Why can't the military clear an area where food and water can be dropped?

[happy_liberal]

I am sure I will be attacked by the 'why don't you do it yourself' people but I just don't get it.

They cannot drop supplies because of rioting? They wouldn't be so desperate if we had dropped supplies earlier. The only excuse for not dropping supplies I have read are 'rioting' and 'they might hit someone'.

Why can't the military clear an area for dropping supplies then distribute the supplies?

[mbperrin]

1. Uh-oh, there ya go thinkin' again!

Just toe the line, don't need actual thinkers in today's Murika, buddy!




:)

[Pirate Smile]

2. The military has been dropping aid in clear places and then letting people go to it that way.

That is what MSNBC reported this morning. It sounds like they dropped A LOT of aid that way today. However, as we know, if there isn't a camera crew with them while they do it then it is like it never happened.

[happy_liberal]

14. excellent

Then why are people on this thread saying it can't be done?

Why are they saying people are going on four days with no food or water?

[piedmont]

3. Ok, how exactly would you do it? What would you do to the desparate people who ignore orders?

Let's say you've got 50 armed troops with you, and a bunch more to handle the packages. You tell the (thousands of) Haitians to stand clear. What happens if they don't? Would you shoot? Would you drive away? What next?

[happy_liberal]

18. I don't know-taze them?

I don't think the people would be so out of control that they would get shot trying to get supplies. Give the people some credit...

[rcrush]

26. Maybe we can just send the shock troops in.

VISCOUS BEATINGS IF YOU DONT GET OUT OF THE WAY

[piedmont]

31. "I don't think" "I would assume" "I would guess"

"I don't think the people would be so out of control that they would get shot trying to get supplies. Give the people some credit..."

Give the professionals some credit for having experienced these situations in the past and having learned from them. Going in and hoping that the worst case scenario doesn't happen because you don't have any plan for it is EXACTLY how to make a bad situation worse.

[rcrush]

38. Hey when all else fails BREAK OUT THE TAZER BRO

[msongs]

4. could be slightly ever so possible that the "military" is already doing that and has been for 2 days

[happy_liberal]

16. Great news!

I don't understand why people are saying it can't be done?

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. Becuse they are NOT doing air drops

they are doing vertical lift net helo operations.

[TheWraith]

45. And they're doing that because otherwise...

THEY WOULD HIT SOMEBODY. :eyes: It's not like you can just air-drop crates of food on a random city street when there's three million people all outdoors because none of the buildings are safe to be in. It has nothing to do with what the people are doing, it's because they're THERE and IN THE WAY. So we've got to do it the slower and more precise route.

[blondeatlast]

5. Why don't you read one of the dozens of threads that address this issue, then,

if you are STILL confused, get back to us?

[lunatica]

6. Your question doesn't make any sense

Port Au Prince is the size of Chicago and has 3 million people in it. The city is a giant pile of rubble. Do you remember how long it took to clear the rubble of the twin towers? Some sources say over a year. And that was in a very small area.

[happy_liberal]

17. they don't have to clear all the rubble

They just need to find one open spot and drop the supplies. Then the military distributes the stuff so there is no fear of rioting.

[lunatica]

23. That's what they've done with the airport

But imagine people in the Eastern part of Chicago having to wait for dropped supplies in the western part, while the military has to clear streets and rebuild bridges to get to them.

Should they drop dynamite and send it dump trucks? I bet there aren't too many of those on the island.

[spanone]

7. 'why don't you do it yourself'

[rrneck]

8. Here's why

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

[seabeyond]

9. not knowing anything myself, why would you assume if there was a way for people to help

they would chose not to help while they all rush to haiti to help?

that is what doesnt make sense to me, from many posters.

you started a thread, with a question. yet you have yet to respond to any of the posts

what doesnt make sense to me, is a poster that is "concerned" and asks for information, yet doesnt respond on their thread

[happy_liberal]

15. I don't know why they wouldn't help if they could

but it happened in New Orleans. They were sending away groups of boats coming to help, water trucks etc.

[nadinbrzezinski]

19. This is not what happeing here

what is happening here is that they do not have the INFRASTRUCTURE on the ground to handle all the materiel that is actually comming in.

They are getting creative

Hell for crying out loud the International Red Cross loaded a MASH unit on to an American C-130 from Panama. Guess what, they had to TRUCK IT IN through the Dominican Republic, which takes a LONG TIME, because they could not physically handle it at the airport. They did not have the space.

Just to load, to give you an idea, took 12 hours, if they rushed it.

Unload, probably another 12, best case.

Load it on trucks, another 12-14

The drive, 18 hours

See the physical math here?

And the DR had to also CLEAR THEM to do this, which they did, but there is that wicket to cross too.

[happy_liberal]

22. helicopter airdrops?

I think if they cleared an area and delivered supplies close to the people, the people could go to that area and line up?

[lunatica]

27. You're repeating yourself. Have you read any of the anwers?

You're trying to come across as not too bright aren't you?

[happy_liberal]

32. some say they are dropping supplies, some say they cannot

I don't understand what is going on, but you have done nothing to explain.

You said my op didn't make sense and it was pretty straight forward... and you can only offer an attack instead of a real explanation so it is obvious that you are the one who is "not too bright".

[nadinbrzezinski]

36. They are doing LIMITED HELO VERTICAL NET transports

where they can secure the LZ.. a wold of a difference from an air drop.

[lunatica]

40. LOL!

Read some of the dozens of threads already talking about this. Your question still doesn't make sense. The answers have been coming fast and furious for days and you post like you just started the topic.

[nadinbrzezinski]

30. How many disasters have you physically worked at?

Line up? You kid me. You think people just line up and wait?

IN a MAJOR disaster like this you have a good chance of riots... over food and water.

They have not happened as much as they could happen, but they already have.

Oh and this is not because this is Haiti. This is just the way it is...

[seabeyond]

25. the world is not bush. and the u.s. is no longer under bush. we dont have an agenda

but to help. nor does the world

[Tim01]

10. The military has not been given permission to defend themselves.

They have been told to retreat away from violence. They won't be able to do anything until they can defend themselves from these desperate half-crazy people.
If the military was given permission to shoot whoever they need to, order could be restored pretty quickly.The civilians are just dangerous out of desperation at this point.In addition to the actual badguys who are no doubt capitalizing on this situation.

[nadinbrzezinski]

39. Actuall no disaster even has those rules of engagement

but I am sure you know that.

Now once the RCMP gets in, you know COPS... now that the 100 from Mexico are there, perhaps they can start doing some of the things COPS do in these situations.

[sandnsea]

11. There are 3 million people in Port Au Prince

There are 9 million people in Haiti.

Still think you've got a good idea there?

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. They already are in limited areas

per MSNBC...

[blondeatlast]

13. Suppose they do drop rations--and thousands of vitims were crushed by the drop

or stampede that would inevitably result.

Would you feel any better?

[happy_liberal]

24. as I stated, they clear an area so people are not crushed

this isn't rocket science here...it's not like it is a new concept or new technology...I don't get why they aren't doing it?

[lunatica]

29. Any suggestions on how to clear the area?

[piedmont]

34. The OP would have them Tazed. With tear gas and rubber bullets to follow, probably. nt

[happy_liberal]

49. it seemed pretty outrageous that you thought people needed to be shot

so I was suggesting a better method if necessary.

Silly me, I thought thousands of people dying was worse than the risk of a few who might riot.

[Retired AF Dem]

21. A fuel air bomb would clear out a nice area

:eyes:

[rcrush]

28. No no no we must taze them!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7480673&mesg_id=7480894

[nadinbrzezinski]

33. On a not so jocking mood, don't be too surprised if some old

Napalm is used to burn some dead bodies.... in the days to come. Oh that will go well round these parts. I hope that is one of those things NOT shown in US TV

[MadHound]

35. Let's see, how would they clear those tens of thousands of tons of rubble without heavy equipment?

How would they bring in that heavy equipment without deep water ports?

Look as much as we all hate this, it takes time for these efforts to get underway, especially in an area that had little and now has nothing.

There is no magic bullet on this one, just hard work, effort and money, which we are providing great quantities of all three.

[nadinbrzezinski]

37. Where are you hiding the pixie dust?

:-)

I know at this point I just have to laugh... my other choice is to cry for my fellow DU'ers...

[happy_liberal]

48. I guess the military found some pixie dust?

:rofl:

[lonestarnot]

41. So where's the Cee Bee's and their heavy loaders, cranes and ammo?

[piedmont]

42. On a ship steaming for Haiti at top speed I suppose. Or flying in what they can in a C-130. nt

[MadHound]

43. With the 22nd Marine Exp Force

Sailed out yesterday after loading up tens of thousands of tons worth of supplies. They will arrive Tuesday.

[happy_liberal]

44. hmmmm

Finally: Helicopter drops
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7482042

MNSNBC showing MREs short hauled and dropped
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7481727

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

46. Using what? The Force?

Invisible elves?

Oh right, you need heavy equipment to do that. Which is where exactly? It gets there how, exactly with most of the roads blocked? Maybe they could use some daisy cutters. That's what they were initially designed for anyway.

[Statistical]

47. Stupid. Uncontrolled and unsecured release of resources would be worse.

The strong gang members with guns will take the resources. Far more than they "need". Those with money will be forced to buy from them and those without will die.

End result same outcome you just made a bunch of criminals richer and more powerful.