Champagne Liberals

[Mari333]

I am posting this story to get your take on this kind of behaviour. Please bear with me.
The other day I was speaking with one of my acquaintances,a lady who is a very vocal Democrat in town, and gets all gooey eyed whenever I mention Obama's name. She has held fundraisers for Obama, and she is fairly well off, a business owner with a huge bed and breakfast in town.
She shmoozes with city people, has her yard immaculately manicured, has a huge house by the beach etc etc etc
thats all fine, I dont begrudge people their wealth.
However, she made a statement that made my blood pressure go up for a bit.

"Hello! " she said "Oh we just got back from Chicago, we went to Whole Foods, it was marvelous..we stocked the fridge with all sorts of goodies...!"

someone mentioned to her, at that point, that they wished we had a Whole Foods in our small corner of Michigan...


She flipped her hand in the air and said
"OH these LOCALS around here MUST have their processed cheese food from WALMART! they would NEVER have the good taste to buy from Whole Foods!"

This is why she is only an acquaintance. if that.

She can fundraise all she wants, imo. It wont do any good with that attitude.

I, personally, cannot stand when people , even liberal people, behave like this.

There are NO jobs here, I know of people living in their cars. I know a man who fishes for his dinner every night or he doesnt eat.
I know of elderly people here who go hungry because they cannot afford food.
To make light of people who cannot 'afford the delicacies of Whole Foods!' is, imo, cruel.

I guess thats what a champagne liberal means.

[cigsandcoffee]

1. I don't like Whole Foods at all.

They built one up the street a while ago, and it feels like a scam - I'm rarely happy with the food I get there, it's ridiculously expensive, and the whole thing feels like a bunch of corporations cashing in on a fad.

The organic products I really like are able to stand on their own two legs at the supermarket.

[Mari333]

2. hah I thought so

its a prestige thing. I like your style. :)

[cigsandcoffee]

3. Cheers. That's how I see it, anyway.

One chain I wish we had down here is Wegmans. When I go there while visiting my girlfriend's family in PA, I just couldn't be any more impressed. They've really got the goods, and without all the attitude.

As to the champagne liberals, the truth of the matter is that assholes come in all shapes and sizes - and ideologies. There just seems to be a whole lot more on the right.

[Evoman]

57. Me neither....not enough processed cheese for my tastes.

[Dorian Gray]

60. Mmmmm....

Velveeta!

[PufPuf23]

4. Limousine liberals

One can spot them because of their lack of empathy for minorities unless in fad and that they tend to be know-it-alls and name droppers. They tend to be urban, educated, and from priviledged backgrounds. They look at rural and third world issues with little true understanding. There is nothing new under the sun.

Probably they identify with the DLC but may not admit the fact in public.

[Mari333]

5. you nailed it

she always drops names. shes having dinner with so and so, has friends who belong to whats what. shes well educated, but in other areas, dumb as a box of hammers. oh, and she pays her employees minimum wage with no benefits.

[SoxFan]

7. No, quite the opposite

I;ve been active in Dem politics for 20 years, and I can assure you that these types have nothing to do with the DLC. They are mainly preoccupied with non-economic social issues, such as abortion rights, or, in the 1980s, nuclear power. The DLC focus on tech policy, budget procedures, and national security isn't their cup of tea. The folks at DLC events by and large are middle class in both their economics and sensibilities.

[anonymous171]

19. Took the words right out my mouth. nt

[PufPuf23]

24. I would argue that their $ contributions tend to go to DLC

types -- I am not making a moral judgment but rather a judgment of their resolution of the world and how their environment tends to frame the issues. I do think that they are a positive because of their ability to raise cash, support for popular social causes, and and visibility is supporting progressive issues. The limousine/champagne liberals have blind spots not moral fails. Tom Wolfe wrote a book back in the 70s still relevant.

[anonymous171]

25. Yes, "blind spots" is a good way of putting it.

It's not that they absolutely hate the worker, they just don't care about him/her or are ignorant of their existence.

[SoxFan]

37. It's simply not true

I've raised money from Democrats of different stripes, and I've seen the donor histories. The upscale types are far more likely to gravitate towards someone who emphasizes social liberalism, not the wonky stuff that the real DLC (not the internet boogieman) focuses on.

Sometimes the two groups overlap, as was the case in the 1992 (Clinton-Tsongas) and 2000 (Gore-Bradley) races. In both of those years, though, both of the leading candidates were socially liberal but also wonky, free trade, techno-savvy types.

