'I'd do it again' former President Bush tells Grand Rapids crowd about waterboarding terrorists

[Bluebear]

Why, again, are we content with not prosecuting torture?

=====

GRAND RAPIDS -- Former President George W. Bush was by turns affable, relaxed -- and deadly serious in his local appearance Wednesday.

"Yeah, we water-boarded Khalid Sheikh Mohammed," Bush said of the terrorist who master-minded the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks on New York and Washington. He said that event shaped his presidency and convinced him the nation was in a war against terror.

"I'd do it again to save lives."...

Bush underlined the role religion played in his life in the White House, saying prayer gave him strength to go forward.

"I prayed a lot. I really did. I prayed before every major speech. I prayed before debates. It was a very important experience."

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2010/06/id_do_it_again_former_presiden.html

[tavalon]

1. One of my indications that Obama is just as much a puppet as Bush

is that this narcissistic sociopath is still walking around talking shit and isn't in the Hague.

[Bluebear]

2. Obama on Torture: Don't Stop Thinking About Tomorrow

The Obama administration will not focus on prosecuting government officials who practiced illegal torture or war crimes, the president-elect said on Sunday, though he added that prosecutions and independent commission have not been completely ruled out. This was Obama's first major statement on the issue since April; over the past few weeks, Obama's aides have repeatedly ducked questions about what, if anything, the administration will do to enforce laws violated by officials under President Bush. The question topped the list of citizen concerns on Change.gov last week, out of over 70,000 submissions, but Obama aide Robert Gibbs refused to respond, leading ABC's George Stephanopoulos to press the question during an interview on his Sunday show.

"My orientation's going to be to move forward," Obama said. The attorney general has to stay above politics and "uphold the Constitution," Obama added, but his administration will focus on "getting things right in the future as opposed to looking at what we got wrong in the past."

This answer tracks the language of many torture apologists (and advocates) in Washington, who posit a choice between protecting the country today and second-guessing the past.

Enforcing laws and prosecuting criminal defendants, however, is inherently about "the past." Prosecutors always work on "past" crimes; there aren't many "forward-looking" prosecutors outside of Minority Report. If the Justice Department declines to enforce recent war crimes, it will not be freed up to go prevent future terrorist attacks. It will simply enforce other laws based on recent violations.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ari-melber/state-of-change-obama-on_b_157122.html

[tiptoe]

42. "...and second-guessing the past." 9/11 is not a closed issue. EXPLOSIVES found in WTC dust; torture

"policy" — as manipulated facade, a "beating-of-breasts-by-Cheney-and-Bush-so-appalled-by-9/11-they'll-TORTURE-to-get-to-the-TRUTH", a mere posturing, unjustified that 1) deflects from complicity in 9/11, 2) smears US government world esteem wrt international law, and 3) promotes FEAR worldwide — based on a FRAUD.

War crimes...based on a FRAUD.

Drain of the US Treasury in Afghanistan and Iraq...based on a FRAUD.

Patriot Act and assault on the Constitution and civil rights...senseless because based on a FRAUD.

80,000 petitioned New Yorkers were stifled by politics in 2009 (abetting the ongoing coverup of the 2001 events), as were 1100 architects and engineers who joined New Yorkers in the call for an independent investigation of 9/11.

We had better "second-guess" the past -- despite Obama's suppressive "looking forward" -- because our present and future country, culture as a free society, fair elections and system of justice continue exposed to subterfuge attempts based on radical right-wing LIES of the past, continued Election Fraud in 2008, and anticipated same for midterms in 2010 and beyond.

Meanwhile, the 'just-one-time'-Sandra-Day-O'Connor-selected  "you're-either-with-me-or-against-me" 'President' Bush tries to create a "new reality" for himself as 'just another face(book) in the crowd'.

And what currently calls itself "GOP" (i.e., now-lacking Susan Eisenhower and minimally 344,000 other traditional, moderate "seed-corn" GOP, known-deregistered between 2006 and 2008...in just 29 states) continued with novel 2004 electronic-vote-switching tactics in 2008 to deny Democratic voters a 22-million vote landslide (p.191, Proving Election Fraud).

How extensive and effective has GOP ELECTION FRAUD been? Have a look, courtesy TruthIsAll's exploring and simple reporting -- i.e., no mathematical models or "fancy numbers" -- of the plain historical data, straight from the exit pollster's 2004 Evaluation Report for direct comparison with published official vote-counts, state by state, 1988-to-2004 (pp.84-91 of the book]):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x515058#HistoricalWPD

Note, too, the missing data for 2008 and realize that the pollster's Evaluation Report for 2008 (containing state exit poll data that, in 2004, affirmed Kerry's national exit poll win) is still being withheld by the mainstream media "news" outlets of Fox, CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, and AP. Do you think the media -- still withholding the 2008 Evaluation Report -- aren't aware of the 2004 Evaluation Report findings published in Proving Election Fraud? How can Obama's 9.5 million vote victory be confirmed without the state exit polls?

Oh, a HEADS UP! if you think 2000 is way in the past and ignorable (like some key people in the current administration, apparently):

Sandra Day O'Connor has reared her head again, on May 21 2010, NY TIMES, "Take Justice Off the Ballot", proposing
 

A better system...one that strikes a balance between lifetime appointment and partisan election by providing for the open, public nomination and appointment of judges, followed in due course by a standardized judicial performance evaluation and, finally, a yes/no vote in which citizens either approve the judge or vote him out. This kind of merit selection system — now used in some form in two-thirds of states — protects the impartiality of the judiciary without sacrificing accountability.

Ahhh, how sweet. Justice O'Connor, even after retirement, still looking out for the best interests of the American people, just as she did in 2000.

Reflect on that concluding tidbit of wisdom of her analysis -- "...finally, a yes/no vote in which citizens either approve the judge or vote him out" -- in the context of GOP Election Fraud described above that shows who benefited when the difference in vote-share margin between the Exit Poll and the Vote-Count exceeded the poll's assumed ±3% MoE. The results should be 50%-Rep 50%-Dem in fair elections. Instead, Republicans are favored in the votecount. How much? Nearly exclusively:

100.0% GOP favored

 in 15 Democratic states,

25 out of 25 times between 1988 and 2004

100.0% GOP favored

 in 15 Battleground states,

25 out of 25 times between 1988 and 2004

93.8% GOP favored

 in 21 Republican states,

15 out of 16 times between 1988 and 2004

 

(If you think conservatives' Election Fraud targets merely candidates, click on the "Proposition" link at the top of 'Historical WPD' to learn differently from an example.)

In the context of the facts above and 'just-one-time'-Justice O'Connor's presumed ignorance of them, how can a final proprosal for "...a yes/no vote in which citizens either approve the judge or vote him out..." be anything less than red-carpet accommodation for extending Right-Wing ELECTION FRAUD more broadly into the judicial system under pretense of a "merit system"?

And given Proving Election Fraud establishes Bush was fraudulently re-elected in 2004 -- after he was fraudulently-selected in 2000 by O'Connor's final vote -- why shouldn't SC Justices appointed by fraudulently-elected Presidents GW Bush and GHW Bush (p.106-108) -- Roberts, Alito and Thomas -- resign...i.e, assuming they truly are "Honorable"?

(See chart on page 98 for a common factor characteristic of five elections, between 1968 and 2008, where Election Fraud was evident.)

[ixion]

4. Exactly.

That is probably the most relevant indicator. If there were still Rule of Law, his scrawny little but would be sitting in the Hague.

[NYC Liberal]

12. Right. Because Obama can have Bush arrested and somehow deported to

be charged and stand trial...all by himself.

[muffin1]

15. The point is

that Obama isn't even INTERESTED in having him prosecuted.

Like the public option and many other things, it isn't even on the table.

[Mari333]

20. [phone]

[treestar]

40. Obama has a lot on his plate

It is understandable he would put the economy first. But why is he alone responsible? Wouldn't that be the Justice Department? Why are we so certain they are not looking into it?

[NYC Liberal]

46. No, the point is that Obama should have nothing to do with

initiating a criminal investigation, whether crimes were committed or not.

It will always be the last-resort, desperate criticism when all others fail. "Bush didn't go to jail....Obama bad!"

[Bluebear]

27. .

[Bluebear]

28. Wow you make him sound pretty powerless.

[NYC Liberal]

47. I make him sound like not being George W Bush.

As you know, it was George W Bush who meddled with the Justice Department.

Crimes should be punished. Obama is NOT the one to be ordering investigations of people.

[City Lights]

18. !

:thumbsup:

[marmar]

23. I think the office of the presidency has become a puppet office......

It's an institution controlled by corporate forces, not any individual, or the people.

[Bluebear]

31. I used to think Obama was not particularly principled.

All compromise, all middle of the road. Now I tend to agree with your assessment. 'It's an institution controlled by corporate forces, not any individual, or the people.'

[fascisthunter]

38. boom!

[Solly Mack]

3. Of course he would...and why not?

It's not as if torture is a crime in rule-of-law sound bite cheering America. Where telling people that no-one-is-above-the-law passes for accountability.


Because if it was crime...I dunno...certain people would be in prison right now.

[RC]

5. Who da hell was he praying to?

"Bush underlined the role religion played in his life in the White House, saying prayer gave him strength to go forward.

"I prayed a lot. I really did. I prayed before every major speech. I prayed before debates. It was a very important experience.""

The second statement shows how self-centered he is.

[AndyA]

7. Bush was praying to Jack Daniels.

Good ole Jack never let him down.

[deutsey]

17. Bush was praying that Rove and his stooges had everything rigged

so he'd always come out looking good.

It's all about him, after all.

[AndyA]

6. It's too bad you didn't do something to save lives before 9/11, Bush.

Oh...but you were on vacation. Again. Constantly. Always.

The man should be in prison, not giving speeches. Thanks for all that change, Obama. I guess breaking the law and being prosecuted for doing it isn't something worth changing. (As long as you're rich.)

[arcadian]

8. Bush is working on his new image.

Launched a facebook site yesterday too. We have to hound that asshole everywhere he goes.

[saltpoint]

9. "I beseech thee, Almighty God, to give me the strength to go forward

and in so doing grant the wisdom and mercy my administration seeks to deny in others, as policy generally but as regards waterboarding in particular, and please, dear Lord of all Creation, may the detainees' screams and panic and mortal fear reach your infinite ears in howls of anguish.

And lead us not into regulation, but deliver us from liberal entitlements and New Dealism, and bestow upon us fewer pretzels and more tax cuts. Amen."

[Ganja Ninja]

10. Hands down - Worst President Ever!

That should tell you what his opinions are worth.

[sendero]

11. What else can an idiot do..

... other than stick by his bad decisions? Bush has made a bazillion mistakes, he's never admitted one.

[madrchsod]

13. well i guess his god kind`a let him down....or had him on hold.

in a couple of years he`ll be calling books trees just like old ron...

[peekaloo]

14. God would put him on speaker, make faces and rude gestures

while all the nearby angels stifled their giggles.

[madrchsod]

26. !.......

:thumbsup:

[muffin1]

16. K&R

What a piece of shit. Does the 'god' he prays to agree with waterboarding? I'm pretty sure his 'god' talked about loving one's enemies, and turning the other cheek.

[Soylent Brice]

19. Nov . 7, 2005... Bush: ‘We do not torture’ terror suspects

updated 4:09 p.m. ET, Mon., Nov . 7, 2005
PANAMA CITY, Panama - President Bush on Monday defended U.S. interrogation practices and called the treatment of terrorism suspects lawful. “We do not torture,” Bush declared in response to reports of secret CIA prisons overseas.

Bush supported an effort spearheaded by Vice President Dick Cheney to block or modify a proposed Senate-passed ban on torture.

“We’re working with Congress to make sure that as we go forward, we make it possible, more possible, to do our job,” Bush said. “There’s an enemy that lurks and plots and plans and wants to hurt America again. And so, you bet we will aggressively pursue them. But we will do so under the law.”

June 3, 2010... Bush: "Yeah, we water-boarded Khalid Sheikh Mohammed," "I'd do it again to save lives."...

[Bluebear]

29. ++++++ LIAR

[Stuart G]

21. "Excessive bail shall not be required, ..fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

Let a jury decide if this was "cruel and unusual punishment"

[sinkingfeeling]

22. Why isn't this admitted violator of international law in jail?

[Bluebear]

30. +

[Eyerish]

24. I'm just speechless....

So...if he just admitted to water-boarding, could an international court pick him up for war crimes or something similar??

[Solly Mack]

25. kick

[Hubert Flottz]

32. The mother of all crocks wouldn't hold your shit george.

"prayer gave him strength to go forward" no wonder we're still screwn.

[opihimoimoi]

43. Gorgie makes Palin look like Einstien....he is THAT DUMB.....

I cannot believe we sre spending so much money to protect him??? for what???

Better to save the money for something important...like addressing Lost Minds and recovery systems...

The NATIONAL Poverty Level went way up under Bushies 8 years...so many are finally realizing this...as they lose their earning power these past few years...

[Hubert Flottz]

48. Bush and Cheney laid all the ground work for the downfall of the

country.

1. Let the energy companies that they were skimming off of, off their chains to loot plunder and pillage at will. And now our "National Security" is awash in a toxic soup. Miners and oil company hands being mass murdered at work, because all the regulatory agencies in the country were hamstrung by the de-regulators.

2. Sucked the Treasury dry and let the banksters and corporate cock roaches gather up all the crumbs on the way out.

3. Gave out tax cuts to the wealthy while the country spent trillions of dollars on two "wars."

4. Threw away the soldier's rights by international law, to be treated like a human being in the event of their capture and confinement.

And Bush is proud of that record. A real human, would be so disgusted by the shit Bush has done and helped to do, that they wouldn't want to show their smirky face again.

To some it up...George is the Mother Of ALL ASSHOLES.

[Solly Mack]

33. kicking in "good faith"

[Bluebear]

34. little outrage/interest anymore, eh?

this is curious to me!

[Solly Mack]

35. Does seem to have dropped off considerably.

I've been kicking this one and the other 2... there's been little activity. Far less than at one time.

[tiptoe]

45. k

[fascisthunter]

36. you didn't waterboard just terrorists you sociopath... you tortured innocent people too

fucking freak of nature

children were raped so you could stir up more propaganda regarding terrorism.

[Bluebear]

39. But we have to "move forward". Disgusting.

[laughingliberal]

37. ...

:puke:

[UTUSN]

41. Knowing what a PoS he is, without this specific news, I reacted viscerally this A.M.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8476089


Opened up this month's VFW magazine and there was an advertisement for Medals of America, which sells veterans' stuff--ribbons, medals, flags, whatever. I have been their customer, along with several other such companies, for years here and there. But this ad was for dog tags and the pictured tags have Shrub's name on them, with a middle initial "S" instead of "W". This made me FUME (oh, btw, there was another set "John KENNEDY") and I called, "I've been a customer for years, small orders whatever. I have a complaint, not about your products, about an advertisement. I don't want you to agree or disagree with me on the phone, just want you to pass on what I say. I was DISGUSTED to see (Shrub's) name on the tags. This was a man who did everything he could to shirk service and just partied his brains out. Then he got us into this wrong war and even this oil leak can be laid at his feet for taking off the regulations. I don't know whether I'll stop being your customer, the small stuff I buy won't matter anyway. That's all." After a long silence the dude (the ads say that VETERANS are the phone staff) said politely, "Thank you for your comments, sir. I will pass them on."

http://www.medalsofamerica.com/Item--i-DT1 800-308-0849

[Solly Mack]

44. kick

[Solly Mack]

49. kick