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The fact that Isarel's actions are only possible because of the United States

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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:25 AM
Original message
The fact that Isarel's actions are only possible because of the United States
economic and military support. And given that Bush and Rice are AWOL again.

How do you characterize the fact that Barack Obama has said NOT ONE WORD.

Here is his radio address for this week:



PRESIDENT-ELECT OBAMA: As the holiday season comes to end, we are thankful for family and friends and all the blessings that make life worth living. But as we mark the beginning of a new year, we also know that America faces great and growing challenges - challenges that threaten our nations economy and our dreams for the future.

Nearly 2 million Americans have lost their jobs this past year - and millions more are working harder in jobs that pay less and come with fewer benefits. For too many families, this new year brings new unease and uncertainty as bills pile up, debts continue to mount and parents worry that their children wont have the same opportunities they had.

However we got here, the problems we face today are not Democratic problems or Republican problems. The dreams of putting a child through college, or staying in your home, or retiring with dignity and security know no boundaries of party or ideology.

These are Americas problems, and we must come together as Americans to meet them with the urgency this moment demands. Economists from across the political spectrum agree that if we don't act swiftly and boldly, we could see a much deeper economic downturn that could lead to double digit unemployment and the American Dream slipping further and further out of reach.

That's why we need an American Recovery and Reinvestment Plan that not only creates jobs in the short-term but spurs economic growth and competitiveness in the long-term. And this plan must be designed in a new way - we cant just fall into the old Washington habit of throwing money at the problem.

We must make strategic investments that will serve as a down payment on our long-term economic future. We must demand vigorous oversight and strict accountability for achieving results. And we must restore fiscal responsibility and make the tough choices so that as the economy recovers, the deficit starts to come down. That is how we will achieve the number one goal of my plan - which is to create 3 million new jobs, more than 80 percent of them in the private sector.

To put people back to work today and reduce our dependence on foreign oil tomorrow, we will double renewable energy production and renovate public buildings to make them more energy efficient.

To build a 21st century economy, we must engage contractors across the nation to create jobs rebuilding our crumbling roads, bridges, and schools.

To save not only jobs, but money and lives, we will update and computerize our health care system to cut red tape, prevent medical mistakes, and help reduce health care costs by billions of dollars each year.

To make America, and our children, a success in this new global economy, we will build 21st century classrooms, labs, and libraries.

And to put more money into the pockets of hardworking families, we will provide direct tax relief to 95 percent of American workers.

I look forward to meeting next week in Washington with leaders from both parties to discuss this plan. I am optimistic that if we come together to seek solutions that advance not the interests of any party, or the agenda of any one group, but the aspirations of all Americans, then we will meet the challenges of our time just as previous generations have met the challenges of theirs.

There is no reason we can't do this. We are a people of boundless industry and ingenuity. We are innovators and entrepreneurs and have the most dedicated and productive workers in the world. And we have always triumphed in moments of trial by drawing on that great American spirit - that perseverance, determination and unyielding commitment to opportunity on which our nation was founded. In this new year, let us resolve to do so once more.



He sold me on LEADERSHIP goddammit

Flame the fuck away.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
1. People In This Country, Sir, Are Much More Concerned With Their Own Affairs Than With The Near East
They expect our new President to put our own affairs in order, and consider focusing on that to be leadership....
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. WEll you see, where I come from we have this metaphysical theory that all things are connected
and all things relate to each other. A cancer in one organ kills the entire organism.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. So, by your reasoning, we should excise Gaza entirely and blast it with chemo and radiation?
Your metaphysical theory is, at best, an irrelevant metaphor in this case.
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. you opinion is equally as valuable (and valued) as mine. Thank you.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. All I'm saying is that holistic metaphors aren't going to get us anywhere
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. and a good leader, of course, must understand that.
:shrug:
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #3
15. You May Be Of That View, Sir, But Few Of Your Fellow Citizens Are...
"Democracy is a form of government based on belief the people know what they want and ought to get it, good and hard."
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #1
16. If US taxpayers pay the bill, it's their affair...
That's a moral responsibility, even if Americans prefer not to know. And it has consequences. Even by the 9/11 official story (as told by Zelikow et al. of the 9/11 Commission) paying the bills for Israeli aggression was the top reason why the US was attacked (not because "they hate us for our freedoms.")
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. It is Your View That 'Israeli Aggression' is To Blame, Sir, That The People Do Not Share
What you call 'Israeli aggression', most people in this country view as self-defense, or at worst giving way to deliberate provocation. The militant elements opposing Israel, after all, view the very existence of that country as an 'act of aggression', and the overwhelming preponderance of our people vehemently disagree with that view. The majority position is going to prevail on this question in determining government policy regarding it.
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Your reply, o giver of bogus honorifics, mischaracterizes what I report as "my view"...
Furthermore, ace, most of the American people, as you perhaps unwittingly implied in your first post, don't know shit about the region. The majority probably don't know who the primary recipients of US foreign aid are (Israel and Egypt). They can't properly identify the countries of the region on a map. They have no clue that the top of several motives for Sept. 11th, in the view of those who wrote the official government story at the 9/11 Commission, was the US support for Israel.

If there even is a "majority position" on this issue (as you say, Big Guy, most people in the US are not even aware that the "Near East" is, in fact, very much their own affair), it almost by definition proceeds from almost total ignorance about the region. When the evening news actually covers the several years of blockade and starvation policy imposed on Gaza, and shows the dead civilians, when Palestinians and their supporters have as much of a voice on the corporate media as Israelis and their supporters, well then, O Grand Poobah, we'll see then what this "majority" thinks.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
2. he has spoken on another crisis, the economy
Gaza is a serious crisis,
I agree he should say something.
I'm just apprehensive about what he would say..
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
4. What can he say, realistically?
He can parrot the Bush policy and be condemned for spinelessness, or he can contradict Bush doctrine and be condemned for presenting a divided front.

He is in an entirely untenable position through no fault of his own. Let him speak on the subject after he's taken the Oath of Office.
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. You know it always goes back to the same paradign . Do what's
politically safe. What is lost in that approach is that is how we got here.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. it's not just about what's safe
it's about having the people on your side. And it's much easier to push through your agenda when you have that.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. That doesn't answer the question--what can he say, realistically?
What would happen, for instance, if he said "the assholes in power both in Palestine and in Israel are engaged in systematic murder of innocent civilians and must stop immediately?"

He'd be right, of course, but he would accomplish nothing by saying it.

However we got here, we are here.


At this point, Obama is in no position to issue statements of international policy, nor will he be until a few weeks from now.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
7. he's not the goddamed president - YET
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. One fireman is retiring, another is replacing him. The retiring fireman
has decided to quit working. The incoming fireman should do what as the fire burns?

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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. The incoming fireman doesn't have the keys to the truck or the wrench to open the hydrant
See the problem with reasoning by metaphor?
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
17. Actually it's one of the more intriguing things he's done so far...
SOP for all politicians until now has been to echo the boilerplate pro-Israeli outrage and blame the Palestinians for bombing themselves. If he's intending to say anything out of tune with the usual US consensus -- note that I do NOT expect this, I am just saying -- he is well advised to say nothing prior to Jan. 21st.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
18. Deleted.
Edited on Sat Jan-03-09 12:52 PM by redqueen
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Charlie16 Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
20. He is addressing other big issues in his speech
Isn't this conflict a biggie, too?

I agree - his silence is telling.
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-03-09 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
21. The Less The Better
Imagine had asshat decided his "ultimate legacy" was an Israeli/Palestinian settlement...and how that would be accomplished. He'd probably encourage "shock & awe" all over the area.

While Rice was the worst and most inept SOS ever, in this case, her futility may have saved lives.

Having boooosh gone takes a big weapon out of the Hamas recruiting and financial arsenal. This regime never had any credibility in the region. Remember, they danced in the streets of Gaza after the planes hit on 9/11...

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