My wife's friend got fired today

[groundloop]

My wife's friend works for a county school system in Georgia. Like most all governments, our school system is feeling the pinch of this recession, and I believe looking for any excuse to get rid of some employees.

Wife's friend works in a school cafeteria, and it's sad how much perfectly good food goes in the dumpster at the end of the day. Most of the cafeteria employees have taken home a few slices of pizza, a few chicken nuggets, or a couple of burgers from time to time instead of throwing it away, even though technically it's against school board policy. My wife's friend took home a paper plate of frozen chicken nuggets yesterday that would otherwise have found it's way to the dumpster, and today the director of the nutrition department marched in and fired her for it, no warnings or anything.

Besides stuff like this they've been getting pressure to work off the clock lately also. They get paid for a fixed number of hours per day, yet are expected to get all their cleanup etc. done even if they have to work through an unpaid break or stay late (after they clock out). A cafeteria manager was fired because she was letting her group take unofficial comp-time by leaving early on the days when they get done early to make up for the other days when they stayed late.

Most of these women know that it's illegal for them to be coerced into working off the clock, but they're all too afraid for their jobs to do anything about it. I'm thinking this is a perfect example of what unions are for.

SO... how do they go about the first steps of becoming associated with a union? Which unions should they be looking at? Contact info?

[masuki bance]

1. Will a union help you take home food for free?

[w4rma]

4. A union will protect them from being fired for refusing to work off the clock.

A union will also help with any lawsuits against the county to get the pay that the workers are owed from working off the clock.

[1]

11. so... you break the rules and non-union, fired!

you break the rules and union...

harumph, harumph, harumph, all is well.

really? is that what a union is?

[Fozzledick]

14. My experience as a manager in union shops

is that employees are treated with more respect when there's a union, and grievances get formally addressed - not necessarily resolved, but at least acknowledged and documented rather than just ignored.

[1]

21. and my experience is that my brother has been a union steward for most of his employment...

and there is as much bad as there is good.

but that's just how we do things here in michigan.

i don't subscribe to any "label"...

ok?

[northernlights]

30. try reading for comprehension

the proposed union is about not forcing people to work without pay, i.e. forcing them to work after they've clocked out for their set number of hours. Something that used to be called slavery.

It's not about allowing people to take home throwaway food for free. That simply was why the friend was fired.

The throwaway food is a separate issue and, frankly, is something that needs to be looked at legally. Businesses should be allowed to donate leftover food to shelters and food pantries without being penalized. As it stands now, at least in my state, they can't do that and are forced to throw away perfectly good food, while people go hungry. It's a disusting waste.

[madmom]

66. I used to work in a deli of a grocery store. We threw away lots of out dated food. When

asked why we couldn't donate it, the answer was because of lawsuits if some one became ill.

[tavalon]

32. The food would go in the garbage otherwise

It's a dumb ass rule as are many in the public sector. This was stupid and just an excuse to drop employees. That is what a union protects from.

[KittyWampus]

46. McDonalds also fires people for taking food home/out of trash.

[tavalon]

60. It doesn't make it right

[rwheeler31]

6. Food in trash is better for who?

[bobshin]

10. Dumpster divers! n/t

[masuki bance]

15. The basic food rule that is universal across restaurants, cafeterias

supermarkets, fast food locations, pizzerias, 711's, etc, etc on infinitum. is that food does not get taken home for free unless approved by owners or management. Any other policy encourages waste. Pizza delivery guys get friends to order extra pizza's for pickup near closing, never planning on getting them. Extra pizza? Take it home. Same concept works on all levels, take out 2 frozen packages of chicken instead of the 1 that is actually needed, "..oops I should take this home or it will go to waste". This type of activity is stealing, stealing from the school budgets and ultimately from the students in the case described above. Accountability for waste is the responsibility of supervisors, management and owners. Purchasing, storage, inventory controls, proper planning, spoilage and the rest all have proven ways of being controlled. Any food business that runs with the attitude that the employees should just take home "extra" food without permission will be out of business in very, very short order.

[conscious evolution]

44. I agree

I have seen it happen many times in the food/bev industry.
Hell,I've seen similar stuff happen in construction.Guys ordering twice the wire needed so they can sell the excess as scrap.

