tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:14 PM
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Poll question: Do you think the War in Afghanistan is winnable? |
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Do you think the War in Afghanistan is winnable?
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virgogal
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:16 PM
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1. Couldn't answer because I have no idea what we are doing there. |
tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:18 PM
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2. I'm with you. But, our generals still believe they can 'win' something |
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there. And, they seem to have convinced the White House and Congress of the same.
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tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:21 PM
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3. Two voted yes. I guess McChrystal and Gates are DUers. |
scarletwoman
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:22 PM
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4. I voted "No", even though I have no fucking idea what "winning" is supposed to look like. |
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All I know is that it's absurd for us to be there. Afghanistan is an artificial construct imposed by the European powers of the day. It never has been, nor will likely ever be, a nation-state on the European model.
It seems to me that we're there to try to prop up an illusion. What a waste!
sw
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Caliman73
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:45 PM
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14. That is precisely why I voted "no". |
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No one has a feasible idea of what "winning" looks like. We have once again stepped into a cultural and political mess by going in gunning with our military when we should have just stayed after the proposed objective of capturing Bin Laden and getting out. We have no chance of winning because we are not fighting a war. We are trying to nation build in a place that needs help, but cannot be fixed militarily.
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elocs
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:24 PM
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5. You need to define "winnable". That is important to the question. n/t |
tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:33 PM
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9. I don't. The Pentagon and the White House do. |
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If they are going to sell us this winnable line, they need to define it.
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elocs
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:38 PM
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10. Yes, because this is your thread, your question. |
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So what do YOU believe is "winnable". That is not an unreasonable question, but you might have to do some thinking about it.
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tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:41 PM
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12. There is no winning, IMO. |
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There is an occupation. We can leave, and that is the closest thing to a win we have.
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madokie
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:25 PM
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what would winning look like?
We need to get our troops out of there as soon as possible is what I think.
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orpupilofnature57
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:26 PM
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7. OFV Define winning? Winning what ? for who? |
TheCowsCameHome
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:32 PM
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8. How would anyone know when they won? |
spanone
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:40 PM
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11. funeral directors are the only winners |
Sebastian Doyle
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #11 |
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Somebody has to make the flags for all those coffins. And the headstones for the graves. And what about the florists?
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mike_c
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:42 PM
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Edited on Mon Aug-31-09 07:19 PM by mike_c
I voted no, not so much because I don't think ANY objectives are achievable in Afghanistan, as because I don't think our objectives have ever been honestly articulated. Remove the Taliban from power and install a puppet government? Done. Utterly destroy the Taliban and make the puppet government loved, respected, and venerated by Afghanis? Not possible to impose from outside, or at least not possible to maintain. Something in the middle? What?
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bigwillq
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:45 PM
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15. We need to get out, NOW! |
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Waste of time, money, energy and lives. The whole Middle East is.
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Sebastian Doyle
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:47 PM
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Or the Brits, or Alexander the Great. Among others through all of history who conquered many others, but failed miserably in Afghanistan.
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Arugula Latte
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:48 PM
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17. Only if we clone Greg Mortenson and fight by building schools and clinics. |
Swamp Rat
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Mon Aug-31-09 06:55 PM
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19. "Win" what? A tomb in the 'Graveyard of Empires'? |
Laelth
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:21 PM
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20. The Russians warned us, and they were right. |
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We are not too stupid to learn from history. The people who started this war wanted it to last forever. War is good for corporate profits.
:dem:
-Laelth
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LAGC
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:23 PM
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21. Arm the anti-Taliban forces and PULL OUT. |
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Edited on Mon Aug-31-09 07:25 PM by LAGC
Let them settle it themselves. Prolonged top-down occupations only cause resentment among the populace towards the goals of the occupier.
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paulk
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:28 PM
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22. the obvious question is what does "winnable" mean? |
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I have supported our continued presence there, if only to rebuild a country we helped to destroy - but I'm perhaps rethinking this, or at least questioning what exactly we hope to achieve there.
Because I haven't really gotten an explanation from the Obama administration. I don't think it's wise to pour men and material into such a situation without clearly defined goals.
So I guess I've gone from supporting to being on the fence.
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qazplm
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:35 PM
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23. I think we needed to go over there |
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I supported it, but the problem is that instead of doing it right, we got distracted by the huge mess that is Iraq.
So Afghanistan has languished as a secondary consideration for years and years.
And now it's become more or less unresolvable. There was a window of opportunity IMO but it has closed, and now we are just doing what folks who've gone into Afghanistan like Britain and Soviet Russia have done, spinning our wheels until we realize it is time to close up shop.
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Orsino
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:44 PM
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24. It's not meant to be won. |
Canuckistanian
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Mon Aug-31-09 07:57 PM
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25. Based on this latest election, no |
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The Afghan people are themselves are pissed off at the whole situation.
They're pissed at the heavy-handed tactics of the Taliban. They're pissed at Karzai. And they're pissed at Abdullah Abdullah, Karzai's opponent, who doesn't have a very good reputation for reform when he was in power before.
Mostly, they're angry at the massive government corruption AND the meddling of coalition forces in a land that TRIES to be isolationist, but keeps getting invaded by foreign armies.
Until THE PEOPLE of Afghanistan find a leader or cause that will lead them OUT of bloodshed and misery, nothing can be accomplished.
Until then, the war goes on.
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Motown_Johnny
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Mon Aug-31-09 08:30 PM
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26. define winnable please |
scheming daemons
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Mon Aug-31-09 08:31 PM
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27. Depends on what is considered a "win" |
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If, like me, you consider a win to be the complete dismantling of the Taliban with al Qaida disbanded... then I say yes.
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tekisui
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Mon Aug-31-09 08:33 PM
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28. I don't think even that is possible. |
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Karzai is sitting where he is, about to claim re-election because of his deals with the Taliban. The Taliban in Afghanistan and Pakistan is like the healthcare industry here. They have the governments by the balls. Al Qaeda is already gone.
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Spider Jerusalem
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Mon Aug-31-09 08:36 PM
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Practically, the answer is 'no'; Alexander the Great couldn't win a war in Afghanistan. The British couldn't win a war in Afghanistan. The Soviets couldn't win a war in Afghanistan. Santayana was right ('those who cannot learn from history...').
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