What's Worse Than A Healthcare Reform Bill With NO PUBLIC OPTION? ....

[Blackhatjack]

A Healthcare Reform Bill that contains a Mandate that everyone buy private healthcare insurance or be penalized.

It will appear to be another massive transfer of wealth to the private healthcare insurers.

That would be much worse.....

[w4rma]

1. Agreed. (nt)

[Laelth]

29. Hear, hear. n/t

:dem:

-Laelth

[WeDidIt]

2. And that's EXACTLY what Baucus put out.

And people wonder why the fuck I'm outraged.

[peace frog]

10. I don't wonder

but outrage has become pretty commonplace these days. **sigh**

[SammyWinstonJack]

3. I don't understand this at all. What if one can not afford to buy?

How can we be forced?

No money to buy into, no money for a fine. :wtf:

What will happen then, thrown in jail? :crazy:

[sandnsea]

There will be subsidies

Oregon subsidies pay up to 90% of premiums.

[girl gone mad]

16. They'll have to throw me in jail.

I refuse to give my money to private health insurance companies.

[Soylent Brice]

7. i wouldn't put it past them.

largest prison population of any country in the world is right here in the US.

they're privatizing the prison industry, and if this happened with HC, it sounds like the perfect scam.

[slipslidingaway]

8. P. Obama also said that there should be waivers for those who

cannot purchase insurance, even with a subsidy.

That still leaves people without insurance.

:shrug:

[wroberts189]

18. Tax penalties/fines... then jail. nt

[SammyWinstonJack]

22. Well they better build a lot more private prisons then. More cheap labor for the prison industrial

complex. And the irony is that health care will be provided for those that are imprisoned for not buying private health care insurance. :silly:

[slipslidingaway]

4. Private insurance companies push for 'individual mandate'

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/june/private_insurance_co.php

By Lisa Girion
Los Angeles Times
June 7, 2009

"Some may find it hard to believe that the U.S. health insurance industry supports making major changes to the nation’s healthcare system...


But this time, it turns out, the health insurance industry has good reason to support at least some change: It needs it.

Private health insurance faces a bleak future if the proposal they champion most vigorously — a requirement that everyone buy medical coverage — is not adopted...


The industry’s real trouble begins in 2011, when 79 million baby boomers begin turning 65. Health insurers stand to lose a huge slice of their commercially insured enrollment (estimated at 162 million to 172 million people) over the next two decades to Medicare, the government-funded health insurance program for seniors..."

[Uncle Joe]

5. I agree, Blackhatjack.

That would only serve to reward the immoral, dysfunctional institution most responsible for our current national health care and financial woes.

Even the foreclosure crisis has been greatly aggravated by the long term concept of an industry; having nothing to do with health care, profiting from the American People's illness and injury.

[sandnsea]

6. The only thing worse is a tax credit

And no monthly subsidy or a requirement to pay up to 15% of your income to premiums. There's lots of things worse if the important details aren't being discussed.

[Blackhatjack]

9. Listen carefully to Repub Ideas and You Can Hear The Private Healthcare Insurers Salivating...

Just imagine a business model in which you have a captive customer base because of a law imposing an individual mandate, and you don't have to compete with a customer friendly alternative public plan.

The Private Healthcare Insurance Company Execs can hardly wait...

[Fumesucker]

11. Not all those ideas are Republican..

"I can envision a day when you will have to show proof of insurance at the job interview" -Hilary Clinton on the 2008 campaign trail

[glitch]

15. Oh they're "Republican" alright, they just don't self-identify as such.

And by "Republican" I mean Fascist.

[Dragonfli]

25. I have been saying that for years (Stealth Republicans under a false flag)

They have nearly destroyed their party and are continuing with plan B: Infiltrate the Democratic party and take it over from within.

The DLC and Blue-Dogs are simply moderate Republicans in a disguise that helps them get elected, they have been doing it since long before Arlen Specter thought of it. Centrist is just a code word for republicans in (D) drag.

[glitch]

26. You and me Dragonfli. Fortunately quite a few other DUers have sussed their game as well. nt

[Better Believe It]

12. We need to elect 100 Democrats to the Senate. That might at least get a public option

Maybe it would.

Well, it's possible.

Certainly by the 22nd century that's possible.

[peace frog]

13. Um, might take

until the 23rd century, but what's the rush? Our esteemed elected officials have all the time in the world, no worries.

[n2doc]

14. Tithing to the alter of the Insurance Co's

At least the Church only asks for 10%.....

[Vinca]

17. Mandatory private insurance is totally unacceptable.

The notion is actually pretty foolish. If I could afford private insurance, I would have purchased it . . . for whatever good it is. If you get an ingrown toenail and need minor surgery they'll remind you of when you were 3 years old and had a hang nail and deny the procedure.

[TahitiNut]

19. Yes... believe it or not, the result of this "reform" could be to create an even WORSE situation.

There is little doubt that the Health Insurance industry is working to completely and totally hijack this legislation to (1) FORCE people to pay them premiums (2) have the government use its power to FORCE providers to reduce costs to the insurers and, thus, increase profits and (3) legislate AGAINST any future attempt to create a public health care system.

It's the "best government money can buy."

[Cleita]

20. I really think they are slimey to even propose this. They know it only

places an additional burden on the populace and delivers no more health care than we already have today. There are failed tests of this system already out there that serve as a lab experiment. However, it's a nice bonanza for the health insurance and pharma industry and for their campaign contributions. It will also put this pesky issue on the back burner for another twenty years. Who cares who dies who didn't have to.

[FiveGoodMen]

21. I'll simply say: God damn each and every motherfucker who has suggested mandating private insurance

for health care.

They are the enemies of the human race.

Yes, really.

[sandnsea]

24. Hillary & Krugman for starters

But somehow questioning his judgment on other economic issues is to be a troll. :crazy:

[lumberjack_jeff]

27. Both Clinton and Krugman want a public option.

Words mean things, and "universal" means "not optional".

Our heath care is expensive because 50 million are uninsured.

[sandnsea]

28. They supported mandated health insurance

Very similar to what Baucus is supporting now.

[lumberjack_jeff]

32. No, they did not.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/05/opinion/05krugman.html?_r=1

Clinton's plan builds on the existing employer-based system of coverage. People who receive insurance through the workplace could continue to do so; businesses, in turn, would be required to offer insurance to employees, or contribute to a government-run pool that would help pay for those not covered. Clinton would also offer a tax subsidy to small businesses to help them afford the cost of providing coverage to their workers.

For individuals and families who are not covered by employers or whose employer-based coverage is inadequate, Clinton would offer expanded versions of two existing government programs: Medicare, and the health insurance plan currently offered to federal employees. Consumers could choose between either government-run program, but aides stress that no new federal bureaucracy would be created under the Clinton plan.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20819827/

[sandnsea]

34. "no new federal bureaucracy", no public option

This isn't even as good as what we've got from Baucus. Hillary and Krugman supported mandated health insurance. That's what you just posted.

[lumberjack_jeff]

35. Sheesh. You can read better than that.

"For individuals and families who are not covered by employers or whose employer-based coverage is inadequate, Clinton would offer expanded versions of two existing government programs: Medicare, and the health insurance plan currently offered to federal employees. Consumers could choose between either government-run program"

In other words, you could choose to opt into Medicare on a sliding scale.

It's the public option which uses the current public insurance. New federal bureaucracy is unnecessary because it already exists if we'd only be allowed to use it.

[sandnsea]

36. You're right, it did offer Medicare to everyone

I honestly don't know how I missed that at the time. Federal Employees health insurance isn't a government run plan though, it's a collection of insurance policies to choose from. My subsidy allows me to choose from a bunch of policies, if it weren't for pre-existings that Oregon chose to dump into one outrageously expensive pool.

[SlipperySlope]

23. What if you refuse to sign up for private insurance? Do you go to Jail?

How does this help people, to send them to jail?

Well, at least you get health care in prison I guess.

[Cleita]

30. I thought that's the plan I read today. Really not very good. n/t

[Juche]

31. One where the insurance companies can still bully the public

By finding ways to deny coverage for pre-existing conditions and drop coverage after a person gets sick and starts to use it.

Yeah, it will be a mess if that is what we get.

[eridani]

33. Not just worse than no public option

It will be far worse than what we have now.

[Blackhatjack]

37. Make No Mistake --Repub floated 'privately owned co-ops' ARE NOT PUBLIC OPTION...

Anything privately owned and run by private insurance companies will not be anything close to a public option, and it surely won't put any pressure on healthcare insurance companies to 'change' anything.

At best it would eventually just fade away....