[Freddie Stubbs]

63. It protects the school from getting sued if someone becomes sick from the food which was taken home

We live in a litigious society.

[AzNick]

17. Unions are bad, mkaaay...

[lonestarnot]

20. are you trying to be funny?

[AzNick]

23. Of course.

[michreject]

40. Half the posters on DU agree with that statement

They love them some non union Asian cars. The hell with union made products. No status in that.

[SidDithers]

45. What about union made Asian cars? Are they OK?...nt

Sid

[michreject]

73. Take your pick

http://www.ml46.org/html/american_cars.html

It's a small list.

[SidDithers]

76. I'm confused. Is it Buy Union? Or Buy American?...

or is it really Buy American Union?

My union-made car isn't on that list.

Sid

[michreject]

84. Buy what you want

Like I stated up thread, I find it hypocritical to support and buy non union products and criticize non union businesses about how they run their company or treat their employees.

[vadawg]

56. what if the union made cars are not what people want

if i want to spend my dollars on an asian vehicle, why the hell shouldnt i be able to. oohh back to the original thread shes a thief according to the employer and rightly she was fired.

[lonestarnot]

62. You're still here?

What do you know about "rightly fired," dee dee dee?

[vadawg]

69. she stole stuff, shes a thief, she got fired for stealing

id say thats rightly fired, or do you think that stealing stuff from your employer is ok.

[lonestarnot]

89. What part of taking food bound for the garbage can don't you get?

[michreject]

70. I find it hypocritical that those who support anti union Co.'s

get enraged at anti union Company behaviour against their employees.

[madmom]

71. Same reason people should be able to

shop at walmart with out being made to feel like a pariah.

[vadawg]

72. hell i shop at walmart all the time, i say if its your money you spend it how you like.

[madmom]

74. There are many on this board who think if you shop at walmart,

you are the enemy. BUT will shout from the roof tops about THEIR right to buy a foreign car "because there are no descent ones made here".

[Obamanaut]

86. For general mdse, men's and childrens' jeans, shirts, underwear,

socks and so on, walmart is the only outlet in my town (25 miles to the next town). No baby clothes at all other than w'mart. Three places to buy groceries - one of these is walmart.

We have a ladie's clothing store, but their shoe stock is limited.

We go to W'mart for general mdse, Lowe's for lawn/garden/appliances, Publix for groceries, a locally owned (and grown) meat market.

edited to correct spelling of walmart

[Greyhound]

26. God, I only hope you're just a troll and not in any way representative of

actual Democrats, though I fear it might not be so.

Do you have any inkling of what an enormous asshole this statement makes you sound like?

[Kittycat]

2. I understand it might not seem like much, but it's still stealing.

And frozen food, does not constitute prepared food that would have been discarded at the end of the day.

[Fumesucker]

5. Probably already thawed but uncooked..

Could not be kept to the next day in that condition.

[Whoa_Nelly]

3. More than school policy...

Is it against health code there?

...just wondering...

[peacetalksforall]

9. Yes, look at the reasons behind the policy or law If your wife's friend knew about

the policy whether she understood it or not, there was probably good reason to be fired, but there are things to look into first - does the policy say that anyone who does it will be fired on the spot? Or does the school have a policty of incremental offenses. A reprimand first. A suspension first. A three strikes policy taking in all other rules. She needs to examine what she knew and when she knew it. Then appeal it if justified?

[masuki bance]

16. Theft is generally an on the spot firing offense.

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. Yes they need a union but she still shouldn't be stealing food

If it's against the rules, it's against the rules. A union can't help in that situation.

[EFerrari]

19. If these people are being forced to work off the clock

it's an indication of the manual being thrown out the window, though.

Stealing is wrong and, in a workplace where the management doesn't follow the rules, the attitude spreads to the workers. It's inevitable.

[proud2BlibKansan]

22. Unfortunately the boss gets to break the rules whenever he wants

A sad reality.

[w4rma]

24. The boss doesn't get to break the law without potential repercussions from law enforcement. (nt)

[tavalon]

34. But only with union protection are you likely to have whistleblower protection

I work under one of the weakest unions I've ever had the displeasure to work under but it's still better than any non-union nursing job I've had.

