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OK, I watched "Extreme Couponing" for the first time...

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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:46 PM
Original message
OK, I watched "Extreme Couponing" for the first time...
and this is what I "think" is happening. Please tell me if I am wrong.

These people must be hoarders. There is no other explanation. One woman bought an enormous amount of cat food and she doesn't have cats (there was no mention of her donating all of it to animal shelters). The rest bought stuff that gets stale over time, like cereal, and unless they are feeding an army their families will end up eating tasteless food of doubtful nutritious value.

I guess there is the thrill value as well. And of course getting themselves on a TV show (but then others who don't go on the show do it, so it can't be that much of an incentive).

What am I missing here? Does anyone have the answer to why people are doing this?

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Goldom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. They also never mention the fact
That in the time they spend working on it, they could have an actual job and earn more than they're saving. Plus all those coupons don't appear for free, they have subscriptions to tons of papers and buy more coupons online.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. You prettty much summed it up. These women stay home and claim they're earning their joblessness
When in reality they're just wasting time feeding their psychological hoarding needs.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Well, they said that they "dumpster dive" for magazines and circulars containing
coupons so that doesn't cost any money (but it sure takes up time!).

One woman said she saved more by extreme couponing than she could make a her part time job so she quit her job to do the couponing! This financial idiocy astounds me.
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
94. Actually at a part time job that only lets you work for four or five hours,
At a pay rate of even $ 10 an hour, once you figure in the cost of gas, and it's not worth it.

Not that I condone this weird behavior. I have known several people that will drive to Timbuktu and back in order to save 20% on some item they don't need. And this couponing fits in the same category.





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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
2. AFAIK, a few of these people distribute the goods to food shelters, churches, etc...
And the rest, IMO, are have an "extreme hobby" to put it kindly, or a form of OCD, obsessive compulsive disorder.

I'll have to break out the DSM-IV

:hi:
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. All of them are hoarders, and in reality, they're not providing the much needed products to churches
They're providing 500 bottles of Windex.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #5
70. Excess inventory in many cases gets sold at flea markets, garage sales.
Don't be fooled into thinking some of these people aren't turning a profit on their mass purchases of items of which there seems no good reason to have a ten year's supply of sitting in their basement.

That inventory acquired for next to nothing turns a tidy profit.

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sammytko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #70
79. I had an extreme couponer on anohter board finally admit to selling 50 bottles of Nivea lotion
She had gotten another 50 free. She gets free coupon inserts because she works for a newspaper. She shops every day after work looking for bargains. She says she doesn't make enough at her job, but I would think, maybe a part time job instead of bargain shopping?
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #2
73. There's a few DUers who do extreme couponing for food banks
they've posted about it before.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
3. Thanks for posting this. I agree wholeheartedly. I realized some things in watching it...
(1) That, yes, they're hoarders. Who the HELL needs 200 bottles of Windex, for chrissakes?????
(2) That their couponing provides them with only THE most toxic, artificial, unorganic, unnatural of foods known to man. I've been noticing that coupons are available only for toxic things. There aren't coupons for fresh veggies, for fresh fruits, for fresh meats, for fresh soy products, for fresh juices, for milk, etc. etc. It's all cleaning fluids, toothbrushes (who the F needs 350 toothbrushes?????), all manner of cleaning fluids, cleaning powders (why on earth would someone pack a shelf from floor to ceiling with some foundation makeup????). I like some of my edible products FRESH, so of course, couponing is out of the question. No wonder they pay 25 cents for $500 of products. They're all toxins with which to lather their house!!!

These people are clearly nuts. They waste their own time, they bother the store shoppers by f******* up the line with their hoarding activities, and they fill their house with toxins.

NUTS, all of them!
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. I spend time collecting coupons that I need from publications I get anyway,
like the Sunday papers. With coupons mostly, I get coffee, frozen vegetables, laundry and dish detergent, and sometimes personal grooming products (but only if I use it ordinarily). Mostly, I save by buying the store's own brand and from sales on what I want (if there's a coupon involved, great, but the coupon alone doesn't do it for me).

I, too, noticed that there were lots of items they were buying with coupons for their families that were awful: "juice" drink boxes for their kids, snack junk, and hot dogs.

All that said, I came away feeling very sorry for these people. They feel an overwhelming urge to spend and go to absurd lengths to show they are "saving" money and they must be even further behind the 8 ball financially as a result. They cannot have very good lives...
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Oh my God, I know. They fill their house with such inedibles! Ridiculous people nt
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #8
44. I watched some woman "score"
25 CASES of Gatorade????

It was just her and her husband.

Really? I was speechless.
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MorningGlow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
25. Your second point is why I quit using coupons
Prepackaged crap like Hamburger Helper or Lunchables? Nuh-uh. I truly never used any of the stuff that I could get with coupons, so it really was a waste of time. That and the fact that the coupons required that I buy way too many of one thing for the coupon to count. I have a small family, and there's no way I'd bother spending mega bucks to get 50 cents off twelve boxes of tissue or whatever. Just wasn't worth it.
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sunflowerseed Donating Member (28 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
29. 91% of soy products are GM.
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #29
55. Organic soy is not GM. Almost all GM soybeans are fed to cows, pigs,
and chickens. And that means that human exposure to GM soy comes from eating animals, not from eating (organic) soy products. Vegans, who tend to eat more soy than average, rarely get any exposure to GM soy at all because they tend to choose organic soy products. Meat-eaters and heavy dairy consumers get the most exposure to GM soy.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:17 AM
Response to Reply #3
57. Well of course, television shows use extreme people and situations to generate interest.
Coupons certainly do exist for fresh fruit and veg (and frozen, which is almost as good, and canned, which is okay for some things) soy, juices, etc. There are plenty out there for healthy, non-toxic cleaning products, household goods, etc. I save a lot of money (and donate a lot of stuff I couldn't otherwise afford to give) by using coupons for such things, and I'm damned picky about what goes into my home.
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lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #3
75. Yes, there *ARE* coupons for fresh veggies; juice, milk, and meats.
They are not the MAJORITY of coupons, but they are out there,and becoming more prominent. There are also a growing number of coupons for the organic and gluten-free brands. The coupon sites I use for reference even group these coupons accordingly so that I can find them more easily.

There's a coupon for almost anything, if you take the time to find it.
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hughee99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. I believe the cat food was for a neighbor.
Sadly, my wife was watching it the other day and I caught that part. I found it all a little disturbing as well.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. my 3 granddaughters, ages 16, 13 and 10, found it crazy, too.
Sometimes I think I must be un-american. No wonder Europeans think we're nuts...
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hughee99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Sadly, on the list of reasons why people think americans are nuts
I'll bet this is very far down.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. Yup. Just another example (small but ohmygod)...
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
12. i do couponing myself and don't appreciate the way these women are being judged.
Granted i do not do 'extreme couponing' but I DO spend a lot of time making a list and I resent this idea that women think they earn their unemployment status. It takes a lot of work to do couponing. But it is necessary so I can feed my family. The goal is to have enough stocked up so that you can have it til the next sales cycle. I have saved over $500 this year since I started and we actually have food to eat. The cost has gone up for groceries while my budget for them hasn't changed. But why don't we call them hoarders. Some may be, but many give extras to food pantry. I have a friend who gives to food pantry and community action. I am sure I will get flamed here but frankly I don't care. I do not need to justify why I stay home. And I certainly don't need to justify what I do to save my family money on groceries.

For the record regular couponers don't really like the extreme couponing show. It is not really a realistic view of what we do.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I didn't mean to offend you. I also spend time couponing and I do save money!
So I am one of those regular couponers you mention. I don't have too much space for storage so I am limited but I have my little coupon holder with me every shopping trip and my husband, who has spinal arthritis and can't help me shop, helps by cutting coupons from the circulars that come with the Sunday papers. I always make a list, which I think is essential to planning and saving at the same time!

My comment was really more about this show and all the attendant publicity than about simple couponing. To be fair, one woman on the show said she was doing it to help feed the 200 people at her church. I mentioned to my granddaughters that I felt it was a legitimate reason to buy so much and they nodded in agreement.

I'm sorry, I should have said in my OP that I believe there is a legitimate place for couponing, plenty of people do it and there's nothing wrong with it. You have my apologies for that.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #14
31. It's ok. as a stay at home mom i am always feeling a bit as if I don't contribute
even though it's a tough job and I couldn't make enough to make it worth getting a job and paying child care. I don't watch that show and you are probably right about these women. The parts they show tend to show them storing stuff under beds and such. I can't say much as I have a bunch of flooring in one of my kids closets that my hubby got real cheap. But that was him and of course at 4.50 a box you COULDN't pass that up. I think that show hurts the rest of us. You get these wannabes out there who decide to do extreme couponing and then stores change policies to make it harder to use the coupons. I don't get clapping managers. I get dirty looks and people acting like I am taking money out of THEIR pocket.

I am glad that you do couponing. I try to get my family members to do it to save money. But it does take time and can be a PITA. I wish that show would go away. Or at least be more realistic and representative.
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #31
68. I say Bravo to you for raising your own kids!
I know it isn't always easy to do financially but I really think if it can be done, it's good for one of the parents to be child's main caregiver over childcare.

:toast:

Julie
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. agreed. why assume they're hoarders?
ok, i haven't seen this particular show but i have seen coverage of couponers getting an entire basketful of groceries for seven cents, e.g.

personally, we spend a ton on groceries even with same limited coupons and other savings techniques, but i don't understand why people would dump on people who practically eliminate this part of their budget. remember, everything you save on groceries is after taxes.

think about the economics of a job stay-at-home moms. you have to pay taxes AND pay for day care or a babysitter. many people would not clear much tax-home pay after those expenses, especially if we're talking about a second income and so the taxes would be even higher. if the amount you can save from couponing is roughly the take-home pay from a job, then why not? plus you get to be the one raising your kid instead of someone for hire.

and getting a gazillion bottles of windex? sure, if they're just accumulating stuff in the attic, that's hoarding. but why assume that? they could donate it, they could give it to their friends and neighbors, they could sell it on ebay or whatever.

if they incorporated, it would be called "inventory" and no one would dream of calling it hoarding.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. You know, you have a point. I wondered if these people were engaged at "reselling"
the stuff at a slightly higher price than what they paid, so they can make a little money.

If this is not the case, I have to call them hoarders, after seeing the vast quantities of what they were buying and storing. It was WAY more than normal people would spend and store on food. And it didn't make any sense. Why would you buy foods like cereals in vast quantities for a family of 4? And only one in the show I saw were actually donating the stuff. Which is fine with me. It's a great idea, in fact.

This show was NOT about what most people do with coupons, which is save the ones you'll use, look at the specials in your weekly supermarket specials circular, and make a weekly menu and shopping list accordingly.

Is there any other rational way of doing this?

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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:59 PM
Original message
I coupon fairly consistently, and combine that with attention to sales.
Lots of websites out there to track those two things together and come out ahead. I'm averaging about 40% off my grocery bill since I started, so that's a good thing. I wouldn't say it's as good as I could make were I working full-time, but it certainly helps. That and not paying for daycare, no question I'm at least breaking even and probably doing better by my kiddo.

As to the Windex (I missed the show), Mrs. Robb used to look aghast when I'd come home with the smokin' deal on laundry detergent that meant I had like eight bottles of the stuff. And yet as the weeks and months roll on, it gets used -- and in the end I paid a quarter what I would've otherwise. So who knows.

The key is (as always) to buy stuff you know you'll use, in quantities you'll use before it goes bad. Just like Cosco or what-have-you, but usually when I "strike" on something in any quantity it's an absurdly good deal, and I save my family money.
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pipi_k Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:53 PM
Response to Original message
30. Laundry detergent....oh yeah!
Mr Pipi does the shopping here, and I love it when he comes home with tons of stuff that doesn't go bad, like detergents, soaps, and toilet paper.

Hey, we're going to use it anyway, so why not.

What doesn't please me is seeing him bring home stuff that we'll never be able to finish in time.

There are only the two of us here, so even just a couple of something...like the two jars of raspberry preserves he bought a while back...will eventually expire. We don't use it very often. So today he went to use one of the jars and found the expiration date was Sept of this year but used it anyway.

I can't blame him, though. He knows how I grew up, and how, at one point, I was on my own with my kids and we were poor and we ate Welfare food (before food stamps) and I would put empty boxes and stuff in the pantry to make it look like we had food if anyone checked.

So he's trying to make up for that, bless him... :)



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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
53. that is good -- buy when the price is right, not when you need it.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
blueamy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #15
66. Cause that is what they are doing. NOT
Who the heck would go to ebay to buy Windex? Really?

I really hate it when I have one coupon and want one bottle of laundry detergent and there are no bottles left, cause some crazy couponer has cleaned the shelves.

These extreme couponers need to learn how to respect others....it's "not all about you".
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #12
33. I'm with you. My wife was a serious clipper and saved us a ton....
... on groceries. Rather than eating stale food, we were eating things we otherwise would not have been able to afford.

I don't believe we ever bought any paper or magazine just for the coupons. We did at that time subscribe to two papers and got a free flyer in addition. I know damn well we didn't buy anything we had no use for.

There were also deals with coupons and rebates that literally resulted in us being paid to eat certain things. Those items always tasted especially good.

Mrs. Scuba said that a serious effort could cut 30 - 40% off the grocery bill, at least back then.
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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
48. +1
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #12
64. Sorry -- but someone who gets animal food with NO animals?
Edited on Sun Nov-27-11 09:54 AM by Donnachaidh
The judgement being laid on THEM is correct. They are hoarders, and in dire need of psychological intervention.

I do couponing too. And *I* resent the fact that many people now think *all* people with coupons are nuts -- BECAUSE of these nutbar shows.

Reality shows should be banned. these lazy production companies are digging out the extreme and crazy in order to make a fast buck. And everyone is getting tarred with a big brush.
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blueamy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #64
67. there ya go
they are hoarders
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #64
71. they gave the catfood to their neighbor
With whom they shared a garage, as a way of thanking her for putting up with the shelves in the garage.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #71
81. so they don't have enough room in their own place?
They are HOARDERS.

That neighbor will come to regret being *neighborly*.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #81
82. They have a condo with a shared garage
The inside didn't look cluttered. Though I wasn't paying particularly close attention, the garage didn't really, either.
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a la izquierda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #64
91. I watched one episode in absolute shock awhile back...
and the only sane-appearing person on the show donated to her local food bank and the 400 boxes of cat litter to the animal shelter.
I could deal with her. The rest of the crazy people on that show are for the birds.

I got stuck behind a couponer once. She had a huge binder with some snotty saying on it. My husband almost had to clamp his hand over my mouth when I saw the saying. Damn, I wish I could remember what it said. Pissed me off. I had to wait as she unloaded three friggen carts. It was right before a holiday, so the whole store was packed. Thank you, lady. I'll never forget that day.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #64
95. i do agree with you about that. this does not represent couponers
and 'reality' shows are definitely NOT reality. They are cheap and they can create the reality they want to create. People are genuinely trying to save their family money and feed them and this show does nothing but make that harder for the rest of us.
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lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
77. I saved over $80 on my Thanksgiving shopping trip
...in which I got a 17lb turkey for $11.
Coupons.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #77
86. good job.
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nadine_mn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #77
90. I don't think the OP was dissing coupon use in general
Its the people that will buy 350 toothbrushes - that is extreme, or 200 deodorants

I don't think anyone has a problem with coupon use - its a great way to save money, its the clearing out of shelves on stuff that will never be used or at least by the expiration date.
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ThatsMyBarack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
13. I've got nothing against couponers.
But I DO avoid shows entitled "EXTREME" anything.
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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
17. thing is, i've never lived near a grocery store sufficiently accommodating.
whenever i hear about major savings with coupons, it's invariably at some place that has triple coupons and allows multiple coupons per item.

i've never lived near a store with policies so generous.

best i've even seen is double coupons UP TO $1.00, not good with any other offer. yippee.

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Phentex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. I also think they have managers who accommodate them...
many stores will not allow you to purchase 15 of the same item with 15 coupons. Some stores have limits for sale items regardless of coupons, but they never seem to show this on tv.
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richmwill Donating Member (972 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
19. It looks staged to me...
Especially when they show the smiling store manager applauding wildly as the shopper drives away with $2000 worth of groceries that they paid $1.25 for. And the cashiers hugging the women after the transactions are over. Frankly, I don't get it- what can you do with 35 jars of mayonnaise, seriously?
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
24. It IS staged.
The stores bend their coupon rules so that these people can get these huge deals. Most stores limit the number of like coupons one can use per transaction. In other words, you can only use five (or whatever the store's limit is) $0.40 off a jar of Miracle Whip coupons per transaction, not 35 like on the show. What you see there is not realistic. Yes, a person can save a significant amount of money using coupons, but not like you see in that show.

I absolutely despise this show. Some of us use coupons so that we can afford to eat. But, thanks to the wannabes who watch it, we often get to a store only to find the shelves cleaned out. And, these assholes will also grab all the coupons out of the store's racks, tear pads, etc. Bunch of greedy fucks.

I see the point in keeping a small stockpile. After all, shit happens, like blizzards, earth quakes, etc. However, these people have all crossed the line into hoarding, and as somebody up said, they're just plain nuts.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. Plus you have to pay taxes on the total BEFORE deducting the coupon
So if you buy $600 worth of groceries and sales tax is 7%, you are going to pay AT LEAST $42 for those groceries. I know not all states charge sales tax on food but mine does and this really bugs me about this show.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #26
32. I believe it is a CRIME to charge a state tax on FOOD!
Didn't the Bible have something to say about salt taxes?

I mean, really! What is the matter with states leges, anyway? This is a crime against the people. It is an insult and is morally wrong. Where are the churches in this?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #32
62. I agree but I've never lived anywhere where you didn't pay tax on food.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #62
88. I never have, I don't believe (maybe in VA where I lived for 9 years).
Certainly not in New England. The idea of taxing grocery food is so abhorrent up here I think there would be riots in the streets if our state lege even talked about it. Our state republicans didn't even try...
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 10:02 PM
Response to Reply #26
51. Sales tax on food is horrible
I've never lived anywhere that taxed groceries, what an awful thing to do. Criminal.
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cyglet Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Is it
mostly in those states that don't have a state income tax?

(They have to make up for it somehow...)
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #52
63. We have income tax in my state and food is taxed
Farmers don't pay sales tax on anything they put in the ground or in their tanks but the consumers pay tax on the food they grow. Go figure.
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sammytko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #52
80. TX does not have an income tax or tax on food...
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snooper2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 10:09 AM
Response to Reply #52
102. We don't have a state income tax nor do we pay taxes on Food
Come on down to Texas :P
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Gormy Cuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #26
78. Only sixteen states charge tax on groceries, so from a national perspective it's more typical
than showing states WITH food taxes. However, it is one of the ways this show bends "reality." Another is that many of the deals used such as doubling or tripling coupon values or getting cash or credit for using coupons that exceed the price of the product are just not available to shoppers in most markets.
Those deals are dependent on living in areas with steep competition or near chains that make it a policy to tout such deals.

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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #19
37. I'd be a happy camper if I was that store manager
First, his store was on television.

More to the point, HE was on television.

As for the coupons: When a store accepts a manufacturer's coupon from a customer, it is sent to the manufacturer who pays a small fee--a penny, I think--for each coupon accepted, as well as reimbursing the face value of the coupon. Double coupons are different--the manufacturer pays the face value of the coupon, the store pays the "double" amount. So...if a can of beans was a dollar and it was paid for with a 50 cent coupon, the beans put $1.01 into the till rather than $1. One penny doesn't seem like much but you make the big bucks on the volume.

The only way you can use two coupons on one product is if they're from different sources--a store coupon coupled with a manufacturer coupon. Manufacturers require retailers to prove that each coupon turned in for credit was exchanged for a different container of product; if they didn't, there wouldn't be much stopping them from going out in front of the store with $2 in change every Sunday, emptying the newspaper box, pulling out all the coupon inserts, using another $2 in change to put the papers back in, and redeeming all the coupons for cash. (People have done it.)
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Liberal_in_LA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
20. They are definitely hoarders. They express too much happiness and satisfaction when
showing off their specially made cabinets full of crap.
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Autumn Colors Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
23. Couponers often swap the items they get cheap/free with others
I'm not an extreme couponer, but I've spent some time on hotcouponworld.com and what people do there is swap coupons with others, trade news about what's on sale where, and they will then swap those items they can get either for next-to-nothing or free with others for things that they DO need.

Barter, barter, barter.....
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
27. Most of them also look extremely unhealthy and
are often obese, probably because the "deals" they are getting are for garbage food. You won't find many coupons on fresh fruits and vegetables and whole grains.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
39. You are describing regular Americans, not merely the sub-set of "extreme couponers." J/S.
Edited on Sat Nov-26-11 08:28 PM by WinkyDink
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #39
54. You have a point, but the extreme couponers I've seen on that show
look particularly unhealthy and most are alarmingly morbidly obese. Some of them can barely walk. It's all that free junk food they're getting. A lot of those boxes of "food" they're hoarding really shouldn't even be considered fit for human consumption. They should ask themselves why they can't get food that's not loaded with HFCS, sodium and preservatives with their coupons.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:22 AM
Response to Reply #54
58. People who will eat any old shit as long as it's free/cheap wind up looking like that.
They did an episode with a vegan couponer, and she's a damned good looking woman.
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #58
96. I'm a vegan, and there are no coupons for most things I eat. I would
be interested to see how she does it.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #96
97. I'm vegan myself. There certainly are, they're just a bit harder to find.
If you're on Facebook try friending http://www.facebook.com/vegancoupons she posts links to printable coupons, a weekly list of suitable items in the newspaper circulars, etc. If your local health food shop is part of Co-op Advantage, there's a bi-monthly coupon book they put out that's also quite helpful. Oh, and Mambo Spouts has health food coupons, some of them are vegan. http://www.mambosprouts.com/free-coupons/
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #97
98. Thank you for the links! I think I've finally found a good reason to sign up for Facebook! ;-) nt
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #54
72. most that I've seen looked pretty normal
Granted, I haven't seen much of the show, but most of the people I have seen on the show looked normal. One was overweight and pregnant. Another was in college and apparently a scholarship athlete. Most were in between.
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Raine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 06:40 PM
Response to Original message
28. I've seen the show and I agree, I think they're hoarders.
Either that or they sell the stuff at swap meets.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #28
40. Hoarders have their floors crowded; EC'ers are also Extreme Organizers.
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lost-in-nj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
34. It's TV and they will show what they think will sell commercials
you have no idea if these people kept everything or donated some or all of it.....

as far as "reality programming" goes..... it's all about the
Benjamin's..... not about "reality".

how can anyone believe, even one iota what these shows try to sell????

it's all cut and paste, drama and comedy....
and of course the subjects sign iron clad disclosures......

lost
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #34
42. The bottom line is always the Bottom Line!
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
35. Here's what I don't get.
You hoard a bunch of coupons - you're a hoarder and are insane.

