Democrats "have grown increasingly suspicious of Obama’s motives over the past year"

[brentspeak]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/debt-talks-bring-tensions-between-democrats-obama-to-surface/2011/07/21/gIQAXeVnSI_story.html

Debt talks bring tensions between Democrats, Obama to surface

By Paul Kane, Thursday, July 21, 9:23 PM

One after another, Sens. John F. Kerry (Mass.), Barbara A. Mikulski (Md.), Maria Cantwell (Wash.) and others demanded that (White House budget director Jacob} Lew explain what the president was doing.

The Democrats were winning, the senators said. The American people were with them on tax increases for the rich and the notion of “shared sacrifice.” Why give up now? Why cut a deal without guarantees of new tax revenue?

For 45 minutes, the cross-examination went on, with few details offered. When Lew left, Mikulski turned to her colleagues and said: “I haven’t seen a meeting like this in my 35 years in Congress.”

snip

Often kept in check out of loyalty for their president, congressional Democrats have grown increasingly suspicious of Obama’s motives over the past year.

[Hand_With_Eyes]

1. Ya think?

Wonder why that is?

[Sarah Ibarruri]

2. Obama is either isolating himself and fantasizing, or he doesn't want a second term. nt

[WinkyDink]

4. I'm thinking more and more that what Obama "wants" is completely irrelevant to his reality.

[TheWraith]

5. Or, maybe, the bubble that DU lives in doesn't represent reality. nt

[madfloridian]

10. I think where most of us live IS reality.

Deny it or not, doesn't matter.

[TheWraith]

11. Clearly not, if people believe the nonsense that gets passed around here as fact. nt

[riderinthestorm]

17. Clearly the bubble Obama lives in means he doesn't get that 80% of Americans want higher taxes

on the rich. Or the fact that 80% of Americans don't want SS, Medicare or Medicaid alterations. Or the fact that slashing services in a recession/depression isn't just "nonsense", its damn dangerous....

Any other 'facts" you believe are nonsense?

[TheWraith]

19. Speaking of 80%... 84% of liberal Democrats approve of Obama's job performance.

So either one has to stipulate that 84% of liberals are stupid and blind, or else DUers aren't as accurate as they think they are.

[riderinthestorm]

24. Link? I'd love to see the data. nt

[TheWraith]

52. Here you go.

"Even though enthusiasm is down, 84% of liberal voters still approve of the president’s performance. So do 54% of moderate voters. However, 86% of conservatives disapprove."

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/obama_administration/demographic_notes_barack_obama_approval_index

[saras]

30. This demonstrates that "Liberal Democrats" is defined funny, but not much more

[madfloridian]

41. One of the polls is skewed and wrong.

I go with the one in which a huge majority do NOT wants cuts to the safety nets. That is more believable.

[hfojvt]

42. stupid and blind?

Why not? Aren't the majority of them getting their information from the M$M? How much would I know about Obama's various betrayals if all I watched was ABC news and read the local paper? I think they have spent more time covering the NFL strike then they have these budget negotiations. And there may have been something else, about the mighty Casey jury striking out.

[TheWraith]

53. Problem is, those "betrayals" are imaginary.

If you spend all your time reading Republican-funded rags like FireDogLake, which constantly report nothing but nasty things about Democrats--most of which are either made up entirely or spun out of all recognition--of course you're going to believe the worst. That doesn't mean it matches up to reality. Internet "news" sources can be just as full of crap as Fox News, but some people don't care because it's preaching to their preconceived notions.

[AlabamaLibrul]

43. I wouldn't tell a pollster I didn't approve of his job -- even though I don't. n/t

[glowing]

56. Ok, if I get a call from a polling company and they ask me if I approve of

Obama's job performance, I'm inclined to say I'm ok or favorable of his job performance. The last thing we need is for the pundits to spout off that NOBODY, including his party, approves of his job performance. It would just make for a big time controversy...

So, while I do not support the crap he's bargained away and all the backroom deals and all the secrecy he said that would be opposite in his Hope & Change campaign, I would not allow the polling firms control the conversation when it comes to democrats within our own party disagreeing.

Now, if the DCCC or any other Democratic Party entities call to ask me for money or for time in supporting President Obama, I kindly tell them that I didn't think I was voting for a Hoover. I felt he understood enough history to know that we needed a Modern New Deal. We need a medicare for all or at least a Public Option. If Big Business is going to sit on cash and not hire, the govt needs to tax and hire the public directly. Once govt starts investing, business starts snowballing from there.. People with money and new services always pick up new innovations or start ups... We could have taken one of the Big 3 car dealerships and turned it into high-speed rail car development and building. How many jobs would fall in place with the engineering, designing, and building of high-speed rail, trolly's, trams for the country and for metropolitan areas that desperately need to rid themselves of the congestion with public transportation... Shoot, every little transport "hub" would house a coffee stand and a hot dog cart, an umbrella man, or a sunglass hut. Short sighted except for giving into the rich henchmen and their quarterly reports.. There's a reasont the govt is NOT supposed to run like a business or a Family with a budget. Its for times like these when people need a helping hand; govt of, by and for the people ought not be the foot that steps on that hand asking for help.

Anyway, I'm dissapointed that his speeches were just speeches. I had hoped just a little bit he'd take the country back into the world of sanity. However, he's allowing the pigs and their corporate backers to continue down the road for our destruction. At some point people will have no choice but to break... and we don't really want to.. we just want the system to actually work.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Maven]

51. Yes. We should all live in Jay Carney's world.

That is reality. Really!

[Sarah Ibarruri]

21. Maybe so, but my reality is what my future will look like, and anyone who sells out my future....

is definitely not on my side.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Dept of Beer]

29. Or perhaps the bubble you live in...

[riderinthestorm]

3. Horrifying if true. Pretty damn scary. nt

[nc4bo]

6. If Congressional Dems feel this way, how the hell do they think WE feel??!!

If it's all a joke, game, chess match whatever - this chick is just too damn dumb to get it.

[brentspeak]

8. Why are you bashing Mikulski?

She's on our side.

[nc4bo]

12. I'm NOT, I'm referring to myself!! nt

[brentspeak]

13. Sorry, misunderstood your post n/t

[nc4bo]

14. Tis ok brentspeak...

:hug:

[Brickbat]

7. What took them so long?

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[loudsue]

15. The problem is...that isn't an option. The two political parties drink from the same trough

and there is no way votes are actually going to change that. Enough bashing by the media and the whole game is called.

This isn't a democracy, I don't care what the old history books used to say.

[polichick]

18. I agree; this is no democracy.

[roxiejules]

35. Trapped in a two-party prison

with our government acting as an indentured servant for global corporations.

[Lorien]

27. At the very least he needs to run as a repug. nt

[craigmatic]

16. I think he has some of the Clinton people from 96 advising him on what's neccessary to win

next year eventhough the same lessons don't apply. Clinton's dsems in congress weren't united or particularly liberal. The dems left in office now are liberals and have done big things and Obama is trying to play to the right which makes him look reasonable in comparison to the teatards but makes him look like a traitor to some of the policies he helped put in place.

[Liberalynn]

20. The lighbulbs are finally turned on

hope they stay that way.

[BlueIris]

22. Glad to see a certain Democrat on that list finally facing reality.

I have been extremely frustrated by my Party's seeming inability to address the serious problem with the executive branch. Regardless of where it goes from here, it's frightening to me that we've let it get this far.

[Larkspur]

23. If Obama goes along with cuts to the Big 3, I want these Dems to vote against Obama

on whatever budget deal the Prez thinks is a Grand Bargain, that is a bargain for the wealthy but a bane to middle and working class Americans.

[kenny blankenship]

25. Do you think they're finally catching on?

I don't. If they could maintain their illusions about him through the health "care" debacle, they are too stupid to figure it out now. Well maybe the 2010 "shellacking" started to open some eyes - who knows?

[Lorien]

26. No shit Sherlock. How many betrayals does it take? nt

[Hell Hath No Fury]

31. DiFi -

is one of the more conservative Dems there is -- if she is unahppy with what is coming out of the White House (and she is) then things are far more fucked up and dangerous than we think. :(

[FreakinDJ]

32. DiFi wasn't even mentioned in the Op

[Hell Hath No Fury]

38. Try reading the article --

she's at the end.

[wiggs]

33. So maybe dems have to step up for what THEY want and be

proactive about it. Unite. Craft a position. Speak the truth. Obama is a consensus builder so dems have to pull on their end, hard, to keep the conversation where it belongs. In the absence of strong dem position, the center will be pulled to the right.

Without a united, strong stance I just suspect that some dems say these things because it's just their turn to be 'good dems'...and that the thing is choreographed and scripted to the last vote. That's the way it's been. There are always just enough outraged dems and just enough 'practical' dems. If that's the way our dem leaders in congress play it, then Obama will seek the middle from there.

If we had 100 Bernie Sanders (who is NOT an extreme lefty, just a normal progressive) then the left's position would be much more clear. As it is now, the left's position is not at all clear or defined. The right's position is damn clear.

Although I wish Obama would act more like a progressive, this isn't all on him. Our dem leaders in congress must push back, define themselves, take a stance, message clearly, and own the issues in deed not just on paper.

[OneGrassRoot]

46. Well said, I agree. :) n/t

[Bluebear]

34. It can't be true!!!1 Jane Hamsher!!!1 truthourt!!!1

:cry:

[QC]

37. They never really, well, you know.

:P

[FreakinDJ]

36. A little Late to figure they have a Dog in this Fight

Been saying for weeks - "Were are all the DEMs"

So now at the last minute they want to rear their head and make demands. They should have been out giving interviews filling the news cycle, sending petitions/letters to the White House all along taking the TeaFarty RATpubliCONs to task over what they are trying to do to America;s Poor and Elderly.

Don't get me wrong - I fully appreciate them finally showing up - but instead of taking the lead in this they are merely the little kid not wanting to go to sleep asking to get a drink of water at 10:45

[Cali_Democrat]

40. They should be suspicious of Obama

Obama's actions prove that he can't be trusted when it comes to standing up to the Republicans and protecting programs like SS, Medicare and Medicaid.

[dreamnightwind]

44. I see this as good news

since I came to the same conclusion about Obama quite awhile ago. Now maybe some real Dems will step up and oppose him.

[slay]

45. They better be - I'm sure onto it - and onto them too

somebody better start acting like real Dems, stand up for SS and Medicare, and for taxing the super fucking well off rich in this time where many are suffering due to the rich outsourcing all our job - or else that so called Dem shouldn't run again. I really wish Sanders or Kucinich would primary him. Hell have Nader register as a Dem and do it - but somebody needs to do something - Obama is to the right of Reagan! Something has been wrong since DAY ONE - since no mention of single payer and NO fight for public option. Day one! :mad:

[LooseWilly]

47. Obama seems to be using his 'bully pulpit' primarily to bully his own party into line...

He used it to shut up the Progressive Caucus over the Public Option when they tried to rebel at the last minute and force a public option into the final HCR bill... and now he seems poised to use it to shut up "the left" of the actual politicians in order to get his "entitlement reform" trimmings through.

It's good to see that there are some Congresspeople/Senators who noticed the last time and seem to be wary of being hustled by "hope" and trust... again.

It seems to me that an outpouring of support for Congress Members in advance of a possible need to vote against crappy deals proposed/negotiated by the White House might help keep our local reps from selling us out in the mistaken belief that we support personality over policy.

It's time to make some calls and have some opinions & constituent info logged by staffers for the possible consideration of some Congress-Folks—our only hope to protect us from Obama's Negotiations.

[bvar22]

48. If THIS guy were President, we would KNOW what is going on!

Transparency
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5t8GdxFYBU

[slipslidingaway]

55. "Public Will Have 5 Days To Look At Every Bill That Lands On My Desk"

'...meeting will be open to the public, no more secrecy...'

That sounded good.

[Marrah_G]

49. Gee- I wonder why.

Just hearing the mans voice now makes me change the channel. Lies, bullshit, lies, propaganda

[blkmusclmachine]

50. You can't fool all the people all the time

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

54. Good. It's about time they wake up to the obvious and "make" him as he demanded.

Being lap dogs to a 3rd Way centrist hasn't worked.

[hifiguy]

57. Gee, I wonder why?

After you've been thrown under the bus once, it's pretty damned easy to see when it is happening to you again. I no longer trust the man any further than I could throw Vicodin Limpballs.