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Oops - John Yoo reveals that Bush authorized waterboarding

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sabra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:25 PM
Original message
Oops - John Yoo reveals that Bush authorized waterboarding

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123318955345726797.html

Obama Made a Rash Decision on Gitmo
The president will soon realize that governing involves hard choices.

By JOHN YOO


<snip>

What such a review would have made clear is that the civilian law-enforcement system cannot prevent terrorist attacks. What is needed are the tools to gain vital intelligence, which is why, under President George W. Bush, the CIA could hold and interrogate high-value al Qaeda leaders. On the advice of his intelligence advisers, the president could have authorized coercive interrogation methods like those used by Israel and Great Britain in their antiterrorism campaigns. (He could even authorize waterboarding, which he did three times in the years after 9/11.)

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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
1. The more these criminals talk, the tighter the case gets.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
2. I thought it was Yoo's legal opinion that allowed BUSH to order
the torture...

hmmm
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jtrockville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Yoo told Bush: "TORTURE is legal", to provide cover for Bush
If this tactic works, we as a country no longer stand for anything.
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Greyskye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. He certainly did - thanks Yoo idiot!

:evilgrin:
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Bonhomme Richard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
4. LOL, I can hear him now.....................
"For Gods sake John, shut the hell up."
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daggahead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
5. The WSJ has become Rupert Murdoch's gossip rag.
Rush Limbaugh? Karl Rove? Journalists?

LOL!

I get more accurate news from The Onion, and that's all made-up news!
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
6. This ACLU Lawsuit Is Big...
Hopefully we'll soon get to read Mr. Yoo's memos...his absolute contempt for the Constitution and his key role in giving the authority of perpetrating a war crime. He wasn't following orders, he was cooking the books to enable others to say that was the case. His job was to scramble the verbage...pervert the crime and give it a legal gloss. The day he's brought to justice isn't a day too soon.
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bluesmail Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #6
22. Well said. Scramble the verbage. Perfect. n/t
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LeftHandPath Donating Member (222 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
7. He is a blatent liar...
"The CIA must now conduct interrogations according to the rules of the Army Field Manual, which prohibits coercive techniques, threats and promises, and the good-cop bad-cop routines used in police stations throughout America."

This is a total fabrication, and has no basis in fact.

Pretty much like his entire career.

I'm curious if Mr Yoo approves of torturing American soldiers if they are captured, because thats pretty much what he is asking for.
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
8. Self-Deleted.
Edited on Thu Jan-29-09 12:45 PM by Subdivisions
Out of context.
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Winterblues Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
9. On the advice of his intelligence advisers, the president could have authorized coercive interrogati
Hear that on advisers advice Laws can be shreaded and torture administered. :shrug: What is everyone so upset about he got advice before he began to torture..
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
11. Mr. Yoo, you have the right to be silent . . .
. . . and I suggest you exercise that right for your own good because we're coming to get you.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. One might think it was a warning to georgie
as to what might come up at a trial?
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. I can't read this that way
First of all, I don't view those lawyers, including Professor Yoo, as having advised Mr. Bush on what is legal so much as co-conspirators with Bush and Cheney to trash the Geneva Conventions and the Convention against Torture. Yoo, Alberto Gonzales, Jay Bybee and others should be prosecuted for war crimes along with Bush and Cheney. The legal reason is too spurious to take seriously. Their mission was to give the former regime legal cover by redefining torture in a way that waterboarding would not be torture, when no serious would say otherwise.

Yoo's pleas that Guantánamo remain open that torture continue are based on the dubious propositions that civiliancourts are insufficient to keep us safe from terrorism and that torture works. To the first proposition I offer the trial and conviction of José Padilla as a refutation. Try as they might, Bush and his legal henchmen could not keep American citizen Padilla from being tried in federal court for terrorist-related charges. Padilla had his day in court and was convicted. It would appear to me that an ordinary federal court was quite sufficient to keep the American public safe from Mr. Padilla. Mr. Yoo also compares the Guantánamo detainees to pirates, "illegal combatants who do not fight on behalf of a nation and refuse to obey the laws of war." However, this is a false analogy. A pirate, when captured on the high seas, is charged with a crime and brought to court to face trial. Here, he enjoys the rights of due process. On the other hand, Guantánamo detainees are denied due process, including the right to be charged with a crime. Most detainees were never charged with any crime. Indeed, the purpose of Guantánamo was to violate the human rights of the detainees to a fair trial and any protection against torture or other harsh or humiliating interrogation techniques.

As for torture itself, which Mr. Yoo defends along with such erudite spokesmen of the lunatic fringe as Sean Hannity, not only is it universally condemned as cruel, it doesn't work. A subject being tortured will likely say anything to get his interrogators to stop. Consequently, nothing a torture victim says should be taken at face value. That includes Khalid Sheik Mohammad. It also includes Ibn al Shaykh al Libbi, who under interrogation by waterbording in 2002 told investigators that the Iraqi government trained al Qaida members to use biochemical weapons. We know now that this is not true, yet by falling back on this kind of "information", the Bush regime cited as a fact the working relationship between Saddam's regime and Osama's terror network. The only thing torture worked for in this instance was telling neoconservatives what they wanted to hear, which were talking points and not necessarily facts. Bush and the neocons didn't care about the facts. They were lying and they knew they were lying when they told us they had reliable information about Saddam's weapons and his ties to al Qaida. Like the legal memoranda approving torture itself, the intelligence gained by torture was suspect at best and worthless at worst.

Speaking about sources we should not take at face value, we have only the word of former Bush regime spokesmen such as Professor Yoo, Mr. Cheney and sycophants like Sean Hannity that valuable information was gained by harsh interrogation techniques. Against this is an article by journalist David Rose that appeared in December's Vanity Fair that states counterterrorist officials on both sides of the Atlantic conclude unanomously that "coercive methods" failed to provide "significant levels of actionable intelligence." Moreover, in the specific case of Khalid Sheik Mohammad, Rose quotes a senior Pentagon analyst as saying, "K.S.M. produced no actionable intelligence. He was trying to tell us how stupid we were."

Mr. Yoo shouldn't tell the public the kind of nonsense that appears today under his by-line in The Wall Street Journal. He should save it for the judge.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. But it is BECAUSE torture "doesn't work" that they NEEDed it, don't you see?
If your intention is to extract factual information regarding terrorism then, no, torture doesn't work. BUT IF YOUR INTENTION is to coerce confessions out of people who are essentially innocent, THEN IT WORKS. It works as a coverup for your vacuous "war on terror" policies and a cover up for your own state-sponsored false-flag terrorism. It works as a means to intimidate people who would speak up against you, too. It has all sorts of VIABLE uses depending upon your intentions. And since the idea was at the time to use 9/11 as a justification to nullify constitutionally protected rights and, thus, implement the equivalent of an enforceable police state, one could say that having a policy of TORTURE was essential to the plan.
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TorchTheWitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Exactly!
hit the nail on the head.

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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
12. Oooh, hard choices!
Let's see, should I follow the law or break the law? Decisions, decisions. Did I swear to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution, or should I junk that because enough people are wet-their-pants scared? Does our nation stand for liberty, justice and freedom, or do we jettison that in favor of a false expediency?

Gosh, these choices are hard! Perhaps my old buddy John Yoo will write me a note excusing me from my sworn duty and the laws of the country and the global human community?
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
13. Is John Yoo a Moonie? Acting on behalf of Rev. Moon?
I've seen this question asked, but never any answers. Considering Moon's nefarious influence in Washington and his intentions toward the U.S., some enterprising reporter ought to figure that out.
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
15. Oh, well then, it's ALL RIGHT!1 Yoo/CHEENEE believe in pRez's unlimited power!1 n/t
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
16. It wasn't a mistake, it's their ARROGANCE. They know a few powerful Dems will always protect BushInc
and pressure other Dems to look the other way.
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
18. Oh yeah. It's that old petard hanging thing which will haunt them
I wish we had a smilie hanging itself with its necktie. That would be so perfect!
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
19. One more rat jumping ship
after inventing legal cover. :puke: May they all drown in their war crimes. :puke:
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