You hoard tons of cats, rats, or other live animals - you're also a hoarder and are insane.

You hoard truck loads of dolls, clothing, whatever you can think of - you're also a hoarder and are insane.

You hoards trillions of dollars in cash - you're a "job creator" and are above the system because unlimited amounts of money now = free speech.

Can someone tell me what's wrong with that picture?
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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #35
41. You mean, apart from the fact no one with trillions in cash creates jobs?
If we are to believe America's job creators are small businesses, then our job creator class is, by and large, lower-middle-class people with good credit ratings who are so deep in debt one bad week will see them living in a van down by the river.

Billionaires, OTOH, are more likely to merge two strong businesses who make the same kinds of things and throw half the workers off the payroll.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #41
47. Yup - I see it day in day out same old shit.
Some "job creator" shaves 30,000 jobs off the payroll (or keeps his employees and slashes millions in salary and benefits) and then they get hundreds of millions in bonuses. And they're the "job creators"???? Give me a fucking break! They are hoarders - nothing more than greedy fucking hoarders. And our media defends them. :grr:
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #47
85. Of course the media defends them.
Who do you think owns the media? They don't just hoard money, they hoard businesses, which is basically what huge multi-national corporations do. It's only fitting that they defend themselves.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
36. I can't watch it.
It drives me crazy.
I can't watch Horders, either.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:26 PM
Response to Original message
38. I use coupons; I've bought EC books. BUT the show with the woman who had not only stockpiles but a
Edited on Sat Nov-26-11 08:26 PM by WinkyDink
veritable LIBRARY of NOTEBOOKS OF HER COUPONS....!!

DEFINITELY Weirdo City.
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
43. The real downside to this is
that now the stores are catching on to couponing "tricks" and changing their policies so that now the average person is losing out on good deals because of these freaks.
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #43
103. Yep. One of our local grocery stores is now requiring cashiers to initial each coupon
I feel sorry for them, especially when they get these wannabes with a ton of coupons. It not only taxes the cashiers, it forces those standing in line to wait longer. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Another idiotic thing to come out of cable TV to screw it up for everyone, along with house "flipping", and formerly cheap food items that are now expensive because some TV chef made them trendy.
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Imajika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
45. Addiction, hobby, competition...
People are strange. For some it probably began innocently enough and became an addiction (perhaps some elements of OCD). For others it is a just a hobby gone too far. Many of these people have probably created a circle of friends that do the same thing and in that case it becomes a competition.

And the ones that get on TV. Yeah, people will do almost anything to get on TV. For coupon clippers, getting on that program is probably like winning the superbowl amongst that crowd of people.

Hoarding is nothing new of course. Dunno why people do it exactly. I had a grandmother who hoarded newspapers and magazines. Her entire house was piled with them and she refused to throw them out. As I recall it actually became dangerous and I think it was a fire hazard. With her it really accelerated when her husband died. I think in her case it was not so much about saving things as it was a psychological problem that caused her to believe she was somehow slowing down or capturing time in print.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
46. I don't see the big deal about it
Edited on Sat Nov-26-11 08:59 PM by fishwax
I don't do that kind of couponing myself, because I don't buy a lot of the products that coupons seem most likely to be available for. I use a few coupons a month, I suppose.

Still, I don't understand the hubbub about the folks who do that kind of thing. If I could get five years worth of deodorant or dish soap or whatever for three bucks, I would do it. (As it happens, I don't really have the storage space for that kind of thing, though.) And I know some people who either donate some of their haul or use it to barter for things that they can use. Doesn't seem like a bad thing at all.

Some, perhaps, are simply hoarders. Some are admittedly OCD. Some are just saving money on products they would likely buy anyway. Yes, it's likely that most get a rush from the thrill of saving money, but there's nothing wrong with that. It's true that some of the people on the show (from what I've seen) buy food products that are generally unhealthy, but that doesn't make them any different than the vast majority of Americans. I don't see much basis for the assumption that they're all/mostly obsessive, unhealthy, and leading unhappy lives.
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cyglet Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
49. The expression
"penny wise and pound foolish" was made for these people.
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fadedrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
50. They probably never heard of DU or
don't know how to go about getting a library card. It's obvious they can read. Biggest bargains at the library where you can get new books to read for free, or at DU where information is available to help in so many ways...

I used to clip a lot of coupons, still clip some, but would rather do something else with the time..

I think they're just plain bored.
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Contrary1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:10 AM
Response to Original message
56. I got lucky a few years back...
I bought a bottle of contact lens cleaner for my daughter that had a coupon in the box for a free bottle of the same. So, I went right back in and got a free bottle with another coupon inside.
We were able to repeat that cycle for several months, until above mentioned daughter lost the "free bottle" coupon. Damn kids. :evilgrin:

That's about the only time I was able to really come out ahead. Otherwise, it's a few cents here and there, and I'm ok with that.
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Tx4obama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:48 AM
Response to Reply #56
60. I did that one year with 'real' butter.
I forget the brand but inside the package there was a $1.00 off coupon.
I had bought five packages for 99 cents each on sale - (normal price was over $2)
Then I took the five coupons from those packages and got five more packages for free, brought those home and took out the coupons and went back for another five free packages.
After that I had 15 pounds of butter in the freezer for a total of $5 -- and that was enough :)


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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #60
84. It ALWAYS pays to look inside the boxes for coupons.
Emerald Nuts has coupons for $1.50 any two EN items inside their "Breakfast to Go" boxes. I was sitting on one until I went to Target a week or so ago. They had one variety on close-out for a buck and a quarter. I got two boxes, which cost me all of fifty cents. Now I have two more coupons to use between now and next spring, when they expire. Hoping the glazed walnuts and glazed pecans go on sale soon...

The "organic" and "healthy" brands of cereals often have coupons on the inside of the box, too.
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Bombero1956 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:35 AM
Response to Original message
59. I clip coupons too
I don't clip coupons for stuff we don't use and I try and get the stuff that's on sale plus the coupon. Last week I got $200 worth of groceries for $138 plus I got free milk. The store I go to also gives you extra store points towards gasoline purchases which my wife uses for her 90 mile commute to work. This week when we brought our turkey we paid 58 cents a pound plus we got 200 extra gas points. The one time I watched this show this guy bought 1,400 boxes of Total cereal that he donated to the local food pantry so some people are helping the poor with their coupons.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #59
87. you must go to Tops because I got that same deal. I am up to 40cents of a gallon of gas
myself.
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Bombero1956 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-28-11 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #87
99. I go to Stop & Shop
here in Massachusetts. Tops was owned by the same corporation but they were sold in 2007.
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #99
100. oic. cool
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #87
104. Lately I've rarely made it up to 40 cents per gallon at my Stop and Shop.
Just hubby and me at home and we don't spend a huge amount on groceries. So at best I get up to 30 cents but 20 cents in more like it...

We also have limited storage space so I can't stock up that much...
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #104
105. i get 10 pts for every coupon... ten coupons is 10 cents. I don't just use coupons to get gas.
I am not going to take my time unless there is a good reason. The most I have gotten was .80/gal I think. But even .20/gal is .20/gal.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #105
106. That isn't the system at my supermarket. Ours is by $$$ spent so it's not a great deal.
Sometimes they offer 200 extra points if you buy 3 of something that they put on a list in the circular. A lot of items on the list are name brands that I'd be paying full price on. I did get frozen shrimp both on sale and with extra points toward gas last week and that was a good enough deal...I buy frozen shrimp anyway when it's on sale...
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-30-11 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #106
107. i don't do it unless it's worth it for me. They have the points for buying a certain number of item
but if I have coupons to help me out and it is worth it then I will do it. If you do the math on those deals and you are paying the price without coupons it usually isn't worth it. But savings plus points towards gas... Thing is, in town gas here is $3.65 to 3.70. Now I went over to another town the same distance and gas there was $3.35. So it's .30 cheaper a gallon. So unless that amount off a gallon was high enough it would not be worth it for me. Granted, I wouldn't make a special trip to that gas station. But I go over that way for doctor appointments and my sister lives over there.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:52 AM
Response to Original message
61. I suspect a lot of people get free crap for the show they wouldn't otherwise.
I mean, if you need to get a thousand dollars worth of stuff for $50 or something to make it good television, you grab every coupon you've got that will get you a free or really cheap item, whether or not you actually want said item. Likewise the huge stockpiles of stuff, most of which I suspect were intentionally inflated for the audition for the show. I'd be willing to bet half of that stuff goes back out to the car and off to the food bank as soon as the camera crew leaves.

FWIW, I save tons of money on good stuff I'd buy anyway with coupons. And I donate a bunch of stuff (ONLY good stuff I'd use myself) to the food bank and to the pet food pantry when I can get more than I can personally use. I don't let stuff pile up the way the people on the show do (not least of all because I haven't got the room to do so even if I were so inclined) so any excess that won't fit where it belongs gets donated straight away.
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Le Taz Hot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 09:59 AM
Response to Original message
65. The thing I noticed is the enormous amounts of
junk food -- flavored waters, candy bars, sodas, pre-prepared foods, that kind of stuff. Having said that, coupons can be a big money saver IF a) it's an item you would normally use or would like to try and b) if you can use the coupon on a sale item. I did the sale/couponing thing for the Thanksgiving meal(s) and saved 36% and 39% respectively. I'm happy with that.
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glowing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
69. I'm not sure how much of hoarding it is or a combo of that with OCD...
One must be extremely organized to extreme coupon. And all their stock piles are neatly arranged and packed away. When they do the show, the women have time to prepare and to prepare the stores for their adventure with the camera crews. One woman normally spends $200.00, but she was trying to make the purchases almost free.. so she had driven 30mins out of her way for a price matching flyer.... Its not exactly cost effective gas wise to get the flyer to save a few pennies.. but she was doing it for the show.

Honestly, the only way I would do something that extreme is if I was working for a food pantry or something like that and all that "extreme" couponing made a difference for other people's lives. However, I shop at Publix... barely ever has anything for sale in any manner like the stores featured.. and my family is brand specific when it comes to some foods.. and the items my family really likes, as in fresh veggies, deli meat, meat in general, milk, bread, and eggs are barely ever found in coupon form. It's nice that I have a coupon for Duke's mayo and I'm in need of more.. that's a nice mini savings. Its nice when I get toilet paper if I have a coupon for it.. But I have too many other interests and work and other things on plate to do the work needed to do what those people do on that show. Its too time consuming.

The coupons I do love are for fabric and craft stores... That's my weakness. I love making things for people by hand. Every year I end up making amazing items that everyone tells me I should be selling for money.... and because it looks designer and sheik, they always think they should be getting me better presents.. I tell them not to worry about trying to replicate hand-made and from the heart. This year, I'm trying to branch out a bit and do a mix basket of jams, fudges, and candies.. in baskets and hand crafted boxes.. I'll cheat on the bases of the baskets and boxes... but design around them to make re-usable items for their home all year round. I found a recipe for blubbery/ orange jam that sounds really great to try (I'm trying to keep some FL themes in the basket). I had almost forgot about my mother-in-laws afghan and pillow throws that I've been meaning to get to... If I were to buy the same items I just made, I would spend at least $150.00, however, I'm about $30.00 as a whole for all the materials... and the pillow fabric is really quite nice... You can't buy 2 18inch pillows for less than $20.00 for regular pillows, forget a fancy pillow.

We all have our things that we like to do... these women have a shopping/ hoarding/ couponing complex... but its what they want to do.... so let them. Just don't watch it I guess.
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madinmaryland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
74. Oops. I thought you typed "Extreme Coupling"?? I was wondering what channel that might
be on? NatGeo??

:D

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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #74
89. No, but if you find one with that name, let me know!
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taught_me_patience Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
76. It seems to me that most of the stuff they buy is crap
packaged, frozen, and processed food. It's hard to stock up on fresh broccoli...
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #76
83. Hard, but not impossible.
Some grocery chains will occasionally have coupons for fresh produce. Often you'd have to load it onto your loyalty card, but the savings are usually worth the effort. Sometimes, one can also find paper coupons for name brand pre-bagged produce like salads. Fresh Express, Dole, and Earthbound Farms Organics are the big vendors for that. You can often print coupons from their web sites, too. It may involve signing up for an e-mail newsletter, but that often leads to other coupon opportunities. Just open a Yahoo or Gmail account strictly for things like that, and you won't have to worry about all that "stuff" clogging your regular mail.

BTW, if you visit couponing sites like Coupon Mom and Southern Savers, they'll do the work for you. If some produce or organic item is on sale, and there is a coupon for it somewhere, they usually provide a link to that coupon.
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onestepforward Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
92. My local Kroger stopped their double and triple coupon program
right before this show started. Now, coupons are worth face value only.
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nadine_mn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-27-11 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
93. Some people are confusing general coupon use vs the extreme
There is nothing wrong with using coupons! I used them and we save money. The key is to using them only for crap you will actually use (otherwise you are just buying to use the coupon).

I have watched the show with same feeling some have expressed: Who needs 350 toothbrushes? One guy set up a special order with a grocery store for over 1000 boxes of cereal (he did donate those), I have seen the clips where they show they have over 200 bottles of salad dressing. How can you eat that much before they go bad?


I think I can sum up the feelings:
1) If you need the rush and thrill - fine coupon away for your 300 rolls of paper towels, but donate them esp the food stuffs. You will never consume in a reasonable amount of time 500 boxes of hamburger helper

2) Coupon use for the average person to save money is fine

3) watching this show causes brain cell loss - at least in me
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Greybnk48 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-29-11 10:08 AM
Response to Original message
101. At first glance I thought this was "extreme coupling" LOL n/t
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