[Odin2005]

27. "in the 1980s, nuclear power" Well, THAT confirms my dislike of the anti-nuclear brigade.

I suspected that those types were upper-middle class folks looking for a fresh outrage to appeal to their vanity, even though it screwed us over in terms of clean energy.

[Name removed]

74. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[PufPuf23]

84. Tom Wolfe in "Radical Chic & Mau-Mauing the Flak Catchers"

that I read back in the 70's is my source of "limousine liberals".

You are the first DUer to accuse me of being a GOPer or Rush (barf) listener.

[paulsby]

6. whole foods aka whole paycheck is quite a ripoff

i am quite a foodie, and i work hard to find quality produce, etc.

whole foods is 200-300% more expensive on many products vs. the russian/mexican market i go to.

the latter is in "the hood" and caters to less affluent people. the quality is phenomenal.

and the prices are awesome 6 limes for $1.

whole foods?

fuji apples? .49 a lb

huge bunches of herbs are MUCH cheaper than safeway, let alone whole foods.

they also have kickass headcheese and salo (the latter being difficult to find).

whole foods is nice because they always have lots of very high quality food (their cheese selection is usually excellent) but you pay a SERIOUS markup to buy there.

i can't stand being ripped off, so i usually give it a pass.

[Mari333]

11. wow Im learning so much about whole foods

Ive never been there but its all the rage here amongst the latte crowd. I will avoid it now and continue looking for foodstuffs at regular stores.

[paulsby]

18. the last time i went to whole foods

was when i had a recipe i needed to prepare and didn't have a lot of time.

i KNEW whole foods would have all of the ingredients, and quality.

and i have to admit they had this one variety of olive in the olive bar that was frigging insanely delicious.

it really is yuppie central though.

i don't DISLIKE yuppies, i am just very UNyuppie.

my two favorite places to shop are h-mart (a korean grocery store that has TONS of seafood choices, lots of staples, and an incredible kimchi bar on weekends.

and valley harvest rocks!

http://store.valleyharvest.us/index.html

[Dorian Gray]

61. Yes... it's true

Too expensive. I prefer Farmer's Markets and local ethnic shops for my shopping. (But I live in Brooklyn, so that's much easier done here than in suburban areas where there isn't the choice.)

[JVS]

67. You've been looking for salo?

Why?

[Burma Jones]

75. More Trader Joe's Outlets would be nice

They have fancy schmamncy food at normal prices, they mostly locate in lower rent areas so they don't seem to be worrying about giving you a "shopping experience" but are instead offering good deals on good food, it's the K-Mart for Foodies, and a popular place in our household.

[donco6]

85. Viva la Liborio!

I shop at our local Mexican super quite often. Their selection of produce is overwhelming. They have the same canned goods as anywhere. And it's far cheaper than Whole Paycheck.

I also have Sunshine Market, which emphasizes organic. Not as expensive as WP either.

[EFerrari]

8. There are anti-social @ssholes in any group. n/t

[NashVegas]

76. Yup. There Sure Are!

[nichomachus]

102. Yeah -- like the people here who sneer at "yuppies"

which usually means "anyone who makes more money than I do."

[readmoreoften]

9. They're elites who fancy themselves modern on social issues. Food is where they are most obvious.

Petit bourgeois lackeys of the bankster class who don't hate rich gays, rich women, or rich people of color. Their hatred of working people is often expressed in comments on food or satorial habits:

ex:

Those trashy poor people don't care enough about their kids to eat organic. Instead they buy cable. (Of course, if the poor didn't have cable, they'd complain about their kids playing basketball in the street.)

I love my lesbian neighbor lawyers. They're nothing like those trashy lesbians who wear mullets and Walmart Clothes and drive pick up trucks and eat McDonalds.

It's all the consumer's fault. Just so happens that the *good* consumers belong to the upper classes.

[Odin2005]

28. And those same types are the same "Liberals" that worship Tom Friedman and supported NAFTA.

[anonymous171]

30. Yep. The same ones who call protectionism "xenophobic."

They use social liberalism as a vehicle for their RW-economic agenda.

[Odin2005]

32. Exactly.

They are Corporatist Elitists in Liberal clothing.

[CBR]

62. Recently an upper-middle class neighborhood

in my city experienced some incidents (burglary, an elderly man was pushed) and they called in the city council to cut down the
basketball nets at the local park so the kids from across the boulevard would not walk through. What an odd solution...

[blindpig]

70. Yes, and don't forget 'white trash parties'.

"It's good, clean fun, we don't mean anything by it."

Pigs.

[Cleita]

10. I know a few of them. Whenever I mention that maybe they should

open their guest houses to homeless working people until they get on their feet, their eyes glaze over. But, that would compromise their privacy they say. But these are little cottages or adjacent wings to houses that they never go into anyway.

:shrug:

[Kansas Wyatt]

12. There was a time when Democrats stood up for average working people.

Now, average working people are taken for granted, just like the republicans take advantage of their evangelical base. Average working people ONLY matter when it comes election time. Until then, average working people take a back seat to all the Chic Special Interest groups that Democratic politicians pander to and coo over.

This woman you speak of is not any different than most of the alleged Democratic Representatives, who promised to help the working people of this country.


If there are any Democratic politicians or their underlings reading this:

You wormy rat bastards better wake the fuck up and deliver on your promises, because the average working people will NOT go out to vote for smarmy politicians, who only think of themselves and do NOT do a damn thing for the average working people in this country. Average working people, who you NEED, do NOT give a shit about your Chic Special Interests that do NOTHING for them and in some cases hurt them. Your fucking chump change token efforts just do not cut it! In case you are too fucking smart to figure it out... You have the spotlight on you right now and all that money and support from working people is at stake for you. Keep thinking the average working people have no choice, but to vote for you, and you can watch as those average working people just give up and stay at home. Then you'll have a lot of time to ponder how so few republicans beat you.

[Mari333]

15. oh yeah baby ditto to that! nt

[NeedleCast]

13. Now I want processed cheese

Damn it, off to the store.

[superduperfarleft]

14. Whole Foods is bourgeoisie liberalism at its finest.

John Mackey, the CEO, is a libertarian dickwad, and the company is incredibly anti-union. I wouldn't set foot in that yuppie hell-hole if you paid me.

[Mari333]

17. hah!! Im going to post that tidbit on my facebook page

she wont like it..and I know she reads it..thanks for the info!

[anonymous171]

16. Hedge Fund liberals are also quite annoying.

We need more populism dammit!

[Marr]

20. In my experience, those sorts of people are almost apolitical.

That is to say, they have no real political beliefs; no opinions on class issues, wealth distribution, corporate power, etc. They may "follow politics", but only as a kind of fashion accessory. They're the first to latch onto social wedge issues and they see the political process as something akin to American Idol. They have their favorite celebrities, their favorite villains, etc.

[Mari333]

21. someone sent me this

how to tell if you are a bourgeois bohemian (BOBO)

Do you:

• Believe that shelling out £10,050 on a home media centre is vulgar, but that spending it on a slate shower stall is a sign you are at one with the Zen-like rhythms of nature?

• Work for a company as cool, hip and enterprising as you?

• GO ON adventure seeking vacations to the remotest parts of the world to X-treme ski, mountain climb or whitewater raft, or do you simply settle for a ride in the sport utility vehicle to the nearest haute-design shops and local purveyors of Third World treasures?

• Dress 'geek chic' or hippy chick - and don't forget the titanium Omnitech athletic gear?

• Have a newly renovated kitchen which looks like an aircraft hangar with plumbing - even after the feng shui?

• Give to Tibet, but not always to the local homeless?

• Feel cheated and betrayed if a big supermarket sign that normally says 'Organic Items Today: 130' today counts only 60?

• Earn upwards of £67,000 but were never in it for the money?

• Buy Third World to save the Third World?

[NeedleCast]

22. I understand what you're saying, but ultimately, she votes Democratic

and it sounds like she does what she can to help Democrats gain office, at least at your local level.

Big tent party, right?

[Mari333]

23. yeah but shes also well known in town

and a lot of people, local people, on the fence about voting dem or republican, will just chalk her up as another elitist liberal...and vote republican. she needs to keep her mouth shut and pay her employees better.

[Telly Savalas]

29. Isn't that a rather elitist attitude?

You're essentially accusing your neighbors of being so stupid that they'll vote for bad candidates who support bad policies just because one of the supporters of a good candidate is a douche-bag snob.

[Mari333]

31. this is a very red area of Michigan

however, a lot of people are on the fence here. if liberals behave with no empathy towards the working class , they send a poor message. I never said my neighbours are stupid.

[Vickers]

71. "will just chalk her up as another elitist liberal...and vote republican"

Bwahahahahahahahahah!!!

:rofl:




Oh...you were serious.

Sorry.

:blush:

[Odin2005]

26. I'm a liberal from a rural, working class background and I am suspicious towards the Latte Liberals.

I can't shrug off the feeling lot of their political views and activism are an act "Oh, look and see how Green and Enlightened I am, kiss my feet, I'm so much better then those uncultured Red State hicks".

If I want organic food I'll go to farmers' markets and ethnic grocery stores. Whole Paycheck is a scam catering to the vanity of the Upper-Middle Class and their desire to free themselves of guilt without really sacrificing.

[Mari333]

36. yeah, me too.

I like to mess with them, tho. I can cross cultures, i.e., sit with a whole group of academic goobers and debate the merits of dialectic materialism, or eat french fries at the truck stop and hoot it up with the waitresses. My dad was a railroad engineer who read Shakespeare to us, and a union man. I guess I got the best of both worlds.

[Odin2005]

40. Sounds like my family.

Except in my case it was my biological Dad, who is a machine operator at a sugar beet processing plant and also a union man, who is a pop-sci fanatic and buried me under science stuff. :) I have most of his old Discover and Popular Science magazines stored in my closet, LOL.

[BolivarianHero]

33. It's a challenge...

Social liberalism and a pro-intellectual perspective are good things, but they don't come instinctually to everyone and the cultivation process creates a certain sort of elitism in many.

It's an idea that's very difficult to articulate, really...How do you show a working-class person of modest education and socially conservative perspectives that homophobia is wrong, that women and men deserve the same opportunities, that the institutional barriers created by race and class are real, that both the repression and the exploitation of human sexuality are two sides of the same coin, or that the War on Drugs disproportionately helps the ultra rich snort coke in ritzy clubs or have their snooty little fucking pill parties in Hollywood Hills (not to mention the assholes in the corporate world and in organised crime who are making a King's ransom off prohibition) while ruining a middle-class student's life for smoking a joint or throwing minorities in jail for non-violent crimes simply because they can't hide in their gated communities while they indulge? Unfortunately, the faculties required for many to grasp all of this and to come to grips with its implications are frequently developed by institutions and in settings that foster elitism and disembededness.

Incidentally, it seems easier to be socially liberal without being snobby in my corner Canada than it is in your neck of the woods.

[Odin2005]

42. IMO the issue is that most people arn't good with intellectual things not because of ignorance but..

...because of personality. It is the distinction between what Carl Jung called Intuition, abstract understanding, and Sensation, concrete understanding. According to my reading 2/3 of people are "Sensing" types, while only 1/3 are "intuiting" types. Sensing types don't do well with abstract theory, they need hands-on concrete examples (and at the same time intuiting types like myself don't do well in being practical, we get stuck in our ivory tower and whine when the sensing types don't understand us). If you want to convince sensing types don't try to argue political theory and moral philosophy, give practical examples, anecdotes, and raw factual data.

[leftyclimber]

34. Oh, gods, I know one of those.

150% for Obama.

Came real damn close to calling an African-American grad student "lazy" and cut themselves off before they completely got it out. Thinks gay people are a novelty and being acquainted with some is somehow stylish (guess who I am not out to?). Makes fun of poor people. Makes fun of rural people. Complains about how oldest child may have to leave a selective liberal arts college and go to the state school WHERE WE WORK because that's not good enough for Oldest Child. Puts down the students who could "only" go to the state school WHERE WE FUCKING WORK (which that person did for their education, BTW), considers them inferior for not going somewhere better (we're talking about poor, first-generation college students here, most of whom can't afford to go anywhere else, regardless of how smart and talented they are). And so on. And so on.

Makes me want to crawl in a hole it's so embarrasing to the cause. I Do Not want people like that associated with liberalism. Dude's a freeper with a blue shirt on.

[BolivarianHero]

35. rofl

I know a "Leninist" who pays $40,000 / year to go to one of those private colleges.

[leftyclimber]

38. Yup, know those types, too.

The ones that see leftism as some sort of fashion statement rather than an objective to be pursued. I try to hand them off to Foucault and his discussion with the Maoists in Power/Knowledge. Makes their heads spin.

And welcome to DU!

:hi:

[Odin2005]

45. Not just leftism, but enviromentalism, too.

It's what makes me skeptical about "Carbon Trading" schemes, sounds like something cooked up by Free-Marketer Latte Liberals as a modern version of the selling of indulgences by the Catholic Church in the middle ages in order to absolve themselves of guilt while doing diddly-squat for the environment. Real change would be a carbon tax and massive funding towards renewables, nuclear energy, fusion research, and recycling technology.

[leftyclimber]

103. Oh hell yes. nt

[Mari333]

39. I saw that a lot when I was in college!

I had a lot of friends in college who called themselves Trotskyites, Leninists, Marxists, and then I visited their homes..they lived in mansions!! their dads were corporate execs!!
I was a kid whose dad was a railroad engineer..so when I argued with my friends (who insisted they needed to 'organize the masses!' I told them that guys like my dad would laugh at them. they got so mad at me for saying that.
I have a feeling a lot of them are CEO's themselves now.

[Odin2005]

47. It's exactly why I think the Trots are a bunch of idiots.

A bunch of armchair revolutionaries into it because it's "cool". Oh, and did I mention that the Neo-Cons are Ex-Trots?

[Gemini Cat]

54. I saw the same thing.

Children of the elite having fun playing revolutionary.
They were serious too! Seriously!!
Down with the bourgeoisie they shouted, until the trust fund kicked in.

[Dorian Gray]

64. You know...

they exist everywhere. I mentioned this on DU at the time, but once I was given a gift certificate for my birthday to the Elizabeth Arden Salon. As I was waiting for my appt, a woman with a Che t-shirt came in and started bitching about having to wait. The irony of her berating the people who worked there while wearing the Che t-shirt (and high heels!) was not lost on me, and it's an image that comes back to me quite often.

[Stevenmarc]

41. Lack of class has no political stripe, one simply does not throw wealth in peoples faces.

[Reterr]

43. Meh...it is easy to stereotype people who shop at Whole Foods as much as those that shop at Walmart

There are a lot of people who shop at Walmart just because they don't care about how slaughterhouse wortkers/animals are treated and will drop a big chump of change on something else (my boss fits this description) but buy the cheapest food they can get....

All this thread proves to me is that in general stereotypes suck...

Sure there are Whole foods types like that, but shopping at Walmart is still not some awesome thing just because "champagne liberals" exist...
I care about the environment and animal welfare and so I spend a lot of money on food. To afford that, I cut back on other stuff...


Stereotypes are fucking stupid....

[Mari333]

44. I agree.

I am sure there are a lot of nice people who shop at both. where I live, however, there isnt a choice. its walmart or a more expensive supermarket. thats all. I was just a bit shocked by this womans lack of sensitivity when it came to the local population and some of the dire straits they are in.

[Reterr]

46. No I totally get where you are coming from...

I just saw that upthread you said you are from Michigan and my family is from MI and so I know what you speak of...
That state is hurting and certainly this woman sounds like an incredibly insensitive asshole x(....

[Mari333]

48. I love your comment line on your sig page by alice walker nt

[Reterr]

50. Thanks

I love that quote :hi:....

[kikiek]

112. No kidding. One comment and look at the responses. They know all about her and her beliefs.

[Greyhound]

49. It seems to me that what she represents is the fundamental issue that we

have always faced, class warfare. It has been going on here for over a century at least and the overwhelming majority of us (the not-rich) will not even acknowledge that it is happening.

About 10 years ago Warren Buffet went on the talking head circuit telling people flat-out that there is a class war, and even then we wouldn't see it (That's where the quote in my sig line came from). Now, from your description it sounds like this woman may not be one of the truly rich but merely a gatekeeper, regardless she is waging the war and those she wages it on, her victims, enable her to continue to steal from them.

BTW, she may be a Democrat, but she is not a liberal.

[anonymous171]

52. I think we get too focused on the social issues sometimes,

and so people like OP's "friend" think that Liberalism is basically conservatism but without all of that nasty social conservatism.

[Name removed]

51. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[applegrove]

53. I've been called a "cocktail socialist" in Canada.

[JI7]

55. Whole Foods is too expensive, even many people who have whole Foods near them don't

shop there. i have to wonder how they make money because whenever i go in there i don't see many people. Trader Joe's on the other hand is always busy and crowded.

[Godhumor]

56. Whole Foods? Psshh, where's the Wegmans?

Pshah, I say! Pshah!

[proteus_lives]

58. Hey, I like processed cheese!

Forget her!
;-)

[liberalitch]

68. especially with a little champaign.

Or Champale.

[proteus_lives]

100. Goes great with mac and cheese.

:-)

[Dorian Gray]

59. There are plenty of snooty liberals

Trust me. I live in NYC and I work in non-profit. I come across them almost daily.

[cagesoulman]

63. Tell her to donate her fucking brie to me and I'll lather her up with Velveeta

Then she can see how real people fucking live.

[maryf]

65. K&R#5

Liberals maintain the status quo with their two faced rhetoric...

[maryf]

66. A song for you by Phil Ochs: Love me I'm a Liberal

I cried when they shot Medgar Evers
Tears ran down my spine
I cried when they shot Mr. Kennedy
As though I'd lost a father of mine
But Malcolm X got what was coming
He got what he asked for this time
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I go to civil rights rallies
And I put down the old D.A.R.
I love Harry and Sidney and Sammy
I hope every colored boy becomes a star
But don't talk about revolution
That's going a little bit too far
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I cheered when Humphrey was chosen
My faith in the system restored
I'm glad the commies were thrown out
of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board
I love Puerto Ricans and Negros
as long as they don't move next door
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

The people of old Mississippi
Should all hang their heads in shame
I can't understand how their minds work
What's the matter don't they watch Les Crain?
But if you ask me to bus my children
I hope the cops take down your name
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I read New republic and Nation
I've learned to take every view
You know, I've memorized Lerner and Golden
I feel like I'm almost a Jew
But when it comes to times like Korea
There's no one more red, white and blue
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I vote for the democratic party
They want the U.N. to be strong
I go to all the Pete Seeger concerts
He sure gets me singing those songs
I'll send all the money you ask for
But don't ask me to come on along
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

Once I was young and impulsive
I wore every conceivable pin
Even went to the socialist meetings
Learned all the old union hymns
But I've grown older and wiser
And that's why I'm turning you in
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

[Fly by night]

69. Eat the rich (regardless of political persuasion)

[Vickers]

72. Better a champagne liberal than a cigar conservative.

:eyes:

[NashVegas]

73. "Judge Not, Lest Ye ...."

I'm fortunate enough to live in an area with a Whole Foods and a Trader Joes, a good farmers' market and tons of stands.

Whole Foods comes into areas where self-motivated organics and gourmet shoppers already exist in great enough numbers for WF to be profitable. This woman might be pretentious, but she's telling you a FACT.

Having grown up in a town like what you describe, I've had experience with those locals. They tend to be assholes to people who don't conform to lowest-common-denominator tastes.


ON EDIT:

Oh, I see. This thread isn't so much about how to get along better with a neighbor, but instead it's more about bashing people, particularly generally liberal and, specifically, food activists for using their financial clout to promote progressive causes, such as non-synthetic food.

Because, suddenly anti-nuke activists are bad for the Democratic party?
Suddenly, people who helped force American campuses and businesses to divest in apartheid-era Africa are bad for the Democratic Party?
Suddenly, people who promote food security are bad for the Democratic Party?

I think I'm having flashbacks to when AOL get usenet.

[Robb]

78. Nailed it. nt

[Mari333]

79. local people in this area make minimum wage or have no jobs

they arent assholes, so much as they just dont have the money to spend on truffles and arugula. they have to choose between heat and food sometimes.
I started the thread to get feedback on the lack of empathy I saw in the woman I described. out of touch.

[NashVegas]

113. Libraries Cost Nothing

Most of us can't afford truffles. Doesn't mean we have any need to begrudge someone who can, and yet, some do. Your neighbor has a "fuck you" to give back to the people who would slam her tastes.

[Mari333]

115. read my first post

I dont begrudge anyone who can afford truffles and brie. I do take issue with people who are well off who make fun of the poor and disenfranchised, and have no empathy. Its just so Marie Antoinette.

[NashVegas]

116. I Read It Very Well

And your many follow-ups. The woman you're describing isn't the only person with a chip on their shoulder or you wouldn't have bothered starting this thread, would you?

What, exactly, were you hoping for?

[Mari333]

117. wanted feedback on the behaviour I saw

wonder why some people need to be cruel , why some people lack empathy and kindness and altruism and compassion.
All in all, I see the woman I described as very insecure, unhappy, and lonely. I extend my compassion to her in that regard.

[NashVegas]

119. Wow. You Got All That With One Line and a Wave of a Hand?

All I got was a statement.

[Burma Jones]

77. There's a whole website dedicated to the objects of your derision......

http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/

[Celebration]

80. Whole Foods *is* expensive, BUT

You do get quality. We don't have cool ethnic markets here, and I have my choice of Central Market (THAT's where the elite shop around here), Kroger (same old, same old, not exactly cheap), and Whole Foods.

