Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

A Few Points about London

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
 
alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 08:30 AM
Original message
A Few Points about London
1. Whether people have political intentions is not the sole criteria for determining whether a particular event is political in nature. Reading politics through individual beliefs rather than social conditions is a deeply conservative tendency.

2. Particular forms of "criminality" are produced in particular social formations under specific social and economic conditions. The idea that we default to some bellum omnium contra omnes when lacking social controls is another deeply conservative idea.

3. There are three dimensions to any riot: a) the intentions, beliefs, or desires of the participants; b) the social and economic conditions within which such intentions, beliefs, and desires can occur, c) the general transhistorical crowd dynamics that appear common to riots across geographical and historical contexts. To focus on any one of these factors may yield valuable insights about a riot event, but it will always be a partial insight when lacking the other dimensions.

4. One can analyze without celebrating.

5. Riots are dangerous and destructive, and much less "exciting" to onlookers when you are caught in one, rather than observing from a safe distance, or through a screen.

-------------------------------------------

"The destructiveness of the crowd is often mentioned as its most conspicuous quality, and there is no denying the fact that it can be observed everywhere, in the most diverse countries and civilizations. It is discussed and disapproved of, but never really explained.

The crowd particularly likes destroying houses and objects: breakable objects like window panes, mirrors, pictures and crockery; and people tend to think that it is the fragility of these objects which stiumlates the destructiveness of the crowd. It is true that the noise of destruction adds to its satisfaction; the banging of windows and the crashing of glass are the robust sounds of fresh life, the cries of something new-born. It is easy to evoke them and that increases their popularity. Everything shouts together; the din is the applause of objects. There seems to be a special need for this kind of noise at the beginning of events, when the crowd is still small and little or nothing has happened. The noise is a promise of the reinforcements the crowd hopes for, and a happy omen for deeds to come. But it would be wrong to suppose that the ease with which things can be broken is the decisive factor in the situation. Sculptures of solid stone have been mutilated beyond recognition; Christians have destroyed the heads and arms of Greek gods and reformers and revolutionaries have hauled down the statues of saints, sometimes from dangerous heights, though often the stone they wanted to destroy has been so hard that they have achieve only half their purpose.

"The destruction of representational images is the destruction of a hierarchy which is no longer recognized. It is the violation of generally established and universally visible and valid distances. The solidity of the images was the expression of their permanence. They seem to have existed for ever, upright and immovable; never before had it been possible to approach them with hostile intent. Now they are hauled down and broken to pieces. In this act the discharge accomplishes itself.

"But it does not always go as far as this. The more usual kind of destruction mentioned above is simly an attack on all boundaries. Windows and doors belong to houses; they are the most vulnerable part of their exterior and, once they are smashed, the house has lost its individuality; anyone may enter it and nothing and no-one is protected any more. In these houses live the supposed enemies of the crowd, those people who try to keep away from it. What separated them has now been destroyed and nothing stands between them and the crowd. They can come out and join it; or they can be fetched."

- Elias Canetti, Crowds and Power
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
1. or... do they get to shoot? nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Not ib G.B. Gun ownership is a no no. nt.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. true. but in my world, if alternative is join or forced out, i see another alternative. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Chorophyll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 09:05 AM
Response to Original message
4. Thank you for this extremely intelligent post.
I see very little, if any, connection between the UK riots and the uprisings in Greece or the Middle East, and I wish that people would not try to force this event to be something it isn't through wishful thinking.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GliderGuider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
5. Excellent post! What an insightful bit of fresh air.
Edited on Tue Aug-09-11 09:10 AM by GliderGuider
Let's hope it slows down the rather surprising blamefest around this issue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-09-11 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Why, thank you
:-)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed May 01st 2024, 02:06 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC