Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

BP ordered by U.S. To Cut Use of Dispersants, AGAIN!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:55 PM
Original message
BP ordered by U.S. To Cut Use of Dispersants, AGAIN!
Edited on Tue May-25-10 12:58 PM by sabrina 1

BP faces criticism over the chemicals it is using to disperse the oil slick. Photograph: Stephane Jourdain/AFP/Getty Images

The EPA already asked that BP stop using Corexit, a dispersant banned in Great Britain, last week. BP refused to do so, claiming Corexit was the best dispersant available. So once again, BP is being asked nicely to stop using this chemical, known to be dangerous to wild life and to humans.

White House orders BP to cut use of dispersant by half

The White House directed BP to cut its use of chemical dispersants to break up the Louisiana oil slick by as much as 50% yesterday, reflecting concerns that the clean-up of the spill could be worsening the economic disaster in the Gulf of Mexico.

Lisa Jackson, the head of the Environmental Protection Agency, said the Obama administration wanted the oil company to scale back its use of chemicals on the water surface.


Clearly we need someone who is willing to do more than request nicely that BP start respecting this Government. If Britain was able to stop them from using this chemical, I don't understand why they are allowed to thumb their noses at the U.S. and use it anyhow.

Lisa Jackson admits BP continued to use Corexit after the EPA asked them to find alternatives last week:

Jackson directed the EPA last week to seek out alternative chemicals within 24 hours, but admitted yesterday that BP had continued to use Corexit to break up the spill.

She and the coast guard commander, Mary Landry, defended the use of the chemical, arguing it had prevented a more devastating landfall of heavy crude.


This is so heart-breaking. That they would try to defend BP's use of the chemical in the face of all the information available of how harmful it is. According to scientists and all the experts on this dispersant, all it does is hide the oil beneath the surface of the ocean making it even harder to stop before it reaches the shore.

NOW, it seems, the pressure and sense of urgency to stop it is so great, the EPA has had to back-track on that defense.

Louisiana's governor, Bobby Jindal, said he had warned the administration for days that the booms deployed by BP would not keep back the oil. He has said some 65 miles of Louisiana's coastline is affected, contaminating oyster beds and coating pelicans and sea turtles in oil. Independent scientists and members of Congress have also been warning about BP's heavy reliance on a dispersant called Corexit which is banned in the UK because it is harmful for marine life.

BP has poured more than 650,000 gallons of the chemical on to the spill. Scientists told congressional hearings last week that Corexit was more toxic and less effective than other dispersants on the market.


But if hiding the extent of the disastrous spill was the reason for using Corexit, it won't work for long. Scientists have already discovered huge amounts of oil under the surface, possibly the result of the use of Corexit:



Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar visited a wildlife treatment center in Louisiana on Saturday.



Giant Plumes of Oil Found Under Gulf of Mexico

The undersea plumes may go a long way toward explaining the discrepancy between the flow estimates, suggesting that much of the oil emerging from the well could be lingering far below the sea surface.

The scientists on the Pelican mission, which is backed by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, the federal agency that monitors the health of the oceans, are not certain why that would be. They say they suspect the heavy use of chemical dispersants, which BP has injected into the stream of oil emerging from the well, may have broken the oil up into droplets too small to rise rapidly.

BP said Saturday at a briefing in Robert, La., that it had resumed undersea application of dispersants, after winning Environmental Protection Agency approval the day before.

“It appears that the application of the subsea dispersant is actually working,” Doug Suttles, BP’s chief operating officer for exploration and production, said Saturday.


It appears that BP's Doug Suttles was wrong, unless he meant it worked to hide the real amount of oil that is there. The above article was from last week. Clearly the EPA and the WH seem to have finally concluded that BP's methods are not working and are possibly only adding to the disastrous results of the spill itself.

We would know more if Scientist were allowed access to study what is going on, but BP once again is calling the shots on this also.

BP has resisted entreaties from scientists that they be allowed to use sophisticated instruments at the ocean floor that would give a far more accurate picture of how much oil is really gushing from the well.

“The answer is no to that,” a BP spokesman, Tom Mueller, said on Saturday. “We’re not going to take any extra efforts now to calculate flow there at this point. It’s not relevant to the response effort, and it might even detract from the response effort.”


What a missed opportunity, to study for future reference, how this disaster is developing. For bidden by BP.

I don't know when the U.S. government ceded its right to study a disaster as major as this to a foreign Corporation. But BP appears to be running this show, from banning reporters and scientists, to ignoring this government's orders.








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
AndyA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. It appears BP is control of everything: the spill, and our government.
Lay down and spread 'em wide, EPA and Obama Adminstration, BP wants to screw you. You have no say in the matter. (Apparently.)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. and ultimately our foodchain among other things nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yep, as my dad would say, "Send in the Marines."
Or at least arrest a few executives to let them know we mean business.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
3. The arrogance is stunning! 'The answer is no to that'!!
U.S. Scientists cannot study this disaster, find out exactly how much oil is spewing into our waters heading for our coast? Since when?

It's as if we were invaded successfully by a foreign enemy! And the mealy-mouthed 'pretty please' pleas of the EPA while daring to defend them initially, is simply unbelievable.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Smashcut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
4. START ARRESTING PEOPLE
It's that simple.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
charlesg Donating Member (311 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
5. Throw them in jail
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rudy23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
6. Use 50% LESS of that toxic chemical---now that's Pragmatism!
See, we don't need a leader who's going to run roughshod over BP. We need an even tempered pragmatist who can meet them in the middle.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Are you serious, or is that snark? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rudy23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Total snark---not towards you, towards the "compromise" of 50%
That's like giving someone half a bottle of arsenic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Thank you! I thought so, but wasn't sure as I'm sure we'll
see people defending this before too long.

That's like giving someone half a bottle of arsenic.

Exactly!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Angry Dragon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
8. So why should anyone have to obey any law or directive
from the government?? This is why the country and perhaps the world is going to hell. A class (or sub class) of people believing they are above the law.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tk2kewl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
10. they should send some F16 out there and to bring the planes in.
:mad:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. They should, but Gibbs says we can't do anything
because BP is a private company. We can invade sovereign nations, but can't control a foreign corporation doing more harm to our country than Iraq ever did or even threatened to do!

Either that says that we have been completely taken over by corporations, or he's lying.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #16
33. Yeah, that's nuts
When did we pass a law saying we have to sit by and do nothing when a private company dumps poison in the ocean and thumbs its nose at our government when told to stop.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BelgianMadCow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
12. ...wanted the oil company to scale back its use of chemicals ON THE WATER SURFACE
BP is injecting enormous amounts right at the well. Which is not at the surface.
Both the size and the location of these injections are unprecedented.

So they can comply with this order and keep on doing irrepairable damage where we can't (immediately) see it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. I did read somewhere else that they were injecting
it around the well. Excellent observation though. Thanks for pointing out that giant loophole.

I wonder if that would account for the strange activity people noticed on the live-stream of the oil gushing out of the ground in the ocean yesterday?

I can't find the link now, but it was obvious that something was different, and that there was some kind of activity that made it seem like there were more explosions, or something, right around the area causing what looked like debris to be flung around, and obliterating the view for several minutes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BelgianMadCow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Here's an AP link for the injection at depth
http://www.thesunnews.com/2010/05/14/1474522/some-oil-spill-events-from-friday.html

Which I found through the rather informative Wikipedia site http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepwater_Horizon_oil_spill#Dispersants

Also from the Wiki: "By 20 May, BP had applied 600,000 US gallons (2,300,000 l) of Corexit on the surface and 55,000 US gallons (210,000 l) underwater" which does relativize the underwater part, at least at that time and if we trust the figures...

The injection started much earlier, so I think it's probably not related to the events on cam you described.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BelgianMadCow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. and a video of the process
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. That's a good link, thanks ~
Here's the one I was talking about, and you are right, this just happened over the weekend so probably not related. I really don't know what to think of this, but you can see from the screen captures that things have changed. Was it an explosion that happened on its own, or were they trying to do something down there?

You need to scroll down the page a little for the article and the screen shots and I think there's a link somewhere to another blog where they had started to watch this as it progressed.

Major Change Down Below

Check out this shot. Airc, the 'gush' on the live cam was both black and white but close together, the white was natural gas and the darker one, oil. In this shot they seem to have separated. But maybe it's just the angle of the shot:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_7-ywsAgfzig/S_b1EIwZpdI/AAAAAAAACbE/U_lirhm889A/s1600/Methane+Burst.jpg
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BelgianMadCow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. "or were they trying to do something down there"
was just looking at the blog you linked as well - from the series of still pictures, and the violent end of them, definitely does not look planned in any way. Anything like controlled explosion I can't imagine - but I'm an engineer in a different field, and the speculations on the blog are hard to follow for me. It just seems the area is becoming unstable. I sure hope this isn't the place of the top kill - should go and dredge up the schematic of things I saw on here yesterday.

Thankfully we have the internets to keep things from being flushed down the memory hole. In all my outrage, I had missed these events, so thank you too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. Other people have noticed a difference in the positioning
Edited on Tue May-25-10 04:51 PM by sabrina 1
of the pipes. Because it is a live stream, most people are not watching it all the time, but it does look like either the camera was moved, or some kind of explosion changed the way the pipes were positioned. I suppose that could be expected.

In this shot from the same website, they seem to think there is a new hole and that the pipes have moved.



What the First Noted Venting Hole (TNVH) turned into 18 hours later.
Same pair of broken pipes, Riser end is in same position, except everything has settled down a few feet, and the hole is bigger. that's an ejection rim. Those two broken pipes are more exposed.
A lot of earth got moved down and away all at once.


The above text is from http://monkeyfister.blogspot.com/.

As an engineer, you probably understand a lot more than I do. But just from the stills on the site, it definitely does look like something happened.

Do we even know that aside from this disaster, it is safe to dig so deep under the earth's surface? I don't know so am just wondering if they could be disturbing something other than just oil and gas ~

Edit to make a correction. That the pipes 'moved' to 'the pipes are more exposed'.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Xicano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
14. Hey Obama! Somebody who fucked up a part of the United States just basically told you fuck you.
What are you going to do about that? Nothing?

Or are you going to at least ACT like a leader and begin to order the capture and arrest of those responsible? So far numerous leaders of small countries who stand up to us show more guts than you.

Now how about doing your fucking job and representing and leading the United States and its citizens instead of being a coward or and bribed off corporate puppet.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rudy23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. He's not President of the "United States" as we think about them (us)
Obama is the President of Wall St., and the President of Hosting Foreign Corporations. There is no President of us.

Do you know who's president of us? Cans of tear gas, and men with tazers, billy clubs, and guns.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lib2DaBone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. Well yes, we do have a president of us.. Lloyd Blankfein of Goldman Sachs..
The Corporations then send in the SWAT teams and Tear Gas.. to serve up a healty dose of "Democracy".

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
23. How about an unequivocal *cease and desist* order? eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. They're a private corporation. New rules say we
cannot interfere with a private business, at least that's what Gibbs said.

Now all terrorists have to do is incorporate?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
27. kick
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 10:52 PM
Response to Original message
28. I need someone with blue links to set me straight.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. ---
:spray:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #28
30. Lol!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #28
34. Lol! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
31. They need to order them to stop using that poison
... it's about making them look better by dumping the oil on the bottom, but it is no doubt worse long run...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
47of74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. And send naval vessels to the gulf with orders to...
...sink any vessel that is found dumping any dispersants into the water.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #31
35. But instead of ordering them, they are asking them politely
And BP has simply told the EPA to basically 'get lost'

Something is not right about this. We invade sovereign nations and ignore the UN and International and Domestic laws, but we cannot stop BP from poisoning the waters in the Gulf. I just don't get it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #35
36. They have to prevail. How embarrassing for macho usa! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri May 03rd 2024, 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC