OK, english professors and common sense folk..

[ObaMania]

.. why is Obama saying of the McCain camp "If they bring knives.." not considered hate speech or violent rhetoric.

Is the above a figure of speech?

Also, why would the guy in Hollywood who hung a mannequin of Palin in effigy from his home a few Halloweens back not be considered someone inciting violence against the right?

[Hannah Bell]

1. it might be if he made such remarks about republicans as a matter of course.

and obsessively focused on demonizing the opposition.

but he doesn't.

unlike certain people who already get too much attention for their anti-social behavior.

[HEyHEY]

2. I don't think burning anyone in effigy is appropriate

As for the knives/guns remark I think it was a poorly chosen figure of speech.

[hlthe2b]

3. English professors?

:shrug:

Are they now the arbiters?

[ObaMania]

6. Lol, no.

While I'm sure there are some on here, it was meant to be a call for everyone's "inner" English Professor. Didn't mean to single them out as arbiters hence the common sense folk qualifier. :hi:

[eShirl]

4. Sean Connery's famous "Chicago way" line in "The Untouchables"

"You wanna know how to get Capone? They pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. *That's* the *Chicago* way! And that's how you get Capone."
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094226/quotes

[sweetloukillbot]

7. A line written by Pulitzer prize winning playwright David Mamet

There, showed off my inner English professor... :-)

[OneGrassRoot]

5. IMHO, it was poor judgment to use that phrase. It was used ONCE.

It didn't become his mantra. No Democratic politician or high-profile liberals have consistently used violent or vitriolic rhetoric that I'm aware of; I've asked for examples to show me otherwise and have yet to see them.

I'd still like to hear President Obama express regret for having used that sentence that one time. Set an example; accept personal responsibility, something we have yet to see from anyone in the public eye on the right except for that WWF guy.

There are definitely more low profile and "regular" citizens on the left who have used violent rhetoric and images, like the Palin effigy of which you speak. I condemn all of those actions and words. They have no place in a civil society, in political discourse.

There is still no comparison between what we've seen from the right in the last two years, made acceptable when Palin entered the scene, and the left. Such behavior became not only acceptable (for which I hold the media largely responsible), it seemed to be required to use vitriol and violence in order for anyone on the right to raise campaign money.

[john donathon]

8. just a question

how many high ranking repukes have consistently used violent or vitriolic rhetoric consistently? Evidence? Links? video? Just want to review so i can have something to talk about to the repubs at work.

[EFerrari]

9. There have been lists all over for days. Cenk does a good job here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=385&topic_id=542498&mesg_id=542498

[Turborama]

12. Thanks for that link, missed it earlier

Will watch and comment later.

Damn! The needle on my trolldar just went off the dial!

[Laelth]

17. Mine too. n/t

-Laelth

[Viking12]

16. Why do I think john d. is not really interested in the evidence?

[OneGrassRoot]

10. I consider Palin, Beck and Limbaugh high profile...

Sharron Angle's campaign; Jan Brewer of AZ.

Pretty much anyone associated with the Tea Party has made gun and violence-related rhetoric their accepted language when conversing about politics.

And, quite frankly, the only example even needed is Palin's target graphic, accompanied by what became her speech one-liner: Don't retreat, reload.

The fact that both the imagery and verbiage wasn't condemned by other conservatives is telling in and of itself.

Tons of examples if you Google Tea Party public figures.

[justiceischeap]

11. Maybe I'm going to try too hard to explain this away, but here goes

I think there's a difference in what Obama said, "If they bring knives, we'll bring guns" and what the right, who uses these kinds of phrases all the time. It's clear, so extremely clear, that his use of that phrase was metaphoric. When people like Palin talk about lock and reload, or Sharron Angle speaks about 2nd Amendment solutions, or someone says bullets not ballots, though these too can be explained as metaphor, the feeling is different. You stop and say, "On some level, do they really believe this?"

When you have members of their party showing up at rally's with guns and rifles, it takes on a whole other context. When Obama said what he did, I took it to mean, if they're going to be tough, we're going to be tougher. There are some conservatives, when they use their ballistic language, that make me not want to leave the house for fear of running into one of them or their ilk. That, IMO, is the difference.

[OneGrassRoot]

13. I agree. They are proud of a gun culture....

which, in and of itself isn't a "bad" thing.

However, many of today's Tea Party members -- leaders and followers -- use their love of guns in a threatening, belligerent way (they always have; we can simply identify this particular type of conservative as a Tea Party member now, for the most part).

They know it; they know we know it. Any deflection as crosshairs are just a metaphor, and "picking up arms" being about voting are flat-out lies.

They know it, we know it.

[justiceischeap]

14. And the extreme Teabaggers come from the Patriot movement

and we know all about their agenda and it's always the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.

[bemildred]

15. Palin is not "the right".

Both items you mention are inconsistent with civilized political debate. Politics has always been a very dirty business, here and elsewhere. Obama has run remarkably clean campaigns, as these things go. He can afford to, he's the pick of the litter.

The knives and guns cliche is a figure of speech, and a fairly empty one.

Fear and Rage are never sound bases for political activity, mostly they just increase your toolishness. If you are serious about politics you want your wits about you and your emotions under control.

[WinkyDink]

18. Well, first of all, the conditional "If" is not to be ignored. Secondly, it was just a wise-arse

quote from a movie set in the President's former "home-town."

Thirdly, it is not an exhortation to action. "Re-load" is.

Finally, it is not a routine type of speech for him (context counts as well as the words used).