Whole Foods gets most of my business. And, the people that shop there aren't the elite rich. As an example, I saw my yardman there once. We only have one Whole Foods in this city, and it is busy with people who have the transportation to get there.

Sure, I would shop at a cool ethnic market a lot for fresh fruit if I had a choice. But, I don't. Whole Foods gets most of my business.

And, their appeal here is far wider than the so called latte liberals.

[AllieB]

82. Whole Foods has better prices on produce than my local chain supermarkets.

Sad to say...

[AllieB]

81. Your acquaintance sounds like a real jerk, but 'champagne liberal' only serves to perpetuate

the RW stereotypes of a 'limousine liberal' and 'latte liberal'.

I understand that people in your area are struggling, but this thread has devolved into a typical class-bashing thread that vilifies people who have the means to shop at Whole Foods and have the luxury to volunteer their time toward liberal causes. I know you did not intend as such, but underlying many of the comments here is the belief that you can't be a true progressive/liberal/Democrat if you have money.

Like Nash Vegas, I am lucky to have several Whole Foods, which sell lots of produce and meat from local farmers, and Trader Joes in my area. A real conversation needs to take place on why the poor don't have access to fresh food, and why our food supply is making us sick, especially for those who can only afford the processed foods that are cheap and toxic. We are killing the least among us on many levels. Last night, Now on PBS interviewed Robert Kenner, whos documentary 'Food Inc' is coming out this month:

http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/523/index.html

[blindpig]

83. Geez, did I hear strains of "Love me I'm a liberal"?

It really is all about class, and your well off liberals are on the wrong side of the divide. They would feel good about themselves but reap the benefits of Empire.

[AllieB]

87. Sorry, I'm not well off. I grew up eating government cheese.

and my husband grew up in public housing. Nice attack though-a false assumption on your part. That chip on your shoulder must be really heavy.

[blindpig]

88. Ain't about you.

Did I call you a liberal? I was brought up well, wouldn't do that without good cause. Shouldn't ought defend them though.

That was good cheese.

[AllieB]

89. People are people, whether they're rich or poor or in the middle.

I'm not defending anyone, just pointing out that there's a lot of class warfare on DU, which is perfectly justified because of the economic policies that have brought the middle- and working-classes to their knees. However, to blame progressives/liberals who have money and donate generously to non-profits and political causes is barking up the wrong tree. It paints them as part of the problem, when they want to see a better country like you or me.

[blindpig]

94. Sorry, but I disagree.

I find them an obstacle to any real progress. That they accept capitalism puts them on the wrong side of the struggle. That they propose worthless half measures and accept the status quo only muddies the water, and that is their purpose, to stand between the rich and the masses. They try to by their way into heaven while accepting hell on earth.

[AllieB]

98. Your lumping a group together, because obviously you see them as a lump and not as individuals.

Kind of like how Stalin viewed the Kulaks. Do you view Ted Kennedy as someone who proposes 'worthless half measures"? He's been on the side of the working people for almost 5 decades and he's rich.

That they accept capitalism puts them on the wrong side of the struggle.

How do you propose people make livings? On collective farms or in factories? Some people, like Senator Kennedy, were born rich and others made money, and not always on the backs of the proletariat.


that is their purpose, to stand between the rich and the masses.

How do you know the motivations of people? Last I checked, people generally act as individuals, and not some secret liberal fifth column that tries to keep the status quo. Painting any group with a broad brush is dangerous, whether you're talking class or ethnicity.

[anonymous171]

106. They aren't necessarily part of the problem.

However, their focus on the symptoms of economic inequality (most social issues fall under that category) rather than the root causes isn't helping anything either.

Also Class Warfare is not only justified, but is required for our (the lower classes') survival.

[NashVegas]

118. I'm Not Well Off. I Make Well Under Median In My Market

And pay 100% of my rent and utilities solo. I'm one of the people in my city who took part in the creation of a demand that Whole Foods exploited. When I buy there or at farmers markets it's because I have a demand for natural, preferably organic, and local fresh foods from producers who don't think farmers ought to be serfs, that Wal-Mart has no real interest fulfilling.

Rush Limbaugh would be so happy to seethis particular segment of a long-time Democratic voting block getting bashed in this thread. It's called "wedge politics."