[tavalon]

33. But not a necessary reality

I am a registered nurse and I've worked as a non-union nurse and a union nurse. In the union, we are begrudgingly treated fairly and respectfully and if contract rules are broken, there are venues for allowing us to get our voice heard. In a non-union situation we are treated badly, forced to endure unsafe working conditions and your only recourse is walking out the door.

Unions are not perfect but they are the best a worker has. Corporations and bosses rarely have workers best interests at heart and unions help mediate that selfish tendency.

[ejpoeta]

29. i don't know if that argument will get anyone anywhere. an employer can find a way to fire you

if they want to, but you don't want to give them an excuse either. If people were being forced to work off the clock, then someone needs to go to the labor board. I know that there was a lawsuit or something where my husband works because a lawyer had called him to ask him some questions. he was surprised about the lawsuit and didn't know anything about it... and he refused to talk to the lawyer until he got permission from the boss at work. after his boss ok'd it, he told them about how they didn't get breaks or lunches... well, i believe there was some form of settlement or something. as long as all the workers are going to tell the truth about what is going on, you should get somewhere. because it does no good if you go out on a limb and everyone else is afraid to lose their job. they can't (supposedly) fire you or do anything to you for reporting it. The employer should also realize the risk to themselves if someone got hurt while working off the clock. and the workers should realize the possible complications for them if they get hurt working off the clock, too.

[madville]

8. Sounds like those workers don't know how to stand up for themselves

I've always let me supervisors know exactly where I stand and that I won't be taken advantage of. We'll compromise or I'll get fired or quit, done it many times.

Taking food or anything from work is stealing though, that same standard applies to most jobs, food service or whatever.

[Wickerman]

13. Georgia is an "at will" state

The employer holds all the cards. The employer in this case doesn't much care if she loses an employee. Sounds like she was looking to cut the staff anyway AND in this economy she can get dozens of applicants for the job. Rock. Hard Place.

[raccoon]

39. Thank you. SC is too. In "at will" states, if you get fired, if you can't get them for some kind

of discrimination, you're just SOL.

[tavalon]

35. Most workers don't think they have power to stand up to management

and the occasional one who does gets an example made of them, to make sure no other uppity workers get the idea that it's okay to stick up for their rights. Hence, they need a union.

[baldguy]

12. Contact AFSCME

http://www.afscme.org/publications/1254.cfm

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. Also Service Employees International.

Problem is UNTIL EFCA passes, this is still a right to work state.. so that is part of the fracking problem

[Greyhound]

25. The initial replies to your thread are what went wrong with our nation.

Reich-wing authoritarians have destroyed this nation. Adherence to idiocy without any thought has become the hallmark of America and has remarkable representation here.

In answer to your query, try http://www.seiu.org/a/contact.php">SEIU contact link.

[tavalon]

36. Script kitties

We've been taught to follow the rules even if the rules make no sense. I come up against this on a daily basis.

[Greyhound]

81. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we didn't used to be like this,were we?

I mean sure, there were always the rules sticklers, but they were generally disliked and usually ignored. Now it seems we are a nation of sticklers, except of course for the rich that completely ignore all of them, including the sane ones like murder, with impunity.

[Ignis]

85. So true.

Why bother actually learning anything anymore? Someone's already done all the thinking for you, and probably most of the scripting. You just plug-n-play; why make waves?

:banghead:

[gtar100]

27. So who the hell are these Nazis that run the place?

What sick people "decide" it's okay to force people to work without pay? What disgusting humans think it's OK to fire someone for taking food destined to be thrown away? They must have hearts filled with hatred and have no joy but their sick pleasure in hurting others. Pisses me off to find out about these reprobates. (sorry, rant off)

Anyone who hates unions (and I know more than a few), they always ignore this kind of crap that people pull on each other. I hope you're able to find a union.

[northernlights]

31. believe it or not, allowing workers to take throwaway food

is against the law, at least in my state.

Nothing to do with health code. Everything to do with *taxes.* Once the food is eaten, it falls into a different tax bracket.

Tax codes need to be revised in a way that doesn't penalize a food provider from at least donating leftover food to food pantries. Many tons of perfectly good food get thrown out every day while people go hungry.

So in this case, the school cafeteria is following the letter of the law when it applies to themselves...and ignoring the law when it applies to workers. Slavery is alive and well in Georgia, but also in many "right to work" states.

