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Obama has a TREMENDOUS opportunity to stand up for civil liberties...VETO THE PATRIOT ACT EXTENSION!

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Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 04:53 PM
Original message
Obama has a TREMENDOUS opportunity to stand up for civil liberties...VETO THE PATRIOT ACT EXTENSION!
Here's a great moment for President Obama. It's time for him to do what's right for American civil liberties and veto this godforsaken bill. I think Obama's numbers will go through the roof if he does this.


AP sources: Hill leaders agree on Patriot Act

(AP) – 2 hours ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — Top congressional leaders agreed Thursday to a four-year extension of the anti-terrorist Patriot Act, the controversial law passed after the Sept. 11 attacks that governs the search for terrorists on American soil.

The deal between Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and House Speaker John Boehner calls for a vote before May 27, when parts of the current act expire, according to officials in both parties who spoke on condition of anonymity. The idea is to pass the extension with as little debate as possible to avoid a protracted and familiar argument over the expanded power the law gives to the government.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jL1YcdW2mETm9K8j8FeSTn5_-alg?docId=aa7673bd9e5e4ed98dbe5f4a7ba340c5


Now is the time, President Obama. You will earn so much support if you do this.

Veto the bill.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
1. recced up to zero
apparently some Patriot Act fans at DU.
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JTFrog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
32. FFS.
Some folks will unrec just because you bitch about it on the first post. But as always, time goes on and the recs are on the positive side.

Go figure.

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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
2. Lets see how many newly minted congressmen throw a fit over this.
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
3. Now is the time, President Obama. You will earn so much support if you do this. Veto the bill.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Me thinks it is more likely hell will freeze over, but hopefully I'm wrong on this one
:patriot:
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. I too believe that BO is more likely to regulate the banks than veto this bill. But HSE
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
4. What if
it passes with a veto-proof majority? Senator Leahy and others are likely to support it, others in a revised form.

What if it passes with more than 67 votes? The temporary extension passed 86 to 12.

Maybe the best thing to do is contact Senators?



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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. I agree the Senate is the best shot
Obama supports this, no way he'd veto it.

But the senate could filibuster it, they've done it before. Then again, we had Feingold to lead us, unfortunately Russ is gone and no one has taken his place.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Not to mention - even Feingold supported about 80% of the first bill
suggesting that very few really want the entir bill to disappear,
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great white snark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. The Senate has a TREMENDOUS opportunity....
I like how you think, but your way doesn't put the blame on the President.
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Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. The official vote for this extension will take place sometime in the next week
We'll see what kind of support in the Senate it has. Even if it does have a veto-proof majority (not a sure thing yet) there's nothing wrong with taking a stand and doing what's right.

Also, if Obama fights for what's right and makes it clear that he will veto, he could very well peel away Congressional support for the extension.

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Agree, he can
perform a symbolic veto, and we can high five his courage even though the extension becomes law.

Waiting around for a Presidential veto and ignoring Congress never made much sense.


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Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. You don't want the patriot act extended, do you?
Why do you seem so resigned to the fact that this atrocity has to go through and Obama will sign it? Nothing is for sure, especially if the vote to extend it hasn't even taken place yet.

Do you want it to be extended?
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. "Do you want it to be extended?"
I don't care, primarily because I see the useful aspects of it and recognize the parts that need to be pulled. This was always the situation. Feingold wanted to amend the bill to remove three provisions, but the majority in Congress will never approach this as all or nothing.

Also, Congress has no intention of scrapping it. Obama's position is similar to most Democrats in Congress.

Forget for a second that a veto threat is never going to happen. Do you actually believe that issuing one is going to peel away nearly 20 votes?

The veto game is fun though.


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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. Hmmmm?
"I don't even know why I waste my time with people who only care about a person and not about the actual issues."

Wow, irony!


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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. OK,
consider it done.

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Here:
Senators Introduce Patriot Act Fixes to Safeguard Americans' Rights (2009)

Washington, D.C. - U.S. Senators Russ Feingold (D-WI), Dick Durbin (D-IL), Jon Tester (D-MT), Tom Udall (D-NM), Jeff Bingaman (D-NM), Bernie Sanders (I-VT), Daniel Akaka (D-HI) and Ron Wyden (D-OR) have introduced legislation to fix problems with surveillance laws that threaten the rights and liberties of American citizens. The Judicious Use of Surveillance Tools In Counterterrorism Efforts (JUSTICE) Act would reform the USA PATRIOT Act, the FISA Amendments Act and other surveillance authorities to protect Americans' constitutional rights, while preserving the powers of our government to fight terrorism.

The JUSTICE Act reforms include more effective checks on government searches of Americans' personal records, the "sneak and peek" search provision of the PATRIOT Act, "John Doe" roving wiretaps and other overbroad authorities. The bill will also reform the FISA Amendments Act, passed last year, by repealing the retroactive immunity provision, preventing "bulk collection" of the contents of Americans' international communications, and prohibiting "reverse targeting" of innocent Americans. And the bill enables better oversight of the use of National Security Letters (NSLs) after the Department of Justice Inspector General issued reports detailing the misuse and abuse of the NSLs. The Senate Judiciary Committee will hold a hearing on Wednesday, September 23rd, on reauthorization of the USA PATRIOT Act.

"Every single member of Congress wants to give our law enforcement and intelligence officials the tools they need to keep Americans safe," said Feingold. "But with the PATRIOT Act up for reauthorization, we should take this opportunity to fix the flaws in our surveillance laws once and for all. The JUSTICE Act permits the government to conduct necessary surveillance, but within a framework of accountability and oversight. It ensures both that our government has the tools to keep us safe, and that the privacy and civil liberties of innocent Americans will be protected. When he was in the Senate, President Obama was a strong ally on these issues, and I look forward to working with his administration to find common ground on commonsense reforms."

"The Government must use every legal tool available to protect us from the threat of global terrorism. But when those tools override Americans' fundamental rights and liberties, we run the very real risk of never getting them back," Durbin said. "As we move toward reauthorization of the PATRIOT Act, we're proposing commonsense changes to better protect our most basic constitutional rights. Our bill strikes a careful balance between the law enforcement powers needed to combat terrorism and the legal protections required to safeguard American liberties."

"Like a lot of Montanans, I have serious concerns about the PATRIOT Act and how it was implemented," Tester said. "What this bill will do is add commonsense so we can fight terrorism without ignoring the Constitution and without invading the privacy and civil rights of law-abiding Americans."

"In recent years, I believe our government has failed to protect the constitutional right to privacy for American citizens," Tom Udall said. "The JUSTICE Act strikes the right balance between respecting the needs of our law enforcement to pursue suspected terrorists and upholding the rights of law-abiding citizens to live free from unnecessary government intrusion in their lives. I firmly believe we can keep our nation secure without infringing on the inherent rights of the American people. "

"We must provide law enforcement with the tools they need to protect our country, and do so in a way that also safeguards Americans' rights. This legislation addresses both of these important objectives by ensuring our security and upholding our cherished constitutional protections," Bingaman said.

"Every American understands that we have got to do every single thing we can to protect the American people from terrorist attacks. There is no debate about that. Some of us believe, however, that we can be successful in doing that while we uphold the rule of law, while we uphold the Constitution of this country, which has made us the envy of the world," Sanders said.

Senator Akaka said: "The JUSTICE Act will allow intelligence agents to monitor terrorism suspects while putting checks in place to ensure that law-abiding Americans' privacy and civil liberties are protected."

"The JUSTICE Act rights some of the basic wrongs of the PATRIOT Act, which became a poster child for the Bush Administration's lack of respect for Americans' privacy rights," said Wyden. "This bill is designed to keep every law-abiding American free from arbitrary government surveillance. At the same time, it gives law enforcement the agility needed to go after actual terrorists and spies who would do our country harm."

<...>


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coalition_unwilling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
6. One can always hope, but I'm not holding my breath - n/t
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eShirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. Good one!
:rofl:
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
11. This, I can endorse.
K&R

:kick:
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steve2470 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
12. I totally agree, k&r ! nt
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kelly1mm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
13. You actually believe there is a chance in hades the President would veto this? HAHA! nt
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
15. Don't hold your breath.
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lib2DaBone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
17. If Obama lets this go thru.. (which he will)....
.. And I have to listen how Obama is not being given a fair chance and he is playing 3 dimentional chess....

Wake up people.. smell the
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Agreed, there's zero chance Obama will do the right thing in this instance
Well, he'll do the "right" thing, as in wing, but that's not what we thought "hope and change" meant... right?
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. less than zero
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/05/with-patriot-act-poised-for-renewal-reformers-will-have-to-wait/239178/

(...)

The three-way agreement appears to be a compromise in which Republicans have mostly gotten their way: Provisions will be extended, but on a slightly longer timeline than Feinstein had called for, without any oversight measures or sunsets attached.

What's odd about PATRIOT Act politics is that the Obama administration has agreed more with congressional Republicans than with its Democratic allies -- a rare occurrence, in general. At a House Judiciary Committee hearing on Department of Justice oversight on May 3, Attorney General Eric Holder voiced support for a permanent extension of the expiring provisions, the position held by Republicans. Holder said:

We believe, I believe, it is absolutely essential that these expiring provisions be reauthorized. We never want to see these acts, these provisions, expire. The fact that they have sunset, period, and requiring us to come back periodically to get them reauthorized, is not helpful to us ... We need certainty. Our prosecutors, our investigators, need certainty in that regard ... So my hope is that these provisions are reauthorized for as long as we possibly can. If they were extended permanently, that is not something we would be opposed to.
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obxhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
23. Unicorns will shit icecream while flying over rainbows
before Obama does anything like that.
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okieinpain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
29. no he should keep it, let hilry veto it when she is president. n/t.
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-19-11 11:32 PM
Response to Original message
30. Of course he'll veto it.
He's the most liberal president ever!
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
31. Well, Obama certainly has the "opportunity" to do the right thing.
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mountainlion55 Donating Member (302 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-20-11 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
33. My money
is on the --Hell Freezes Over bet! Can you say DLC.:smoke:
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