When will we all grow up?

[PhillySane]

Adults have conversations. Adults know responsibility. Adults don't kick and scream like two-year olds when they don't get their way.
This isn't a left or right thing. It's a wrong or right thing. And I'm talking about behavior. America's behavior. If you want your children to learn something, stop acting like a child. We are their role models after all.

A nine year old girl was killed in Tuscon last Saturday, trying to be grown-up. Trying to be like an adult. Participating in democracy. That is the saddest aspect of what happened. Obama is 100% correct. This really isn't about anything else right now. And everyone, left, right and center needs to acknowledge that. Stop, take a look at yourself. Listen to what you are saying. Do you want your kids to behave that way? To constantly blame everyone else for what is wrong? We are what is wrong. We can't exchange ideas anymore. We can't listen. We can't compromise. Three very important things that adults should know how to do.

I will only speak for myself right now. I need to grow up. I won't stop having opinions, or stop disagreeing with those opinions that aren't like mine. And I won't stop trying to discuss them with everyone else. You may even be able to persuade me to see it your way, if it makes sense to me. And if it doesn't, okay. We can still get along. We can even be friends. Big deal, you have a different political view than me. But lets just talk.

Let's grow up.

[FiveGoodMen]

1. That's what I've been wondering for a decade now.

[svsuman23]

2. great message!

[Pyrzqxgl]

3. How many kids will be afraid to attend political events, or parents for that matter.

[seabeyond]

4. at what point do we put a discussion to a kickin screamin tantrum. you say

emphatically, all knowing, it is not a right or left thing... it is a wrong or right. ok, as an adult, i disagree to degrees. am i allowed to say i dont agree with you, totally, or is that me having a tantrum

what if i see the adult way is to discuss the hate rhetoric, because i believe it precipitates these behaviors. am i suppose to shut up because i dont agree with you.

i understand that there are those on the board that feel it is all about mental illness, and there are not clear lines to political. i can respect that. i dont agree. to me, the event and evidence shows it is a political thing.

but i am not demanding that you believe what i do. i have shared my views. i agree with some. i dont agree with others. i dont agree with obama that we dont suggest it is a right thing.

and, i still valued and appreciated his speech last night, and him as our president.

for me, that is being adult.

[HughBeaumont]

5. Unrec.

Not finding common ground with people who refuse to waver from whiskey-throttle Trickle-on economics, cowboy foreign policy, "screw-the-lazy-poor" groupthink or red-baiting/racist hatemongering.

The further to the center WE move, the further to the right THEY move. And for some dumb fucked-up reason, they ALWAYS seem to get their way, and America is far worse off and crippled from it.

They're the ones who need to change, NOT us.

[pintobean]

7. Rec

I think you totally missed the message.

[HughBeaumont]

9. What did I miss?

That I should somehow "be the better person" and give credence to the ideas and policies of greedy idiots who have done nothing but ransack this country stem to stern in order to line their pockets? That I should sit calmly and listen to the brilliance of Fox-"News" droolers who believe in the most boneheaded economic policies known to mankind, liken you and I to "commie traitors" and would like nothing more than to see us die quickly so they can breathe our air?

That it's "mature" to just let this country go down the rat-hole of corporatist ruin, all for the purpose of continually pleasing a vastly overfed and underworked handful?

No.

"Bright-siding" and "compromise" has allowed nothing but canyon-sized long-term problems for our children's children. They're effectively killing our voice. It's disingenuous to believe that Republicans and the wealthy care about anything other than themselves.

[uppityperson]

12. No. That we get past dichotomous "us vs them", get past dehumanizing others

by calling them names and insulting them. It doesn't mean don't accept things being how they are but looking at how you react and act to them and those involved. Issues, not personalities. Good grief, am I channeling skinner?

Edited to add that I am not calling you out, simply seeing how I interpreted the OP.

[HughBeaumont]

15. With modern Republicans?

:rofl: :rofl:

Yeah . . . because that's what they're all about . . . "reason and understanding". Hoooo boy.

[uppityperson]

18. whoosh, you missed it again.

[HughBeaumont]

21. Someone's missing something, and it ain't me.

Just like the right overassume the wealthy's benevolence, everyone on this thread assumes you can talk reasonably to a modern Republican equipped with against-their-best-interests politics. You can't.

Stupid policy is stupid policy, and I'm not entertaining it as serious discourse.

[girl gone mad]

22. We can't even get centrist Dems to show a modicum of respect toward liberals.

Jane Hamsher gives a reasoned criticism of Democratic policy and she gets called "firebagger" (whatever that even means) and "hamster".

This type of childish invective is encouraged and cheered by half the posters here.

I don't have much hope that people are going to rise above.

[uppityperson]

24. Indeed. It is possible to disagree civilly, without resorting to violence or dehumanizing language.

I have a pretty poor view of humanity as a whole, but can always hope and must try.

[EFerrari]

28. It isn't dehumanizing to call anti-social behavior what it is.

In fact, it is re-humanizing to expect, and to demand when necessary, that people behave as responsible members of society.

/typing

[uppityperson]

30. I didn't say it was. It is dehumanizing to call people names to show they are less than human

democRATs, repugs, etc etc etc. Of course it is not dehumanizing to call anti-social behavior what it is. It IS dehumanizing to call others name meant primarily to show they are less than you are. One describes behavior, the other insults the person to make them less.

Call out anti-social behavior, call out assholery. But you don't need to make those being anti-social into less than humans, "them" vs "us".

[orwell]

11. It's easy...

"And for some dumb fucked-up reason, they ALWAYS seem to get their way,"

The RW philosophy aligns with the dominant CorpoState philosophy, unbridled unfettered capitalism.

Private property is holy. Public commons is theft.

The use of SkyGod© as meta-narrative and hot button issues like "baby killing", "gay rights", and "gun rights" are used as organizing tools to shut off all rational discussion with a large segment of the population.

Keep 'em fearful to keep 'em in line.

Modern societies are enormously complex. People are inherently fearful of complexity. Fight or flight feeds the lizard brain quite well. In essence most of our genetic lines got this far because we were willing to use either cunning or force to survive. we are effectively modern apes in business suits wielding nuclear weapons.

As long as the right aligns with the dominant corporate oligarchic hierarchy it will be promoted ad nauseum through the corpo-media.

If the left suddenly aligned itself with the modern fascist state and the right went all biblical on their ass everything would magically be different.

Follow the frickin' money...

[patrice]

13. It IS completely possible to be strong and honestly Liberal and Left without

having to "respect" what is wrong in others. It's a matter of being honest enough to genuinely share what you do share with them and, THUS, hold them accountable for same, e.g. the love of Freedom, this land, History, community, respect for the truth . . . .

There isn't much that MUST be sacrificed in such relationships, unless one or the other party to the relationship wishes it so and if that IS the case, respect for the truth means that fact also cannot/must not be denied either. It is because we do not talk to/about one another honestly and constructively that makes this discussion of the actual priorities of our values (not impossible) but just RARE.

[hfojvt]

6. I don't wanna

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8HMSf4O2FM

[valerief]

8. I'm grown up.

[Fire Walk With Me]

10. "It is time to put down childish things." -Obama (and another book)

[patrice]

14. Not all dichotomies are false, HENCE, it is NECESSARY to recognize those which are/are not.

The status quo is that everything is assumed to be dichotomous and that is not the truth, so those things which are actually dichotomous are sold for cheap in the confusion.

[Urban Prairie]

16. Unfortunately there is absolutely no way to inspire most of the rightwing to "grow up", IMO.

Especially the most extreme RWers, as all only admire and desire to have more power, money, influence and authority than any of them already possess.

The only way to gain their full respect, and expect to communicate/collaborate with the RW is to be feared by, and/or pretend to be one of them.

Keep your friends close and your enemies closer, that old saying is why I have an email address that is dedicated solely to RW feeds and updates. I have signed up and registered on several, such as Townhall as well, although I have not posted on any of them very much lately.

[patrice]

17. a low-key Socratic approach might be helpful. nt

[emilyg]

19. Good message.

[woo me with science]

20. K&R nt

[Raine]

23. I thought this country had finally grown up when it elected Obama but

the worst was yet to come. The childish brats that didn't get the person they wanted elected have thrown the absolute worst spoiled brat tantrum of all time. :-(

[EFerrari]

25. As a grown up, I appreciate the President's effort and disagree with him.

And with you, I suppose. I am not what is wrong. I can exchange ideas. I can listen and I can compromise. But an adult, I know better than to compromise with anti-social behavior.

Grown ups don't agree to false equivalences to keep the peace at any cost. Grown ups don't avoid problems. Doing both of those things got us exactly here. Grown ups understand logical consequence, like the consequences of allowing sociopaths to rule our airwaves.

The truth is, we have a massive problem in this country with violent, inciting right wing hate speech and if we don't acknowledge it and deal with it as adults, there will be more funerals in our future. At a minimum. At a lower level, our right wing hate problem informs every aspect of our political environment and shapes our public discourse, behavior and outcomes.

[spanone]

26. philly, sane

r

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

27. Your first 3 sentences define our great American leaders...

...captains of industry and politicians, alike.

EDIT: They must be great, right, because they make the most money, hold the most power, and they get all the media attention, and after all, that's what it means to be a great leader in America.

[End Of The Road]

29. Sadly, I think it's too late.

I just read on another thread that back in November 78% of liberal and moderate republicans supported the republican agenda.

78%! In order to elect some of the crazies we now have in DC, a bunch of people who consider themselves LIBERAL REPUBLICANS must have voted for the likes of Rand Paul. (Either that or their numbers are so few that they couldn't prevent it.) Republicans are tending further and further from the middle. How do we find common ground with a group that not only feels that we're wrong, but that we're evil? And where would we start? About the only issue we have in common is hatred of the TSA.

Democrats can set a place at the table for them, but they are NOT going to show up. Gridlock will continue until something catastrophic happens (probably economic), and it will be too late.

As a country, do we need to grow up? Probably. Do we need to grow a brain? Definitely.