Bondsman's family outraged officer not charged in killing

[The Straight Story]

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. -

The family of a bail bondsman shot and killed by a Jacksonville police officer says it is outraged the officer who killed him is not facing any criminal charges.

At a news conference Tuesday morning, the mother of 32-year-old Antonio Cooks said the Jacksonville Sheriff's Office used excessive force in her son's death, and that's why she intends to sue.

The family believes Officer Jason Bailey overreacted in May when he shot Cooks and a second bail bondsman while they were looking for a habitual traffic offender during a late night raid at an apartment complex.

Prior to the shooting, the Sheriff's Office confirmed, Cooks made calls to police notifying them he and two other men would be at an apartment complex. But due to miscommunication, police said, the officer thought he was responding to an armed home invasion and didn't realize the bail bondsmen were serving a warrant.

Cooks' family released the autopsy report Tuesday, which indicates Cooks was shot five times, including once in the back.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/Bondsman-s-family-outraged-officer-not-charged-in-killing/-/475880/4759012/-/ojoh9rz/-/

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NOLALady]

2. Somebody had to die

for an habitual traffic offender. :eyes:

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

3. So two armed gunmen "raiding" an apartment in the middle of the night were shot by the police

Not seeing a problem here...

[The Straight Story]

4. Ummm they were the one that called the police and were bail bondsmen(nt)

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

5. Still don't see the problem,

Brandishing firearms in a residential area in the middle of the night is probably a bad idea.

[The Straight Story]

6. I have been both a cop and an armed security guard

While a guard at an empty apt complex I drew my weapon believing there was someone in one of the buildings. I didn't have access to a phone or way to get a hold of the police - had I done so and they showed up and they shot me would that have been ok?

Cops have a responsibility to identify the threat before reacting. When I entered the apartment I identified myself, kept my gun lowered so as to avoid potentially going off half cocked and shooting someone (could have just been kids, etc).

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

7. And naturally as a security guard you were dressed head to toe in black and wearing a skimask?

Cause Chuck Norris here was dressed for a burglary.

[idiotgardener]

9. "Chuck Norris here was dressed for a burglary"

Apparently the police officers who were with him a short time before he was shot did not think so.

Your comments here are disappointing, to say the least. An innocent man is dead, shot in the back, and you "don't see a problem".

Big talk, but I bet if you were faced with the man's family, you might find a little human decency inside you somewhere.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

10. This was an armed gunman creeping around in the dark, call it fog of war or an occupational hazard

The police officer who shot him was responding to a reported burglary. If your line of work requires dressing head to toe in black and "raiding" apartment buildings chances are pretty good you are eventually going to get shot by somebody.

[The Straight Story]

11. And would that include cops who dress like that? (nt)

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

12. That happens too,

But nothing presented here makes me think this is anything other than a reckless accident caused by the deceased being tough guys. If I was running down the street chasing a woman with an axe it is entirely possible we are just making a youtube video... but I wouldn't fault the police or bystanders from acting on other possible conclusions.

[idiotgardener]

13. The police were notified that they were going to be there!

And the police "miscommunicated" it!

But nevermind, clearly none of the facts of the case are going to make a dent in your opinion that nothing bad has happened here.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

15. The police officer that shot them was answering a robbery call

and was confronted by two armed and belligerent men dressed in black and wearing ski masks who refused to drop their weapons. There isn't a jurisdiction on earth where this would have gone down differently. If you are armed and refuse to drop your weapons in a confrontation with the police THEY WILL SHOOT YOU.

And even if the police didn't shoot them, if this is the way they go about their business someone else was going to shoot them sooner or later.

[Ikonoklast]

8. They had a legal right to be armed, and were operating within the law.

They weren't 'Brandishing' firearms; they were carrying them and using them in a legal manner as part of their employment as bondsmen, also legal.

'Brandishing' is a crime. Carrying weapons in the course of one's legal employment is not.

The cop saw 'Black Guy With Gun' and shot him dead.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

16. Their conduct might have been legal, but still a great way to get shot.

Oddly enough armed men creeping around in an apartment building dressed head to toe in black and wearing ski masks are viewed with an unreasonable level of suspicion.

There is no law that says I can't choose to enter my vehicle by throwing a cinder block through the window, but were I to do so I might be viewed with a little suspicion. I suppose I could argue with the police that it is my car I just broke into, or maybe I could just skirt the issue entirely by just not placing myself in that position.

[Ikonoklast]

19. Dressed like this, you mean?

Oops, those are cops.

Guess you would have no problem with someone assuming that dressed like that they are criminals and up to no good, and open up on them as they creep around your apartment complex late at night, as there is little or no way to discern that they are law enforcement.

Seems you have a personal grudge against bail bondsmen for some reason, and are glad that one got killed.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

24. Cops told the unidentified armed men to drop their weapons and they didn't.

What followed would have played out the same anywhere else on earth. If you creep around in the dark dressed like bandits waving a gun around like a gonzo Mel Gibson character sooner or later somebody is going to kill you.

I'm not glad this guy got killed, but it seems it was probably inevitable. I just feel badly for the cop who crossed this pair of testosterone tripping tough guys.

[rhett o rick]

18. Bail bondsmen have way too much "legal" power. nm

[pipoman]

20. The state either allows bondsmen to enforce their bonds, or nobody

will be able to get out of jail without a pile of cash. Like it or not, it is necessary with our system.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

26. And there was no other way to do this?

This could have turned out even worse if innocent people had been killed by this hyped up pair instead.

[pipoman]

29. This is how our system works..

of coarse you can go to the local pd and offer to bail out the poor..if they skip, big deal, just write he $10k, $50k, check and feel good about it..others can't afford to write that check

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

30. Yeah, sounds like it works really well...

http://www.nytimes.com/1997/09/02/us/bounty-hunters-kill-couple-in-case-of-mistaken-identity.html

In a flurry of bullets early Sunday morning, at least five bounty hunters wearing ski masks forced their way into a house here and killed a couple who apparently did not know the bail jumper who was being sought.

The Maricopa County Attorney, Richard Romley, said today that the deaths of Chris Foote, 23, and his girlfriend, Spring Wright, 20, were ''troubling,'' and warranted a look at new laws that would force bounty hunters to be licensed and undergo background checks.

The bounty hunters, who wore body armor and ski masks, burst into the house at 4 A.M., held three children and another couple at gunpoint, then opened fire into a bedroom that Mr. Foote shared with Ms. Wright. Mr. Foote returned fire, wounding two of the attackers.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/local&id=6750664

It was 3:30am when Hinojosa says he was awoken by a series of bangs on his door. Looking outside, he says he saw a bunch of men and he says they were armed.

"I opened the door and the big guy, he stuck a barrel through the door and I remember it clearly," he said. "I remember it clearly because the shotgun had a flashlight on it."

Fearing for his family, he says he says he grabbed his Glock Nine and fired through the door, striking one of the men. He says never during the raid did the men identify themselves as bond forfeiture agents.

How can anybody argue this is a good idea?

[pipoman]

33. I can find 10 stories of police doing the same thing.

The reason bail is set is to pay the state for the cost associated with capturing people who fail to follow through with criminal responsibilities. By allowing bonding companies to bond people who can't afford their bail. It saves the state significantly on housing in already overcrowded jails. If someone fails to appear, a warrant is issued. If the person remains a fugitive, the bond will come due. The state will take the money from the bondsmen. The bondsmen are given certain powers of arrest, thus saving the state. Without this every county would have to employ more warrant officers, have more jail beds, and the poor would occupy the jails. The system works pretty smoothly with no more issues than private security or repossessors. People who haven't seen this from the inside has no idea how many people this system effects.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

35. So you support private businesses engaging in paramilitary activity in the continental US

Thank you for clarifying that.

Is killing innocent bystanders an acceptable outcome to you? Cost of doing business?

I would rather see people chilling in jail than these morons swaggering around playing Green Berets in innocent peoples homes.

[pipoman]

36. I have a realistic understanding of the issue..

let you or a loved one end up in jail with a bail too high to pay out, and you too will be calling a bondsman.

There is a certain moronic swagger with people without a clue saying shit like, "I would rather see people chilling in jail...".

oh, and do you feel the same about police who regularly do similar shit? At least when these guys fuck up they are usually charged with a crime, unlike police who are given a promotion..

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

37. And I have a realistic expectation that private companies not shoot up my neighborhood

If it is a choice between leaving people in jail or letting the agents of private companies behave as though they are in Waziristan on the streets of American communities, sorry Cletus you can stay in jail.

How many people might have been hurt or killed if these imbeciles got in a shootout with either the fugitive or the police, they were in an apartment complex for fucks sake.

If that is the risk incurred by society so that bondsmen might offer their services... fuck no.

I don't cut the police much slack either, but they are usually acting with legitimate authority, while these bounty hunter thugs are just out to mitigate a financial loss from a bad business decision.

[pipoman]

38. And you can pay for it, the public won't..we're talking billions here..

mos of DU already feel the poor are treated disproportionately worse by our judicial system...yeah, maybe you're right, fuck the poor, it's the American way. If you're looking for causes and dangers to society, you'll have a very long list to work through before you get to bail bondsmen.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

39. And this can't be accomplished without vigilante gunmen?

In the two examples I cite you had large groups of men, armed with assault rifles descending on the homes of random families in the middle of the night and in the case in Arizona indiscriminately murdering two occupants in cold blood and holding children at gun point.

This of course being just a dangerous to the gunmen as it is to the innocent homeowner as in both examples the innocent homeowners opened fire wounding their attackers and in this very case the gunmen were themselves shot by the police after refusing to drop their weapons.

This is a bad movie from the creators of Toy Soldiers staring Mel Gibson and Chuck Norris. To argue this is a well thought out and essential part of the justice system is insane.

[pipoman]

40. The two examples from

1997 and 2009 respectively? Hardly a trend, no? Legislation and public policy should never be determined by anecdotal instances. I can find 10 stories which involve DWI accidents which the perpetrator was driving an suv..therefore suvs are bad, bad and should be outlawed..There is inherent danger in fugitive interdiction regardless who is doing it. It has been an essential part of law enforcement and release of those presumed innocent awaiting trial for centuries..bounty hunters..you can pretend it hasn't..doesn't make it so.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

41. Those are just two I remembered off the top of my head

The Arizona case is particularly memorable because the state sought the death penalty for the bounty hunters.

It took me less than a minute to find multiple examples within the past couple of months. I particularly like this one:

Kevin Houston says the Bounty Boys pounded on the door of his apartment just before midnight on July 26. He says they told him to open the door, and when he did several men rushed in. The men were wearing vests labeled with the word "Fugitive" on the back. They also carried guns, tasers and badges. Houston says he did what they told him to do because he assumed they were police.

Midwest City police say the Bounty Boys held Houston, his fiancé and two children hostage for almost an hour before they realized they were in the wrong place. Houston called police as soon as they left.

Five members of the Bounty Boys are now faces charges of kidnapping, and entering a structure with intent to commit a felony. They are:

...

Sanders is could also be charged with pointing a firearm and unlawful carrying of a firearm. Dewitt also faces a charge of unlawful carrying of firearm.

http://www.news9.com/story/15277622/bounty-boys-charged-for-entering-wrong-midwest-city-home

If fugitives are to be arrested, that is a job for law enforcement, you know, this being a society and all. Not cowboys with big guns and small dicks who are too insubordinate or insane for law enforcement or the military but want to show the world how tough they are.

Please do the world a favor and stay out of the debt collection business, the body count would be devastating.

[pipoman]

42. I was in the debt collection business for 20+ years

on the obverse, it is always the clueless who have all the answers and no solutions.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

43. Says the one arguing for undeputized civilian gunmen running amok...

Some solution...

[rhett o rick]

17. Letting bail bondsmen use firearms is a bad idea. nm

[pipoman]

22. Nonsense

[RSillsbee]

21. I agree

The cops point a gun at you and tell you to drop your's you do it

then you sort it out.

[Rochester]

14. Good!

If there's one thing I hate more than government thugs, it's private, for-profit thugs.
Well done, pigs.

[pipoman]

23. You have a problem with the poor being able to get out of jail on bond?

[flvegan]

25. So the bailbondsman gave the police notice

that they be there, yet one of them was shot 5 times, once in the back.

"Miscommunication" is one of those words you hear a lot about.

Yes, I read the article. I'm sorry for the loved ones of the departed. It shouldn't have happened this way.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

27. and the police gave the unidentified gunmen notice to drop their weapons

If their egos, adrenaline and testosterone didn't get in the way they might still be alive. The responding officer was looking for armed robbers and conveniently enough he was confronted by two armed and belligerent men who couldn't have looked more like armed robbers if they raided the wardrobe department at Universal Studios first who also refused to drop their weapons.

How else was this going to play out?

I rarely cut the police any slack, but I can't see how anyone with the information the officer had would acted differently. He found the described men who were armed and dangerous and refused to disarm themselves.

[pipoman]

28. So they say..it isn't like police don't lie..not known for their

"egos, adrenaline and testosterone"..(hint: ows)

[Supply Side Jesus]

32. and so they say

not like anyone else ever lies

[flvegan]

31. "looked more like"

????????

[Cid_B]

34. The mother seems confused...

"It begs the question then, what is their policy? Shoot first and ask questions later? Or shoot until the person is dead? " Crump said.

More of this shoot to wound bullshit... Might as well ask to shoot the gun out of their hand.