Dear Arne Duncan, you misread my book. Sincerely, Herbert Kohl.

[madfloridian]

This article from The Progressive by Herbert Kohl is pointing out the issue that so many teachers are concerned about. In our area teachers were unable to talk about their opinions that differed from the prevailing ideology in education at any given time. But since I am retired I hear their pain.

Kohl is referring to Secretary of Education Arne Duncan's insistence on more and more testing of children to determine how to pay teachers.

Education Secretary Arne Duncan misread my book

I’m worried about the direction you’re taking education policy. In a recent interview with NEA Today, you said you read my book “36 Children” in high school and wrote an essay about it in college. “The book had a big impact on me,” you said, adding that it gave you “tremendous hope” to address the “challenges that teachers in tough communities face.”

But I’m afraid your emphasis on testing is only going to increase those challenges, especially in tough communities.

..."I wanted to let the students’ creativity and intelligence spring forth. And I wanted to provide interesting and complex curriculum that integrated the arts and sciences and utilized the students’ own culture and experiences to inspire learning. I discovered then, early in my teaching career, that offering ideas, experiences and activities that engage students is the best way to teach them. My career over the past 45 years has confirmed this.

Now the mantra is high expectations and high standards. But with all that zeal to produce measurable learning outcomes, we have lost sight of how best to motivate students to learn.

This statement sums it all up.

It is hard for me to understand how educators can claim that they are creating high standards when learning is reduced to the mechanical task of getting a correct answer on a manufactured test.

Amen, Mr. Kohl. Where are the parents who want their children to learn and love learning for learning's sake? Where are the parents who are so very tired of the robotic testing their children are being subjected to, and will be subjected to more under Arne's tenure?

Teachers can't really speak out much, as they often get marked down for it. I was once told that I did not respect authority when I questioned a ridiculous school policy. Teachers soon learn to keep their mouths shut.

So where are the parents?

It is the goal of Arne Duncan to increase testing, build more testing databases in order to give teachers merit pay based on those scores.

Part of the stimulus money, he told Sam Dillon of The New York Times, will be used so that states can develop data systems, which will enable them to tie individual student test scores to individual teachers, greasing the way for merit pay. Another part of the stimulus plan will support charters and entrepreneurs.

..."It turns out that Duncan, like the Bush administration, adores testing, charter schools, merit pay, and entrepreneurs. Part of the stimulus money, he told Sam Dillon of The New York Times, will be used so that states can develop data systems, which will enable them to tie individual student test scores to individual teachers, greasing the way for merit pay. Another part of the stimulus plan will support charters and entrepreneurs.

..."At the charter school, Duncan endorsed the core principles of the Bush education program. According to the account in the Times, Secretary Duncan said that "increasing the use of testing across the country should also be a spending priority."

Mr Kohl ended his post at The Progressive with an offer to send Mr. Duncan another copy of his book if he would read it again.

It is possible to maintain high standards for all children, to help students learn how to speak thoughtfully, think through problems and create imaginative representations of the world — as it is and as it could be — without forcing them through a regime of high-stakes testing. And yet your Education Department is insisting on more and more tests. This runs completely counter to the message of “36 Children,” which you said had such an influence on you.

I could send you another copy if you’d like. And I would welcome any opportunity to discuss these and other educational issues with you.

Sincerely, Herbert Kohl

Thank you much, Herbert Kohl.

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Awesome!

[Lorax7844]

2. K and R

[Luminous Animal]

3. Yes! Awesome.

You do great work here on DU, madfloridian. I am always happy to rec and contribute to your educations posts. Thanks!

[Luminous Animal]

4. Another kick and a comment...

We, as a society, are endorsing the radical conservative model of education. Privatization and dehumanizing mechanization.

[madfloridian]

5. Thank you and yes we are doing that.

"dehumanizing mechanization"

Good choice of words.

[SleeplessInAlabama]

6. To be frank, it is easier to dehumanize and mechanize education.

More children are being whisked through instead of being forced to go back, bite the bullet and take the 9th grade math class in 11th grade or fail.

The schools that need the most help are told to get their act together on a shoestring budget while those which are ostensibly "performing" are given money to go acquire land or refinish their football stadiums. Children spend hours upon hours upon hours upon hours being "taught to the test" instead of learning anything meaningful. The educational industrial complex is rapidly-growing with Scantron tests, #2 pencils and mandated drug screenings.

It's evolved into a massive standardized bureaucracy, and in some strange way, it is just easier.

[Luminous Animal]

7. Easier? How so?

If you factor in the stress on children and their families, how could this approach be easier? And, certainly, it is not easier on teachers. For all of the aforementioned, it is extremely difficult to box themselves into non-problem solving, uncreative entities. The only people who would have any kind of relief in such a system would be an elite few... administrators and those who make a profit off of standardized curricula and tests.

[lolly]

49. No, probably means easier for administrators

I assume that's what that reply meant. It's easier to "evaluate" a system by looking at a set of numbers than it is to analyze all the complex, qualitative factors involved.

[madfloridian]

8. I wonder how much high pressure testing parents will take?

The teachers can't speak out much.

[madfloridian]

9. Kohl on "scripted curriculum" and "teachers under surveillance"

"People who insult and denigrate teachers by forcing scripted curriculum on them are perfectly aware that they are forcing teachers to act against their conscience and students to close down their minds. What must be raised and answered for is the moral cost of creating joyless schools that resemble panopticons.

..."the irony is that even with the imposition of so-called “teacher-proof” curriculum, teachers are evaluated on the effectiveness of their student’s performance on tests relating to material they have no control over. No one evaluates Open Court or other such curriculum when students fail. It is the powerless “proofed” teachers who take the hit. This is morally reprehensible and yet the question of the values underlying this kind of teaching and evaluation is neglected when experts discuss educational issues.

Teachers under surveillance are also the agents of surveillance since they are expected to do continuous monitoring of their students’ progress. Continuous monitoring implies that learning takes place in measurable increments and that constant testing somehow contributes to enhanced performance. Whether it does or not, it reinforces educational practice which has no space for conversation, exploration, or the personalization of learning. The classroom becomes a humanly impoverished environment, a sanitized place where students’ personality, charm, and ingenuity have no place. Morally it contributes to depriving the young of opportunities for the development of their minds. Fortunately there are many subversive teachers who work in the service of their students and according to their own conscience rather than submit to the coercive education they are expected to provide.

Add high stakes testing and school-wide punishment for failure and you have even greater weapons of control and coercion. Student and parent anxiety is increased; teachers, being judged themselves by the results of the tests, have incentives to press and pressure their students to perform or even in some cases encourage them to be absent on testing days. Because of no tolerance and no exceptions policies, students who just can’t do well because of disabilities that are no fault of their own, or students who don’t speak English, are forced to take tests they know they will fail. Setting students up to fail is simply immoral, and yet there is surprisingly little outcry about this attack on these young people’s very being."

http://unlockingtheclassroom.blogspot.com/2009/03/herbert-kohl-on-surveillance-and.html

[Jakes Progress]

10. Shame on Arne.

Shame on our administration for letting this industry shill speak for our president.

Can we get him fired now? Please. Buddies from the old days are for having a beer with, not putting them in charge of our children.

[madfloridian]

11. It's going to harm the children.

I never see parents speaking out much either. The parents I remember from my classrooms would have been irate that more testing was on the horizon.

Maybe they are not organized? Teachers can't say much anymore. And Duncan is already threatening to withhold money from states that don't obey him.

So it's up to the parents.

[Jakes Progress]

14. Parents seem to have been as successful a target

of the neocon/corp-ed propaganda as many here on DU.

[madfloridian]

18. For years parents have been told that teachers are their enemy

The local media in Florida is outrageous in the way they push anything that makes teachers look bad.

It has gone on so long I fear it won't change.

If the parents accept the robotic testing, then it will continue.

[Mithreal]

12. Big K&R for Kohl. Everyone who cares about education

needs to know the War on Education is still being waged.

[madfloridian]

13. It really is a war on education.

Exactly.

[madfloridian]

15. Kohl on Duncan's "Race to the Top" agenda...

Question:"What’s your quick impression of Arne Duncan’s “Race to the Top” plans, which include what sounds like serious competition for dollars—and that means winners and losers? Is this political courage, or is it more federal encroachment on public education?

Answer: Arne Duncan, on the official Department of Education website said, “For states, school districts, nonprofits, unions, and businesses, Race to the Top is the equivalent of education reform’s moon shot.” I thoroughly agree with him. Remember we went to the moon, not to improve science or the quality of life in our country, but to face down the Soviet Union. We spent a lot of money doing it, got little return, and never went back. I believe Duncan’s analogy should be taken seriously. (heh heh)

One of the goals he articulates for the program is to be first on international standards of performance. Good luck – there are no agreed upon international standards. Another goal is to digitize education information and treat it like the digitize medical information the Administration proposes. But that simply entrenches specific high stakes tests into the system without delivering any substantial pedagogical change. It also locks the evaluation system into specific instruments of measurement, which are likely to turn out inadequate and consequently abandoned in the future, causing the need for expensive revisions to the system.

..."Finally, his proposal to “press” states to accept his agenda, in order to receive funding turns the education reform into a competition where states that apply, given that the agenda itself is vague and has little research behind it, can easily game the system."

http://learningmatters.tv/blog/op-ed/current-efforts-at-reform-will-produce-minimal-change-an-interview-with-herb-kohl/2460/

[madfloridian]

16. I hate to see unrecs start on education posts.

Not sure what they mean. It's a fair subject for discussion and criticism, because soon it will be too late to change what is happening. :shrug:

[Mithreal]

17. It is DLC'ers, other DINO's, and trolls on DU. nt

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[George II]

30. Just what do you mean by "rationalizing"? You seem to use that word in many of your one-line posts.

[George II]

32. .....

Censoring now are you? In more that four years that's the first post I've had removed. So much for being "progressive", eh?

Glad it was you that did it.

[Mithreal]

34. Censoring? You have to be kidding me. Stop this childishness. nt

[George II]

36. Just what do you mean by "rationalizing"?

[Mithreal]

42. See post #38 for an example. And well-done, ignoring most of the words I used. nt

[madfloridian]

37. I think the two of us should leave this guy alone. ...look what happened

The two of us got deleted.

He did not.

I am not risking my future here by pointing out that he does this on every thread of mine.

Thanks for standing up for me...but time for me to back off and let him do what he wants, say what he wants.

[George II]

38. All I "do" and "say" is in support of Democrats. That's why we're here.....

....I don't do "this" on every thread of yours, but if you are going to criticize Democrats through vague, strained, decades old connections then I'm going to point that out.

You may seem to think it's on every thread, but maybe that's because lately almost every "discussion" you start has to do with what's BAD about Democrats, and I do it with civility which is why MY post is still there and the others are gone.

I post in plenty of other discussions as well, most of those are positive toward Democras and I "recommend" them as much as I can. Too bad you can't see that.

[GreenArrow]

40. sometimes what both Republicans and Democrats

want is bad for the country. Education is one of those times. Duncan's a dipshit with no clue about educating, and he has no business dictating education policy. The fact that he's a Democrat has little to no bearing. Sadly, he's in a position where he can wreak real mischief.

[George II]

44. I agree, but......

.....what I resent are "democrats" who make a career out of criticizing Democrats, particularly by drawing strained, convoluted, or false connections between some of Obama's administration or other Democrats and objectionable issues.

I criticize Democrats frequently, but not ALL of the time and I do find quite a few good things to say about Democrats, unlike some here.

One of the most aggegious examples recently was "blaming" Obama's Secretary of Education (Arne Duncan) for mayoral control of schools in NYC, even though Duncan has been in the cabinet for a mere 8 months and Bloomberg has had control of NYC schools for more than SEVEN YEARS! But claiming that provided the writer yet another opportunity to bash the Obama administration even though the connection between Duncan and Bloomberg's control of NYC schools is false!

That is just an example, and there have been countless others. This is what I object to.

[Mithreal]

51. Stop this. DU rules:

"Do not post personal attacks or engage in name-calling against other individual members of this discussion board. Even very mild personal attacks are forbidden."

"Do not "stalk" another member from one discussion thread to another. Do not follow someone into another thread to try to continue a disagreement you had elsewhere."

"Do not talk negatively about an individual in a thread where they are not participating."

"But you are not permitted to make broad statements about another person's behavior in general, and you are not permitted to post repeated reminders about another person's mistakes."

"You cannot attack someone because they attacked you first, or because that person "deserved it,""

Please do not get both of us thrown off this board, because I am not backing down from rude comments.

[George II]

52. Where I come from that is called.....

....CHUTZPAH!

On the one hand you deride me in a post, then ask me to be respectful because you have a family crisis. I was going to do so (no reponse to that post). Then a half hour later you post this????

Now listen. First, my posts are directed to someone other than you, you are the one who decided to start "stalking" and following me from thread to thread. We discussed this last week, and you indicated that you understood. Now, THIS post isn't even directed toward the OP, but to yet another poster. But you still have to chime in with your derrogatory comments.

So, please SPECIFICALLY state which of those rules I have violated an how:

I have never engaged in any name-calling of other members - NEVER!
I have never "stalked" another member from one discussion to another. On the other hand.........
I have not spoken negatively about an individual in a thread where they are not participating.
I have not attacked someone because they attacked me first, I have just commented on the ideas contained in their posts.

If you can come up with one specific instance in which I've done any of these, I would appreciate seeing it. But I suspect that will be a long wait.

I understand the rules very well and I am very careful about what I post and how I post it.

If you don't like what I say or where I post, IGNORE my posts and don't respond to them!!!

[Mithreal]

55. This is the first opportunity I have had to respond. No. nt

[Mithreal]

41. No, this site is for progressives first, not party first.

I only take offense to stupid offensive substance-less comments. Ever seen me object to anything positive you have written?

Which is it? It seems you are unable/unwilling(?) to understand that Democrats can do wrong or if they do, it must be spun or never mentioned.

The only reason I even try and have a discussion with you is hope for our party. I do not doubt you are as you say a "good Democrat" just that you seem to have some phobia of criticism of our party.

[George II]

46. I blame Democrats when blame is due...quite often in fact...

...but I don't manufacture such blame, which we see here often.

And no, I have never seen you object to anything positive that I've written, just as you have never seen me object to anything positive that others have written. Its just in the case of some DUers, those "positive" posts are few and far between.

Unfortunately, this will be written off as that as yet undefined "rationalization" that is claimed I do.

[Mithreal]

47. "Unfortunately" - You are quite the martyr for your cause

It is not your responsibility to keep a scorecard of people's perceived positive and negative posts. Perhaps you should let people know when they have created enough positive posts that will allow a "negative" one to be made?

I gave you an example of your rationalizations and now again you supply more. They are weak and I have stated why.

Again I say, grow up. We are trying to make a more perfect union and discussing things that may be wrong with our party is a valuable exercise. When I have seen you disagree, you have brought zero substance and only personal attack in short phrase snipes. Stop attacking people I respect and who make a valuable contribution. Will please, work?

[George II]

53. OK, let me address you once and for all, point by point!

- I don't keep a scorecard of positive and negative posts - I commend positive posts and point out negative ones where appropriate. No tallies either way whatsoever.
- You "gave examples" of what you perceive as rationalizations, but never stated WHY you perceive them as rationalizations. And you have NEVER "stated why".
- I have ALWAYS brought substance to my positions, and have NEVER engaged in personal attack. Easy for you to say, but so far impossible to demonstrate. I welcome an example or two.

Be more specific and less evasive and yes, "please" might work, but it's not one-sided, and you're not the arbitrator!

[Mithreal]

56. Your argument goes on and on and says nothing. nt

[Mithreal]

43. And my post seems to have been deleted because I either broke

a DU rule or came very close. And you are being dishonest, your posts have been deleted a number of times even at least once in this thread.

[George II]

45. Other than this post in question.......

...the only other posts that have been deleted of mine (can't remember the last time, by the way), were deleted because an entire subthread was deleted, not because of my post iteself.

"A number of times"? Example?

[Mithreal]

50. I have been a silent observer on a number of threads.

I have seen your comments deleted before. Be responsible for your own posts, don't ask others to tell you when they have seen your same stupid phrases over and over again disappear in certain op threads. You are persistent, I admire that. Stop adding more negativity to the world. I realize I have done the same, but it is in my nature to stand up for others especially when I see they are being disrespected or outright rudely attacked.

I have a family member dying now, I am growing weary of your behavior. Please leave the op writer alone. I understand what you think even more than you can suspect or believe. Sometimes I have recognized a tone in a post that might have sounded negative but I have always seen the op working for truth and justice. Can you please understand that I admire this person? Please? And you are senselessly and often attacking? Please?

In kindness and with respect I ask you to stop.

[George II]

54. ...

I appreciate your family crisis. With that in mind, why did you post yet another "attack" on my positive DEMOCRATIC ideals and position after this one? Any empathy I may have had was diminished by that subsequent post. And this post? Highly dubious, to be nice.

I wish you the best for your family.

[Mithreal]

57. I tried to respond to each subthread. I may not have done it skillfully.

Some of what I wrote last time that may have invoked empathy was simply a weak moment and a lot of frustration. Thank you for your sympathy.

I was frustrated for a variety of reasons and probably just mentioned the family thing because I sometimes post straight from the heart. It is alright, you of course should ignore me if that is what you think best. I am after all doing the same exact thing with maybe a slightly different intention.

FWIW, someone can post on a subthread, read further comments and get angry again and restart the argument from another angle. All the good intentions are still there even if the timing is off.

If I might be given a little slack to talk about a past thread, then whatever understanding I had of your position was not agreement or acceptance in all aspects. Your counter questions require me to outlay too much time to explain when my original questions were simple yet went unanswered while the argument became more heated and I, and probably you, have better things to do than continue old arguments when we both know we aren't going to change the other today. It also doesn't help that elements in this discussion were deleted and they contained context.

Let's "bury the hatchet"? Can we agree to not continue an old argument and let this one die? If you do post a phrase like the following, "Yet another anti-Democratic post." on an OP that criticizes Democrats and is fact based, I may counter with something like, "The op puts truth, justice, and progressive policy first and sometimes that is at odds with the party leaders or entrenched party interests," or something similar, but this will not be intended to restart a feud, just a statement of position. Is this acceptable? You may ignore me or state your position whatever it is. Of course, you could just do it from the start but up to you. You are right, I am not your arbitrator and we should not carry on a fight across threads, it is wrong even if it wasn't prohibited. There is nothing personal about my disagreement and I apologize for actual or perceived personal attacks.

Plus even in one thread, writing comments across sub-threads causes me some difficulty in keeping the disagreement to that specific sub-thread. I think part of it is lack of skill on my part but I am unsure.

I will defend any voice that is attacked for fact based criticism of Democrats especially when that criticism is intended to strengthen the progressive movement.
Either way, I am done arguing this thread and ending this disagreement from my end.

[LuckyLib]

19. Where are the parents? Gone to private schools where that shit is minimized.

"Where are the parents who want their children to learn and love learning for learning's sake? Where are the parents who are so very tired of the robotic testing their children are being subjected to, and will be subjected to more under Arne's tenure?"

I'm a former teacher, teacher educator, strong proponent of public education -- but like many of us, I couldn't stand the energy expended in the wrong directions in my community -- school board bullshit, testing up the wazoo, and the continual failure to listen to teachers. Put my child in a school community where learning and relationships come first, where teachers are respected and supported financially and otherwise, and where assessment is part of learning -- it doesn't drive the boat.

[madfloridian]

20. That's a problem. Abandon public schools rather than fight.

I don't blame you for doing it, but it is a problem.

It was not hard for them to wear good teachers down. There was no one standing up for them.

Unfortunately in our community, the charter school community is run by the religious right...paid for with my tax money. I read the board members' names, and I just wept. Most of them are Southern Baptists, fundamentalists, who believe abortion is murder and evolution is evil to teach.

I don't blame you, and as I have said many times here at DU....public schools won't be fought for by many. They really don't understand.

[LuckyLib]

29. I fight each and every day. In my work I tell it like it is, and my

message is not popular. I was angry about horseshit schooling as a kid, as a teacher, and I still am. I simply decided that while I would fight the good fight, my child, learning in a healthy environment, would provide me the window and the hope that things could be better. It makes me fight even harder for how public schools could be.

[madfloridian]

21. Won't fight for health care, but will put up a fight against public school teachers...

and their unions.

The administration wavers on health care reform, but they speak with one voice on testing our kids until they are exhausted.

Teachers' orgs need the money so much that they are caving in to Arne Duncan and his militant style.

Teachers can't fight back because they will get marked down in evaluations.

Parents don't know how to fight back, and it is easier to flee.

The new world of testing and charter schools

While many educators hoped that President Obama and Education Secretary Arne Duncan would temper the federal role in education, their new Race to the Top initiative uses federal dollars to force the hand of states. The $4.3 billion in grants — part of the economic stimulus package — come with strings. The White House wants states to increase charter schools and link student test scores to teacher evaluations.

According to the pending US DOE rules, states seeking the grants cannot have “‘barriers to linking data on student achievement or student growth to teachers and principals for the purpose of teacher and principal evaluation.”

Gerald Bracey, a former director of research, evaluation and testing for the Virginia Department of Education and an Obama supporter, wrote on his blog: “States are rolling over and playing dead on this issue because a) they are desperate for money and b) it is unlikely that people like Bloomberg or the Governator — or Duncan — have a clue about the abuse they are permitting.

“Duncan’s enthusiastic championing of a “reform” that has been shown not to work very well — charter schools — can only be taken as an instrument for union busting. If the NEA and AFT won’t stand up to this abuse of testing, they deserve to be busted.”

[DailyGrind51]

22. Kohl was the inspiration for many new teachers.

Unfortunately, policy-makers have attempted to apply the "management by objectives" approach, designed by Peter Drucker for profit-making businesses, to areas such as education and health care delivery, having very different, more qualitative, determinants of success.

[madfloridian]

23. They have taken the heart from teaching...

and turned it into script reading and rote test taking.

Open Court was adopted just as I retired, and I remember looking at the manuals and thinking how happy I was leaving.

[DailyGrind51]

31. I got into teaching later in life and can't wait to retire!

[emsimon33]

24. Man-o-man do I love you!!!!! You made my day.

I have been bitching about the selection of Arne since it happened (it was NOT the change I worked so hard for)..Teachers are the most powerless individuals in the educational process. They are over-worked, highly stressed, and underpaid. All three were bearable as long as teachers could actually touch the lives of children and encourage their intellectual growth and learning. Then came NCLB and next came NCLB with funding and the view that teachers and teacher unions were what's wrong with education.

I am so glad that Herb Kohl called Arne out. Our children are not goods to be packaged like so many look-a-like cookies in a box. Nor should education be a for-profit enterprise run like a business rather than an entity that serves the common good.

Those nut-balls at the HC town hall meeting, unable to connect even the most obvious dots, are what an NCLB education will serve up to the nation. Texas has had an NCLB-type testing-testing-testing focus long before there was a national NCLB and look at that population (sorry if I have offended any Texans here--but, seriously, you know what I mean). National standards will only further dilute the educational pablum but sure will make it easier for the for-profit educational books and materials people.

Arne was a terrible choice. National Standards and more NCLB--where we leave everyone behind--will only further impair the country's ability to compete in the 21st century. Once we get through this health care reform mess, we need to go after Arne and his ilk, end funding for private and religious schools, force charter schools to pay at the same scale as the public school for professional personnel and staff, and end the idea of national standards. Enough of a terrible idea is enough! Thank you Madfloridian for keeping us informed and thank you, Herb Kohl, for calling these incompetents out for what they are: Idiots who have no understanding of education or appreciation for what the US education could be if fully funded and refocused away from testing.

[madfloridian]

25. You are most welcome. Yes, teachers are helpless in this case.

I wish more people cared and understood. They can't believe Obama picked someone who will harm public education so much....thus they get upset with me for posting about it.

[emsimon33]

26. Unless you have been a public school teacher, you just don't understand.

It isn't enough to have merely sat in a classroom. It's a walk-in-the-shoes thing.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

35. Reminds me of one of my favorite scenes from Woody Allen's "Annie Hall"

Woody (Alvy) and Diane Keaton (Annie) are standing in line:

MAN IN LINE

It's the influence of television. Yeah, now Marshall McLuhan deals
with it in terms of it being a hot medium ... as opposed to a ...

Alvy steps forward, waving his hands in frustration, and stands facing the camera.

ALVY
(Sighing and addressing the audience)
What do you do when you get stuck in a movie line with
a guy like this behind you? I mean, it's just maddening!

The man in line moves toward Alvy. Both address the audience now.

MAN IN LINE
Wait a minute, why can't I give my opinion? It's a free country!

ALVY
Do you hafta give it so loud? Aren't you ashamed to pontificate like that? And
the funny part of it is, you don't know anything about Marshall McLuhan's work!

MAN IN LINE
Really? I happen to teach a class at Columbia called "TV Media and Culture"!
So I think that my insights into Mr. McLuhan have a great deal of validity.

ALVY
Well, that's funny, because I happen to have Mr. McLuhan right here.

Alvy gestures to the camera which follows him and the man in line to the back of the crowded lobby.
He moves over to a large stand-up movie poster and pulls Marshall McLuhan from behind the poster.

ALVY
(To McLuhan)
Tell him.

MCLUHAN
(To the man in line)
I heard what you were saying. You know nothing of my work. You mean my whole
fallacy is wrong. How you ever got to teach a course in anything is totally amazing.

ALVY
(To the camera)
Boy, if life were only like this!

http://tinyurl.com/ykutkw

Boy, if life were only like this!

[BrklynLiberal]

39. Excellent!

[Dinger]

48. Thank You Herbert Kohl AND madfloridian : )

:) :patriot: