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Whoop, There It Is... 'The Cop Group Coordinating The Occupy Crackdowns' (With Homeland Security)

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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:20 PM
Original message
Whoop, There It Is... 'The Cop Group Coordinating The Occupy Crackdowns' (With Homeland Security)
The cop group coordinating the Occupy crackdowns
Shawn Gaynor - San Francisco Bay Guardian
11.18.11 - 11:23 am

<snip>

As cities across America evict encampments of the Occupy Wall Street movement, similarities of timing, talking points and tactics among major metropolitan mayors and police chiefs have led critics to wonder: Is some sort of national coordination going on? The White House says there’s no federal oversight. Speaking November 15 aboard Air Force One, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said “The president’s position is that obviously every municipality has to make its own decisions about how to handle these issues.”

But a little-known but influential private membership based organization has placed itself at the center of advising and coordinating the crackdown on the encampments. The Police Executive Research Forum, an international non-governmental organization with ties to law enforcement and the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, has been coordinating conference calls with major metropolitan mayors and police chiefs to advise them on policing matters and discuss response to the Occupy movement. The group has distributed a recently published guide on policing political events.

Speaking to Democracy Now! On November 17, PERF Executive Director Chuck Wexler acknowledged PERF's coordination of a series of conference-call strategy sessions with big-city police chiefs. These calls were distinct from the widely reported national conference calls of major metropolitan mayors.

The coordination of political crackdowns on the Occupy movement has been conducted behind closed doors, with city officials and PERF refusing to say how many cities participated in the conference calls and the exact nature of the discussions. Reports of at least a dozen cities and some indication of as many as 40 accepting PERF advice and/or strategic documents include San Francisco, Seattle, New York, Portland, Oakland, Atlanta, and Washington DC.


<snip>

More: http://www.sfbg.com/politics/2011/11/18/cop-group-coordinating-occupy-crackdowns

The Democracy Now piece: http://www.democracynow.org/2011/11/17/paramilitary_policing_of_occupy_wall_street

:mad:

:kick:

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. "The group has distributed a recently published guide on policing political events."
I'd like to see a copy of this document.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. As Would I...
:hi:

:kick:
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eShirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. is this it? from their website...
Chief Concerns: Police Management of Mass Demonstrations: Identifying Issues and Successful Approach
http://www.policeforum.org/bookstore/
Code: 852
Cost: $22.00
ISBN: 1-878734-95-4
Pages: 96

Description:

To order call 888-202-4563.

Chief Concerns: Police Management of Mass Demonstrations - Identifying Issues and Successful Approaches addresses many of the challenges for police officers in a democracy in handling mass demonstrations. From spontaneous disorder after athletic events to highly organized protests against international monetary policies, local law enforcement agencies have encountered demonstrations that require every available resource to contain. In addition, police actions seem to be the subject of increased monitoring by third parties, including news agencies, amateur reporters, and civil rights organizations, all of whom are armed with video cameras. These developments exert sustained pressure on law enforcement to "get it right".
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. I found a pdf for mass demonstrations, posted below.
But, it may be corporate fluff.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #11
159. Motorola, a major federal and law enforcement contractor, is the PERF sponsor. Note, also what this
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 08:59 PM by leveymg
publication has to say about federal involvement in planning and organizing the police response to major political events.

First, note that Motorola is the primary sponsor of PERF:

This publication was supported by Motorola, Incorporated. The points of view expressed
herein are the authors’ and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Motorola, Inc.,
or individual Police Executive Research Forum (PERF) members.



http://policeforum.org/library/critical-issues-in-policing-series/MassDemonstrations.pdf

See, in particular, pages 9, 14 and 43 dealing with planned federal involvement and escalation, intervention, and command over major protest events and designated National Special Security Events (NSSEs). P 17 discusses Memoranda of Understanding between local and federal agencies. P 43 is interesting in its description of tactics employed against mass demonstrations and targeted arrests of leaders)


p. 9 (Bear in mind, this section describes planning for events such as national political conventions where there will be VIPs present, but it does give one the scope of potential federal involvement in what is described elsewhere as "major events".

8 — Chapter 2. Planning and Preparation


box 2.1 National Special Security Events


by Tony Narr

In May 1998, President Clinton issued Presidential
Decision Directive 62 (PDD-62), which in part
included a classified document dealing with the
coordination of federal counterterrorism assets
for events of national interest that are deemed
National Special Security Events (NSSEs). The
designation of an NSSE allows the U.S. Secret
Service (USSS), the lead agency for designing and
implementing the operational security plan, to access
ample resources and ensure public safety by
forming partnerships with other federal, state and
local law enforcement and other security and public
safety agencies.

There are only a few events that the Department
of Homeland Security (DHS) designates as
NSSEs each year. Recent designated events include
the 2004 Democratic National and Republication
National Conventions and the G8 Sea Island
Summit. These events were good examples
of effective coordination and cooperation among
federal, state and local homeland security and law
enforcement resources. The DHS and its many
component agencies have provided tremendous
support to local law enforcement charged with
ensuring the safety of the masses who gather for
these types of large events in their cities. For
events that do not meet NSSE standards, DHS’s
Operations Integration Staff (I-STAFF) established
an Interagency Special Events Working
Group (SEWG) to develop federal consolidated
security plans. This new system categorizes

events into Levels I, II, III and IV, corresponding
with the internal FBI Special Events Readiness
List (SERL). The factors that contribute to the
level designation include federal participation, location
of event, available threat assessment and
state and local resources available. At this writing,
DHS is expected to publish a Special Event Standard
Operation Procedure in the near future.

Local law enforcement agencies must work
with their governors to request an NSSE designation.
A governor can ask that an event be considered
an NSSE by formal request to the Secretary
of DHS. The request is reviewed by the NSSE
working group, composed of representatives
from the USSS, FBI and FEMA. These representatives
gather facts and make a recommendation
to the Secretary, who makes the final decision.
A number of factors are considered when designating
an NSSE. First, the USSS determines how
many dignitaries are expected to attend the event.
Any event that may be attended by government
officials or foreign dignitaries may create an independent
federal interest in ensuring safety and
increasing resources. Second, the size of the
event may increase the need for additional security
measures. Large events may draw the attention
of terrorists or other criminals, increasing the
attractiveness of the forum as a target for employing
weapons of mass destruction. Third, the
significance of the event may be historical, political
and/or symbolic, which may also heighten
concern about terrorist acts or other criminal
activity.1

1. More information on National Special Security Events can be found at the U.S. Secret Service website:
http://www.secretservice.gov/nsse.shtml, and at the DHS fact sheet website: http://www.dhs.gov/
dhspublic/interapp/press_release/press_release_0207.xml.
Chapter 2. Planning and Preparation —9


demonstrations, even celebrations, resulted in
unprecedented brazen violence for which they
were not prepared.




