Cal's Court ruling sucks but Gay Marriage is gonna be the law of the land.

[Botany]

It is no longer a question of if gay marriage is going to happen but when ... justice will triumph someday and equal rights will be the law of the land.

I know people are hurting and angry and with good reason too but this wrong that happened in California can not stand forever
because it violates the equal protection aspects of the U.S. Constitution.

As a straight guy I am amazed that among many of my son's friends and peers in high school and middle school
openly gay and lesbian students are accepted as no big deal. The fact is many do not see "it" as an issue at all and have
moved on. That is the future and there is nothing the right wing and the "God Squads" can do about it.


Remember:

Blacks and whites were not allowed to marry.
Blacks were not allowed to play in professional baseball.
Women could not vote.
You could own slaves.
Blacks were not allowed to sleep in some hotels, eat in some restaurants, use the same drinking fountains as whites, and
had to sit in the back of the bus.
You never saw a black, a Hispanic, a women, an openly gay or lesbian person, or even a Jew in many positions of power or leadership position.
You never saw a Hispanic on the U.S. Supreme Court.
You never saw a black man as President of the United States.

This is going to be a long fight and there will be setbacks along the way but to me at least the outcome is not in doubt.

[regnaD kciN]

1. It will be, eventually...

...simply due to demographics, as the generations most opposed die off and younger, more tolerant people join the electorate.

But I fear we're going to be in for a period of retrenchment in the near future. I think any effort to overturn Prop H8 in the next few election cycles is doomed -- a narrow majority of California voters are still anti-gay marriage, and I think an even larger majority are opposed to overturning a just-passed initiative in the next election cycle or two (or three). I don't think there will be a realistic chance for repeal until 2014 or 2016.

In the interim, I think you will see the same Prop H8 forces work for similar legislation in other states that have gay marriage, and also attempts, while they still have the sentiment behind them, to "lock in" a ban on gay marriage in more-conservative states which have a more-difficult constitutional amendment procedure, so that, say, if sentiment in those states swings the other direction, gay marriage proponents will have an uphill battle changing the laws of the state to allow it.

Right now, the homophobic right feels they have the wind at their back temporarily, but know it's probably the last time this will be the case. Therefore, look for them to use their window of opportunity to lock down the law to support their position as much as possible before the tide turns. In short, I fear we're going to be in for a number of years, maybe even a decade, of rear-guard action, trying to prevent any further damage, before we can start successfully pushing for laws in favor of inclusivenss.

:-(

[Botany]

4. Once Jackie Robinson broke the color line in baseball there was no going back

Even after he made it to the bigs there was and still is ignorance and bigotry but things had changed
forever ...... Hell, insurance companies now have a gay couple in their ads.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX2k7IVNtNY


All of New England (although I think New Hampshire's Governor vetoed a gay marriage law) and Iowa
have the basic rights of all people protected now and more states will follow w/ out a doubt .... and
someday all states will have to allow gay marriage because given time Obama* will get enough people
on the US Supreme Court and the equal protection law of the Constitution will be enforced.

And you are right about the homophobic because you are born straight or gay because it is not a choice
no matter how many times they say that lie ..... deep down many of them know they are selling hate and
bigotry not protection of traditional marriage.



* Stevens is 89, Scalia is 73 (and fat), Kennedy is 72, Thomas is 60, Ginsburg is 76, and Breyer is 70

[regnaD kciN]

7. There may have been "no going back" in baseball, but...

...two decades later, MLK was still needing to lead protest marches to guarantee equal treatment under the law. For that matter, nineteen years later, marriage was still defined as "a union between a man and a woman of the same race" in a number of states.

As Nelson Mandela put it, there's no easy walk to freedom.

[Botany]

11. I never said the walk would be easy but sooner or later gay marriage will ...

.... the law of the land.

BTW Jackie Robinson was not allowed to say anything back for 3 seasons.

[Toasterlad]

2. I Appreciate the Sentiment, and I Agree, But I Am Tired of Waiting.

[tnlefty]

8. ...

:hug: It'll be even longer in TN for those who are tired. I despise that equal rights for all is so easily dismissed and I'm tired of dealing with the dunderheads in this state and politicians (even elected democrats) who refuse to even make an effort to educate voters, just continue to cave to the religious crowd on this issue.

Enough!

[RufusTFirefly]

13. I'm an atheist who feels your pain.

I'm straight, white, and male, so I've got no worries on a number of fronts, but the knowledge that I will probably never be able to run for higher office without "staying in the closet" about my secular beliefs is kind of disheartening, especially given Article 6 of the U.S. Constitution which says "no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States." But then, as today's California Supreme Court ruling has proven, Constitutions can be obeyed or ignored at the Court's convenience.

Perhaps that's why the outrage of Prop H8 resonates so deeply with me. Or it may simply be that I am human.

[Renew Deal]

3. I agree

It's a matter of time, and we're getting closer every day.

[yodoobo]

5. Agree. I think that Obama will strike this down

Either through legislation, executive order or other means.

There is simply no way that Obama will let this injustice stand.

[regnaD kciN]

9. How the hell can Obama "strike down" a ruling of the California Supreme Court...?

It's not a federal matter. Besides, as much as I have come to disagree with him, Obama himself doesn't support "gay marriage," merely civil unions.

Thinking strategically, I would argue that what is needed now is a counter to the DoMA (which ended the traditional principle that each state and the federal entity had to honor the marriages conducted in any other state), requiring that, if the title of "marriage" is denied to same-sex couples, each state -- and the federal government -- must still honor the rights and privileges of couples in a civil union as they would be defined in the state in which the civil union was contracted. So, if one state defined civil unions has having all the rights and privileges of opposite-sex marriage, even the most benighted state would have to grant them to same-sex couples.

It wouldn't yet be marriage (although that would probably follow soon thereafter), but it would duplicate the situation within California proper (where the Court declared that, since same-sex couples in civil unions have all the same rights and privileges as opposite-sex married couples, the only issue of Prop H8 was over the semantics of whether you could use the word "marriage"), instead of the current situation, where, if you're in a civil union (or even a same-sex marriage in the states that allow it), once you cross state lines into another state that doesn't recognize them, you are merely two individuals with no more status possible between you than two total strangers.

[yodoobo]

12. He's the President of United States

He is hardly powerless.

I'm really started to get frustrated with the lack of faith in Obama on this site. I see more criticism of President Obama here than on extremist rightwing sites. (/rant off)

Anyway,


Think about it this way.

Medical Pot is perfectly legal in California, yet, the Federal government routinely harass and arrest pot growers in California.
A perfect example of the Feds reaching into a state matter.

This can be done in reverse.

A Federal order banning the prohibition on gay marriage nationwide. Then using the same judicial techniques that the Feds use to reach into California, do so to ensure that Gay marriage is upheld.

Legislation, executive order, who cares. There are many tools at his disposal.

This can be done. it will be done.

[RufusTFirefly]

14. Advice: Stop posting. Read a history book or two instead.

With respect, your admittedly idealistic post betrays a profound ignorance of American government.

[Ohio Joe]

6. All true but...

It still pisses me off. Equal rights should be a no brainer... oh... wait... I guess I just explained the people against civil rights for all.

[falcon97]

10. LOL!

(sadly)

[bleever]

15. This ruling is the last hurrah for the people wanting to restrict marriage.

A huge, wonderful fireworks blast in the air of NO!, and the sad thing (for them) is that they are left with an optic afterburn, and spiders of smoke in the sky, and the ground pulled out from under them.

They'll survive. The after-effects of extending civil rights tend to be pretty gentle.