The anti-immigrant hysteria has reached the scary stage.....The Utah"list"

[marmar]

AP via HuffPost:



SALT LAKE CITY — Investigators examined records at several state agencies Wednesday to find the origins of a list being circulated around Utah that contains the names and personal information of 1,300 purported illegal immigrants and demands that they be deported immediately.

Utah is looking into whether a state worker may have illegally accessed a database containing the sensitive information to help compile a list that has sent chills through the Hispanic community.

The dossier – sent from an anonymous group to reporters, state officials and politicians – marks the latest example of hysteria that has spread since Arizona passed its harsh immigration crackdown this year. Immigrants liken the list to a modern-day witch hunt.

A 36-year-old Salt Lake City woman whose name was on the list along with those of her husband and three children, told The Associated Press through a translator that she's consumed by fear. She said her family is considering returning to their home outside of Mexico City where they all have citizenship.

"Our worst fear was that immigration will come for us or will stop us while driving or being out on the street," said the woman, who requested anonymity to protect her family's identity. ............(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/14/utah-illegal-immigration-_n_646955.html

[Solly Mack]

1. k/r

Damn

[rurallib]

2. I hope they find the person who released this personal information

and they get a bit of time and a nice cell to consider what they did.
I also hope they share a cell with Cheney.

[Ozymanithrax]

3. We have been here before...

"First They Came for the Jews"
By Pastor Niemoller

First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me.

So they are coming for the immigrants first, this time. No big whop. The nationalist, supremacist, racist freaks don't mind mixing things up a bit.

But what list is next. Maybe they will make a list of those people who they claim were born in Kenya. It doesn't matter where you were born, because if they say your ass was born in Kenya that is all that matters. Then they come for the Muslims, because everyone knows that all Muslims pray to Allah every fucking day to turn America over to President Ossama, the one in a cave in Afghanistan, not the Kenyan. Then they come for the people with mental disorders, because everyone knows that liberalism is a mental disorder.

Warning: The above comment used hyperbole.

[conscious evolution]

37. IBM and Nazi Germany

was my first thought on reading about this list.

[WinkyDink]

4. Well, SOMEbody got their Special Mormon Undies in a twist!

[Erose999]

5. The scariest part of this is that its basically identity theft.

If this list was composed by "taxpaying citizens" then those "taxpaying citizens" were probably acting outside the law. If you work for a government agency, like a welfare office, it is illegal to compile or release peoples' information for any purpose other than your job duties.

I worked at a state college admissions/financial aid office and I had to sign a non disclosure agreement stating I wouldn't use peoples' information for purposes other than the duties explicitly outlined in my job procedures. I had to sign a similar agreement for my job at a state university library. I am pretty sure all state employees in any capacity are bound to similar agreements and that there are similar agreements binding independent contractors and such.

Hopefully those who have leaked information will be fired.

These are probably the same idiots who sit on Freep all day and bitch about FEMA camp conspiracies and the coming of the "police state". They don't realize its the conservatives like Jan Brewer who are behind the police state policies.

[EFerrari]

35. A leader in the Latino community in Utah said today

that it looks like it was leaked by a state agency.

[Bloofer_Lady]

6. Oh those naughty Mormons!

For a religion that has been persecuted they sure are a bunch of assholes.

[Erose999]

13. Its funny that the x-tian teabaggers embrace mormons like Glenn Beck

and Mitt Romney, etc. I am sure they are largely unaware that the LDS floks don't believe in the trinity.

The next time my teabagger/fundie x-tian Aunt talks about how she trusts Glenn Beck because he "always tells the truth," I'm gonna bring that up.

[Bloofer_Lady]

15. They would throw the Mormons...

...under a bus if they totally take over this country.

[obxhead]

7. Where's the list of Utah EMPLOYERS hiring illegal immigrants

at far below minimum wage, free from unemployment insurance, free from tax obligations, and free from workers comp insurance. Where's that list demanding the seizure of their assets for being the CAUSE of their immigration 'problems'

When I see that list circulated via MSM I'll believe they really care about immigration.

[Bragi]

8. Is this a symptom of the final unravelling of America?

This is an example of right-wing States being prepared to pass laws to undermine national laws and policies. I can see that catching on big time. This may point to how America will finally disintegrate as a political entity. Maybe the tea party crowd will finally be able to do what the Confederacy couldn't do.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

9. "Immigrants liken the list to a modern-day witch hunt." ...

Not really a "modern-day witch hunt because Illegal immigrants actually exist.

While wiccans/witchs, by self-identification and definition, exist... but they are not the mytholigical personas that were being hunted throughout history.

[marmar]

10. Your point, other than a semantic quibble?

:shrug:

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

11. Should huffpo really be using hyperbole like that?

I doub't they even meant to use it as hyperbole. They were serious.
If so... they were wrong.

[marmar]

12. Actually, it was the AP......

..... and Heaven knows that's a far more important issue than some state employee spreading a list with people's names and personal info on it. :eyes:

[pinboy3niner]

14. Actually, their use of the term is not an unusual one

The term "witch-hunt" is often used by analogy to refer to panic-induced searches for perceived wrong-doers other than witches. The best known example is probably the McCarthyist search for communists during the Cold War, which was discredited partly through being compared to the Salem witch trials.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch-hunt

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

32. Once again...

The use of witch hunts as a comparison tactic is discrediting because it implies something is being zealously sought after which does not exist. The comparison of witch hunts to discredit McCarthy's rooting out communists was wrong back then too - there WERE real communists. Was everyone they targeted a commie? No. But some were.

The application of the analogy back then was wrong then and it it would be wrong to do now. There were (are) real communists and there are actual illegal immigrants.

[EFerrari]

34. Then please explain the presence of legal immigrants and citizens

on that list.

Thank you.

[LanternWaste]

39. Then let us liken it to a McCarthy-era Blacklist...

Then let us accurately liken it to a McCarthy-era Blacklist to avoid the issue one may take with the rhetorical flourish of a writer.

[Romulox]

16. So...how do we decide which illegality is important, and which not?

Seems like there is more than one crime at play here, but our outrage is being directed only toward one of them. Odd. :shrug:

[pinboy3niner]

18. Unauthorized presence in the U.S. is a civil violation, not a crime. nt

[Romulox]

19. Identity theft is a far more serious crime though.

As is tax evasion, e.g.

[pinboy3niner]

23. The Utah list makes no allegations of identity theft or tax evasion.

It provides a dossier on individuals the mystery group suspects of being undocumented immigrants.

[Romulox]

24. If it contains SS numbers, the inference is ineluctable. nt

[pinboy3niner]

31. You're assuming the "suspicions" about all 1,300 people are true?

We don't even know who the mystery accusers are--but you'd accept their claims? The "inference" is unsupported.

[Erose999]

And said group likely used illegal means of obtaining that info. Meaning that

it would be inadmissible in any court.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

33. As a violation of Title 8 SS1325 of the U.S.C. it would be a felony, no?

Under Title 8 Section 1325 of the U.S. Code, "Improper Entry by Alien," any citizen of any country other than the United States who:
* Enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers; or Eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers; or

* Attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact; has committed a federal crime.

"Any alien who is present in the United States in violation of this Act or any other law of the United States is deportable." Nationality Act Section 237 (a)(1)(B)

Violations are punishable by criminal fines and imprisonment for up to six months. Repeat offenses can bring up to two years in prison. Additional civil fines may be imposed at the discretion of immigration judges, but civil fines do not negate the criminal sanctions or nature of the offense.

Violations are punishable by criminal fines and imprisonment for up to six months. Repeat offenses can bring up to two years in prison. Additional civil fines may be imposed at the discretion of immigration judges, but civil fines do not negate the criminal sanctions or nature of the offense.

In addition to sneaking into the country in violation of the immigration law that requires that aliens be documented for legal entry (referred to as "entry without inspection -- EWI"), others enter with legal documentation and then violate the terms on which they have been admitted by taking jobs that are not authorized or overstaying the authorized period of stay in the country.

The list below are all crimes involving illegal immigration:

(1) Violating the immigration law is a FEDERAL CRIME

(2) Forging documents is a FEDERAL FELONY CRIME

(3) Passing forged documents is a FEDERAL FELONY CRIME

(4) Stealing ID is a FEDERAL FELONY CRIME

(5) Using stolen ID is a FEDERAL FELONY CRIME

[NNN0LHI]

17. Anyone who doesn't realize when they get done with them they will start on someone else ...

... is whistling past the graveyard.

If this isn't nipped in the bud many of us are going to be getting the same treatment soon.

Just watch.

Don

[Romulox]

20. Contempt for the law tends to engender contempt for the law.

That is another lesson to take from this.

[marmar]

21. The larger contempt at work here is the contempt for brown people, IMHO

I don't think these people's motivation is their love of Civics

[Romulox]

25. I think there is plenty of evidence for contempt for brown people

amongst those who claim they are needed to "do jobs Americans won't do."

I would think the essential worth of every human being would be a first principle for everyone involved, but the argument that we must import a lower caste of workers to do jobs that are "beneath us" is as disgusting as any I've heard from overt racists--worse yet, it disguises itself as a noble sentiment.

[NNN0LHI]

26. Forgetting laws can be created or selectively enforced to fit any agenda is a big mistake though

Some people in Germany knew that when trade unions were made "illegal" in 1933 trouble was ahead. Like when the law was passed that the only "legal" political party was the Nazis a month later.

Lot more didn't realize it until after it was too late.

Don

[Romulox]

30. That's a truism that doesn't reveal any additional light on the subject though.

Saying that Nazi Germany made trade unions illegal is not a good argument in defense of securities fraud (to pick an absurd example,) for example. I agree that publishing the list is abhorrent; I wouldn't do it or support anybody that did.

[pinboy3niner]

29. I'm afraid you may be right, Don

They want "their" country back. As in, THEIRS, not OURS.

I wonder which list WE'LL end up on?

[EC]

22. Keith O said that the SSN's were published also

isn't that illegal in itself? Besides if these are supposed to be illegals, wouldn't they not have SSN's? So maybe these people aren't here illegally.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

27. No, publishing a SSN is not currently a cime

How you obtained it may be.

[Froward69]

28. Not to sound "glenbeckish" but Hitler compiled lists

of "undesirables" for deportation too.

[meow mix]

36. right out of an episode of "invasion"

pretty sad

[newspeak]

38. and history repeats

during the great depression, we had the immigration scare--remember Woody Guthrie's song "Deportee?" The elite really know how to divide and conquer and point fingers. And, that's what happened in the last depression-they had their hate spewing radio talking heads that informed the masses about those without jobs, if they really wanted a job they could have one, they're just lazy--and those immigrants are taking you're jobs. Nope, nothing about the robber barons making a killing off of the backs of others or irresponsibility (no regulation) of wall street.

Also, we've had a government and MSM shoving FEAR down our throats for well over eight years. I'd say some of our citizens have actually lost brain cells living in that bubble of fear for so long. The people on that list are living in a state comprised mostly of members of a church who invades every moment of your life. Most are indoctrinated since birth to lock step and adhere to what their bishop tells them to do.

I lived in Utah, that's why I say most-there are some Utahans that don't lockstep-but the church does have great influence over the state. Enough that there are a lot of stepford people.