P. 14

14 — Chapter 2. Planning and Preparation


MUTUAL
AID
AND


MULTI-AGENCY
COORDINATION


Mass demonstrations—because of their size, potential
for violence, and the sheer demands they
can place on an agency—often require the host
agency to call upon neighboring law enforcement
agencies for assistance. A significant challenge
facing the lead department is the coordination,
training and deployment of a multi-agency force
in a crowd management situation. For example,
the Boston Police Department; the Federal Bureau
of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
(ATF); and other agencies involved in the
planning and handling of the 2004 Democratic
National Convention recognized they could not
handle the event without collaboration. Understanding
that shared responsibility and unprecedented
cooperation would be essential to a successful
police operation, the Boston Police
Department sought and received the assistance of
scores of outside agencies to manage the event.
(See article by Boston Police Department legal
advisor Mary Jo Harris, later in this section.)

As mentioned earlier, because large-scale
events often take place in a variety of venues that
span jurisdictional lines, multi-agency cooperation
is a key factor. As such, one initial goal of the
external planning process should be to develop
written agreements that outline the roles and
rules for each of the agencies involved in the joint
endeavor. The general content of Memoranda of
Understanding (MOU) between public safety organizations
can be thought out and structured in
advance, but experience has shown that there are
often unanticipated last-minute issues. In order
to mitigate such issues, several topic areas should

be addressed through stipulations prior to a
multi-organization event agreement. They include
the following:


Mission

Direction—joint philosophical framework

Supervision

Assignment of personnel

Authority (deputation)

Joint organizational structure

Equipment

Funding, payment and financial processes

Joint facilities agreements

Internal and external communication plan

Liability and legal services

Documentation and tracking system
agreement

Operational plans

Use-of-force policy

Duration
An example of a comprehensive MOU was
created by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police
(RCMP) and the Calgary Police Service (CPS),
and can be found in the 2002 G-8 Summit After-
Action Report produced by the Calgary Police
Service (Perry and Kerr, 2002). Another example
is an MOU defining relationships between the
Metropolitan Police in Washington, D.C.
(MPDC), and several federal and local agencies.



p 43.


Chapter 5. Roles and Responsibilities — 43


The Boston Police Department and all of its
federal, state and local law enforcement partners
prepared for the 2004 DNC using a multilayered
command structure. The Multi-Agency Communications
Center (MACC) was established to
serve as a Strategic Center staffed by top or very
high-level personnel from the representative
agencies. This was the “big picture” command,
where overall event management was centered.
Critical decisions such as requesting major external
resources or approval to deploy chemicals, for
example, would be addressed by the MACC.

The Joint Operations Center (JOC), where
another command-level group of representatives
from participating agencies was housed, was responsible
for executing and modifying the response
and contingency plans. All field reports,
intelligence and other information were coordinated
there. Using all sources of input, the JOC
determined if course corrections were in order
and communicated those orders to the tactical
level.

The Tactical Operations Center (TOC) is
where those directions from the JOC are translated
to actions in the field. While keeping both the
MACC and JOC informed and carrying out their
designated roles, the TOC commanders were responsible
for directing field units.

COMMAND
PROTOCOLS


Command protocols are necessary to inform and
direct decision making so that strategic, operational
and tactical commanders know what they
are expected to achieve and how they will do it.
Command protocols also must address potentially
competing demands. For example, the senior
investigating officer may require time to investigate
a crime scene during an incident, and these
demands might conflict with the operational
commander’s ability to protect the scene. These

conflicting demands often compete for available
personnel and equipment as well. The key principle
for any command protocol policy is that each
commander involved knows the following:


His/her role, responsibilities and objectives;

What resources are allocated to meet those
responsibilities and objectives;

His/her geographical or functional area of
operation; and

The contingency plans for transfer of command
when there is:

Federal intervention, if a major/terrorist
incident occurs

Specialist team deployment (e.g., a
firearms or hostage incident within the
main operation).
In an operation involving mutual aid with
other police or support agencies, there must be
an agreement that this command protocol will
extend to those additional agencies.

CRIME
INVESTIGATION


Studies on recent mass event disorders show that
in many well-publicized events, protesters seeking
to direct negative media attention toward the
event or the police have developed deliberate
programs intended to force confrontations with
law enforcement agencies or other protesting
groups. Operational plans, therefore, should emphasize
the potential need for a proactive criminal
investigation to detect and address suspicions
or signs of unlawful activity aimed at physical
confrontation. The early assignment of a senior
investigator to manage the investigation is valuable.
Likewise, personnel dedicated to gathering
information and intelligence must be in place to
support the strategy. A detailed policy guide to

44 — Chapter 5. Roles and Responsibilities


general investigative policing can be found in the

U.S. Department of Justice publication, The Attorney
General’s Guidelines on General Crimes,
Racketeering Enterprise and Terrorism Enterprise
Investigations.2

SPECIALIZED
UNITS


Specialized units can fill critical roles during
mass demonstrations. Some agencies have
learned that the careful deployment of specialized
units can have a significant positive effect on
managing the demonstration. They are often better
able to move among the crowds, allowing
them to collect intelligence and even dissuade
criminal activity. Below are examples related to
the use of specialized units during mass demonstration
events.

Bicycle Patrols

The Miami Police Department opted to organize
a bicycle patrol to escort all major parades and
rallies during the FTAA meeting week. They
worked in two teams or platoons, each with radio
access to high-level supervisory personnel. Bicycle
officers could not only provide a rapid response
(unlike cars or vans that would be impeded
by heavy vehicular and pedestrian traffic), but
also present a nonthreatening image to protestors
and the media.

CART Teams

The Seattle Police Department deployed four
Chemical Agent Response Teams (CART) to support
demonstration management platoons at the
WTO. CART teams were deployed—under the

control of the incident commander—during those
hours in which the largest crowds were expected.
Hoping to maximize their former training and existing
experience, all the CART team members
were current or former SWAT officers. Each team
consisted of a sergeant and three or four officers
with specific experience in the use of chemical irritants
or other less-lethal impact munitions.

Cut Teams

At recent events protestors have been known to
employ “sleeping dragons” to disrupt traffic or to
create a diversion. Protestors link themselves together
by placing their hands into hollow piping
with metal or cement fortification on the outside
of the pipe. In order to separate or remove the
protestors, the pipes must be cut. The Miami Police
Department staffed, trained and fielded four
“cut teams” to handle such actions. They were
staged and scheduled in staggered shifts to provide
maximum coverage throughout the event,
but were instructed to remove these individuals
only if they posed a threat to health or safety. Fortunately,
the cut teams were never called to action.
The FTAA after-action report notes that
protestors may have decided against the use of
sleeping dragons “due to media coverage of the
expertise developed by those officers charged
with removing such devices (Timoney 2004).”




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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #3
17. 'Third parties'?? The press is a 'third party' now?
The truth is that UNTIL these thugs show up, there has not been any violence in eight weeks of dozens of huge demonstrations, sometimes lasting all day. The cops arrive, and they start the riots, and even then, I have to give credit to the protesters, the violence comes from them, almost 100% of the time.

They really don't like those citizen journalists. And why, if they are acting as they should, are they worried about these 'third parties'? They HAVE been controlling the press. We noticed how the press always leaves, just before the police start attacking and rioting against peaceful protesters.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #17
25. The NYPD issues press credentials and lately, they are picking and choosing
which ones to honor, if you can fucking believe that.

