Which candidate's voice needs to be heard more by the nation and world??

[TahitiNut]

Let's just FORGET, for a moment, who might make a 'better' President or who might make a 'better' candidate and have the best chance of winning an election that's still 18 montsh in the future. Let's see who we think is saying what needs to be heard MORE ... who's saying things that are not being heard enough. Some candidates already have access to a microphone - as incumbents - some more than others

Isn't that reason enough to contribute to a campaign at this point?

After all, that's what money buys - the microphone. The stage. The attention.

[Bicoastal]

1. I can't help but feel this is biased in favor of everyone but Clinton, Obama, and Edwards...

Oh well...at least one poll is...

[TahitiNut]

8. I hope not. I hope it's mostly focused on WHAT is being said: the Issues.

After all, if someone is saying things that other candidates are already sayinng, then a reasonable person wouldn't think it needs to be heard more, right?

I'm trying to appeal to the 'pragmatists' (the "ends justify the means" folks) and that part of all of our thinking (since we all have some of that in us) ... and get a bit more immediate. What do we want to have heard NOW? (Eighteen months is a long, long time.)


FWIW: I'm not dedicated to any specific candidate and rarely make up my mind until I vote. So, I'm really not being a stalking horse for any candidate. I've made no secret that I agree most with Kucinich, but I'm diligently undecided.

[loudsue]

2. Thanks for posting this poll, TahitiNut!

I'm so glad to see that I'm not alone on the Kucinich/Gravel train!

Fuck the media talking-heads and the well-coiffed "top tier" candidates, and all their stinkin' blood money! I want a REAL voice out there that shows the values that Democrats really stand for. Kucinich & Gravel are the two that share my values.

:kick::kick::kick:

[magellan]

3. Everything loudsue said

...and then some! True conservatives aren't the only ones who've had their party hijacked by corporate shills; true progressives are in the same boat.

[nannah]

4. i agree. the only one's who acknowledged reality

for the regular folk who make up the larger portion of the population. and for all the talk of solving health care, only kucinich and possibly edwards have a plan that makes sense. i say maybe edwards because apparently his plan is to open federal single payer health care as an option, so people can select for themselves. of course the devil is in the details, which dennis kucinich has already spelled out.

the insistence by all the others, on both health care and iraq, was to tweak the status quo with the typical, vague, and soon overlooked language about standards and benchmarks.

[TahitiNut]

5. Sure thing, sue. It usually seems that it's a matter of asking the right questions.

It has perplexed me for years that the vast majority of DUers hold political opinions closest to those of Kucinich ... yet repeatedly engage in the self-defeatism of squelching his voice. For many, the same goes for Mike Gravel - many of us liked WHAT he said. (It doesn't yet matter whether he can be elected.) I've never really understood why people are so codependent that they cooperate with those who'd deprive them of a platform for the candidate voicing their own perspectives -- because of some prognosticated 'unelectability.' So what? Why should I care right NOW that the voice I agree with the most might not be elected - and then cooperate with the silencing of that voice? To me, there's a huge value in having the perspectives with which I agree getting the audiences they deserve.

How many times have I heard DUers say "Biden's on the Sunday Morning News shows again. What else is new?" After all, hasn't he had plenty of access to the microphone?

It just seems to me that predicting defeatism is throwing the dirty baby out with the still-clean bathwater. I really dislike "foregone conclusions" ... they're too often merely someone's agenda in manipulating majority opinions which, if left un-spun, might take a very different direction. It's nothing but propaganda - 'bandwagon' approach - and that's why it's so effective.

[kimmerspixelated]

17. With ya!!!!

[Blue_In_AK]

6. Gravel and Kucinich

about equally. It pleases me that Gravel still has the "fire" that he displayed back in the Vietnam days. I was impressed with him as a senator even before I moved to Alaska in 1975. His passion is so refreshing.

[loudsue]

10. I wasn't even aware of Gravel until the debate, I'm ashamed to say.

And I protested the draft & the war in the late 60's early 70's, and lost a great many of my classmates in that war!!!

I can't believe I knew so little about our specific elected congresscritters back then! I'm so thankful for the internet now.

Until the debate started, the name "Gravel" had not even entered my vocabulary. What a delightful surprise it has been.

I'd love to see a grass-roots HUGE surge of money for the campaigns of those two (Gravel & Kucinich), so the talking-heads and the cookie-cutter candidates can see that there is a GREAT deal of support for the positions of these two courageous & prophetic statesmen.

:kick::kick::kick:

[MadBadger]

7. Joe Biden has a lot to say on Foreign policy, if anybody would listen.

[jillan]

12. Agreed!

Hopefully a few more are after the debates.

[valerief]

9. I like your poll. nt

[TahitiNut]

11. Thanks!

:hi:

[bobbolink]

13. I know the "correct" answer is either Gravel or Kucinich, but...

since POVERTY is still not a "sexy" or "popular" issue, I will continue to say that Edwards needs to be heard more.

He's doing quite well on his own, but it would be nice if he had half the megaphone given to Hill and Obama.

Some of us have lives that depend on it.

Again, that's not "sexy", but there it is.

There are more of us in the US dying from poverty, than there are dying in the war.

[TahitiNut]

14. (I don't know about 'correct.') Is that how Edwards is actually using his voice?

I'm really most interested in how each individual DUer 'hears' the candidates on the issues - and I'm literally trying to remove the 'strategic' political game-playing perceptions from the poll. As I said, it seems that the most direct and immediately meaningful impact of support (financial or other) we might choose to give a candidate at this point in the campaign is about their voices on the issues we care most about - and what's not being said enough.

After all, we might be inclined to support Obama because of WHO he is (which is the focus of his rhetoric) but not hear very much being said about the issues. Thus, while I might be of the opinion that the intangibles of charisma and character warrant eventually voting for him (or someone), the more immediate consideration might be what they're saying THIS week and THIS month. That's not to say that's the way I'd eventually vote - but it is the way we do sometimes vote.

Put another way ... thinking of the campaign as a Wurlitzer - what selection on the juke-box do we pick when we put our money in today, irrespective of who we might think deserves a Grammy next year? What tune is right for right now, needing to be heard today?

[bobbolink]

16. Given that my life has been HELL because of homelessness, etc,

and the lack of support or concern from "LIBERALS" (and the ugliness of Clinton on this issue!), it is the only issue I can be concerned with now.

As I said, it's not "SEXY" like war or impeachment, but many of us have lives that depend on poverty being strongly addressed.

What did it for me was when Edwards went to campaign for Lamont, and apparently had very strongly made a "deal" with him, because the first thing Lamont did when he came out onstage was to apologize for not having made poverty a stronger issue in his campaign.

I can't take that any other way than that Edwards said, "Sure, I'll come campaign for you (unlike the other Dems!!!!!!), but in order for me to do so, you must speak strongly to poverty."

I don't hear Kucinch saying or doing anything like that, and certainly not Gravel. As a matter of fact, as much as I liked hearing what Gravel had to say a couple of months ago at the other debate, his tax crap would kill me, literally, as well as other poor folk. Yet, here on DU, with all the "liberals", there is now suddenly serious talk about his tax shit.

Oh well, so what if more poor people die. That's not as important as soldiers dying, right?

Yes, I'm angry that we have been pitted against each other this way! :nuke:

[TahitiNut]

23. I think you know I agree with you in that regard. It's not something I've told many ...

... but I was homeless for a couple of months in the year after I got back from 'Nam ... not because of joblessness or lack of family options, but because of the marital and emotional difficulties I had. It took a while to get back on my feet, get enough paychecks under my belt, and do the 'home-hunting' I had to do. I slept at the YMCA for a few weeks and then got a (very) cheap motel room ... then lived with a fraternity brother whose wife had left him, for a few months more before I could get my own place. I was very lucky - most others aren't.

[bobbolink]

24. Thanks for sharing that. I wish more would speak about it.

I wouldn't be accepted into the "fraternity", but I feel more in common with Vietnam vets because of the sense of isolation, etc., than I do with muddleclass people.

What so many of you went through is SHAMEFUL, to say the least!

The only thing I can say is that at least you all have each other for understanding.

So many of us who are/have been homeless have NO ONE and no group from which to get understanding and support. We belong NOWHERE, and the isolation is a killer.

Oh yeah, I forgot... there are pills for that. :crazy: :angry: :silly:

[BlooInBloo]

15. LOLOLOL! Awww how cute! Threads for the fringe candidates!

[Egalitarian]

29. Please explain further...

Seems pretty logical to me?

[Jillian]

18. Biden needs to be taken more seriously on what he has

accomplished in foreign affairs, and safety issues for our country.

And everyone needs to stop talking about how he talks. It reminds me of Kerry being called a flip-flopper. It's been taken way out of context.
I like the way Biden talks. I feel that when he talks, he talks from his heart, and I can't say that about several of the candidates.

[bobbolink]

19. cracks me up that someone thinks hillary needs to be heard MORE...!!

:rofl: :crazy: :silly: :rofl:

[TahitiNut]

20. Well, sometimes people just don't understand the question, ...

... don't take the time, or ignore it to beat the drum for their fan club. :shrug: There's always a lot of "fuzz" in DU polls where folks 'fire for effect' (their own agenda) instead of contemplating the question, choosing honestly, and letting the chips fall where they may. Some vote where the least votes are registered and some vote to break ties. There are side-effects of knowing the vote tallies so far when voting, too. (That's not to say that all or any spcific votes for any particular choice are always that way ... but it happens.)

[bobbolink]

22. Yup, that's why I said I knew what the "correct" answer would be.

I just posted a thread that (angrily!) asks why "liberals" can't think of others besides themselves. That seems to fit in with what you just wrote...

Yes, it's a bad day. :(

[Egalitarian]

30. In all fairness

We should be open to the possibility that someone feels that Hillary best represents their views. Until we learn to acknowledge somoeone else's viewpoint we will not have a real discussion. To acknowledge a differing viewpoint does not validate or invalidate it in itself, but rather keeps the dialogue open.

[Faryn Balyncd]

21. Mike Gravel - - - Here is his speech on Eisenhower's warning....

http://www.gravel2008.us/?q=node/257

[bobbolink]

25. Dang! It won't play here at the library!

THannks for posting it... wish I could hear it...

[bvar22]

26. Dennis Kucinich, without a doubt!

Dennis Kucinich is NOT afraid of losing large single source contributions (CEO).
He is free to speak for those Americans who must Work for a Living.
THIS is the voice that needs to HEARD in the USA and the World!

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has a Clear & Consistent position on the illegal and immoral Iraq Occupation.

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has presented a Clear and Consistent position on Wars of Aggression, and the need to JOIN the International Community on Land Mine Bans and the International Criminal Court.

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has a Clear & Consistent position on Single Payer Universal HealthCare.

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has a Clear & Consistent position on "Free Trade".

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has a Clear & Consistent position on Election Reform and BBV. (Paper Ballots hand counted locally).

Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has given Clear Voice to the ISSUES that are critical in America today.
I understand why the MSM and the establishment Democrats are afraid of his voice. He has pledged to change the status quo in DC, and would turn off The Money Machine that runs this country today.


DK has my confidence, my money, my vote, my time, and my support!



The Democratic Party is a BIG TENT, but there is NO ROOM for those
who advance the agenda of THE RICH (Corporate Owners) at the EXPENSE of LABOR and the POOR.

[TahitiNut]

27. Well, 85 votes isn't all that bad on DU for a Saturday. The trend seems pretty clear.

Let's see how it holds into the evening.

[TahitiNut]

28. At 99 votes, now ... closing in on 100.

Not bad. :shrug:

[bvar22]

31. K & R

:dem:

[TahitiNut]

32. Thanks for the good poll participation, folks!

It seems clear there's general agreement that there are some good reasons to support a candidate beside any conjecture regarding their eventual "electability." There's some signficant merit to having some strong and valid perspectives heard during the prolonged campaign season. It sure can't hurt, imho.

I often wonder why some are eager to stifle those voices. :eyes:

[TahitiNut]

33. Yep. I'd say 121 votes is fairly representative of the DU community.

:party: