CNN: sources say Dems knew two months ago Iraq funding bill would be without time-line

[sabra]

Seems like the MSM has been quoting several anonymous Dem sources lately...

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/05/22/war.funding/index.html

<snip>

A senior Democratic senator said late last week the last-minute attempts by Democrats to get a withdrawal timeline was "political foreplay."

A Democratic leadership source told CNN some two months ago that Democratic leaders knew they would have to send the president a war funding bill without a timeline, and that would likely mean a bill with significant Democratic defections and GOP support.

The maneuvering over the past several weeks has been a Democratic attempt to show their anti-war base that party leaders were trying until the 11th hour to stand up to the president, the source said.

CNN's Dana Bash, Andrea Koppel and Deirdre Walsh contributed to this report.

:eyes:

[TahitiNut]

That's clear. K-Y Jelly was used instead of Preparation H.

:shrug:

[AndyA]

1. So, basically they're PLAYING GAMES with us, right?

Oh yeah, no reason to be serious or anything. I keep forgetting that the dead troops are just numbers and the whole war thing is just a comma.

Freaking unbelievable!

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

[sharp_stick]

8. Do you really think that cutting off funding would stop this?

I'm surprised at how much credit people give Bush. He does not give a flying shit about any of the people over there, as soon as the funding was cut, he would stop funding any training, stop giving even basic survival gear and blame the democrats. The media would buy the spin, like they always do, from whatever empty suit happened to be up that day in the briefing room and the headline would read. 100 troops killed today because the "democrat" congress refused to give them the funds.

The only way this is going to end is with a Democrat in the White House. There is no way that I can see that we will be out of Iraq before that happens.

Shrub has infested every area of the Government with his "liberty university" "graduates and they will happily do his bidding until the rapture. We need the White House to start cleaning it up and it's going to take a long long time.

[brentspeak]

12. That's pretty much the bottom line.

The Democrats are extremely limited in what they can do re. Iraq with Bush in office.

[atreides1]

13. A Dermocrat in The White House Won't Matter

If the Republicans control the Congress!!!!!!

[sharp_stick]

17. I don't know

with all the "presidential authority" shrubbie and gonzo have given the office I can only imagine the nightmare Hillary would cause the freepers.

But in reality you are right, we will need to have the all three branches at the end of 2008 to really undo the nightmare we are currently in.

[brentspeak]

9. Do you always take the word of unnamed sources?

I always make sure the information I read is confirmed before making a firm opinion on anything.

[AndyA]

34. You do understand the significance of the question mark, do you not?

I was asking a question and responding to the original post with outrage, so as not to disrupt the flow of the thread. I'm certain the truth will come out at some point, but it certainly is believable given what we've seen today, is it not?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. w/ your permission, I will quote you.

unbelievably unbelievable. If this is true, I have lost all hope for this congress. then again, I always had an itch in the back of my head, warning me about something. Now I see why.

[spanone]

2. 'A democratic leadership source'.....Let's name names CNN. I call Bullshit.

[Fridays Child]

6. Unfortunately, the facts on the ground don't appear to contradict this, in any way.

I wish it weren't true. :(

[EFerrari]

11. The planted stories sure are coming fast and furious.

This stinks to heaven.

[sabra]

14. yep, as you noticed yesterday with NBC...

[EFerrari]

19. It's so creepy, isn't it?

Thanks for keeping us current. It helps so much. :)

[sabra]

20. just trying to do my part to get DU the info...

[frylock]

26. planted stories..

Dems set war bill without Iraq timeline

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070521/ap_on_go_co/us_iraq

Dems to yield on war bill timeline

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070522/POLITICS/705220371/1022

Democrats drop insistence on Iraq withdrawal timeline

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-warfunds22may22,1,2311355.story?coll=la-headlines-nation&track=crosspromo

Dems Set War Bill Without Iraq Timeline

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/ap/story.asp?AP_ID=D8P912UG0

etc.

[EFerrari]

29. Thank you, frylock.

:)

[Phredicles]

3. Political FOREPLAY?

I guess that's 'cause they were getting ready to fuck us all over.:grr:

[patricia92243]

4. I've thought that all along, and I think it makes them look like fools. It would be better to have

sent Bush what he wanted from the very beginning than to fold looking like a bunch of weaklings. I'm very disgusted with us Democrats right now.

[gkhouston]

5. I don't consider "sources say" to differ much from "some say".

Nor am I finding CNN to be lightyears ahead of Fox in the credibility department.

Or could this "source" be named Lieberman?

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

16. I am sure...

That the Democratic Senator named in the report was, in fact, Lieberman. As for the leadership source, who knows?

[Pastiche423]

37. Couldn't have been holy joe

he's an INDEPENDENT.

My bet goes to a DCLer.

[brentspeak]

7. "Sources say"...same thing as "some people say"

Someone high up in CNN wants to spread a little bit of discord among the Democratic ranks, it appears.

[EFerrari]

22. The campaign seems to be going into a higher gear.

Joe Kennedy would have taken that as a sign of strength. :)

[partylessinOhio]

15. We been snookered again. But Madame Squeaker, he who snookers

last snookers best! Elections are coming. Hopefully, you will be sent to Hollywood or retired to your vineyards. Don't let the door hit you on your way out.

That goes for the rest of Democruts too.

:evilgrin:

[brentspeak]

18. If "sources said" that the moon was made of green cheese, you would automatically believe the story?

Sheesh. :eyes:

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

21. "See! We're sorta, maybe, kinda, later, trust us, working to end the war..if Bush apporoves."

If not...well, they'll try another "compromise".

But, they're "keeping their powder dry" until something important comes along like....campaign contributions.

[EFerrari]

25. Wall Street. That was what that secret trade agreement was.

"We have something, you have something. Let's do business."

But, isn't that what politicians do? How is that surprising? And am I too cynical to live?

We just have to keep working.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

32. Cynicism is a much derided philosophy - that probably influenced Jesus.

3. Cynic Ethics

Foremost for understanding the Cynic conception of ethics is that virtue is a life lived in accord with nature. Nature offers the clearest indication of how to live the good life, which is characterized by reason, self-sufficiency, and freedom. Social conventions, however, can hinder the good life by compromising freedom and setting up a code of conduct that is opposed to nature and reason. Conventions are not inherently bad; however, for the Cynic, conventions are often absurd and worthy of ridicule. The Cynics deride the attention paid to the Olympics, the “big thieves” who run the temples and are seen carrying away the “little thieves” who steal from them, politicians as well as the philosophers who attend their courts, fashion, and prayers for such things as fame and fortune.

Only once one has freed oneself from the strictures that impede an ethical life can one be said to be truly free. As such, the Cynics advocate askēsis, or practice, over theory as the means to free oneself from convention, promote self-sufficiency, and live in accord with nature. Such askēsis leads the Cynic to live in poverty, embrace hardship and toil, and permits the Cynic to speak freely about the silly, and often vicious, way life is lived by his or her contemporaries. The Cynics consistently undermine the most hallowed principles of Athenian culture, but they do so for the sake of replacing them with those in accord with reason, nature, and virtue.

Early Christianity

There has been some speculation about whether Jesus was heavily influenced by Cynicism. Indeed, there is a fair amount of evidence for this idea. It is generally agreed that the historical Jesus could speak Greek, and knew something about Greek culture, which would allow him easy access to Cynic teachings. The town of Goddarah, around 20 miles away from Nazareth, was a major settlement and probably home to an itinerant Cynic or two. And there is of course the parallel between the ascetic life of the Cynic preacher and the life of Jesus and his disciples, giving up their money and possessions in favour of a life of poverty. There is also the idea of the 'brotherhood of man' which comes through strongly in both. Jesus taught that the whole of humanity was your family, and this is very similar to the Cynic ideas of family. This idea would be quite shocking to a Jewish society because Judaism places very heavy influence on ties of blood. He challenged Judaism's social materialism and concentrated instead on spirituality - you get the picture by now. When you look at it, there are a huge amount of parallels between the teachings of Jesus and the Cynics (though not perhaps the early period's 'tub philosophy').

During the time of Jesus, the Roman Empire was home to a surprisingly large number of travelling Cynic preachers, so that even if there were none resident in the area it is quite probably he had some contact with them. But note the phrase quite probably; there is no actual evidence of an interface between the two at the time of Jesus.

[MadHound]

23. This wasn't foreplay, this was CYA by the Dems

They could stop this goddamn war now by simply burying all of the supplemental war funding bills deep in committee. But noooo, they have to please their corporate masters(funny, the same masters that are behind the 'Pugs) and keep this profit machine, er, war going for their benefit. All that the Dems have done is try to confuse the American people with smoke and mirrors, cover their ass on the abject failure, and then throw up their hands saying that they can't do a damn thing.

Bullshit.

Votes are running from the party like water through a sieve right now, and if the Dems don't show some courage, stand up and stop this war, they are going to lose in '08. The anti-war liberals will either flee to the Greens or stay at home, while the moderate 'Pugs who want the war to end will go back to voting 'Pug out of disgust. The corporate, DLC wing of the party will thus be unable to muster enough votes to elect anybody to any office, including dogcatcher.

If this war funding does indeed go through, the Dems can kiss it all goodbye. About the only thing that good save them in that scenario would be giving Kucinich, a man whose anti-war creds are beyond questioning, the nomination and hoping he pulls enough of the left back into the fold. Anybody else and they are toast.

Good job there Dems, not only do you consign us to more war, but you are consigning us to more Republican rule:grr:

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[brentspeak]

27. You see "no reason" to doubt the word of unnamed sources?

While those of us who demand to see actual facts and names are "pollyannas"?

Pravda and FOX News had great success tapping into that kind of uncritical, gullible mentality.

[Mojorabbit]

36. See this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3276329
This is a real congressman

[frylock]

38. uncritical, gullible mentality..

howz that Dem party treating you, brent? Gotta choose your battles, right? Keep that powder dry. Lather, rinse, repeat. See you in Sept when the dems cave again.

[Tesla]

28. They didn't want to spend their summer vacations working on funding bills

you important things need done, visiting their new Dubai vacation homes just given to them for bending over!!

[EFerrari]

30. I'm not a Dem, nor a pollyanna and I don't believe most politicians

do give a damn.

But the manipulation of the media has been stepped up lately. Make of that what you will.

[back2basics909]

31. "senior Democratic senator" = Lieberman.[nt]

[emulatorloo]

33. Since when did Karl Rove become a "Democratic Leadership Source"???

(probably rove's words spoonfed to Lieberman)

[EFerrari]

35. Since Mitch McConnell became a Democratic aide

:rofl: