Why are some of us pissed off and uneasy?

[SHRED]

Obama Administration: US Forces Can Assassinate Americans
NYT: Obama Administration Pressuring NY AG To Accept Bank Settlement Instead Of Prosecuting
Feds threaten crackdown if medical-pot makeover becomes law
White House visitor logs riddled with holes
Obama's John Yoo Moment-- Cherry Picking Lawyers
Activists cry foul over FBI probe - The Washington Post
Emails Show White House Promotes Genetically Engineered Crops in Wildlife Refuges
Obama Broke Pledge to Force Banks to Help Homeowners
Obama's tough budget cuts: money to help needy pay for heat
Labor unions uneasy as OSHA withdraws proposed rules
Justice Department seeks to have all web surfing tracked
Treasury Blocks Legal Aid for Homeowners Facing Foreclosure | The Nation
US to lift ban on new cases for Guantanamo detainees
Obama administration keeps new policy on Miranda secret
Drug Makers Win Administration Support in Price Dispute
Counterinsurgency Outsourcing: America's New Mercenaries in Afghanistan, Middle East, Africa
Obama administration readies indefinite detention order for Guantanamo detainees
War Room: Contrary to public statements, Obama admin fueled conflict in Yemen
A Reversal on End-of-Life Planning Under Medicare
Obama and GOPers Worked Together to Kill Bush Torture Probe
U.S. drops demand for Israeli settlement freeze
Obama waiver allows U.S. aid to 4 countries using child soldiers [br />The Deal with the Hospital Industry to Kill the Public Option
Blackwater Wins Piece of $10 Billion Mercenary Deal
U.S. Is Said to Expand Secret Actions in Mideast
Obama invokes 'state secrets' claim to dismiss suit against targeting of U.S. citizen al-Aulaqi
Despite Fresh Rhetoric About Saving U.S. Manufacturing, Obama Is Quietly Pushing Failed Bush Trade Policies
Administration backs utilities in climate case
DOJ gags scientists studying BP disaster
US Still Holds Detainee Pentagon Wanted Freed in 2004
Banks to benefit most from White House program to help fight foreclosures
White House proposal would ease FBI access to records of Internet activity
White House Mulling Business Group's Regulatory Hit List
Obama Hires Fmr. Wellpoint Exec to Implement Health Care Law
Obama - Scientists expected Obama administration to be friendlier
Across From White House, Coffee With Lobbyists
Administration Hardens Stance Against Leaks to Press
Obama administration backs private twist to public housing
Lawsuit to Challenge Salazar's Wholesale Disregard of Marine Mammal Protection Laws in Gulf of Mexico
NOAA Warned Interior It Was Underestimating Threat Of Serious Spill
Feds on GMO Labeling: Don't Tell, Don't Ask
New rules on terror custody being drafted
Afghans 'abused at secret prison' at Bagram airbase
|Obama administration backs telecom immunity
Obama Packs Debt Commission with Social Security Looters
Pesticide Lobbyist Gets Posted as Chief Agricultural Negotiator
Environmentalists Blast Obama Mining Reversal
More Obama DOJ attacks on whistle-blowers
Obama's Sudden, Senseless Assault on Medical Marijuana

To name a few.
:mad:


--

[Vanje]

1. K&R

I am pissed off and uneasy.

[frazzled]

2. Because ....

If you only read sources from Counterpunch, Crooks and Liars, and Democracy Now, with sensational headlines, you will get your blood pressure up. They mean to do that to you. They want you mobilized.

I'm not saying you should NOT read those sites, but that you should read a variety of types of sources, including traditional news analysis from NYT as well as blogs that deal with foreign policy and economics that tend to sensationalize a bit less.

Truly, that is my opinion. Take it or leave it. I have a feeling you'll leave it.

[Vanje]

4. beacuse , we KNOW that the NYT would NEVER lie. nt

[frazzled]

12. And we also know that ...

the sites I mentioned will never lie. Not.

Look, if you only get your news from far right wing sources you are going to believe certain things; and the same goes for only getting your news from extreme left wing sources. The answer is not to only read "centrist" sources but to read as many sources as possible that present as many viewpoints as possible. Then use your own fucking brain. Don't let others lead you around by the nose.

Corollary: if you're looking for trouble you'll find it. I could post a passel of articles about Elizabeth Warren's connections to Wall Street and the people she hired from the megabanks and investment houses to staff her agency. But you'd ignore them, because they don't fit your narrative.

[bhikkhu]

105. Yes...half-lies are the meat and potatoes, outright lies the spice that makes it all satisfying

Once you get used to the stuff like the OP lists, you're not so much a "thinking individual" as one who has a certain condition that must be fed daily.

[ellisonz]

166. That's why I read political cartoons.

If the cartoons for the other side aren't funny you know we must be doing something right, because our cartoonists are hilarious. The laughter test ;)

[ThomCat]

158. If you're looking to stick your head in the sand,

that's also incredibly easy to do. Far to many people seem to want to keep their heads in the sand, and imagine that everything is going to be okay simply because their dear idol is in office. He's a politician. We should always be paying close and critical attention to what he's doing. Just as close and critical as we would pay to any republican in the same office.

The fact that so many people are supporting policies that they opposed when Bush was in office merely because Obama has taken his place is hypocritical and disgusting. It is also disastrous for the US and the entire world.

[ellisonz]

167. ...

"The most radical revolutionary will become a conservative the day after the revolution."

Hannah Arendt, The New Yorker, 12 September 1970

[reACTIONary]

185. +1 Sometimes its amaizning...

...how transparent it is, even within the article itself. First the scarey, attention getting headline, followed by a lead paragraph with slice-n-dice quotes. Then some "analysis" telling you what you should think / feel / believe. But then all that is followed by some "on the other hand" stuff, or some fuller quotes that give a little context and you realize you've been had, without even having to read any other sources for the same story.

[elocs]

197. Congratulations on an insightful comment. Unfortunately, most seem to only support news & comments

that reflect their own point of view, rejecting those that do not, and that goes for both sides.

The talking heads preach to the choir and the choir adoringly cries "AMEN!" at the obviously righteous and truthful words they are hearing.

Polls are legitimate only if they produce agreeable results, otherwise they are obviously biased.

Human nature, left and right. We like to pretend we are not opposite sides of the same coin, but we are.

[me b zola]

51. Its all about balance

You'd be one sided if you only read the news from responsible journalists. This must be counter balanced with propaganda. How else can you trusted to support the same political Kabuki theater thats been entertaining us for years?

[Vanje]

52. I love you

[emsimon33]

86. Well said!

The problem with far-right publications is that they too often are propaganda. I read from all sources and am amazed at the out right lies as well as the twists on the truth that they represent as far and balanced. "Truth," as Stephen Colbert said it so well, "has a liberal bias."

[Raksha]

99. LOL!

On second thought...maybe that's too true to be funny.

[Dover]

169. Fair and balanced..fair and balanced...fair and balanced...fair and balanced...

:crazy:

[Why Syzygy]

11. He has links

to NYT and WaPost. It's a "variety". Factually, one has to bury one's head in the sand dune to avoid reality. Yeah. That's the ticket.

[Bluenorthwest]

14. First link I clicked was from the NY Times..what are you talking

about? I see on that list, at a glace, the NY Times, Washington Post. So you look at a list of links to the Times and respond by suggesting one read the Times? That's very odd.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

163. That's because they couldn't care less where links led to.

All they know is that if it is critical of Obama it must be a left wing lie.

[sabrina 1]

56. Why do you assume people here only read the sources you

mention? That is a pretty condescending assumption on your part.

I will say this, as someone who reads multiple sources especially when there is a controversial issue at stake requiring an original source, those sources you mention have been been proven to be right most of the time. Which is too bad really, I always hope they are wrong and that things are not as bad as they are.

So, what is incorrect in the OP's list and what sources do you have to counter anything that is wrong.

Rather than make it personal, how about having an actual discussion on the merits of the articles and if you can show they are wrong, I doubt anyone here will reject actual facts.

[axollot]

68. *facepalm* oh why didn't you suggest "icanhazcheezburgers" for the blood pressure? LMAO eom.

[Jim_Shorts]

116. Yes, remember to be fair and balanced

Most of us know which sources "try" to get the facts right and the ones that twist or make up facts to make their point.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_3jj3mzidCHA/RsqtEWapkjI/AAAAAAAAAMg/mvpZVJt9Ijs/s400/fair+and+balanced.png

[sendero]

212. Facts.

... are facts. Most of us can see past the "sensational headlines" because that is what we have to do every day.

[Vincardog]

3. You can't blame BO. He is just doing what he has to do to get the MONEY from the Parasitic Financial

Corporations that have stolen our Government and economy. There is nothing else he could do because:
1) he is absolutely POWERLESS
2) he can not overcome the useless tea-baggers in Congress
3) he is a lot better than the opposition *Do you want President PALIN?
On the other hand

FUCK YEAH that is why we are pissed

[defendandprotect]

62. +1000% -- and keep on tellin' it -- !!

[tblue]

188. I have yet to read a defense of our president based on the merits.

It's always one if the ones you listed or else some ad hominem atrack, and it's gotten real old.

Why is the JoD ignoring the crimes of the Bush administration or of Wall Street? No one, and I mean NO ONE, can say they tried. And that's a couple of stains that won't wash off any time soon.

Also WTF is the defense for these drone attacks that kill civilians and for extending, no, STRENGTHENING the Patriot Act?

Is Obama weak or corrupt? And does it even matter? Or is he the master chess player who leaves us dangling while he outwits the Republicans by giving them more than they dare even ask for?

Oh I know. I'm a hater who wants to hand the reins to the GOP. Yeah right. Sorry. I'm not the one empowering the opposition.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. But..but..the poor guy is powerless..and he hasn't had enough time. K&R

[dawg]

6. Oh no.

Not a list! :evilgrin:

[Vanje]

7. ~~~~

[Vincardog]

9. How many times have we seen a "list of BO's accomplishments"?

[chervilant]

119. Countless times...

Has ProSense shown up to post it here?

[Jim_Shorts]

121. Which list? . . . .This list?

http://whatinthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

[Oldenuff]

182. Now there is a list.

Now,after the Repub candidate is known,all we will have to decide is...which candidate is the lesser of 2 evils?

Out of the current flock of Repub hopefuls...and Obama....Gary Johnson isn't looking that bad.

(sad ain't it?)




And he was all like, "I will open the doors of Government and ask you to be involved in your own Democracy again", that is..until the topic of Cannabis legalization came up...

[ellisonz]

168. My laundry list will eat your shorts.

:)

[Why Syzygy]

8. .

:popcorn:

[Autumn]

10. Yeah, that's a hell of a list of a few of BO's accomplishments

and pretty well covers why I am pissed off and uneasy. K/R

[newfie11]

13. knr

[ProSense]

15. So

"Obama Hires Fmr. Wellpoint Exec to Implement Health Care Law "

...even when those headlines (some of them more than a year old) turn out to be bullshit, you can't get over it?

The Righteous Relitigation of Heath Care Reform

<...>

Since my post, Sam Stein has done solid reporting to debunk this story. First, Stein reports that Fowler was never a lobbyist for Wellpoint. In addition, several advocates of health care reform who know and worked with Liz Fowler sing her praises, including staffers of SEIU, Public Campaign Action Fund, and Hill Democrats. Perhaps most persuasive, however, Rep. Pete Stark (D-CA) strongly sings Fowler's praises. Stark has been an advocate for single payer health care for decades. If we're going to attribute the views of Fowler's past employers to her (which I wouldn't recommend), we can't cherry-pick -- you'd have to argue that she must be to the left of the Obama administration as a zealous advocate of a fully government-administered single payer health care system, like her former boss Stark.

<...>

"Environmentalists Blast Obama Mining Reversal"

Obama EPA Revokes Largest Mountaintop Removal Permit in US History

There is a huge difference between policies and the daily headlines.

[tridim]

18. Apparently people who hate Obama believe the media never lies.

That's really all I need to know.

The GOP thanks the OP for doing their dirty work for them.

[Vanje]

21. :: Lets go bowling!

Hyperboling!

[midnight]

39. Please tell me this is another media lie... Thank you...

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/10/exclusive-blackwater-wins-piece-of-10-billion-merc-deal

[Vanje]

41. That

is sickening.

[2banon]

45. Ten Billion Dollar No Bid Contract for Blackwater. Mercenaries that will never be dismantled

much less be prosecuted, not even under a "Democratic" President.

Kudo's to Wired for tracking and reporting Blackwater's current status. (aka Xe, now "International Development Solutions".)

[defendandprotect]

64. +1 --- Privatization of the military is bankrupting Treasury -- along with the Bush/Obama wars--!!

[tblue]

190. Why else would the MIC let Obama "end" the war in Iraq?

One thing they're not is stupid.

[sabrina 1]

57. How about setting the record straight then. Which of the articles

linked are incorrect? Just saying 'people who hate Obama, (btw, WHO, other than the far right, 'hates Obama'?) believe the Media never lies' doesn't explain what you mean. Which media? We all know the MSM lies in every way possible either by omission or otherwise. So I assume you are talking about Republicans, but I'm not sure.

If something in the OP is wrong, then point it out so that people do not use it again.

[stockholmer]

172. projecting a little? there's a HUGE difference between hating a person & being sickened by political

stances they sometimes take. So sick of the idiotic pop psychological smearing of people on here as 'Obama Haters' if they simply have the temerity to stand up for progressive values.

:eyes:

[tblue]

189. The GOP thanks Obama

for doing their dirty work for them. He's so in line with them they have to MAKE UP CRAP to criticize.

[tridim]

194. Thanks for proving my point. nt

[fascisthunter]

195. BINGO!

[Shining Jack]

50. Bwahahah!

That's all you could come up with? :rofl:

[Vanje]

54. Sadly

That is the only opposition to the OP that attempts to actually argue any of the OPs points.

They got nothin.

Except some really REALLY great photographs of the President with some babies.
(see elsewhere in this thread)

[JDPriestly]

96. The overall Obama record, especially on human rights, is

just not good enough. He is not standing up for what is right.

When I think of Teddy Roosevelt and Franklin Roosevelt and then I compare Obama . . . Oh, dear!

We can't demand perfection, but why can't Obama show a little backbone?

Why does he insist on keeping all his Wall Street cronies in high places?

He is so willing to prosecute marijuana crimes, why can't he prosecute the crimes of the rich and famous?

[harmonicon]

175. Really? The Roosevelts?

Please remember that Obama would have had to use the workers' entrance to the white house in their time.... if they would have allowed black people to work their at all. I imagine those men would have never even shaken his hand. Spanish American war.... that one was a hoot. Both of those men had a hand in that crazed genocidal blow-up, I think.

[Pholus]

180. I would be interested in a source showing FDR's involvement...he was 16 in 1898.

I don't think he had anything to do with it.

[harmonicon]

181. Ok, my math was off by a few years.

I thought he was already in the military then. I guess it was a few years later.

[tblue]

191. Yeah? Well, Cirque du Soleil has a new show coming out.

I don't get how your point addresses what the other person said.

[harmonicon]

201. It in fact addresses it exactly.

The Roosevelts had a much much worse record concerning human rights than does Obama. Internment camps? No problem.

[JDPriestly]

205. They were men of their time. This is now, and Obama should

know better than to make a lot of the mistakes he is making especially in the area of the rights of the accused.

[harmonicon]

206. Same explanation: he's a man of his time. It doesn't work in either case. nt.

[Name removed]

193. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LWolf]

16. Good God. That list doesn't even include

his assault on my profession, his escalation of the war on terror, his support for "free" trade...

"Pissed off" and "uneasy" seem to understate things.

[dixiegrrrrl]

53. Doesn't include the sole source no bid contract with Siga, a big contributor to his campaign,

for a small pox pill at 225.00 per which has not been approved by FDA or even tested on humans.

"A company controlled by a longtime political donor gets a no-bid contract to supply an experimental remedy for a threat that may not exist.

Reporting from Washington— Over the last year, the Obama administration has aggressively pushed a $433-million plan to buy an experimental smallpox drug, despite uncertainty over whether it is needed or will work.

Senior officials have taken unusual steps to secure the contract for New York-based Siga Technologies Inc., whose controlling shareholder is billionaire Ronald O. Perelman, one of the world's richest men and a longtime Democratic Party donor.

When Siga complained that contracting specialists at the Department of Health and Human Services were resisting the company's financial demands, senior officials replaced the government's lead negotiator for the deal, interviews and documents show."


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x637823

[LWolf]

67. How can anyone turn a blind eye to all of this? nt

[dixiegrrrrl]

82. Those that are paid to, will.

When you have so much corruption at the global/country/national/state/ and city level......exactly who is available to change things?

It would take a revolution of serious proportions, a general strike of long duration, a massive prolonged refusal to play in the system.
For that, a critical mass has to be reached.

[LWolf]

83. Yes.

When do voters stop turning a blind eye and become part of that critical mass?

[SwampG8r]

156. if you put

a D in parenthesis after his name for some reason some people don't see all these things
like a magic D or maybe magic parenthesis

[LWolf]

198. And that is as willfully self-destructive

as those who do the same thing for the (R).

[tblue]

192. He "understands" our "frustrations."

So I guess it's all cool then.

[LWolf]

200. As long as he says something nice. nt

[ctsnowman]

215. I feel your pain.

lol

[jaxx]

17. Because some want to be?

Propaganda can spin anything into scare tactics.

[Vanje]

20. All of the OP's cites are "propaganda"?

All of them?

You know this because....you read them?

[jaxx]

23. Not biting. "All" is your word.

As we see here daily, when something anti-Obama surfaces it's immediately "the truth".

[Vanje]

25. I'm just waiting for you and yours to argue the actual merits...

....of a single one of these articles.

Just one?

[jaxx]

26. Me and mine?

No thanks, I'm not going to argue with preconceived notions. Enjoy the stories.

[Vanje]

29. Wont even try?

to defend your point.

Are you losing your fire?

[jaxx]

31. Huh uh, I'm saving it for the important stuff.

Not the everything is a conspiracy theory.

[Vanje]

33. None of the many subjects listed in the OP are "important" to you?

None of the many subjects listed in the OP are "important" to you?
NONE of them?!

Okay. I'm beginning to understand you better.

[jaxx]

34. No, you're not understanding me better.

Again you are imposing your words to spin mine. That's why nothing is worth discussing.

[whatchamacallit]

63. Thanks for bringing

absolutely nothing.

[hfojvt]

46. a lot of them look like fairly silly shit to me

like I am supposed to be trembling with fear and rage because Al Alaqui got killed.

Does that give you wour one? Because concern about Al-Alaqui registers about .000004 on my give-a-shit-o-meter.

I know, I know that I am a moral failure because I either do not recognize the SERIESNESS of the violation of a High Moral Principle or I just have my head so far up Obama's rear end that I can't even see.

[Vanje]

49. Great post

...but I failed to actually detect an argument on merit against even one of the OP's Large LIST of articles.

But, Have a nice weekend. Carry on.

[Shining Jack]

55. Lol!

+1000

[hfojvt]

59. What is my motivation to argue on merits

The OP wrote "This is why I am angry" and then gave a long list.

I didn't even read the whole list, much less click on all of the links to articles which may or may not be accurate as to the headline. Media of all types writes a lot of stupid crap which is half true, or completely fabricated, etc.

But I read the first five and think
yawn
yawn
yawn
yawn
yawn

Clearly the OP has issues that he/she is deeply invested in, but clearly as well, we do not share the same concerns. For example, not only do I not smoke medical pot, like that would ever be legal in Kansas anyway, I don't have any family or friends who are suffering in the slightest because of a lack of availability of medical pot.

Granted, this OP could end up with over 200 recs, and so some of DU seems to share the OP's concerns, and far far less of DU shares my concerns about tax policy, jobs, poverty and income inequality.

I have been arguing for months that Obama needs to be primaried, (I now think Obama is worse than Clinton, a man I voted against twice, and once against his wife) but not for the reasons on that very large list. If I was going to argue the merits, the issues would have to rate much higher on my give-a-shit-o-meter.

[Vanje]

60. I guess you'd have to "give a shit"

about civil liberties , transparency in government , and , like the , constitution and stuff.

(The first five articles listed, actually, dont have a thing to do with weed)

[hfojvt]

75. aha, those old time High Moral Principles

link 3 says "feds threaten crackdown if medical pot ...".

Seems to be a little bit related to weed.

As for High Moral Principles, they are nice in theory, but I tend to not get all that worked up about every supposed minor infraction. The issues that I care about look something like this

1. progressive taxes
2. good schools
3. effective social programs
4. peace
5. the environment
6. infrastructure and services


Those High Moral Principle thingies are somewhere below 1,000 in order of importance. I mean, civil rights are certainly important, but until mine have been violated, or Ted Rall gets rubbed out by the CIA, I don't sweat very much what happens to a pi$$ant like al-alwaki.

[Vanje]

78. Read the list again (edited to say Read the list for the first time!)

Do you honestly claim none of those subjects are important to you?
NONE?!

Administration not prosecuting banks? No? Doe'snt do anything to you?

Private Corporate farming on on National Wildlife refuges? Hmmm? Not a problem?

So you care about income equality. Heres some for you:
Obama breaks promise to make banks work with homeowners ??? , , AND blocks legal aid for families facing foreclosure?
and Banks to benefit most from White House program to help fight foreclosures
Nothing? Thats okie dokie with you? Well, you must be very comfortable.

Administration cuts money to help needy pay heating bills? . Everyone you know must live in a very warm place .

Drug makers win administration support in price dispute. ....Oh. Thats right. You dont support drugs for medical purposes.
Hope you stay healthy! or at least wealthy ! ....for a long long LONG time because...
A Reversal on End-of-Life Planning Under Medicare ....you're on your own, here too.

Administration backs utilities in climate case .....I guess thats not the 'environment' you claim to care about. How about THIS environment :
]DOJ gags scientists studying BP disaster Thats cool with you. Awesome!
Do they Save the Whales in the "environment" you care about? because it doesnt look like Obama's man, Salazar is looking after ther interests of our finny friends ;Lawsuit to Challenge Salazar's Wholesale Disregard of Marine Mammal Protection Laws in Gulf of Mexico

It goes on and on. Even for a one who admittedly does'nt care about civil liberties, theres enough here to appall any decent liberal.

[hfojvt]

122. you must have me confused with Santa Claus

a mistake I actually encourage.

But I am the Grinch, so I am not the one who checks lists twice, or even once. Instead, I gather up all of the crap and take it up to the top of Mt. Crumpet and give it the old heave-ho.

Sometimes, in the midst of all that crap may be some good things, maybe a DVD of The Lorax, but who has time to sort?

Actually, I never said that "none of them were important to me"

Rather, I said "a lot of them look silly" whereas you seemed to assert that none of them could be refudiated.

And no, prosecuting banks was not high on my priorities list.

The trouble with this list, for me, is that it lost me after about the first four, and skimming through it did not generate any real anger or fear either. Surprisingly enough, your attitude has not won me over either. Go figure.

[Vanje]

133. Have I got this right?

You criticize an OP that you did not fully read.

Not only did you not read the articles listed in the OP, ..You admit you could not make it through a dozen or so article titles.

Apparently the substance of the thread is of little interest to you.
I am similarly lost by your Dr.Suess references.
But its nice to know you are well read in children's literature.

[SwampG8r]

159. what i read him saying was

he is also pissed off but by things beyond this list
you seem to be argueing over who is more right in their co-pissedoffishness
in other words he agrees with your sentiment but for sentiments of his own

[JDPriestly]

98. And, while he is an improvement on the Republicans,

Obama is very weak on every issue that you claim matters to you.

Nobody cares about Al-Alwaki as a person. What we care about is whether Al-Alwaki's right under the Constitution to a fair trial was respected. It was not. That is an extremely serious violation of the Constitution.

Obama went to Harvard law school. He should know better. Shame on him.

[hfojvt]

132. hey, I think he sucks

I have been calling for a primary challenge for months. I took myself off of his email list last December when he caved on the Bush tax cuts.

But I still think there is silly stuff on this list. The Alwaki stuff jumps out at me. I am reminded of when Saddam's sons were killed. There was weeping and wailing on DU. I asked my dad what he thought. He just said "good riddance".

[2banon]

138. lol! i thought I detected the rank odor of faux snooze rhet-o-ric..

" I am reminded of when Saddam's sons were killed. There was weeping and wailing on DU. I asked my dad what he thought. He just said "good riddance".


weeping and wailing, ? :rofl:

[JDPriestly]

151. As I explained to someone else, it isn't a matter of caring

about Al-Alwaki, it is a matter of caring about the Constitutional right of each of us including Al-Alwaki to be tried before a jury of our peers before being sentenced, much less before being killed.

I have heard hints about what the accusations against Al-Alwaki might be, but that is too little to satisfy me that he received the due process to which we are all entitled under our Constitution.

Technicality? Yes. But it is for that and a few other "technicalities" that brave American soldiers including a few of my ancestors risked their lives in battle and many, many died.

[stockholmer]

173. +1000 , not to mention his 16 year old son, also a US citizen, also assassinated a couple days later

With no judicial process whatsoever.

[harmonicon]

176. Fuck right and wrong. Your dad's ok with cold-blooded murder?

That makes it fine by me!! "Hey, everyone! Some stranger's dad is ok with our country murdering people!! It's all ok now!!"

[GirlinContempt]

210. YAWN to assassinating American citizens?!?!??!

Fer reals?!

[Enthusiast]

84. Pffft!

[JDPriestly]

97. You should be afraid if an American citizen is killed without

a fair trial. Why? Because you or your children could be next. That's why.

We are on a slippery slope toward completely relinquishing the rights guaranteed to us by our Constitution, and one of them is a fair trial before a jury of our peers when we are accused of a crime.

[hfojvt]

123. sure they could

I suppose if they declared jihad against the United States and then went and hid in Yemen, that that could happen, but I am not terribly worried about it. Now if they start going after relatives of Aaron Burr for being obnoxious putzes, then it will be time to get worried.

[JDPriestly]

152. As the Germans discovered, dictators first break the rules about

due process and the rule of law with regard to the bad guys, then the guys they disagree with, and then they finally come after people like you, law abiding citizens whose ideas offend them. That is the way dictators work.

And our Constitution with what some people seem to think are its quaint due process requirements, is intended to prevent a dictatorship of that kind in the US.

That is why I do not defend or condemn Al-Alwaki. I have no idea what evidence there was against him. I don't think that our government was even concerned enough to demonstrate that it really had evidence of crimes on his part.

They just got rid of him in the modern-day version of the lynching or the ad hoc firing squad.

Whatever crimes and offenses Al-Alwaki committed, I have no idea. He may have been extremely guilty of horrible things. But those who killed him did so in violation of his rights as a citizen under the Constitution in my view.

[chervilant]

125. Conversely,

when something anti-Obama surfaces, all his devoted sycophants deride those of us who record herein our concerns with this administration.

I had issues with Mr. Obama before he became 'our guy,' the sole contender for the Democratic vote. Then, I had issues with his adjuration that we must move forward, and stop dwelling in the past (a trite justification for avoiding the prosecution of the myriad war criminals from the Bush cabal). Then, Obama appointed a Confederacy of Dunces to key posts in his administration, including Arne "I play basketball" Duncan as SecEd.

Blind allegiance predicated by party affiliation epitomizes the kind of 'patriotism' Samuel Johnson called 'the last refuge of a scoundrel.' We can ill afford such arrogance within our own ranks, even as we struggle to expose such false patriotism among the rank and file Republicans (Eric Cantor comes readily to mind).

Obama's lackluster performance as POTUS is not surprising to me. I doubt there's a 'leader' on this planet who could stop the speeding bullet of corporate megalomania. Still, I am among those who have noticed that MANY of Mr. Obama's decisions warrant the increasingly vociferous adjurations from progressive democrats that he NOT be a sock puppet for the uber wealthy.

Dismissing the concerns of *all* of Obama's critics is both demeaning and disingenuous, and it will not help us regain our footing in these perilous times.

[2banon]

140. rofl! "confederacy of dunces" ! good one!.

:rofl: :thumbsup:

[LWolf]

153. +1,000,000

[stockholmer]

174. eloquently put, love the Samuel Johnson reference

:hi:

A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.
- Friedrich Nietzsche

[treestar]

107. ding, ding ding

boy it must have taken a long time to compile that list and do the links!

[bvar22]

19. I could add a few of my own.

My "pet" issues are those that relate to Free Trade, LABOR, and the continued bi-partisan Strip Mining of the Middle Class.
I have a list of specific campaign promises with VIDEO that have been ignored, and even ridiculed by the administration,
but I didn't add them here,
because THAT would be Piling On.
:hippie:

Next time, please use Double Space on lists like that.
That will make it easier to read for those with tired, old eyes like mine.



You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their excuses.
Solidarity99!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Swede]

22. And why everyone should be scared.

[blindpig]

40. I'm so scared.....

Given the world wide expansion of US military presence and aggression.....

Given that the President has put Social Security on the table....

Given the obscene coddling of BP during the Gulf Tragedy....

You can't scare me much with that gang of goofs.

Whoever is President will do what is required to meet the needs of the ruling class.

[Raksha]

103. That pretty much sums it up, doesn't it?

Whoever is President will do what is required to meet the needs of the ruling class.

That's why I can't be cowed by the "lesser of two evils" bullshit any more.

[rhett o rick]

69. Our overlords want you to be scared. It isnt an accident that the republicons

are running so many crazies. And running them over and over. You are intended to be scared. As you can see in this thread. "Life may be terrible, but thank God (read Corp-God) that we dont have one of them crazies for a president. I feel sooo much better."

[ctsnowman]

216. That's the way I see it.

NT

[TreasonousBastard]

24. And you'll stay pissed off because you WANT to be pissed off...

some of those stories are bullshit, and some discuss situations which are complex and nuanced and have no correct "side". Doesn't make a damn bit of difference though, because Obama will never match up to the ridiculous expectations some have had.

He is not a saviour, saint, or magician. He's just a smart guy who is navigating the waters of US and world politics while trying to keep us afloat. No President can ever meet all the expectations of the left or the right, and if one tries to it will lead to his destruction.

It's a big country, and not that many agree with all our positions-- deal with it.

[2banon]

47. please help me discern which ones are the bullshit stories on the list..

that way, I can cross them off as "bullshit" before I post to my fb..

[2banon]

48. oh... i think 99% of folks in the country feel differently

we'll be dealing with it by golly..one way or the other.

[JDPriestly]

100. I used to think Obama was smart . . .

I'm not so sure these days.

The trade agreements were really, really stupid.

And his choice of economic advisers and education advisers, really not very smart.

So, Obama gives good speeches and is a nice guy, but smart??????

Compared to who? Either of the Roosevelts were way, way smarter, as was Lincoln, as were Madison and Jefferson and a number of other US presidents.

[2banon]

141. we had an extremely skewed perspective foisted on us for 8 years.. .

When they trotted out dumbya and foisted that moron on us for 8 long dreary years, along came someone who could actually string a few words together and we thought we were looking at brilliance, or at least someone intelligent enough we could get behind. And hey, he was a Constitutional Lawyer (not) and a Community Organizer to boot! (i'm thinking that might not be true either, but i don't really care anymore, cuz it's all been a big lie and we've been had big time.)

They may as well appoint the office to Howdy Doody for all that it matters. The President doesn't appear to be in charge of anything apparently.

[treestar]

109. +1

Obama cannot just convince everyone to take the same positions as the malcontents with the "bully pulpit." If that worked, Bush could have turned us all into right wingers.

[xchrom]

27. Recommend

[TBF]

28. K&R nt

[progressoid]

30. That's more than a few.

k/r

[HereSince1628]

32. You only picked the bad stuff!!!!!!!

Too bad there is such a huge damned pile of it!

[Huey P. Long]

35. Oh wow. OCCUPY. -eom

[Enrique]

36. you need an attitude adjustment

stare at this picture of Bo the dog wearing a lei and you should feel better

[Vanje]

42. Look!

Heres Obama with some babies!

[Shining Jack]

208. Awww, that's so sweet!

Best President ever. :P

[Enthusiast]

87. I'm softening up already.

[Mosaic]

37. So many morons that listen to lies on fox

Believe Obama is 'socialist'. He's actually to the right of Reagan, one of his idols, if you examine his actions and policy. Please see things clearly.

[midnight]

38. So many icky things... So I decided to open with the blackwater deal-yuck!

Apparently, there is no misdeed so big that it can keep guns-for-hire from working for the government. And this is despite a 2008 campaign pledge from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to ban the company from federal contracts.

Eight private security firms have won State’s giant Worldwide Protective Services contract, the big Foggy Bottom partnership to keep embassies and their inhabitants safe. Two of those firms are longtime State contract holders DynCorp and Triple Canopy. The others are newcomers to the big security contract: EOD Technology, SOC, Aegis Defense Services, Global Strategies Group, Torres International Services and International Development Solutions LLC.

Don’t see any of Blackwater’s myriad business names on there? That’s apparently by design.

Blackwater and the State Department tried their best to obscure their renewed relationship. As Danger Room reported Wednesday, Blackwater did not appear on the vendors’ list for Worldwide Protective Services. And the State Department confirms that the company, renamed Xe Services, didn’t actually submit its own independent bid.http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/10/exclusive-blackwater-wins-piece-of-10-billion-merc-deal

[Vanje]

43. More kick

Pumped up kicks

[Name removed]

44. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DCBob]

58. I could make a list 10 times as long with reasons you shouldnt be pissed.

But I doubt it would make any difference with the outrage brigade.

[rhett o rick]

72. Yeah, send your list to OWS and see if that placates them.

But then you probably dont support OWS. It is a bit embarrassing for Pres Obama.

[bluestate10]

91. Explain exactly how, and better yet WHY President Obama should be embarrassed by OWS?

Everyone has a right to protest in the streets. I prefer more effective means for bringing about change, but if the OWS people want to take their course of action, more power to them.

[rhett o rick]

102. Strange that you have to ask that. People, exercising their Constitutional rights

are being brutalized in many cities in our country. This is a reflection on Congress and the President.

What are your "more effective means for bringing about change"?

[treestar]

108. Is "being brutalized" bringing about any change?

This is the US. It is absurd to think protests here are going to be of like effect as in a third world dictatorship and sillier to rely on "brutalization." By cops, subjected to the Constitution no less.

[bluestate10]

110. OWS people can focus all of the energy into organizing politically and

finding political candidates that reflect their views. That is how change happens. Getting sprayed in the face by morons that have authority to wield weapons against unarmed, peaceful people IS NOT how to bring about change. Brutality does gain sympathy, but sympathy does not bring about change unless an organized and concerted effort is made to gather all sympathetic people into a political force. Until people of your thinking realize that hard reality, teafucks and the right will continue to have their way with government.

[rhett o rick]

112. In other words, sit down and shut the fuck up. Yes Rahm. nm

[harmonicon]

178. If you really think that, you've completely missed their point.

The point is that working within US politics is now impossible. It's been tried, has, and will fail. The two parties and the media have seen to that. It's as if you thought the remedy to gaining women's suffrage was for women to just vote for it... er... impossible, schmipossible. Working within the system is the only way, even when the system is broken!!

[chervilant]

134. More effective means?!?

The most significant social change in this nation's history has been accomplished by small groups of citizens!

“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”

Margaret Mead (1901-1978)

[hfojvt]

76. reminds me of a favorite snippet from Catch 22

Yossarian says to Lt. Scheisskopf's wife on Thanksgiving.

"I bet I can name two things to be miserable about for every one you can name to be thankful for."

except you are sorta going the other way. I said it this way, with The Parable of the Irish Stew
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/hfojvt/163

[bluestate10]

88. President Obama could crap gold bricks, that crowd would just accuse him

of spending too much for food at the White House. Nothing will satisfy them, or teafucks.

[Vanje]

93. But if Obama crapped gold bricks on a school lunch pizza...

that other crowd would call it a vegetable.

[rhett o rick]

104. Maybe if he stopped appointing men like Jeff Immelt to be his advisors. nm

[bluestate10]

111. Struggles are not won with only saints.

You despise him and to be honest, I have enormous concerns about him due to his company's federal tax payment avoidance. But Immelt is paid to do what is in the best interests of the company that he leads. The way to counter his type of capitalism is to build alternatives that put people first. But I bet that you despise capitalism with a blind passion, yet you simply can't name a system that has greater capacity to deliver good if run right. The challenge is not to hate men like Immelt, but to replace him with men and women that put their country people and fellow world citizen's economic well being on the same level with profits.

[rhett o rick]

113. That's quit a load. We elected Pres Obama in the hope of change. He immediately started

surrounding himself with people like Jeff Immelt. This was not part of the deal. How do we replace Mr. Immelt as you suggest? Send an email to the Pres and beg? I dont despise the President and when you say things like that you are being intellectually dishonest.

In the current circumstances your defense of capitalism is scary. Capitalism and democracy do not mix well. Capitalism works so much better under authoritarianism. China is a great example of capitalism. Capitalism must be controlled.

In my opinion, the Pres caters to big corporations and that's why he has Jeff Immelt at his side.

[chervilant]

137. Sad, really...

I find it disheartening that so many of our fellow DUers are bent on vilifying those of us who voice our concerns about Obama's 'leadership.' This tendency to denigrate those of us who are questioning Obama's performance reminds me of a rather interesting subtext to Obama's controversial record, to whit:

Obama has admiringly quoted St. Ronnie, during whose administration this nation's massive economic train wreck first occurred. Ronald Reagan spent more than EVERY other president before him COMBINED. Our country saw its first trade deficit EVER during Reagan's reign of terror. Does anyone else remember how the intractable Ronnie Raygun irrevocably damaged unions when he fired the air traffic controllers? Does anyone else remember how he embraced and promoted Uncle Miltie's catastrophic economic creed?

The uber wealthy corporatists, who installed Reagan in office for their express purposes, grew ever MORE wealthy and powerful during his tenure. So, WHAT is it that Mr. Obama admires about Mr. Reagan?

How about this patronizing little sound bite from Mr. Obama during the Debt Ceiling Kabuki Theater:

Now, every family knows that a little credit card debt is manageable. But if we stay on the current path, our growing debt could cost us jobs and do serious damage to the economy.

Really? Setting aside for now the fact that the uber wealthy have not been asked to make sacrifices like those expected of the vast hoi polloi (AND, apparently, ignoring the fact that many of these hedonists are responsible for the WORST blows to our economy), Mr. Obama needs to use the correct tense when discussing job losses and serious damage to our economy--especially NOW that the wrecked engine of our economy is FINALLY grinding to a halt. We are already witness to the relentless crumbling of this global economy, quite the logical outcome of decades of unfettered hedonism from the disaster capitalists.

What say you about this, from our Paternalistic POTUS:

"We must eat our peas."

Really, Mr. President? How presumptuous to use peas (a most delicious vegetable) as an analogy for the austerity measures shit sandwich we're expected to swallow (we, the hoi polloi, NOT the uber wealthy).

Actually, Mr. Obama pegged the meter on condescension when he asserted that "YOU progressives" view the glass as "half empty" (Cenk did a great commentary on this which was posted here on DU). Like SO many other jobless, soon-to-be-homeless citizens in our beleaguered nation, I DON'T need Mr. Obama's condescension; I need a *JOB.*

Which brings me to this final observation:

Obama's appointment of Arne Duncan as SecEd, ALONE, put a huge question mark in my mind about his integrity. Then, his casual dismissal of protesting teachers as 'resistant to change' provided an accurate, if disheartening, picture of his attitude toward a profession that is VENERATED in nations that excel at educating their citizenry. How many teachers (firefighters, union workers) support him now?

Mr. Obama (and his sycophants) can ignore our anger, or he can hear our concerns. Dismissing us as whiners, malcontents, or pathetically misinformed is both disingenuous and disrespectful, and it will NOT help us save this nation.

[MannyGoldstein]

136. Yes! For example, just last month Obama passed three of his four jobs bills, but

http://www.scfl.org/?ulnid=2070">Obama Signs 'God-Awful' Free Trade Bills

but do folks on DU give him any credit? They treat it like a vicious attack on the 99%! It's crazy!

Hopefully the many newly-employed in Korea, Panama, and Colombia will give Obama the credit he deserves.

[LWolf]

154. +1

[RetroLounge]

207. This ^^^

RL

[Shining Jack]

209. +1000!

[Scurrilous]

61. I thought we hated lists.

:shrug:

[stevenleser]

147. You beat me to it. So, lists are now in! Bookmark this OP!!!! nt

[Scurrilous]

150. ...

:thumbsup:

[woo me with science]

65. K&R And that's a very small sample. nt

[whatchamacallit]

66. K&R!

Fuck this shit!

[in_cog_ni_to]

70. Sad state of affairs it is, indeed.

:scared: With Dems like that, who needs Rethugs?

[Vanje]

71. Indeed. nt

[woo me with science]

73. K&R

[defendandprotect]

dupe

[defendandprotect]

74. This needs another K/R -- kick -- !!

[xchrom]

77. Kick

[Vanje]

79. I'll see your kick

..and raise you a Rec

[xchrom]

101. Well, I've already rec'd, raised a kick - so kick again! Nt

[xchrom]

135. Eh- wise guy- well, kick again. Nt

[Magoo48]

80. How can so few people fuck up so much so royally, so often?

[bertman]

81. But, but, but . . . he's a Democrat so he must be adored. REC. nt

[BlueIris]

85. Excellent. It's too bad this set of blue links isn't more widely appreciated. nt

[Enthusiast]

89. k&r NT

[hyphenate]

90. I'll bet you dollars to donuts

That a lot of these stories were written by sources friendly to the Bush era. The right-winged propaganda machine is still at large and whacking people's brains a lot more aggressively against the Obama administration than they ever did during the 8 years of pure hell we endured under that crackpot regime.

I'm not saying what Obama is doing is better, but I'm saying that it's being made to seem a lot worse than it likely is.

And go back in time and I can honestly say that there is a downside to every form of government, and any administration, going back to George Washington himself. Someone is going to be riled up no matter who's in charge.

[JDPriestly]

92. K&R

And he is almost certain to be re-elected and continue his attacks on our Constitution and our freedom because the Republican alternatives are nutty and no honest person has the courage to run against Obama.

[Raksha]

94. K & R, bookmarking

[unapatriciated]

95. k&r

[indepat]

106. While not all-inclusive, the ratio of RW to LW initiatives in these captioned headlines

provide a pretty good guage of where in the political spectrum the politics of this Administration lie. :shrug: :patriot:

[Tx4obama]

114. Why are some of us ARE NOT pissed off

Obama’s 2008 Campaign Promises Kept:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/

Long partial LIST (with citation links) of what Obama has done: http://pleasecutthecrap.typepad.com/main/what-has-obama-done-since-january-20-2009.html

Short List of Progressive Achievements by The Obama Administration
http://shoqvalue.com/short-list-of-progressive-achievements-by-the-obama-administration

Obama Administration’s Achievements (Thus Far)
http://obamaachievements.org/list

Obama’s LGBT Chart LIST
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x777350

Accomplishments by the Obama Administration and Congress on LGBT Equality
http://www.equalitygiving.org/Accomplishments-by-the-Administration-and-Congress-on-LGBT-Equality

100 Accomplishments of President Barack Obama
http://simplifythepositive.blogspot.com/2010/03/100-accomplishments-of-president-barack.html

Lists and graphs: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=433&topic_id=751914

List: 2.8 Years in Pictures....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x772937

We All Have a Choice in the 2012 Election
http://www.democratsforprogress.com/2011/09/03/we-all-have-a-choice-in-the-2012-election/

So That Ignorance Won't Be The Reason Why "Progressives" Are Throwing The President Under The Bus
http://www.thepeoplesview.net/2011/09/so-that-ignorance-wont-be-reason-why.html

80 Reasons Why It’s Time To Take These Republican/Tea Party ‘Sons Of Bitches’ Down
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/09/06/80-reasons-why-its-time-to-take-these-republicantea-party-sons-of-bitches-down/

Bikini Jobs Graph
http://www.democraticleader.gov/blog/?p=4478

Rachel Maddow On President Obama & Democrats Accomplishments (November 2010)
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLQ-OKa6OZQ

Legislation signed by President Obama http://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/signed-legislation

Executive Orders signed by President Obama http://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/executive-orders

The REAL Reason Barack Obama Won That Nobel Peace Prize
http://wrightandleftreport.com/news/the-real-reason-barack-obama-won-that-nobel-peace-prize/

Obama’s Foreign Policy Successes
http://thinkprogress.org/report/obama-foreign-policy-successes/

[Shining Jack]

143. Yawn!

[pscot]

115. I had to clear my ignore list

so I could follow the discussion. K&R.

[hulka38]

160. lol!

[chervilant]

117. Oh, Goodie!

Something tangible to counter Teh Hallowed List.

Thank you for this.

[Hardrada]

128. It's great!

[DeSwiss]

118. K&R

[MissDeeds]

120. K&R n/t

[upi402]

124. Obama backs telecom immunity

nail meet coffin

i am no longer in that party either

no party for me
no party

[WCGreen]

126. Well, that's an impressive list of stuff...

It's been building and building.

I don't know. It's hard to justify a lot of that stuff as just political jockeying as I imagine a lot of long time backers of president Obama do.

I guess I am not as upset as other because I never had such high expectations for him.

[harmonicon]

179. I think I'm in the same boat as you.

Really, I just expected to be voting for not making matters worse when I voted for Obama. Some people seemed to be expecting the moon. Since Dems took control of congress in 2006 and did virtually nothing to bring about left/liberal policies - or even to stop Bush policies, for that matter - I stopped expecting anything substantial from the Democratic party. He has done some things which surprised me in the negative, but on the whole, it's what I expected.

[bigwillq]

127. K and R (nt)

[Sportsguy]

129. Lots Of Info There

Bookmarking for now, so I can read it later.

[sandyj999]

130. Pretty much sums it up. I am really angry. Sad thing is nobody cares.

[KoKo]

131. +!!!

[Mnemosyne]

139. ...

[Demeter]

142. The real question is: Why Aren't the Rest of Americans Up in Arms, Too?

[mrdmk]

144. K & R & P & O'ed

:kick:

[Better Believe It]

145. K & R

[Name removed]

146. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Vanje]

149. Aw Jeez

[unkachuck]

148. bottom line....

....it's Obamas' choice to represent the status quo, nobody is forcing him....Obama is making Obama unacceptable when the status quo is no longer acceptable....

[donheld]

155. Thank you

[MindMover]

157. and the latest.....

voting on bill this week that will allow military to pick up any citizen at anytime for any reason.....

[saras]

161. Because we're not on psychiatric meds, and anger and unease are sensible responses to the situation

[SwampG8r]

162. i was a big supporter in 2008

i feel like i was taken for a ride
not this time
this time i vote for who represents me best
no more voting against anyone
from now on i only vote FOR my best interests
if that means i vote for the rent is too damn high party then thats what it means

[ellisonz]

170. The Rent is Too Damn High!

[HCE SuiGeneris]

164. Very nicely presented.

Let's not be so nice about demanding accountability.

[Fire Walk With Me]

165. ...

:thumbsup:

[Fantastic Anarchist]

171. What's sad is that's just a partial list.

[WillyT]

177. K & R !!!

:kick:

[jannyk]

183. Fucking Big K&R!!!

[Robb]

184. Perhaps you should update your bookmarks.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1819853&mesg_id=1819933

[fascisthunter]

196. lol

good gawd.... is that all you have?

[Robb]

214. When I post, I stick to issues I have some knowledge of.

It is a practice I recommend, if sometimes only by example. :D

[polichick]

186. Yes, just some of the reasons Pres. Obama is only the lesser of evils.

[Name removed]

187. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[zanana1]

199. Of course, a President Gingrich would be MUCH better!

It's one thing to complain. It's another thing to try to swing people over to the other side. And if you say "just don't vote", that's saying that the Republican candidate gets your vote. There's no denying that.

[Vanje]

202. I knew you were going to say that. nt

[zanana1]

203. HAH! nt

[woo me with science]

204. More than uneasy. Angry as hell and alarmed for this country. nt

[Myrina]

211. Too late for a Rec, but here's a kick ...

:kick:

[TBF]

213. Another for your list: Obama Legalizes Horse Slaughter for Human Consumption

http://technorati.com/lifestyle/article/obama-legalizes-horse-slaughter-for-human/#ixzz1f9DAqZlG