[tavalon]

37. Have you ever asked why it's against the law?

Following rules that make no sense makes for a nonsensical world. Let's use the brains God gave us. Rules for rules sake are not of use to any of us.

[yodoobo]

28. She has company. my wife gets fired on Wednesday from the school system

Along with quite a few other teachers. Its the end of the school year and the district is making huge cuts.

I was hoping that the stimulus money would have made it to the schools to save her and her colleages jobs, but that doesn't appear to be in the works :(

[NNN0LHI]

38. Wonder your wife's friend drives a non-union made Toyota/Honda or a domestic union made car?

Because if I were in the position where I had to let someone go the people who drive non-union made cars would be the first to get the axe.

I never hire anyone who comes here to write an estimate for a job at my house who is driving a non-union made car.

Thats just the way it is. And thats the way it will stay. I will help American workers who support other American union workers all I can. But the ones who don't? Fuck them.

With the hundreds of thousands of UAW retires and their families spread across the US I expect there is going to be a lot of that going on in the future.

Don

[Obamanaut]

41. So if an employee pilfered supplies they could stay if they drove

an approved vehicle?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

42. "He's a thief and a liar, but he drives a Ford"

Gee-sus.....some people are really going wacky around here.

[NNN0LHI]

43. They would be under the microscope for any infraction

Thats the way it would work.

Hope that clear enough?

Don

[Obamanaut]

48. Nope. Didn't answer the question. Too many variables. 3 pilferers

driving 3 different vehicles - a Toyota made in Tennessee, a Dodge made in Canada, an F150 made in Dearborn. Three pilferers - do all go, or forgive the one with the approved vehicle?

One can carry "union made" acceptance only so far.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

50. Must never get any work done if he's checking VIN numbers......

......to see where the car was made.

[NNN0LHI]

55. I know exactly where my two vehicles were built

My 2000 Explorer was assembled in Missouri and My 2004 Taurus was assembled in Chicago.

Don

[Obamanaut]

77. But what about the 'American' cars that are not made in America?

Do you check the vin on each one to make sure the owner is eligible to work for you?

What if the worker is the second or third owner of a disallowed vehicle? Are they likewise penalized because they could perhaps not afford a new Dearborn made vehicle?

[NNN0LHI]

54. Here is the deal

The other countries are pumping billions of their taxpayers money into their auto industries to keep their companies solvent and profitable.

The US government is doing the same thing.

Now why would someone purchase something to help another countries industry and its workers when we can help our own right here?

Do you shop at Walmart?

Don

[Obamanaut]

57. Do you answer a direct question directly? As to the walmart one -

in my small town there are three (3) stores that sell groceries, one of them being Walmart, and I buy our foodstuffs from one of the other ones.

And when I go to this other grocery store, I make it a point to leave my cart adrift in the parking lot so it doesn't appear that I am doing an employee's job by bringing it to the storefront myself.

For general merchandise (other than building supplies), walmart is the only store available.

Is your computer made in the USA?

[NNN0LHI]

58. My computer was assembled about 10 miles from my house

My brother built it for me.

You said: walmart is the only store available

Nice try.

:rofl:

Don

[Obamanaut]

59. For general merchandise, we have only one choice. The next

town is 26 miles from my house. In our town, there is only one spot for general merchandise - baby clothes and supplies; men's shoes, underwear, shirts, work clothes, etc.; there is another store for women's clothes.

Several years ago, there were other choices, including a K Mart. When the super walmart moved in, the others soon moved out. KMart went away during their bankruptcy period, and they also left the neighboring town (which still has a super walmart) but there are other options available there - it is not nearly as small as mine.

When your brother "assembled" your computer, did he use made in USA parts?

Oh, and BTW. I googled 'autos made in usa' and one of the choices I was offered was the uaw site, but there was a warning that it might damage my computer with mal ware. Is this typical of their sites?

[Obamanaut]

65. Still haven't answered the question re 3 pilferers -

3 pilferers, driving 3 different vehicles - a Toyota made in Tennessee, a Dodge made in Canada, an F150 made in Dearborn. Three pilferers - do all go, or forgive the one with the approved vehicle?

Does it matter that the Toyota assembled in Tennessee was made by American workers, or is just that the parent company is elsewhere? (But that's another question, so maybe this isn't being fair.)

How much work went into the keyboard and monitor your brother made? (oops, another question)

[NNN0LHI]

79. Did the US just invest $50 billion dollars plus to save the American keyboard industry?

No that was the auto industry.

Wasn't it?

I think you may be confused.

Don

[Obamanaut]

80. Are we going off on a tangent here? The main thrust of your argument

has been "buy American", not "buy stuff the US government has invested in." If the latter were true, then surely you would scurry right out and trade your Ford products in on something from GM, a government owned (partially) entity.

And never use FEDEX or UPS over USPS.

And back to the other question, do you ever answer a direct question directly, or simply obfuscate?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

87. So even if American union workers make a foreign car, that's not good enough?

Also, if dropping huge amounts of money to save American businesses is your litmus test, you must only do business with Bank Of America, Chase, Citi, despite their stupidity because that is the best way to "support America"?

[DatManFromNawlins]

75. Is your brother in a union?

If not, why do you fraternize with the bum?

[NNN0LHI]

78. He has been a union member since 1969

Whats your point pal?

Don

[Obamanaut]

82. Does his union shop make keyboards? Computers? Monitors? nt

[seabeyond]

47. love the justification for stealing and not following employer rules

then yell about them stealing employee hours....

both are wrong.

[shadowknows69]

49. My mother is up for tenure next year, in the art department

Which she's hoping there will even be one very much longer. Her class just won big in a state art show though so she should hopefully have a leg up there.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

51. While the rule doesn't seem fair

She broke it knowing full well the consequences.

[Raine1967]

52. Georgia is a right to work state but does have a teachers Union:

http://gae1.org/

What district in Georgia was she Fired from?

[Freddie Stubbs]

64. Unions exist in Right to Work states

They have them here in FL.

[Enrique]

53. people are calling that "stealing"?

that's not stealing. It might be against the rules, but it's not stealing.

edit: and on the working off the clock, you can report that to the U.S. Dept. of Labor., Wage and Hour Division. Or possibly the State of Georgia's labor dept., though I imagine Georgia's labor laws are pretty lax.

[KillCapitalism]

61. It's appalling how much food is wasted by restaurants.

I worked in one that wasted enough food on Friday & Saturday nights to feed about 30 homeless people. It pissed all of us off. That food didn't really go uneaten though, raccoons and opossums would always find a way to get to it.

[Obamanaut]

83. It's appalling how much food is wasted by people in general,

especially in buffet type setting. Folks fill up a plate with enough for two or more people, and leave most of it on their plate - then go to the dessert bar.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

90. Badly trained by their parents

We were always taught not to take more than we could eat, that we could always go back for more.

Yet I see kids wasting food with their parents watching. Sure, take six chocolate chip cookies off the plate at church coffee hour, take a couple of bites out of each one, and then leave them in a soggy mess on various chairs.

[BlooInBloo]

67. 10% of me can sorta kinda understand this...

Something along the lines of: if somebody got sick from eating "unofficial food" from the school, the school would be up shit creek.

90% of me thinks it's just stupid.

It isn't obvious to me that a food service union wouldn't back such rules, also.

[high density]

68. I find it hard to believe that a school dept would have a HR policy that allows firing on the spot

Most governments and corporations seem to have polices that require several written warnings before a firing can occur. I've seen that truly bad employees can linger for months while the boss goes through the steps. (Yet with the "at will" employment process, good people who are laid off are gone immediately without notice.) I could see an instant firing happening at a small business but not a local school system.

I think there is something your wife's friend is leaving out of the story. Is the cafeteria outsourced to a private company?

[donco6]

88. It's against federal regs in the Nat. School Lunch Program.

You can lose your funding over it. A union wouldn't help that. But it might help with the other stuff.

[davsand]

91. Whatever state you live in should have an Education Association. They organize support staff.

For instance, in Illinois it is the Illinois Education Association (IEA) in Missouri is is the MEA. They are all part of the National Education Association (NEA.)

http://www.nea.org/

I know for a fact these guys organize any employee in a school district because I know organizers for them in a couple of different states.


AFT (American Federation of Teachers) may be another possibility, however, I know less about them. They may also provide a union for support staff, and if they are the driving force in that local district they may be the ones to contact.

I will tell you that the dismissal for taking food home may be tough to fight, but NO WAY should they be required to work off the clock. They really should be looking to organize.


Laura