal Voice

[Hannah Bell]

62. The low-life jackasses = the corporation who continues to run the sales

with no security or crowd control upgrades, despite trampling incidents every year.

[Rabrrrrrr]

68. If people can only comport themselves as human beings because of a police presence,

then they don't deserve a police presence.

Let the mob mentality jackasses kill each other. We'd be better off for it. If saving $10 is worth more to them than a human life, then so be it.