No They Can't©...The Audacity© of Graduate Students Facing Higher Debt Under Obama's Budget Plan

[Amerigo Vespucci]

Amanda Terkel HuffPost Reporting

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/13/graduate-students-higher-debt-obama-budget_n_822603.html

WASHINGTON -- In his 2011 State of the Union address, President Obama promised that investment in education and getting the next generation of Americans ready to face their own "Sputnik" moment would be a focus of his administration. But at least one component of his FY 2012 budget, which will be released tomorrow, will likely pile more debt upon students who decide to pursue graduate school, potentially making the dream of higher education even more unattainable for many Americans. The move, say administration officials, is needed to ensure that a popular financial aid award stays available at current levels.

In an interview on CNN's "State of the Union" on Sunday, Office of Management and Budget Director Jacob Lew said that interest on graduate school loans will begin building up while students are still in school. Currently, interest does not begin compiling until after students graduate.

Host Candy Crowley questioned Lew about whether this would make graduate school less accessible for many Americans:

LEW: Well, let's just be clear. Interest will build up, but students won't have to pay until they graduate. So it will increase the burden for paying back the loans, but it will not reduce access to education. That's, I think, part of how you can responsibly have a plan that deals with the challenge of solving our fiscal crisis, getting out of the situation where the deficit is growing and growing, but also investing in the future.

[bluestateguy]

1. I'm not sure we need more Ph.D.'s and JD's

The universities are churning out more JD's and Ph.D's then there are jobs to put them into. In particular, you have a lot of third rate law schools at exorbitant cost pumping out law school graduates at a level that is beyond what the job market can accommodate. And they accumulate massive debt in the process. If they are lucky they end up doing contract law (a temp job), being paid by the hour, making $35,000 a year.

As for Ph.D's, you have massive numbers of underemployed Ph.D.'s, adjunct teaching being paid per course per semester. These jobs usually have few benefits and no job security. Less than half of people who start a Ph.D. program even finish at all; of those who do, less than half land a tenure track job at a college or university.

So I am not so sure we should be encouraging people to get degrees beyond a 4 year bachelor's unless they can a) afford it, or b) unless they get into an elite school that will make them employable.

Med school and MBA's are a another matter of course, but this is just what I have seen with Ph.D's and JD's.

[MadHound]

2. Never mind those professions that require their practioners get MA's and Ph.D's

Never mind those professions that raise your pay because you get a doctorates.

I find it vastly amusing that you're saying we shouldn't have people getting Ph.D's in any subject, but getting an MBA is okey dokey with you:rofl: Never mind that we have vast herds of MBA's roaming this country doing irreparable harm to it in the name of personal profit.

[bluestateguy]

5. You are putting words in my mouth

I simply deferred the MBA issue to somebody else. I really don't know much about MBA's or MD's, so somebody else on this thread can address that. And I did not say people should not get Ph.D's, but I did advocate for a little bit of common sense and discretion.

Getting a Ph.D. in the Humanities from Southwest Third Rate University State is probably not a good investment if it will all be paid for in student loans. Nor is getting a law degree from Third Tier State if it will be paid for with $150,000 in loans that are likely to never be paid back.

[MadHound]

6. Unlike undergrad students, people going into doctorate programs try to get into the best possible

Or at least the best possible that they can afford. Proposing that they only get a doctorate on their own dime, or from one of the few elite schools is, well, elitist.

As far as putting words in your mouth, your statement was "Med school and MBA's are a another matter of course." Implying that you have no problem with the numbers of MBA's, who are more likely to go to a podunk school than a doctoral candidate, but Heaven forbid somebody get a doctorates in History or some such.

[mmonk]

3. Unfortunately that is the cycle of tax cut produced burdens.

Higher tuitions and higher debt. Are the jobs there to work it off?

[renegade000]

4. crap...

Just started my PhD program, and I still have a decent principal balance from my Masters, though I'm in a lot better shape than others in the grand scheme of things. Still, this is ridiculous, and once I know more I'll be writing some letters to my reps/ the white house.

[exboyfil]

7. I talked with my brother in law's mentor

about how my brother-in-law as doing. I told him that after getting his Doctorate in Biochemistry from Harvard and kicking around awhile, he landed at a high end Biomedical company doing advanced drug research. The prof seemed to imply that it was something not so cool about working for a private company doing research. It was somehow less important than being a professor at a university. I am still a little shocked at the attitude. By brother-in-law is working on drugs that will cure diseases - how is this less noble than being in the ivory tower. His company is currently working on Cystic Fibrosis and Hepatitis drugs (and probably a bunch of other things he can't talk about).

The problem I have with folks who stay in college their entire careers is that they really need exposure to what goes on in private enterprise. Most engineers I know get their M.S. while they are working full-time. Many later go back to school after working for a few years.

Obviously the pipeline for PhDs is too filled up. Post docs and PhD adjuncts are treated like slave labor. At one time I wanted to get my PhD in engineering (actually finished all the coursework while working full time), but I see no advantage in it today. I prefer to spend that time otherwise invested with my children.

You don't need to be in college to continue to learn and develop.