I've been following some MoJo reporters on Twitter and one of them reported that once when he said he was press, he was asked who he was with and when he said Mojo, he was told to take a hike.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #25
73. I hope they challenge it
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #73
111. At the very least we need to challenge the use of Homeland Security
against the citizens. They work for us not the good damn corporations. Either they are the DHS working for all of us or they are the SSS working for the corporations. I think we need to contact our legislators and the WH about this at least. That is our own tax money they are using to destroy us and they call it security?

They are the new CIA with their own agenda and their own definitions of security. Like the CIA they have no interest in democracy.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #111
115. "They work for us..."

Really? Are you of the ruling class? If not, they ain't working for you.
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #115
119. No I was a public worker for years - the years when we knew that
we worked for the people. My suggestion is that we remind the public workers of that again. Too bad you are in such a bad mood today.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #119
124. The security apparatus is different than your average public...

worker. They are the iron fist of the ruling class. Listen to the libertarians, they would dispense with all public expenditure except 'security'. They are the priests of capitalism.
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #124
128. On that I agree with you - is there no oversight of DHS?
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #128
130. It's a Cabinet level department....

so......
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #130
131. Oops.
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dotymed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #111
158. The homeland security personnel that I have had the
displeasure of meeting (post Katrina) were to the man, slovenly bullies. Seriously, I don't know how they choose them, but I wouldn't be surprised it's from a prison lottery. Maybe I met the wrong ones, either way, we don't need more Fascism in this police state.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #25
75. Wow...that is jaw dropping
The NYPD issues press credentials???

Has this ever happened with any other situation?

I'm stunned.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #75
78. No conflict of interest there at all, right?
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #25
89. Well, now they are completely out of control because
they arrested several reporters who actually did have Press credentials from THEM. And they also attacked two of their own rightwing reporters, the one who had the argument with Matt Damon and a colleague. She stated that it was the protesters who 'were actually very kind' to her when they helped after the attack. It will be interesting to see if she changes her attitude now.
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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #25
96. Why that sounds like licencing the press.

I think that directly contradicts the purpose of the First Amendment.
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nineteen50 Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:11 AM
Response to Reply #25
99. It's called embedding
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #99
127. Yep.
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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #17
95. Good points. Especially about controlling the press. nt
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
21. Looks like it, doesn't it? nt
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AlbertCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #3
105. Identifying Issues and Successful Approach
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 09:31 AM by AlbertCat
They have really concretely identified the issues!




And, boy! has their approach been SO SUCCESSFUL!



:sarcasm:
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sandyd921 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #3
122. sustained pressure to "get it right"
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 11:28 AM by sandyd921
Really?

Wonder what their definition of "right" is?

:shrug:
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unionworks Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
134. "Armed" with video cameras???
As opposed to batons, mace and guns?
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Shining Jack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #134
143. +1 n/t
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
4. They were certainly successful in promoting and spreading the idea that the President is in on it.
It never occurred to me that some within federal agencies might be working with RW fuckwads connected to big city police fuckwads.

And we end up fighting among ourselves.

Fuck those fuckers.

K and R.

x(
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Fighting Amongst Ourselves Is How The 1%, And The Power Structure, Wins...
Divide and Conquer... eh?

:shrug:

:hi:
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Zactly!
:hi:
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dixiegrrrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. Great find!!!!
Bookmarking.
K&R.

:yourock:
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nineteen50 Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:17 AM
Response to Reply #8
100. I think we need to get our heads
out of the old understanding of left and right, and think and
act on what is best for the 99% and forget about parties make
this movement truly new dawn.
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Zorra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #8
112. Again: The 1% has more resources at its disposal than all the rest of us
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 11:19 AM by Zorra
put together.

They can hit as on every front.

Except for numbers. We can surround them if we get the numbers.

Please, support and/or participate in the OWS movement.

Solidarity.
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Sirveri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #112
151. The 1% only has 35% of the wealth. Though they do have the instruments of state.
So all working together, we could tell them to shove it, the problem is getting all of us to work together.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
23. Imo, it's a mistake to make this about Obama.
We know this problem is systemic, not personal, and has been developing for decades. He has a responsibility as would any chief executive but making it about him will only upset us all and not get us anywhere.

Smarter imo would be to track down how this is working all over our country, to learn as much about it as possible and so be better prepared to deal with it and to try to minimize people getting hurt as much as possible.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #23
33. +1
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #23
34. Oh I Agree... But I Would Like A Strong Statement... And Some Hearings, For The Record...
:shrug:
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nineteen50 Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:26 AM
Response to Reply #34
102. Do you think
Obama is part of the problem or part of the solution? This
goes beyond Obama. We need to get outside the old box and
allegiances and on to new insight and solutions not just more
of the same in a different package.
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #23
41. Or we could just demand that the Prez call Janet N. and tell her to knock it off!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. I don't think that would work. The corporate influence is too ingrained.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #44
139. Re Obama, that's the sad point -- when it comes to corporate influence, he has always been on wrong
side of anything to do with corporations --

Would be nice to think he's not involved or aware and doing nothing --

but it's his Justice Department -- his Homeland Security, so to speak.

Certainly the WH is aware of what's being said about his involvement !



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geek tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #41
50. What EVIDENCE is there of DHS's involvement again?
This story doesn't provide any.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #50
55. That's Why We Should Have Some Congressional Hearings... You Know... Put This Thing To Bed...
Nothing like calling in ALL possible actors to explain to us why we are totally wrong.

I'd love the chance to be proven wrong...

If it walks like a duck...

:shrug:
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #55
123. Unfortunately the gop run the committees that can call hearings.
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #123
152. Democrats still control the Senate.
They can have hearings and they have subpoena power.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #50
59. Have they issued any statements denying it yet?
The story of their involvement, and they ARE involved with the NYPD we know that, has been all over the place, including in the foreign media. They have not responded, have they? Yes or no, it's simply. But for some reason, they have chosen not to address the issue.

So yes, let's have hearings. If our government is treating Americans like the enemy, the people ought to know about it.

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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:43 AM
Response to Reply #59
81. The story has been all over the place. Unfortunately, the evidence to back up the story has not
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 12:49 AM by jeff47
The Examiner took a break from it's usual tabloid coverage to put out an anonymous quote saying DHS and the FBI were directly involved. They provided no other evidence.

Lots of other people have been citing the Examiner story. But all that reporting is built on that anonymous quote in an article from a publication that usually pushes Government/Space Alien conspiracy theories.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 03:25 AM
Response to Reply #81
90. I am aware of that. But since it is all over the media,
I am sure that the FBI and the DHS are aware that many people now believe they were involved, and yet they have not made any statement denying it.

But we do know now that the attacks WERE coordinated, and there is a link to the DHS and PERF. And we are all entitled to come to our own conclusions. Mine is that they were involved. I know they work with the NYPD so this would not be the first time they worked with the police.

Ray Kelly has some pretty shadowy stuff going on in his department and reporters have always had a hard time getting him and his lying media rep, Browne, to return calls to answer questions about exactly what is going on in that department, long before this movement began. There seems to be no oversight of these police departments, or else, they have carte blanche now to view and treat the American people as terrorists. Because they don't seem to feel threatened at all by what the public thinks. So who is making them feel they can do whatever they want?

There needs to be serious investigations of our police departments now. A lot has been revealed that is extremely disturbing, not to mention the crimes committed over the past number of weeks against innocent people.
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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #90
160. As if a denial would do any good.
"But we do know now that the attacks WERE coordinated"

Yes, but coordination is not coordination by DHS or the FBI.

"and there is a link to the DHS and PERF"

No there isn't. There's a connection with PERF, which appears to be a lobbying outfit. To say their coordination is the same as DHS's coordination is false. "Ties" to DHS are asserted with no enumeration of those ties. Assuming that they are the lobbyists they seem to be, the "ties" could be as strong as contacts with DHS and hiring former DHS employees like all lobbying outfits....That's not the same as following DHS's orders or bringing DHS's orders to local police.

"I know they work with the NYPD so this would not be the first time they worked with the police."

I'm not saying it is impossible for them to get involved. What I dislike is the leap to insisting they were involved based on no real evidence.

If there had been some DHS personnel on the conference call, then that would be evidence. But all we have so far is an anonymous quote from a tabloid, and a presumption of guilt because the same company lobbies police and DHS.

"So who is making them feel they can do whatever they want?"

We are. When was the last time one of them or their supporters lost an election over their corruption? Fundamentally it is up to us citizens to police the police force. But a lot of us buy into the fear-mongering too much and give the police free reign.

"There needs to be serious investigations of our police departments now. A lot has been revealed that is extremely disturbing, not to mention the crimes committed over the past number of weeks against innocent people."

Yes, but investigating a DHS/FBI link is a waste of time, unless there's some evidence of it's existence. Investigate the police and those ordering them to do this. But railing against DHS for it, and then railing against Obama for it, just deflects the issue away from the police.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #160
161. Don't have time right now to show the link.
But it's there, and all that is left now is to find out how much of a role they played. Also, where is the money coming from to pay for all this abuse of citizens? We are going to be doing that research over the next few days. DHS sends money to the states. It will take a little time, but worth it to find out how much and how much of that money is being used for these attacks on citizens.

Have to run, but you are wrong that there is no link. And again, why will they not return calls, make a statement?
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Magoo48 Donating Member (315 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #59
94. They really don't care if we know. Any hearing is before those already bought and paid for.
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nineteen50 Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #94
104. Sounds like we are dealing with
King George the third.
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geek tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #59
148. Yes, they denied it. So did the President's spokesman. nt
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:23 PM
Response to Reply #148
153. Got a link to the DHS's denial, the FBI's?
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 07:23 PM by sabrina 1
Because they might have been lying, if indeed they have denied it, given the new information now available regarding PERF and its ties to the DHS.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #41
138. +1 -- Homeland Security is certain a model of fascism --
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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #23
98. +1
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #23
116.  So we should not approach our congers persons and the WH on
the misuse of DHS funding?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #116
125. The question can be raised without personalizing it. nt
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Dutchmaster Donating Member (195 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #23
129. It needs to be about Obama.
He is the top dog, allegedly. Remember the buck stops here?


It just needs to be not ONLY about Obama. He doesn't get a pass. DHS supposedly answers to him.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #129
140. +1 --
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #129
146. Making any issue about an individual is a loser
and as for responsibility, my post addressed that.
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suffragette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #23
137. Agree with you. This problem is systemic and it look like new systems such as the fusion centers
which meld local, state and federal and private and public organizations are engaged.
Once these systems were constructed, they were ready to be made use of in this way.

And I think the little we've learned so far is likely just scratching the surface of how they're involved.

We need to put those disparate items together to get a more full picture of that.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2338578

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2337714
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #137
142. +1000%
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #4
54. If we could only get word to Obama that this is happening..
Then he would put a stop to the violation of the people's rights.

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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #54
101. Um, and he can't read reports that people are being arrested and ask, what for?
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 09:20 AM by caseymoz

Reports of arrests are in the mainstream press. He can't get curious about this worldwide Occupy thing he's been hearing about and look at a feed? You'd think he would after somebody took a shot at his window and police searched the Occupy camp for the suspect.

I'm not going to argue the president's involved in the police actions, but we can't make his eventual support our strategy, either. It's much easier for him to get information than you're assuming, and for some reason, he's not responding to it.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #54
132. If only the President could use his bully-pulpit to articulate this message to all American
governors, mayors, police chiefs, and the like rather than his press secretary just conveying to the locals that it's up to them how they handle their local situations (as if they knew, cared, or gave a diddle-dy shit about the 1st Amendment). :patriot:
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unionworks Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #54
135. Hilarious
...good one!
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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #54
136. Oops! Fell for it. nt
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WildNovember Donating Member (726 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 02:17 AM
Response to Reply #4
86. Not only big cities; small ones too, and counties. I became aware of the coordination
of our PD with higher agencies while working for a social service org.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #86
145. Don't Want You To Name Names, But...
Is there any way you could give us a comparable hypothetical situation to give us a sense of what it was you became aware of ???

Without giving yourself away.

:shrug:

:hi:


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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #4
117. divide and conquer
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
5. K&R n/t
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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R
Thanks for this WillyT.
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Dragonbreathp9d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
7. Wow! Thank you!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. WillyT, do you think this could be it? PDF re mass demonstrations.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 08:44 PM by EFerrari
http://www.policeforum.org/library/critical-issues-in-policing-series/MassDemonstrations.pdf

On the other hand, I read in the Bay Guardian comments that these people lobby for TASER, so their publications may be the kind of crap corporations put out that really don't say anything.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Could Be... But Let's Not Let Anybody Off The Hook... What I Mean Is...
(And Fat Fucking Chance, at this point)

But maybe somebody in the Democratic controlled Senate, could... you know... hold hearings...

Bring the mayors, their police chiefs, Janet Napalitano, Eric Holder, Michael Bloomberg to be sworn in and testify...

I know it's old school, but I would wager that C-Span would get some major ratings boosts with such a hearing.

:shrug:

:hi:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. If I had some whites, lol, I'd sit here and look for the profit motive.
Edited on Fri Nov-18-11 09:00 PM by EFerrari
Some guys that sell weapons hire stink tanks like this one and grow a web all over the country, buying some key politicians along the way to grease the wheels -- because you know that's where these tactics originate, as a rationale for those purchases. LRAD, TASER, tear gas, tanks.

The Mayors are like the middle management guys that players need but mostly to talk over their heads among themselves. And especially now that the Feds have their hooks directly into communities via fusion centers and Secure Communities and so on.

In other words, how did an LRAD unit wind up at Occupy Oakland? Whose property was it and how was it funded? City, county, subsidized by the state or with Federal funds or what? Paging autorank, lol.

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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. Most Excellent Point...
And when did we allow military weaponry into the realm of domestic protest?

Damn.... maybe the black helicopter dudes were right all along...

It's just that the helicopters were coming for us... not them.

:shrug:

:yourock:

:hi:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. The black helicopters were coming for our money
and couldn't care less about us.

lol

:hi:
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arcane1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
49. "when did we allow military weaponry into the realm of domestic protest?"
When the existence of a flushable toilet meant that druggies could destroy evidence before police could enter.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #49
64. LOL !!!
I had not realized... until this moment... that toilets were military weapons.

:rofl:

:loveya:

:hi:

:evilgrin:

And yet... many should be.

:yoiks:

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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
57. 'how did an LRAD unit sind up at Occupy Oakland? Whose
property was it and how was it funded?'

From the Military? I just read a very disturbing article about units of the Military being 'deployed' to the 'Homeland', to help with 'civil unrest' working with 'local authorities'. And, I will have to find it again, but airc, it did talk about 'non-lethal weapons' claiming that they would be used for 'control' rather than 'lethal weapons' as they were using in war.

The article was on Army Times in 2008. I do not know if has Congressional approval, but it certainly seems totally unconstitutional to deploy the military to the streets of this country.
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dadzilla Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #9
109. I would appericate anything that covers tatics on a pratical level.
anything that covers tactics on a practical level. I believe it's time activists started studying these police organizations with the same diligence they study us.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
10. They planned, in advance, the decision to shut out the media. (nt)
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. And in Oakand, at any rate, using the same tactics the Pentagon used
with embedded media in Iraq, right down to the Info Officer's tour.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
16. The AP reported that 40 police departments 'had coordinated
their efforts' to crack down on the Occupy movement. People scoffed at the claim, but this does say '40', so it looks like there will be more.

It's also interesting that this group is International. We noticed eg, that whenever there are crackdowns here, they also occur in almost identical fashion, in other countries. Eg, Paris and Sydney Australia occupiers were on Twitter the same time as the crackdowns here, which I was following on Twitter, and people began to notice the similarities of how they were doing it. So, are our police now 'Global Corporate Cops'? I think we need some investigations into this.

The people pay for civilian police, they pay a lot. If they are no longer working for the people, then we should not have to pay for them. We need a new police force and we need the money to pay them. This alone should have the country up in arms.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. NYPD consults in other countries all the time,
spreading their sweetness and light globally. I bet L.A. does, too, and maybe Boston and Chicago. All four departments are pits of corruption.
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #16
62. Good point. Quit paying global finance security goons.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 08:57 PM
Response to Original message
18. WTF???
"an international non-governmental organization with ties to law enforcement and the U.S. Department of Homeland Security,"

INTERNATIONAL organization? WTF?

Sooooo -- tell me, how is this WH going to explain how an INTERNATIONAL group *suddenly* was coordinating efforts to suppress free speech and use violence against American citizens?

Fascist fuckwads. Tell me again that famous saying -- *Everybody Chill, I got this.*

REALLY? Want to claim you *got this* too? :grr:
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #18
42. plus+++
:thumbsup:
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Aquavit Donating Member (5 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
20. K&R
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Bonhomme Richard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
24. Who fiances PERF? I'd like to know.
Will have to do some research.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. About PERF:
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Ironic That PERF... Is One Consonant Away From PERP...
Might wanna see the perfs do the perp walk one day.

:D

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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
30. some apologies may be due here to those who were spanked for saying....
...the attacks on Occupy camps are coordinated.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. DHYB
Can ya guess??? (BTW - I agree)

:evilgrin:

:hi:
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Remember Me Donating Member (730 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:24 PM
Response to Original message
32. I consider this exceedingly dangerous
exceedingly fascist. International? Bad, bad news.
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:51 AM
Response to Reply #32
85. I agree...

if it was our own government, at least we would have some say. Shades of 9-11.
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:31 PM
Response to Original message
35. Clicking on their Board of Directors gets a 404 error.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. I Got This... With Phone Numbers...
:evilgrin:

BOARD OF DIRECTORS

President
Commissioner Charles Ramsey
Philadelphia Police Department
(215)686-3367

Vice President
Chief Charlie Deane
Prince William Co Police Dept.
(703)792-6652

Secretary
Chief Tim Dolan
Minneapolis Police Department
(612)673-3559

Treasurer
Chief Rick Braziel
Sacramento Police Department
(916)808-0816

Member At Large - Elected
Chief Edward Flynn
Milwaukee Police Department
(414)935-7200

Member At Large - Appt - Leg Chair
Chief William Blair
Toronto Police Service
(416)808-8010

Member At Large - Appt - Mem Chair
Chief Ralph Godbee
Detroit Police Department
(313)596-2763

Ex Officio
Sir Hugh Orde
Association of Chief Police Officers
001 44 207 0848976

:shrug:

:hi:
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. okay....
...who are the operating staff?
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. Here Ya Go:
Staff Directory

Name Title Phone

Alicia Armstrong Receptionist/Staff Assistant (202)466-7820

Nathan Ballard Research Assistant (202)454-8311

Jacob Berman Research Assistant (202)454-8333

Colleen Berryessa Research Assistant (202)454-8318

Jennifer Brooks Travel/Office Coordinator (202)454-8323

Jason Cheney Research Associate (202)454-8331

Balinda Cockrell Research Assistant (202) 454-8322

Megan Collins Research Associate (202) 454-8328

Craig Fischer Director of Communications (202)454-8332

Craig Fraser Director, Management Services (202)466-7820

Heath Grant Director of Research (202) 454-8327

Kevin Greene Legislative Specialist/Research Coordinator (202)466-7820

Molly Griswold Donaldson Senior Research Associate (202)454-8344

Ken Hartwick Finance Director (202)454-8330

Debra Hoffmaster Senior Associate (202)454-8327

Daniel Kanter Project Assistant (202)454-8320

Christopher Koper Director of Research (202)454-8317

Robert Kreisa Senior Associate 865-474-1640

Bruce Kubu Senior Research Associate (202)454-8308

Charlotte Lansinger Executive Search Consultant (301) 639-3020

Kit Lau Accounting Assistant (202)454-8334

Andrea Luna Chief of Staff (202)454-8346

John Mason Receptionist/Staff Assistant (202)466-7820

Shannon McFadden Research Associate (202)454-8345

James McGinty Project Assistant 202 454 8329

Gerard Murphy Director, Homeland Security & Development (202)454-8314

Tony Narr Director, Management Education (202)454-8316

Rebecca Neuburger Membership & Operations Administrator (202)454-8300

Richard Overman Consultant (386)478-1584

Raquel Rodriguez Accounting Manager (202)454-8338

Sunny Schnitzer Research Associate 202-454-8320

Bill Tegeler Deputy Director, Management Services (202)454-8337

Tam Vieth Executive Assistant (202)454-8326

Chuck Wexler Executive Director (202)466-7820

Daniel Woods Research Associate (267)269-1205
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #43
52. it's up to us to research these names
find out the networks
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #43
53. Willy, where did you find this? n/t
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:05 AM
Response to Reply #53
77. Here:
Link: http://members.policeforum.org/about-us/staff_directory.dot

The left hand side is the motherload.

