We could have had Hillary

[TheBigotBasher]

Hard working WHITE Americans them all.

Yeah right.

In 2010 America voted for cuts. So what do you get? Who do you blame? The wrong man.

So easy to start internal fights. So difficult to start a fight against this?



Really.

Yep. Oh was too hard for the left to stand up to the teabaggers when they attack health care reform, so they joined with Grover Norquist in an attempt to defeat the entire concept. The Stimulus. The banking and auto bailouts. All of that sucked. Stand with the GOP. Elect more Rethugs. That results in progress.



This counts



Not these idiots



They protested for cuts. Where were the protests against them?


NIL

You drive YOUR agenda.

[David Sky]

1. With Hillary, it would have been no different. There is no evidence

that she was that different. Sorry.

No evidence.

Republicans would have had more ammunition with Bill's personal life in the background, attacking Michelle Obama is viewed, even by conservative voters, as less than reasonable, but beating up on Bill, that would have been fine with most Americans.

Of course, I'm surprised no one mentions Bush anymore, the guy who ACTUALLY PUT US IN THIS MESS!

[TheBigotBasher]

2. My point exactly.

I personally believe it would have been a lot worse.

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Rageneau]

35. We also don't know if Gore would have been a better president than Bush.

Gore, like Hillary, was constantly criticized by the MSM, by many in her own party, and by the snarling right-wing. Obama, like Bush, had a comparatively free ride, with cheerleaders in the MSM, very little hostile criticism and the wind at his back.

Gore, like Hillary, was one of the best-prepared and experienced people ever to seek the presidency. Obama, like Bush, was a newcomer to national politics, with only the barest of qualifications and no track record.

Like Gore, Hillary was an all-star first-string quarterback with 14 years experience at the highest levels of national government and the uniformly excellent resume' of a proven fighter and a proven winner. Not a naive nerve in her body.

Like Bush, Obama was a rookie right out of college, a draft choice, a half-term senator with no heavyweight accomplishments, an inexperienced cipher that people could (and did) paint their own desired image upon.

But, sure, it's anybody's guess as to whether Gore would have been a better president than Bush, or Hillary better than Obama.

Sure it is.

[boppers]

36. "14 years experience at the highest levels of national government", LOL

"I slept next to him, therefore, I am as experienced as him"?

I'll give her 8 years of elected senatorial experience, where do the other 6 years come from?

[dionysus]

40. ROFL... in the end it all comes back to this...

:rofl:

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

44. So many exaggerations in this post, I don't even know where to begin.

Get over the 2008 primaries!!!

[Fearless]

48. Gore not better than Bush?? I don't know what planet you lived on from 2001-8

But please go back there!

:wtf:

[iamthebandfanman]

51. the gore of today

is not the gore of 2000 ..

so yes, back then he was a little more right wing.


definitely would have been a difference between him and bush though.


the comparison you are trying to make isnt valid as they are different situations all together.

two democrats versus a democart against a republican.

[MilesColtrane]

42. There's one difference I can think of.

She wouldn't have been able to get ANY kind of health care bill through Congress.

[Laelth]

60. That would have been better. n/t

-Laelth

[MilesColtrane]

62. Perhaps for you, sir.

...certainly not for the many with pre-existing conditions that couldn't buy health insurance at any price.

[FrenchieCat]

3. Rec'd!

You won't be popular, or voted up by the kool kids,
but you are correct!

Folks didn't get their precious Public Option, and have
pouted ever since about everything....while leaving
the opposition alone and ignoring OBama's accomplishments
as not measuring up to their high ass standards of expecting
Obama to remake the government by his lonesome based on the
image conjured up in their own minds.

They actually know better, but don't give a shit.
They figured they put up with Bush for 8 years,
and so now they are owed everything.

That's why they will be made to remember sooner than soon
exactly what harsh reality is. It will take Republicans back in control
totally, for some Democrats to realize that they aren't entitled to anymore
than the energy they have put out....and in this case, the only energy they
have put out has been against this Democratic President....so it is obvious,
they aren't interested in keeping him around, and so, perhaps, they will get just that.

[TheBigotBasher]

4. Just like much of Europe,

united in impotent opposition, betrayed by the third parties who promised so much.

[Number23]

28. Oh, my love. Get ready for the "EUROPE IS BETTER THAN AMERICA!!one"

storm from folks who love all things European even though they've never been there.

I'm currently living in my third foreign country. Folks here act as though the only thing keeping them out of Australia is the long and expensive flight, and not the fact that the Aussie government would turn most of them down without so much as a second glance.

But I have no doubt that of the minute handful that actually could emigrate here, the second they see their yearly taxes or pay $9 for a bunch of bananas, or realize that despite having a Green party and a few other ones to choose from, most folks still vote and favor a two-party system, they'd be on the first boat back to the USA.

[TheBigotBasher]

5. Where the fuck were they?

I would really like to know.

[FrenchieCat]

6. There were on the Internet, mad cause Single payer wasn't on the table......

then mad cause the public option was taken off the table by the
super majority fillibuster breaker, Sen. Lieberman.

Then they forgot how politics even work, and started making shit up,
jumping to conclusions, whipping up exaggerations....

Meanwhile, the media predicted that the "enthusiasm gap" would allow
Republicans to win in 2010. Of course, it is suspicious that the media made
that exact prediction an entire year prior to the election......partially
because they were the ones who helped promote the tea party.

Now the media is doing it again, betting that we will once again just sit there
and bicker amongs ourselves....meanwhile, they will be making sure that the contest
between the intelligent guy who was still able to salvage this country in spite
of how it was left for him vs. the dumbass who will say anything hateful to gain a vote
will be in a very close race.

Then folks will scratch their ass and try to figure out how it happened,
and then will do nothing more than continue to do what they've been doing; blame one man....

[TheBigotBasher]

46. There were on the Internet, mad cause Single payer wasn't on the table......

allowing the teabaggers to drive the agenda in the town halls.

[livetohike]

7. Wish I could rec your post too FrenchieCat

:-)

[dsc]

10. The reason many of us were so angry over the health care issue

was that all during the primary campaign we were repeatedly told by Obama and his supporters how evil the mandate was and what an terrible infringement of freedom they were, and then about 10 seconds after he was in office the mandate was just fine. I wouldn't have complained at all had I not been repeatedly compared to fascists for supporting the very same policy that Obama ended up giving us. In fairness, unless we were willing to use reconciliation from the get go I don't see anyway for there to have been a public option, but similarly during the primaries it was every bit as obvious that if you were going to eliminate pre existing conditions then you also had to have a mandate.

[FrenchieCat]

13. I understand.......

and I often wonder what Pres. Bill Clinton promised on health care and then didn't deliver in his first or second terms...

[dsc]

57. and that is the absolute usual answer Obama supporters give

instead of honestly admitting that you were dead wrong in the primaries and we were right. Heck there were dumb policies of Hillary that if she had been elected she never would have done (lowering the gas tax for example). The difference between us is I said at the time it was a dumb idea instead of pretending you were a facist for saying it was.

On edit by you I mean Obama supporters in general, I have no idea what your position on either the mandate or the gas tax was.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

45. THERE. IT. IS!!! +1,000!!!! n/t

[mcar]

8. This is great

Let's fight the repukes, not each other.

[CakeGrrl]

9. Rec

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[FrenchieCat]

12. Perhaps, but it was a term used by many during the 2008 elections; the primaries and the general.

"I have a much broader base to build a winning coalition on," she said in an interview with USA TODAY. As evidence, Clinton cited an Associated Press article "that found how Sen. Obama's support among working, hard-working Americans, white Americans, is weakening again, and how whites in both states who had not completed college were supporting me."

"There's a pattern emerging here," she said.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-05-07-clintoninterview_N.htm

[AtomicKitten]

31. Well, Frenchie, he can't win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCv_mDHuJSM

[CakeGrrl]

15. Tell it to

Hillary and the MSM. In 2008, she touted her support with "white Americans" and the MSM ran with it.

And still does.

Recent headline from Fox: "Obama has a problem with White women".

Chris Matthews was just recently spouting the same stuff about the President losing 'working-class white voters'.

[Evergreen Emerald]

14. Still attacking Clinton, I see--This thread is so very offensive.

[CakeGrrl]

16. When people keep putting up "I wish Hillary was President" threads, it's a fair rebuttal.

[Evergreen Emerald]

17. Not fair rebuttal. Offensive, ugly, distortions.

[CakeGrrl]

20. If one reads the post, it's clear that it's only a lead-off statement

Obviously Hillary was not the one in cahoots with Norquist or the Tea Party. The point of the OP is that there are a number of self-defeating issues on the Left - lamenting the outcome of 2008 is but one of them.

The problem around here is that so many things are MIS-perceived as attacks when they aren't. People have used misperception to stay angry and combative.

[Life Long Dem]

22. Sure is.

[paulk]

30. it seems a clear violation of the rules

but some "rules" are more equal than others...

[Dawson Leery]

18. -1

[Dawson Leery]

19. -1

Hillary is NOT a racist. Shameless garbage.

[CakeGrrl]

23. It's not garbage. For better or worse, Hillary brought it up and the MSM ran with it

The soundbites are a matter of record.

But some of you are missing the larger point of the OP to get outraged about that comment. The point is that the Left has come up with plenty of self-defeating distractions and gets away from the focus of the REAL enemy - the GOP/Tea Party.

The responses to this thread prove the OP's point to a degree.

[andlor]

38. +1

[democrat2thecore]

21. Again - Turn the language around..... -1 on this thread

"BLACK Americans them all"

Would that be acceptable here? I just wrote in another thread that I have seen a growing acceptance of threads and posts that are derogatory against white people simply for being white. That's racist. That's wrong. It shouldn't be happening (and tolerated) here.

I realize that some DUers honestly believe that all criticism of this president is because of his skin color and that's just not true. It wouldn't matter if he were purple and put Wall Street executives to run the economy - some of us would be angry. That's just no excuse for turning the tables and making broad attacks against all white people just for being white.

We're better than this.

[CakeGrrl]

25. Response: My post #23 above yours. -nt

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

50. You need to provide evidence to this fact, or else you're just plain lying.

Where is it that white people have been attached. Proof, please!!

[Number23]

24. BB, why don't you post more?

I know this place brings new meaning to the term "uninformed, impotent rage with a sprinkling of lunacy" but I remember you used to do your PUMA bashing exposes. They were great. Nice to see you trying once again to let folks know about Hamsher, but this place is a lost cause now.

Needless to say, kick and rec. But trying to get folks to see their own self-destructive stupidity has never been an easy chore, particularly when they have convinced themselves that they know every damn thing there is to know about every damn thing when in reality, they know very little.

[wisteria]

26. Oh please, the RW would have found another way to attack and demean her.

And, frankly, I never have yearned for a Hillary presidency.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seaglass]

29. Another Obama as victim post. I smell desperation. n/t

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[efhmc]

33. As much as I love Hillary, should of would of could of doesn't work.

[Vattel]

34. Probably would have been a little better than the person we got.

But both are way too rightwing for me.

[Vinca]

37. I don't think Hillary would have been much different . . . except

I bet she would have kicked a little ass and that would be refreshing.

[uponit7771]

39. Good point on the Tax Cut protesters, the vast majority of those who are bitching now COULD'VE...

...been making sure those people who were in the Tea Party looked like the cooks they are

[Honeycombe8]

56. So THAT'S who the Tea Partiers are.....cooks????!!!!! Now we know! nt

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TrainToCry]

43. Good point.

[shellgame26]

47. K&R

[Ter]

49. And we would have all been better off

Obama doesn't hold a candle to Bill Clinton, and having Hillary would have been the closest thing to Term #3 for him.

[iamthebandfanman]

52. Agree hillary would be just the same on most everything BUT

Obama is still doing a bad job... and if it were Hillary, id say the same thing.


I cant believe people on DU are back to arguing which corporate sellout is better than the other.

[LaydeeBug]

53. It's not hard to "fight against this" Now if only Obama would start. nt

[Marrah_G]

54. Pretty sure she would have been pretty much the same

The powers that be are NEVER going to let someone be taken seriously unless they know the person will play ball. That's just a fact. It all goes back to the money. No money, no chance of election.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

55. If HRC Is A Racist What Does It Say About The Person Who Made Her America's Face To The World?

~

[Yavin4]

58. Life Under President Hillary Clinton....

We would have had virtually the exact same economic team that Obama has.

We would have had the pretty much the same foreign policy team that Obama has.

We would have had Monica Lewinsky, "Where is she now", stories and probably a reality show.

We would have had Paula Jones, "Where is she now", stories and probably a reality show.

More women coming forward saying that Bill Clinton slept with them.

More trumped up scandals involving Bill Clinton's global charities.

We would have had more of a sexist Tea Party instead of a racist one.

She would compromise even more with the Republicans.

And DU would be flooded with, "We could have had Obama" threads.

[TheBigotBasher]

59. Hear hear...

and we still would not have been targeting our ire at these fucks

[StevieM]

61. I think Hillary would have been a great president and I think Obama is a great president (eom)

[Number23]

64. I feel the same.

[Zorra]

65. Only an honest Progressive Democratic President would have

taken the critically important steps necessary to begin fixing the mess we are in.

The best way to cure an infection is to eliminate the source of the infection. Aspirin and NyQuil don't cut it when dealing with a potentially fatal critical illness.

The source of our national infection is wealthy private interests influencing and controlling our government.

Until a strong and serious Commander-in-Chief steps up and forces wealthy private interests out of our government completely, we will continue to have leaders that appease and pander to our deadly internal enemies, and who do basically nothing toward curing the deadly virile infection that is crippling and killing our country.