Kaiser - What Conservatives Are Winning (re Health Care (oops!) Insurance Reform)

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

If you want to call these "wins". Only in the Pyhrric sense.

http://www.kff.org/pullingittogether/071410_altman.cfm

What Conservatives Are Winning
Drew Altman

Publish Date: 2010-07-14

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Item: In our recent survey of people in the non-group insurance market, we found that the average deductible for an individual policy is now $2,498, and for families it's $5,149. These are very high thresholds by any standard. Consider, for example, that a family with median income facing such a deductible would be spending almost 10% of their annual income just for their deductible before their insurance kicked in.

Item: The percentage of workers facing high deductibles -- $1,000 or more for single coverage -- has been growing rapidly. It doubled from 10 percent to 22 percent between 2006 and 2009, and increased from 16 percent to 40 percent in small firms.

Item: Indications are that the share of workers with high deductibles is continuing to grow, a trend I expect our 2010 employer survey to confirm when we release it in September as we have every year for more than a decade now. And a substantial number of these high deductible plans are paired with tax-advantaged savings accounts, which conservatives have long advocated. Facing cost pressures without alternative answers, employers are moving to plans with less comprehensive coverage to reduce their expenses for employee benefits.

Item:Health reform is unlikely to reverse these trends. Large employers will continue to look for ways to address the rising cost of health care. And, for the basic "bronze" insurance plan that people will be required to buy, deductibles could run several thousand dollars for individuals and double that for families. To be sure, other aspects of health reform cut the other way. For example, there will be no cost sharing for preventive services in newly-purchased plans, and insurers will be required to cap consumer out-of-pocket costs at defined levels. And, of course, there are substantial subsidies to reduce premium and out-of-pocket costs for lower-income people. But, for the first time, the government will be defining the threshold that decent insurance must meet, and that minimum coverage will have the kind of high deductibles that conservatives favor.

(Remember that deductibles are in ADDITION to premiums)

My whole point during the HCR debate was that capping costs did not make the costs de facto AFFORDABLE or in line with what the rest of the world pays for health coverage for their citizens. And of course, that there is no mechanism for cost containment or LOWERING them from where they are today, still way out of whack with the rest of the world.

[xchrom]

1. one could say the bill was constructed not to address those trends. nt

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

2. my goodness, one could say that, couldn't they?

This stuff was all obvious from the getgo.

The only positive I can see is that we'll get to the point of employers dropping coverage sooner rather than later and then perhaps finally we will get to the point of decoupling healthcare from employment.

[havocmom]

6. 'we'll fix it later!' By appointing the corporate employee in to government who wrote it to fix it.

Wages still declining in real dollars. Workers can't pay house payments. Employers dropping benefits... yeah, we will get to that point of decoupling health care from employment, but we still won't be able to afford it

And I have GREAT insurance, but still no real health care. Insurance companies control what doctors do, prescribe, even how much time they can spend with each patient. It ain't health care, it's processing people like fast food burgers. Volume is the only thing which makes money. Volume is OK for a burger joint, but not for medical practice. There is a reason so many doctors are getting out. And the young ones coming in, working for corporate medicine, instead of themselves, are just well schooled burger flippers. They can't practice the medical arts, they can only get the people processed fast. Volume volume volume.

The insurance companies make the rules and Obama/Baucus/Fowler make the people support the insurance companies. It's not health care.

Thanks, Phoebe, for all you do to address issues.

[YOY]

3. Hey! We had to solve this in our "unique American way"!

Fuck any other systems that provenly work the world over!!! We need to boldy continue to fuck over the public!

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

4. We didn't solve anything. We deferred solving.

We put a bandaid on a gushing femoral artery.

[YOY]

5. Hey, I was just quoting someone that I cannot criticise...

n.t.

[slipslidingaway]

13. Criticism of Karen Ignagni is allowed ...

Uniquely American Solution: Collaboration, Leadership Required to Bring Change
Author(s): Karen Ignagni

http://www.commonwealthfund.org/Content/Publications/Commentaries/2009/Apr/Uniquely-American-Solution.aspx

"Significant consensus has emerged that health care reform, which has eluded our nation for almost a century, should be enacted this year, and that bold changes are necessary to ensure high-quality, affordable health care for all Americans...

In moving to pass legislation this year, Congress can create a uniquely American solution by encouraging and expecting uniquely American stakeholder responsibility."


Uniquely American Solution - What is it ? Why is it being pushed?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6289091&mesg_id=6289091

Some talking points from the Herndon Alliance and published on the Third Way site...

"2. Tap into key values the public places on reform:

» Stability and peace of mind
» The middle class
» Choice and control
» Quality
» Continuity—keeping your current plan and doctor
» Value—paying less and getting more
» Affordability
» Patriotism—“uniquely American solution”

[havocmom]

7. Now, now, we solved the fear that Insurance execs might not have so much $$ in future

We sure as hell solved THEIR worries.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

8. True. We gave them a "cost plus" contract and guaranteed their margins at 15%

Like I always ask, wouldn't you love to be a business owner with a deal with the government with terms like that?

[msongs]

9. kaiser charges $1000 per MONTH for one person nt

[ehrnst]

12. Not the same Kaiser. This is not the insurance company - it's a foundation.

Not affiliated in any way with Kaiser Permanente.

Kaiser Family Foundation and Kaiser Permanente have the same relationship that Washington DC and Washington State do - named after the same guy.

[burnsei sensei]

10. Third Way?

No change!
This is no different than the paring down of health insurance and care quality in the early 1990s.
It's just taking the same process a few steps further.

[notadmblnd]

11. I'd be surprised if employers don't drop their employees plans all together

It was my fear that by compromising on health reform, that it would allow employers to dump their plans all together. So far, they say rates will keep going up while benefits will decline. How long will it be before they decide that why bother offering health insurance as part of any employment package? After all, with the destruction of unions (who made it sensible for employers to offer health coverage to begin with), who will be left to fight for the common working man?

[Winterblues]

14. And then after all that Insurance will only pay between 65-80%

If you Medical bill is $10,000. and your deductable is $5,000. you could end up paying as much as $6750. and the insurance paying only $3250. and Democrats think this is OK..That this is a great accomplishment..

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

15. Sicko's whole point was that people going bankrupt due to illness HAD insurance.

All the tables on the new predicted premiums showed that out of pockets were capped, but no one addressed the fact that for many people, even the capped costs were way too high. The counter argument is constantly - "it's still better than what it was". Whereas I think it doesn't matter if you jump out of a twenty story building or a ten story building - you're the same amount of dead when you hit the ground.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

16. evening kick. Premiums+ deductibles=unaffordable nt.