:hi:

:kick:
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
37. Board of Directors page missing from PERF website
How CONVENIENT!
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
38. non profit tax exempt?
papers would be public, in that case
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arcane1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
40. I'm interested to know if this "international non-governmental organization"...
has been "advising" any departments in other countries as well
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. Haven't Found Much Yet, BUT...
This could prove interesting...

CRITICAL ISSUES IN POLICING SERIES: Is the Economic Downturn Fundamentally Changing How We Police?

Link (.pdf file): http://members.policeforum.org/library/critical-issues-in-policing-series/Econdownturnaffectpolicing12.10.pdf

:shrug:

:hi:
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. questions
1. who are the staff members?

2. how is PERF funded?

3. does PERF make donations to campaigns?

4. what are the functions of PERF?

5. what kind of coordination is there with DHS, with think tanks?


What I know so far is that PERF conducts reviews of candidates for police chief jobs and makes recommendations. That's an opening for ideological stacking.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #40
47. These people do cops but they probably have cognates
all over the cabinet.
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 09:51 PM
Response to Original message
45. Hold on, there were several threads saying this was not going on
and the mayors denied everything, said they were innocent, and no conspiracy or coordination was taking place.

Since this news story doesn't conform to that, I refuse to believe it, and this story itself must be a planted conspiracy! <sarcasm>
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #45
51. Shhh... Don't Blow My Cover Man !!!
:D

:hi:
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #45
56. Oh yes: There is NO conspiracy to uncover re the mayors that partook in their common conference call
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #56
60. What do you need besides the Official denial? Come on!
:)
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Eyerish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
58. K&R
This is a great find...
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intheflow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:39 PM
Response to Original message
61. That is essential viewing/reading.
What an interesting interview, with such diverse participants. Both Norm Stamper and Judge Smith's perspectives gave very unique insight.
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bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
63. Every post is distorted.
Members should read the body of your posts instead of the deceiving headlines. My family is deeply religious, according to your logic, that makes ma a flaming jesus freak. The way you contort information to distort shit is a wonder to behold. Maybe getting a grip would be a good idea?
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #63
67. Where is the distortion?
We were told that there was no coordination. Democracy Now, you know, that 'conspiracy theorist' Amy Goodman, has just proven otherwise.

But a little-known but influential private membership based organization has placed itself at the center of advising and coordinating the crackdown on the encampments. The Police Executive Research Forum, an international non-governmental organization with ties to law enforcement and the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, has been coordinating conference calls with major metropolitan mayors and police chiefs to advise them on policing matters and discuss response to the Occupy movement. The group has distributed a recently published guide on policing political events.

Speaking to Democracy Now! On November 17, PERF Executive Director Chuck Wexler acknowledged PERF's coordination of a series of conference-call strategy sessions with big-city police chiefs. These calls were distinct from the widely reported national conference calls of major metropolitan mayors.

The coordination of political crackdowns on the Occupy movement has been conducted behind closed doors, with city officials and PERF refusing to say how many cities participated in the conference calls and the exact nature of the discussions. Reports of at least a dozen cities and some indication of as many as 40 accepting PERF advice and/or strategic documents include San Francisco, Seattle, New York, Portland, Oakland, Atlanta, and Washington DC.


From the horse's mouth. Now could you please point out the distortions? .
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #67
120. police state fascism.... I only hope cops understand what they are losing
...and that they are now tools for the 1% trying to take complete control away from "We the People" to destroy what is left of our democracy.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #63
70. So, you have zip to say about this OP?
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #63
72. I recommend you read the article
:-)

Yup, there IS a DHS connection
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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #72
82. There is a massively tenuous connection of anonymous "connections".
That's a little like claiming I have connections to Wal-Mart because I drive past one every day on the way to work.

What's missing is evidence of their ability to actually influence DHS, and of them following DHS's orders. From this article, looks a lot like a lobbying shop.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 03:52 AM
Response to Reply #63
91. Nice attempt at slander. Just what, exactly, do you think is misleading? nt
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #63
118. aha.... well, if you feel this is about you, there is nothing more to say
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
65. Cops are pretty dumb, then


If we, the taxpayers, pay for their salaries and pensions and health insurance, and we the people ain't got squat for money, who do they think is going to pay them if things don't change?

Are they all planning on becoming private mercenaries, security forces for the rich? There will only be so many of these jobs available.

When the taxes dry up, cuz the rich don't want to pay their fair share and none of the rest of us has a dime, at least the cops will all be fired. Then they can gloat about how they "stopped that OWS movement!" when they're sitting at home wondering how they'll eat.

They're hitting themselves with their own batons, and are far too stupid to feel anything....yet.



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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #65
71. I asked that earlier this week.
Oakland is spending about a million every time it calls up cops from around the Bay Area to arrest tents.

Who is going to pay these cops when the budget is shot?
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Tsiyu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #71
84. I've been wondering about the massive amounts they're

spending to corral and intimidate OWS, and it just doesn't make sense at all.

I guess they think people will give up trying to change things for the better if they throw enough money around. That is NOT going to happen.

Cops better start thinking about who feeds them. The 1% have already stated they don't feel compelled to add anything to the public till. Yet the cops are protecting them rather than the public who pays their wages. :wtf:

We do live in interesting times....





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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
66. K&R'd & bookmarked.
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
68. chuck wexler?
hmmmm, which neocon is he associated with? koch?
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:06 PM
Response to Original message
69. K&R
Actually recced a few hours ago. I have been trying to come up with a response to this, but none of it is printable on DU.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-18-11 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
74. kick
:kick:
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
76. "International Non-governmental"? What is that???! n/t
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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #76
83. Lobbyists. (nt)
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smokey nj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
79. Kick!
Excellent work, WillyT!
:hi:
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Blaze Diem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
80. Watch out. Here it Comes "Houston introduces Police Drones"
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 12:47 AM by Blaze Diem
Phase 2 of 'the cross country coordinated effort of crowd control'.

The timing of the Police Drone's public introduction is not just a coincidence.
Lying son-of-a-bitches.
GHW Bush's New World Order..Their world-Their laws
---------------------------------------------------------

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2341822

A Houston area law enforcement agency is prepared to launch an unmanned drone that could someday carry weapons, Local 2 Investigates reported Friday.

The Montgomery County Sheriff's Office in Conroe paid $300,000 in federal homeland security grant money and Friday it received the ShadowHawk unmanned helicopter made by Vanguard Defense Industries of Spring.

A laptop computer is used to control the 50-pound unmanned chopper, and a game-like console is used to aim and zoom a powerful camera and infrared heat-seeking device mounted on the front.
--------------------------------------------

(snip)
http://www.click2houston.com/news/New-Police-Drone-Near-Houston-Could-Carry-Weapons/-/1735978/4717922/-/59xnnez/-/index.html

"The aircraft has the capability to have a number of different systems on board. Mostly, for law enforcement, we focus on what we call less lethal systems," he said, including Tazers that can send a jolt to a criminal on the ground or a gun that fires bean bags known as a "stun baton."

"You have a stun baton where you can actually engage somebody at altitude with the aircraft. A stun baton would essentially disable a suspect," he said.

Gage said he has no immediate plans to outfit his drone with weapons, and he also ruled out using the chopper for catching speeders.



--------------------
Tks to DUer DOVER for the heads up on this subject
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 02:36 AM
Response to Reply #80
88. notice the word "mostly" in his statement.
"Mostly, for law enforcement, we focus on what we call less lethal systems"
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WildNovember Donating Member (726 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 02:20 AM
Response to Original message
87. A Reagan-era innovation, according to wikipedia. And international.
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 02:44 AM by WildNovember
The Police Executive Research Forum (PERF) is a national membership organization of police executives from the largest city, county and state law enforcement agencies, primarily in the United States. The organization is dedicated to improving policing and advancing professionalism through research and involvement in public policy debate. Since its founding in 1981, it has fostered debate, research and an openness to challenging traditional police practices. It is headquartered in Washington, D.C.

General members lead larger police agencies in the United States and around the world; their jurisdictions are often the seedbeds of the toughest problems and hardest-won solutions in policing. They collectively serve a majority of the U.S. population....Incorporated in 1981, PERF's primary sources of operating revenues are government grants and contracts, and partnerships with private foundations and other organizations.

In 2007, PERF made news by reporting that violent crime rose by double-digit percentages in cities across the country between 2005 and 2007.<1> This claim was controversial at the time <2> and the FBI Uniform Crime Reporting Statistics show rates of violent crime decreasing consistently between 1994 and 2009. <3>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police_Executive_Research_Forum


Carnegie Corp of NY (r/t Carnegie foundation) is a funder: http://carnegie.org/fileadmin/Media/News/carnegie_results_fall_11.pdf

Beginning in 2008 Carnegie Corporation awarded
PERF grants totaling $850,000 for case studies, public
education and outreach about the impact of immigrant
policy on law enforcement at the local level.


So is DOJ, through their COPS (Community-oriented policing) grants. Community-oriented policing sounds nice and cosy, but:

This study of conducted energy devices (CEDs) by the Police Executive Research Forum
(PERF) was supported by Grant #2005-HS-WX-0007 awarded by the U.S. Department of
Justice Office of Community Oriented Policing Services (COPS Office).


http://www.cops.usdoj.gov/files/ric/Publications/e1206144.txt

-- what are "conducted energy devices"? That doesn't sound nice. Tasers?

Here's another: Kroll Chairman William Bratton to speak at Police Executive Research Forum conference:

NEW YORK, April 4, 2011 – Kroll Chairman William J. Bratton will be the keynote luncheon speaker at a Police Executive Research Forum (PERF) conference at the Newseum in Washington, D.C. on Monday, April 4, 2011. The conference, entitled, “How Are Innovations in Technology Transforming Policing?”, is being hosted by the PERF to give police officials the opportunity to discuss the increasing use of technology in law enforcement. Attendees will focus on technologies that police departments are finding most effective for accomplishing key tasks in policing.

Mr. Bratton is the Vice Chair of the Homeland Security Advisory Council, whose members provide advice and recommendations on a variety of homeland security issues to the Secretary of the U.S. Department of Homeland Security.


http://www.altegrity.com/Media-Detail.aspx?dpid=240

He's all over:

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-ab&hl=en&source=hp&q=kroll+chairman+bratton&pbx=1&oq=kroll+chairman+bratton&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=4146l6055l0l6653l9l8l0l0l0l2l247l1271l0.7.1l8l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=4b1e990a4fc26b63&biw=1024&bih=577


William J. Bratton - Chairman

William J. Bratton is Chairman of Kroll, one of Altegrity, Inc.’s three core businesses. Prior to the acquisition of Kroll in August 2010, Mr. Bratton served as Chairman of Altegrity Risk International, which is now part of the Kroll business unit.

Mr. Bratton joined Altegrity in November 2009 after serving as Chief of the Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD) for seven years. He is known as one of America’s premier police chiefs, the only person to have led two of the largest police forces in the United States, the New York City Police Department and the LAPD.

http://www.kroll.com/about/leadership/


William Joseph "Bill" Bratton CBE (born October 6, 1947) is an American law enforcement officer who served as the chief of police of the Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD), New York City Police Commissioner, and Boston Police Commissioner.

Bratton began his police career at Boston Police Department before becoming Police Commissioner in New York City, where his zero-tolerance policy has been credited with reducing petty and violent crime. He moved to Los Angeles Police Department in 2001 reforming the police after the 1992 Los Angeles Riots and crime was reduced....<2>

Bratton was approached by British Prime Minister David Cameron to become the new Metropolitan Police Commissioner in July 2011, but this was blocked by the Home Office... Bratton instead was offered an advisor role to the British government which he accepted in August 2011.<8>

he served in the Military Police Corps of the United States Army during the Vietnam War...On September 11, 2009, he was awarded with the honorary title of Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire by Queen Elizabeth II "in recognition of his work to promote cooperation between US and UK police throughout his distinguished career."

He holds a Bachelor of Science in Law Enforcement from the University of Massachusetts Boston and was a research fellow at the John F. Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University.

Bratton is married to attorney and TruTV analyst Rikki Klieman]/b], and has one son, David, from a prior marriage. Bratton was also formerly married to attorney and newscaster Cheryl Fiandaca.

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-ab&hl=en&source=hp&q=kroll+chairman+bratton&pbx=1&oq=kroll+chairman+bratton&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=1274l13092l0l13402l30l19l0l3l3l1l1622l8830l0.10.2.1.6-2.0.3l21l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=4b1e990a4fc26b63&biw=1024&bih=577
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #87
144. Bratton, former NYPD police chief. So it's located in DC
connected to the DHS, is funded both by tax dollars AND privately and is International. The last would explain why the crackdowns in other parts of the world coincided, with identical tactics, same robocops, with the ones here.

This sounds like the Global Capitalists police force and our civilian policing has gone Global.

Has Congress anything to say about this, I wonder? Maybe its time to start a huge 'movement' to occupy Congress and demand they explain this war on the American people coordinated with foreign entities.
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WildNovember Donating Member (726 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #144
164. "gone Global. " is my impression too. but i doubt Congress is going to say anything, I doubt
Congress wants it on the agenda at all.
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FirstLight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:01 AM
Response to Original message
92. bookmarking for the morning..
thanks!
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:40 AM
Response to Original message
93. Fascism.
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nineteen50 Donating Member (488 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:08 AM
Response to Original message
97. Coordinating
Over my life years I have watched the different ways those in
power silence dissent and free speech, from assassination to
bribery and all the stops in between. But I have never seen
such a concerted effort across the board centrally coordinated
by a department of the government to deny free speech and the
right to redress grievances. The control of politicians,
courts, media, information gathering and force seems absolute.
The status quo must truly be frightened. The conductor of this
orchestration must be determined and occupied.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
103. Reagan-Bush NSDDs: The Beginnings of Today's Police State...
George HW Bush Takes Charge: The Uses of “Counter-Terrorism”

A paper trail of declassified documents from the Reagan-Bush era yields valuable information on how counter-terrorism provided a powerful mechanism for solidifying Bush’s power base and launching a broad range of national security initiatives.

By Christopher Simpson
Covert Action Quarterly Fall 1996

During the Reagan years, George Bush used “crisis management” and “counter-terrorism” as vehicles for running key parts of the clandestine side of the US government.

Bush proved especially adept at plausible denial. Some measure of his skill in avoiding responsibility can be taken from the fact that even after the Iran-Contra affair blew the Reagan administration apart, Bush went on to become the “foreign policy president,” while CIA Director William Casey, by then conveniently dead, took most of the blame for a number of covert foreign policy debacles that Bush had set in motion.

The trail of National Security Decision Directives (NSDDS) left by the Reagan administration begins to tell the story. True, much remains classified, and still more was never committed to paper in the first place. Even so, the main picture is clear: As vice president, George Bush was at the center of secret wars, political murders, and America’s convoluted oil politics in the Middle East.

The Reagan-era National Security Council (NSC) used NSDDs to formulate high-level policy on political and military matters. The directives ranged from presidential orders for testing nuclear weapons to negotiating strategies for US representatives at various international summits.

Reagan and the NSC also used NSDDs to settle conflicts among security agencies over bureaucratic turf and lines of command. It is through that prism that we see the first glimmers of Vice President Bush’s role in clandestine operations during the 1980s.

CONTINUED...
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SHRED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
106. KR
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BR_Parkway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
107. And they got $1,888,231 in 2009 donations from where? As a non-profit
they are required to post their tax forms for anyone to see. The last one posted was for 2009 -

out of $3,090,640 in non-program revenue -

$241,272 came from member dues
$961,137 came from government grants (wonder how much of that is from Homeland Security)

and

$1,888,231 is classified as "all other contributions, gifts, grants and similar amounts not listed above"

Police Executive Research Forum
http://www2.guidestar.org/organizations/a/52-1101422/police-executive-research-forum.aspx
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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
108. K&R
:kick:
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Kip Humphrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
110. So, they are using a private entity to organize and coordinate public activities so as to
avoid government culpability and responsibility in executing a nationwide, coordinated offensive against peaceful protesters who are only exercising their constitutionally guaranteed free speech rights to petition their government for redress of grievances.

IMO, this sounds like conspiracy under the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act (RICO). This also has shades of fascism in so far as local governments have employed a private corporate entity to generate a coordinated national assault against non-violent citizens with actions and outcomes by government which are effectively those of a national police state.

This is TREACHEROUS, OUTRAGEOUS, DANGEROUS, VILE, and ANTITHETICAL to the notion of a free, open, and accountable democratic society.

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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
113. Looks like most of the people who vehemently denied this are...
...coincidentally absent from this thread.

:rofl:

NGU.

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sarcasmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
114. Makes you wonder if DHS is organizing the raids on medical marijuana.
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whatchamacallit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
121. K&R! n/t
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
126. No surprise here. The Administration has distanced itself from stomping on Occupy
by allowing a "private" entity to do it.

Police state. Democrats or Republicans in charge. Same same.

REC.
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unionworks Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
133. Can you Say "Blackwater"?
Just Pinkertons with a new name and newer equipment.:grr:
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #133
150. That's what I am thinking.
:mad:
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
141. who finances this NGO?
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
147. This PERF aligns perfectly with the Bilderberg Group. (Not OWS - their working acronym is OWO)
Edited on Sat Nov-19-11 04:28 PM by peacetalksforall
One World Order - ownership and control of the earth and sky and total control of the people.

BG - not just a social club. This is the first I've heard of PERF, but I would guess that it aligns perfectly with BG. It is probably a spin-off group reporting to an existing BG entity. Other entities being the IMF World Bank Council on Foreign Relations Trilateral Commission Roundtable - PLUS an unending family of entities that keep growing and we don't look at them.

If interested, there is no need to get into other theories, i.e., entities over the BG. Start with the Bilderberg Group and learn down words, i.e. - learn how the BG holds the umbrella and under it is all their think tanks and foundations who analyze and come up with the plan that is handed to the banking/investment, military, industrial, commercial, media, political, social engineering, royalty and country leaders for implementation.)

Their goal - no national sovereignty. Taking total control over the people. It all fits. We are protesting the BG work even though everyone says and thinks we are protesting Wall Street.

Current example: Europe EU - its formation and now it's current step ... converting each country to the Bilderberg world. Current example: Italy Monti: Prime and Financial Minister. Monti - straight out of the BG family of entities.

Anyone who says that our leader level is not at war with the citizens of the U.S. doesn't yet have a good view of things that have been going on for 100 years in the U.S. and more than 100 in the U.K..

If you haven't already read it - start with this fast reading book plus reference source. Daniel Estulin - The Bilderberg Group

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certainot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
149. so are these cops driving to their strategy sessions listening to limbaugh and the local
blowhards whining about the filth and rats and traffic congestion and rapes and drugs and the paid callers and teabaggers calling in about how they were inconvenienced and insulted by the urine soaked commie hippies, effected by it? or maybe they aren't listening but half their troops are listening to those stations because they're the handy source for news and sports and weather and that's where they get the local pro and college sports. and in most parts of the country those stations are the only free source for politics while driving and working.
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SleeplessinSoCal Donating Member (710 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
154. 1981 - the "foundation", "incorporated" - also the advent of Trickle Down Economics.....
... was going to need a major coordination of how to handle the angry masses.
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
155. Police sharing expertise on how to do a difficult and sensitive job? Shocking! How dare they! N.T.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-11 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #155
165. Difficult? Considering that there has been no violence at all
even at huge protests, such as the over 100,000 in Oakland, UNTIL the police show up, it is becoming more and more clear, that if the police simply stayed away, there would be no problems. The are the ones rioting and even in the face of their brutal attacks on American civilians, the protesters have remained non-violent.

The difficulty you speak of, explain it please??
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
156. knr nt
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Charlemagne Donating Member (94 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-19-11 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
157. But the Tea Party shows up with guns
And they are treated by everyone as the right and correct voice of America?!?!? These citizens show up with ideas and are treated as a national security threat. I keep telling myself that there isnt a concentrated and overt war against the left, but that is getting harder to believe each and every day.

I had some buddies that got fucked up in Iraq. I want them to have lost body parts for the Constitution, not for corporate profits.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-11 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #157
162. The Tea Party was barking up the wrong tree, so they were considered benign
Edited on Sun Nov-20-11 12:07 AM by Quantess
by the handful of people who own America.

OWS picked the correct tree to bark up, so to speak.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-11 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
163. Time for a kick!
:kick:
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-11 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
166. self-delete
Edited on Sun Nov-20-11 10:15 PM by ClarkUSA
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-21-11 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
167. time for a kick
important thread
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-24-11 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
168. Annual Meeting for next year...
The 2012 PERF Annual Meeting will be in Washington, DC on April 26-27, 2012.
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