Question. Do you feel deadly force is justified to stop a rapist?

[Tim01]

This is an additional question to my other post.

I'll just say up front I prefer dead criminals. Maybe that is because I don't choose to rob, or mug, or rape, or murder other people. If a person was to break into my house I would be comfortable with shooting him before he even knew I was there.

My question is simply is it wrong to kill somebody to prevent a rape?
A woman is home alone. And unarmed man smashes his way into her house and smashes his way into her bedroom where she is hiding. She has her husbands duck hunting shotgun and can use it just fine. The guy tells her he is going to take the gun away from her then rape her.

Does anybody feel she is wrong to kill the rapist? Can you explain?

[Iggo]

1. .

:popcorn:

[Richard D]

2. Perfectly OK with me.

[WillieW]

32. It's ok with me to

[EOTE]

3. Definitely not.

Even if you don't think that the act of rape itself is enough to justify killing the SOB, there's no guarantee that the rapist won't kill the victim after he's done. If the threat of violence isn't enough to stop him, I'd think it would be crazy not to kill the fucker.

[Downtown Hound]

4. No.

[Downtown Hound]

55. Amended to clarify

I don't feel she was wrong to kill the rapist.

[sojourner]

wrong premise...how does she know he won't kill her?

That said, I'd shoot him -- no discussion (his "telling" her his intentions is too much talk!) --

[Tim01]

12. Lets just assume he said he is going to rape her and not kill her. nt

[raccoon]

14. And of course, assailants who break into a house and say they're going to rape you,

beat you, etc., are utterly trustworthy. :rofl:

What is your agenda here, anyway?

[eShirl]

22. he's obviously a trustworthy man of his word, so she should lay down her gun, close her eyes, and

grit her teeth.

:sarcasm:

[bobbolink]

53. Grit her teeth? I think she's supposed to think of England.

Too bad we can't be civilized enough for every woman who wants to to be able to be trained in Model Mugging! That would end a lot of these attacks, right there!

[havocmom]

83. Self defense coach told us a rapist who says: cooperate and I won't hurt you' is already hurting you

Blast away, I say.

[SteppingRazor]

5. I'd blow the dude away. That said...

I suppose if you're utterly committed to pacifism and the idea that taking a life is always wrong, you may have a problem here. I can see some people having a problem pulling the trigger.

But, hell, I'd pop the dude and then pop the champagne.

[supernova]

6. No, of course not

Anyone who invaded my home for that purpose would be killed without question. I'd have to find an alternative though, because I don't have a gun.

[Vidar]

68. Absolutely justified.

[brendan120678]

7. In your scenario, it's justified because the woman's house...

was broken into. The shooting isn't because she was about to be raped...it's because an armed thug intruded into her private property with the intent to do violent harm.

Shoot the bastard.

[aikoaiko]

8. Yes.

I'm ok with lethal force being used to stop any violent felony.

[Dr. Strange]

19. Sounds good to me.

[sui generis]

9. did this really happen or is this a lame gunjeon lead?

I have two answers. If it really happened that someone broke into anybody's home knowing somebody was there, take the fucker out of the gene pool, with prejudice. Note, I did not say a gun had to be used to achieve that outcome.

For the gunjeon lead, why a woman? Why rape? Why the elaborate setup?

[Tim01]

23. In spite of the fact you have chosen to be insulting for no reason

I will answer.

The basic answer is someone told me she would not shoot somebody even if to avoid an intruder in her house raping her. I just can't get my head around that kind of thinking. I'd shoot an intruder to save my dog if I could get away with it.

The reason I mentioned the gun is because it is deadly force. And solid deadly force. Anything less than a gun is a crap shoot for a woman against a man. If she shoots a bad guy she will win. But my question is about the deadly force, not about the gun.

[sui generis]

31. oh I despise gunjeon scenarios

that is a clear reason for being insulting.

Thank you for your clarification, if no gunjeoning was intended no offense was given.

You CAN shoot an intruder to save your dog and get away with it. You can also beat their head in with a tire iron, push them down the stairs and in Texas you can even shoot your neightbor's intruder after chasing them down the street.

:blackhumor:

Seriously though, in an armed society if someone breaks into your home while you are at home you'd best assume they are armed and don't intend to leave a witness, regardless of the arrangement of your pink parts. I'm a gun grabber (:eyes:) but that's because gun laws were written for psychos like me. If somebody breaks into my house while I'm at home they'd better hope I have a gun, because otherwise it's gonna get really messy.

[havocmom]

84. Personally, I wonder if some wingers are doing research to see if libs are easy targets

Boy, would they be surprised!

[Auggie]

10. Yes n/t

[rocktivity]

11. Of course you can use deadly force on someone breaking into your home

It doesn't matter if his intent is to rob, rape, or use deadly force against YOU. What are you supposed to do, WAIT until you can determine what his intent is?

:headbang:
rocktivity

[derby378]

13. It's her body, her sanity, and her right

She has every right to defend herself and send that pathetic shade down to the Seventh Circle of Hell.

[ixion]

15. if someone enters your home uninvited

they take their life in their own hands, IMO.

[MADem]

16. If you can draw a good bead, shoot the guy's dick off! nt

[The_Commonist]

17. I don't think she should shoot to kill.

But I do think she should blow his genitals through the back wall.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

20. She should aim right in the middle of his body and hope her hubby had 000B loaded in it.

Sorry, meant as a reply to the OP - not to your post i nparticular. :)

[fascisthunter]

45. let him live without his balls

in prison for all the other inmates to see.

[backscatter712]

75. There's no such thing with firearms.

The gun folks would say you "shoot to stop". In other words, you fire two rounds at the center of mass and the third round at his head, because the fastest way to stop an attacker is to inflict damage upon him that is way beyond lethal.

[krispos42]

81. Shoot to kill. Blow the balls off after he's dead.

Worst they can charge you with is mutilating a corpse.

[Nye Bevan]

18. She should kill him.

Check out this compelling video that illustrates this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1_NY4n2rg0&feature=related

[Gold Metal Flake]

21. Sometimes murder follows rape. Deadly force should be the FIRST choice.

Never limit the damage when defending against rape.

[eShirl]

24. That was my thought as well.

I would assume I was defending my life and act accordingly.

[supernova]

26. Exactly,

The idea that you can in a split second decide if someone will *not* kill you is frankly insulting. You bet your ass, I'd kill him.

[Heidi]

25. My body and mind are my property and I will defend myself.

Rape is an act of violence, and I would not hesitate to defend myself against violence using whatever force necessary to stop the threat. Death might be an unintended result of an attempt to stop a threat. I wouldn't like to go through life knowing I'd killed someone, but life rarely is as black and white as a yes or no answer to a question like the one you've presented.

[madaboutharry]

27. 100% Yes. Kill him.

In fact, shoot him several times to make sure.

[get the red out]

28. Definitely!

Unless you would rather pat him on the back when the job is done, give him a glass of wine and commiserate with him about how his horrible childhood made him rape women and that he should be allowed to do so since it is his only emotional outlet in the nasty, cruel world. And really, it was the woman's fault, she forgot to lock the deadbolt, so she was just inviting someone like our poor emotionally damaged man to express the fullness of his anguish with her by force. That and the sexy nighty he found her in. :sarcasm:

[TexasObserver]

29. Of course using deadly force is justified.

Deadly force is justified any time a person has a reasonable belief that their life or that of another is threatened. Rape is a very serious assault, and it is reasonable for any rape victim, or person coming upon such an attack to conclude that deadly force may be required.

I oppose the death penalty, but I do not oppose killing these rat bastards in the act, if there is a reasonable basis for doing so.

FYI: Asking one question in your topic line and ending your post with a completely opposite question has led to you receiving answers that appear incongruous. Some posters answer the topic line question, and others answer the last question in your post.

[justanaverageguy]

30. I will take your scenario at face value

and agree that there is not threat of death.

The use of deadly force is justified when there is reasonable belief of imminent death OR serious bodily harm.

I think we can all agree that rape qualifies as serious bodily harm.

So yes, shooting the potential rapist is justified.

[surrealAmerican]

33. I would say that deadly force is justified ...

... but I fully understand people who would choose not to kill the rapist.
I like to think that in these circumstances I would try to find a way to escape instead of having to kill the man because if I killed somebody I would have to live with that.

[11 Bravo]

34. The way this is phrased renders it meaningless. You ask two questions ...

"Is deadly force justified to stop a rapist?" and "Does anybody feel it is wrong to kill a rapist?" A "yes" to question 1 is a "no" to question 2, and vice versa.

Having said that, I believe that deadly force is justified to prevent a rape.

[Yunomi]

35. Almost this exact scenario

happened to a friend of a friend. A stalker knew she was home alone, kicked in her door, but didn't know she was armed. She killed him. Left her with an awful mess to clean up, but no one, including her, felt bad about the guy dying. I think he had a knife, but it was long ago and I don't remember. Whatever, he had bad intentions. I would have done the same, but have large angry dogs instead of guns.

[Beacool]

41. Good for your friend!!!

I've never been stalked, but if I were I would buy a gun and learn how to use it. I wouldn't sit around like a ninny waiting to be raped and possibly killed.

[Duer 157099]

36. I would shoot him in the leg first, then in both hands

What could he do then? No hands?

I mean, it stops him, saves me, and yet I am not burdened with having taken his life.

win win win

[Beacool]

37. Hell, no!!!

I say, blow away the mother f**ker. One less sick bastard out there to cause mayhem.

One woman in her 50s did that a few months ago. A guy had broken into her home through a basement window and raped her. A mere two weeks later he broke in again. This time she heard the commotion and when he surfaced from the basement she blew him away. Good for her!!! Pity that she didn't have a gun handy the first time around.

x(

[EFerrari]

38. Thinking about using deadly force may put you on the wrong track

to stay safe. It's usually more a matter of taking the rapist's advantage and using it on him.

The guy that broke into my house, 2 rape priors, turned off the light so he could have cover of darkness. I used the darkness against him instead of trying to get to a weapon. Had I struggled or tried to lay hands on something, the outcome probably would have been different and worse for me. :shrug:

[Beacool]

42. Was the guy armed?

I hope that he didn't hurt you. You seem to have kept your cool and handled the situation well.

;(

[EFerrari]

46. He wasn't armed but I had to bet that he was.

More important than that, MY SON was on the other side of the bedroom wall. He was 10 but if he woke up, I knew he would walk right into bad things.

It was a total "protect my baby" moment for me.

[Beacool]

49. I'm glad that you and your son made it through the ordeal.

:hug:

[EFerrari]

57. Thank you! We need to teach young women how to respond

to this stuff and live to tell about it. Even if most of the training goes out the window at the moment, whatever they hang onto can save their lives. We need to get into the habit of being safe.

I was taught not to try to hurt my attacker as much as possible but to look for the quickest way to escape safely. Those lessons came in really handy.

:hug: :grouphug:

[rvablue]

44. Good grief, EF.....thank god you were OK.

:scared: :hug:

[EFerrari]

47. Scary. AND as it turned out, when the guy ran out of my house,

he ran right into the Berkeley PD, which was monitoring a rave two blocks away on University Ave. He ended up doing time and it was about a year and a half before I could sleep easily again. Sheesh!

[LAGC]

69. Damn lucky the cops were right there.

They aren't always that close and convenient when you need them...

[krispos42]

39. Yes

I think rape can be classified as "severe bodily injury" without even getting into the PTSD, STD, and pregnancy issues.

Of course, if the attacker is in a position to forcibly rape, he is also in a position to injure, maim, and kill, so it's really all the same reason.


If I, a male, had somebody breaking into my house even though he knew I was in there, I could shoot him knowing I was protecting myself, my son, and my roommates from injury, death... or rape.

I admit it hadn't occured to me that somebody might be breaking in to rape me, but I suppose that's entirely possible although I don't really resemble the studmuffins in the magazines... :-)

[cliffordu]

40. Yep. I'll serve drinks afterward.

[Breeze54]

54. You forgot something....

The :sarcasm: tag

or did you? :shrug:

[cliffordu]

61. I'd drop a rapist in a new york second and have a nice cup

of tea afterwards.

Unless I could set one on fire of course.

I got no time for sexual predators.

[Breeze54]

62. TY

for clearing that up.

:hug:

[cliffordu]

65. No problem.

I used to work with street kids...virtually all of whom had been molested and raped as very young children.....Many of them saw themselves as commodities and sold themselves on the street as such. The odds of recovery from self medication in their cases was very rare - and most of them wound up in the adult system as criminals - for all practical purposes due to poorly surviving sexual predation.


Some went on to offend, also. Rape is a generational problem and I have never heard of a sexual predator who has recovered from it to the point they never re-offend.

[H2O Man]

43. Sure.

It's a good thing.

[ismnotwasm]

48. How 'bout I just beat the shit out of him?

Shove a couple of fingers deep up his nostrils and pull, for starters.

[salguine]

50. Not just yes, but HELL yes.

[lunatica]

51. Since rapists have been known to kill their victims the answer is yes

[Breeze54]

52. YES!! Kill the A-Hole..... Ask questions later!

If you don't have a gun?

Use a baseball bat!!

Beat the living shit out of them!!!!!! :evilfrown:

[Joey Liberal]

56. Hell yes. nt

[chrisa]

58. Yes, and justified

Shoot to kill, definately, if you can't scare the perp off with a warning shot.

Rape often leads to murder, and even if it didn't, it would still be justified.

[OhioChick]

59. "Do you feel deadly force is justified to stop a rapist?" Yes. n/t

[frogmarch]

60. She should shoot him. n/t

[rockymountaindem]

63. Who would be against it? n/t

[flvegan]

64. If she has no other options, take his head off.

I say "other options" such as first attempting to barricade herself in a room with the gun after calling police. But if it's "get raped" or "sweet shooting" then have at it ma'am.

[mitchum]

66. Of course it is justified

[konnichi wa]

67. I would hope she would kill his ass as soon as he gets inside the house.

Preferably with 3 shots starting with the knees.
\

[Pavulon]

70. Yep..Pretty simple

fire the weapon at the person until they no longer present a threat. IE not moving. She also has the right not to hide but actively defend her home by taking a position that gives he the best vantage to defend herself. Such as the top of a staircase firing down onto an intruder.

[rucky]

71. If that's what it takes.

Faced with a violent person with impulse control problems, it's reasonable for a victim to believe her life is in danger.

[Mugu]

72. If enough time has elapsed that he has verbalized his intent

she has hesitated much too long.

[asteroid2003QQ47]

73. 2 in the chest, 1 in the head. With shotgun, so much the better! n/t

[backscatter712]

74. Hell, yeah! Blow his fucking head off.

Protecting yourself against rape is more than enough justification to paint the ceiling with his brain matter.

[DeschutesRiver]

76. Sure do

A percentage of all rapes committed do end in the death of the victim. I have no way to know how this one would turn out, and so I would be in fear for my life and only focused on survival at that moment. The hypo that says assume you won't be killed would either require me to believe the rapist when he said this or read his mind, neither of which is a sure bet that I would indeed live.

So I'd ask him to immediately turn and leave or or I will shoot. And if he advanced at all after the warning, I would end the encounter.

[Withywindle]

77. It's totally justified.

And if I killed one, I don't think I'd have much of an issue with guilt afterwards. Violent rapists almost never strike only once--any tendency to guilt I might have would be mitigated by happiness thinking of all the other women my act might have saved from being raped in the future.

[Kitty Herder]

78. Absolutely. It's justified. And...

If anyone ever raped me, I would hunt him down and kill him. Then if I was convicted of murder, I'd gladly serve the time.
It may be wrong, but I don't care.

[WonderGrunion]

79. Are they raping me with their mouth

Like David Letterman? If yes, then no.

BTW, why does this hypothetical woman even have a husband. Maybe she has her own .38 special because she doesn't need a man to protect her.

[LaurenG]

85. David Letterman raped you with his mouth?

This statement is extremely offensive to women who have been raped.

David Letterman is a talk show host who says stupid things, rapists are violent and do permanent harm. :eyes:

[WonderGrunion]

87. I'm guessing you didn't see the video of the "protesters"

outside of Ed Sullivan theater. One particularly batshit insane "demonstrator" called Letterman a "verbal pedophile" and said he "rapes children with his mouth". My post was a screed against the sexism of the OP.

[LaurenG]

89. Thanks - I thought I was "smelling" something odd

I'm glad it wasn't you! And thank you for the explanation, I didn't see any of the "protest."

[WonderGrunion]

90. There are a couple of videos of it in Political Videos

Watch on an empty stomach, some of what they say will make you vomit. Watch the Sam Seder one last, he really turns things around on them, particularly the "verbal pedophile" nutjob.

[-..__...]

80. She should just lay back and enjoy it.

:sarcasm:

Abso-fucking-lutely shoot to kill without mercy or remorse.

Even if the odds of the rapist murdering the victim are negligible, a bullet in the brain pan will guarantee that he never rapes again.. and also save a few tax dollars in prosecution and incarceration expenses in the process.

[votingupstart]

82. i would have no problem using deadly force to stop a rapist

i also think the woman would be justified in planting the bastard.

[Zavulon]

86. Not only is it justified, but

I think it's justified for someone passing by a rape or an attempted rape to kill the rapist. I don't think the justification should be limited to a victim or would-be victim.

[Zodiak]

88. Shoot the fucker!

Anyone has the right to self-defense, ESPECIALLY in their own home.

[Undercurrent]

91. I live isolated in the deep woods, and have a rifle by my door.

I'd use it.