Don't Ask - Don't Tell

[QueenOfCalifornia]

Do you think that this is an issue we need to deal with NOW?

Can it wait until heterosexuals decide it is okay to allow gay and lesbian armed service people to be open about their sexual orientation?

Obama promised to repeal DADT... Now he seems to have forgotten that promise.

[Cant trust em]

1. There seems to be an option missing

DADT should be repealed, but I believe that there are other things that should take precedence.

[JuniperLea]

2. Good call...

If it's between saving all our asses, and changing lives of a portion of the populace in a non-lethal, non-ruinous manner, I have to go with the former.

I also think there needs to be rules set in place well prior to changing DADT... there are just too many "good ol' boys" in the military who probably won't go for this... their reactions should be anticipated and rules set in place to put the smackdown on them... there are good reasons to go slowly with this.

[motely36]

6. So if it doesn't effect everyone then it's not important?

:shrug:

[JuniperLea]

7. Of course not... don't put words in my mouth... not what I said... not even close...

Read again. We all need saved first. If we ALL lay in ruin, there's not much point to the DADT issue anyway.

[motely36]

11. I'm not trying to put words in your mouth

I'm sorry, but I disagree, to me DADT is just as important as Health Care.

[JuniperLea]

13. As important as health care?

Really? You would rather people be allowed to be openly gay, than for people to live or be healthy? That's not really very nice. Very selfish, actually.

I have great health care, and I still think health care is a number one priority. Not only for the health and lives of others, but because it is important to the economy and health of businesses too.

Wow. Just wow.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

14. You are one of the more outspoken

people here.

I sometimes agree with you.

sometimes not.

But I think you are missing the point --- When something like DADT dictates to a portion of our citizens it is harmful. It allows for discrimination and this is not right. If past administrations had decided that the plight of African Americans was not as important as other things and had put it on the back burner we would not have our first AA POTUS. There is never a wrong time to correct an injustice. And DADT is a bigoted injustice to a section of our society. It could be repealed in a day. If we wait for health care to be fixed prior to fixing bigoted and unjust laws we are treating our gay and lesbian brothers and sisters in a shameful manner.

[JuniperLea]

18. I disagree...

Many of our gay and lesbian brothers and sisters are in dire need of health care too. Everyone is in need... businesses will have a more solid bottom line if health care is fixed, there's a definite domino effect in play here. People are dying because they cannot go to a doctor. Millions of people. Children too.

All I'm saying is that, and at the risk of repeating, "If it's between saving all our asses, and changing lives of a portion of the populace in a non-lethal, non-ruinous manner, I have to go with the former."

Health and life are far more important than just about anything, other than food, for humans to survive. We are in survival mode, and we have one president, and resources/time of day are finite. All I'm saying is that if it's between helping 100% of the people, and helping $25% of the people, I have to go with the higher number, regardless.

Yes, DADT is painful and wrong. Detestable even. But it doesn't kill people. If I have to make a choice between lethal and non-lethal situations, I think it's just wise to take care of the lethal issue first.

There are four years to a president's term. To expect him to handle everything month one, quarter one, or even year one, is pretty silly.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

20. So...

until health care is "fixed" then getting anything else done is impossible?

Not hardly.

Multiple things are handled at the same time by competent people. Obama seems competent enough to keep his campaign promise and repeal DADT.

[JuniperLea]

22. Not what I said either...

It's just not going to happen right now, that's all. There's a lot on his plate and he isn't afraid of hard work, but he's got four years to keep his promises and since it's only been a few months, and he's doing a lot of good already, I'm not going to throw up my hands and say he's a failure or he's gone back on his promises.

He's not one to rush into things. This particular issue is something that could be horribly botched if rushed. A lot of holes need plugged and a lot of anticipation of the stupidity that will follow needs reviewed, discussed, and ways and means of running around and past the disruptions is absolutely necessary in order to do this right. No one is going to die if it's not done next week. Someone could die if things are rushed.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

23. I guess I am

not fond of seeing people having their rights dismissed.

[JuniperLea]

24. They haven't been dismissed...

I think that is my main point. I would rather see Obama go slow and easy on this one. There are just too many idiot old timer good old boys in the military that would make the lives of gay soldiers sheer hell! Those gaps need filled and rules laid down before any further action can be taken. It's not like the marriage deal in CA where something was given, then taken away. THAT is a right that was dismissed. This issue is just going to take some time no matter how you slice it.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

26. I do not agree that

the military should wait until an entire generation dies off before rectifying its mistakes.

Nothing would ever change if we waited the way you are suggesting.

[JuniperLea]

33. I'm not suggesting anything of the sort!

Honestly! I cannot for the life of me see where you are getting that bullshit from what I said! Bullshit.

[Toasterlad]

27. "But it doesn't kill people"

You don't think a lack of qualified personnel in combat situations isn't lethal?

I'd ask you to think about it, but it's clear that you can only focus on one problem at a time...and that equality's number won't be coming up any time soon.

[JuniperLea]

34. Where are they lacking people?

It's clear you think insulting people will win influence or something... I'd ask you to think about that...

[QueenOfCalifornia]

37. They are lacking

translators.
http://bravenewfilms.org/blog/?p=1164

[BoneDaddy]

17. No, it is just that more pressing things

may take priority. Everyone has an idea of what is most important to them, but rarely do people take into consideration what is the most important thing for the country.

Kinda like triage. You handle the heart attack first, the broken bone second and the small stich needed third.

Of course if you have the broken bone and the needed stich you may want to be seen first, but some things are more important in the scheme of things.

[anigbrowl]

16. I'd settle for sometime this year

On the basis of amending the rules to anticipate end-runs around the repeal, rather than the 'either/or' healthcare thing.

[dorkulon]

31. There are already rules in place regarding disobeying orders or assaulting anyone.

To be clear: It is already illegal to beat people up. The good ole boys will do what they're told.

[JuniperLea]

35. I think there needs to be a "hate crime" element

So the punishment is swift and severe.

[MarjorieG]

8. Tired of waiting/strategic option deemed uncaring. Could derail health care, made

wedge, not getting health care or DADT. sp

[QueenOfCalifornia]

12. Could you say that again

but this time in english?

[MarjorieG]

19. Anyone favoring strategically waiting until health care passed is accused of uncaring.

I think the wedge aspect (and never underestimate a few naysayers making their opinion seem universal on MSM) would serve to make health care and DADT new law DOA and endlessly spun..

[Toasterlad]

25. People Like You Will Always FInd More Important Causes Than Equality to Worry About.

[MarjorieG]

28. I care about it passing and don't think it would without big Obama push-which he will do.

Difference of strategy, and I'm madder beyond words to get reviled, attacked like I don't care. How dare-you-question everyone as not caring.

[Toasterlad]

32. Sure You Care...As Long As Healthcare Is Taken Care of First.

And then the economy. And then education. And then the war in Iraq. And then the war in Afghanistan. And then...

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

15. Yes, because it's not like 70% of the country supports repealing it or anything

:puke:

[jobycom]

3. If it can be done, it should be done now, I'm tired of the "Two Americas."

All inequality, all oppression, should be opposed, and there should be no higher priority.

[Prism]

4. Finally

With all the talk of ponies, I've been waiting for months to see that Seinfeld reference here =)

[QueenOfCalifornia]

10. I have wondered the same thing

--- I figure I've missed it somehow because I can not have been the first to employ that quote.

[DutchLiberal]

5. DODT looks so ridiculous to us Dutchmen.

But hey, what do we now, we don't live in the "land of the free". We only invented gay marriage.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

9. I love your country

I've been there several times.

My brother in law lives there so he can be married to his husband. He said it was worth learning to speak Dutch.

[DutchLiberal]

36. Thank you. You're very kind.

Yes, learning Dutch is very hard, I can imagine. I'm glad for your brother in law that he can live with the man he loves, yet I'm sad he couldn't in the U.S. But maybe he will be able to in the (near) future, when more states legalize gay marriage. Let's hope that day comes soon.

[aikoaiko]

21. Obama should say: no sucking or fucking among troops......

...regardless of sex/gender and everyone who meets the entrance and training requirements can serve.

Or something to that effect.

[Kaleva]

29. It took three years for the military to follow Truman's order

Two years after Truman signed the order, he said he expected desegregation to happen sometime in the nearby future.

[Starry Messenger]

30. So hopefully now would be a good time to get cracking.

We're in a war and need the people. We're sending in people who want out and are stretched too thin and getting PTS. We're firing people who want to serve and are trained. The opinion of the country is with this.