"Champagne liberal"
"Limousine liberal"
"Latte liberal" <---- nice one, left over from Club For Growth's anti-Howard Dean campaign in Iowa 2004.

[AllieB]

121. Exactly. I love to see my fellow progressives buy into RW terminology.

:eyes:

I'm also happy to shop at Whole Foods. They have better sales on produce and meat than my local chain grocery stores. They also carry meat and produce from local farmers.

According to some of the posters on this thread, I'm a class traitor because I see people as individuals and not lump them into a group.

[Odin2005]

97. People like the women described in the OP is the source of the RW "elitist liberal" stereotype.

It's not like these stereotypes came out of nowhere, RW propagandists took sentiment derived from people's own experiences and twisted them for political gain.

[NashVegas]

120. Yes, And It's Working

Here you are, talking just like Rush Limbaugh on a site called "Democratic Underground."

How groovily ironic, huh?

[Taitertots]

86. Let them eat cake

This is exactly the problem with our system.

People like her make their excess wealth at the expense of the people they bemoan.

It reminds me of a discussion I had with a wealthy acquaintance. He was complaining about people not having health care, not being able to afford college, and not being able to retire. I told him he was rich, and if he lived at the median income lifestyle he would be able to pay all his workers health care, they would have a living wage, be able to retire, and he would still have all those things. It outraged him. The idea that he forgo vacations, new trucks, big TVs, and a huge house was unacceptable.

This was from someone who claimed to be a democrat.

[anonymous171]

95. There are people like that on here.

A couple of days ago someone was arguing for a fucking Federal Sales Tax increase in order to pay for healthcare. They would rather shift the burden of taxation onto the middle and lower classes instead of paying their fair share to society through progressive taxation.

[dorkulon]

90. Rich liberals are still beter than rich conservatives.

This lady may not appreciate the common folk, but at least she doesn't want them to starve.

[rcrush]

101. When they get that rich and up their ass theres not much difference

Its all an act for the 'privileged'.

[AngryAmish]

91. We were talking about this problem at the country club the other day...

[Mari333]

92. lol

[anaxarchos]

93. Lemmings...

...with sleep masks and ear plugs.

Talking endlessly about how "the sheeple" are "stoopid".

Thinking that their "intellect" or "innate talent" or edumication or "new ideas" or "sensitivity" makes them immune.

Drowning in their own "realism".

I like 'em...


... with fava beans and a good Chianti.

[emulatorloo]

96. I wouldn't paint with such a broad brush. Everybody has said something assholish now and again

-- I'd just politely talk to her about it.

-- I'd be happy she is not glued to the fox channel.

[AllieB]

99. That's what I was trying to say above.

But I'd be a traitor to my class if I defended rich liberals as individuals rather than as a class that is part of the problem.

:eyes:

Painting any class or ethnicity with a broad brush is dangerous.

[BlooInBloo]

104. Yah, snobs suck.

[Zomby Woof]

105. Champag-na?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

108. Do you like my painting?

I got it at Target. :rofl:

[Lydia Leftcoast]

107. In the 1960s, such people would have been Republicans

They like the Dems now because they value freedom on behavioral issues (as rich people always have) and maybe adhere to Environmentalism Lite, but don't talk about progressive taxation or better working conditions for the working class or building low income housing in their community, because then their Inner Republican will come out.

[anonymous171]

109. Yep. They're the kind of people who want to pay for UHC by creating a 10% VAT nt

[Annces]

110. I have known some people like that

And I think it is just human nature to see your own particular interests mostly. Even so-called "poor" people often only see their own view of the world, and don't know anything for instance about other countries problems. Even saints generally pick and choose what they place their concerns and time on. Nothing is perfect, far far from it.

[rvablue]

111. Shallow people come in all shapes, sizes, colors and political bents.

Nothing new there.

And frankly, I find people like this woman ridiculous. They think they are "better" because they take pride in being ripped off. And they like to assign themselves "status" because of what they buy.

Folks like this exist in all races, religions, nationalities, socio-economic groups and political parties.

Wouldn't really label her a "champagne liberal." She's more just your basic run-of-the-mill nitwit.




ed:ms sp

[old mark]

114. Sorry, but I am a Walmart Liberal - we are on a fixed income more or less,

and we save a lot of money by shopping there.
They have great vegies and fruit, but we get meat and fish elsewhere.
We save easily $50 a week shopping there.
I even use their pharmacy, and we both got eye exams and glasses made through Walmart.
mark