I don't know what to say anymore

[SHRED]

Is this really what we thought we voted for?
Really?



---

Home Sweet Wall Street

Posted on Feb 16, 2011
By Robert Scheer

A most dastardly deed occurred last Friday when the Obama administration issued a 29-page policy statement totally abandoning the federal government’s time-honored role in helping Americans achieve the goal of homeownership. Instead of punishing the banks that sabotaged the American ideal of a nation of stakeholders by “securitizing” our homesteads into poker chips to be gambled away in the Wall Street casino, Barack Obama now proposes to turn over the entire mortgage industry to those same banks.

The proposal, originated by Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner, involves nothing less than a total “winding down” of the 80-year-old federal housing program, setting instead a new goal of a two-tiered America in which the masses are content to be mere renters of the American Dream. Such a deal for a country where, as the report concedes, “Half of all renters spend more than a third of their income on housing, and a quarter spend more than half.”

This is the same Geithner who during his tenure in the Clinton Treasury Department championed the total deregulation of the then-emerging market in collateralized debt obligations that sliced and diced people’s home mortgages into the toxic securities that created what his new report calls the greatest economic crisis since the Great Depression. Later, as president of the New York Fed, he cheered on the banks as they went hog-wild, conning folks into buying homes they couldn’t afford and stuffing them into the incomprehensible securities that form the rot at the core of our bankrupt economy.

This is a made-in-the-U.S. nightmare that we inflicted on the world, thanks to an explosion in those toxic securities brought on by the deregulation that most of the Obama economic brain trust supported when they worked for President Bill Clinton and during the ensuing bubble years when they enriched themselves. As the report admits: “The U.S. is … the only high income country in which securitization plays a major role in housing finance.” Yet instead of ending that practice Obama now calls for more of the same: “The Administration believes the securitization market should continue to play a key role in housing finance.” Indeed, the plan’s goal of eliminating Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac will dry up the alternative public funding that has provided a source of mortgage support ever since President Franklin Delano Roosevelt launched Fannie Mae to check the power of the banks over mortgages. Now Obama proposes to eliminate that check and leave would-be homeowners to the tender mercy of the banking giants.

CONTINUED:
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/home_sweet_wall_street_20110216/

---

[Overseas]

1. Sad K&R. //nt

[SHRED]

3. What I find interesting is...

...why the conservatives haven't embraced this guy?
Why they continue to put forth the false notions that he is somehow a liberal or even remotely shaded toward the left hand side of the political spectrum?
:shrug:

ANSWER ON EDIT:
I think it is in order to further move the political goalpost to the right.

[somone]

6. Exactamente

Obama can never please them - and they will never love him - but he will try harder and harder

[bighart]

20. So do you really believe that is what is behind his policies,

he sits up at night thinking "How can I make the right love me?" I don't believe it has anything to do with the right, I think it is just how things are done at the federal level. The corporations and big money players have bought and paid for their interests to be protected and by golly that is exactly what our politicians do.

[LiberalLovinLug]

26. Good point

He walked into a closed and bought out corpocracy and when he was sworn in, or before, he was sat down and told the way things were. Either go along or be made into a baffoon and radical by more than FAUX News and the Rethugs, but by every MSM network and blue dog DINO....even more than he is now. The DLC wiped any thoughts of a "progressive" agenda or favoring people over profits. I think he was just drowned with these insiders like this and never even had a breather or a moment to hear from the liberal wing who were shut out at the door.

I think Obama was well meaning, but was not strong enough to withstand the one-sided hurricane from the big business / Wall Street lobby that hit him. He was not the brave visionary leader that he pretended to be, he's just a run-of-the-mill politician who jumped at a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that opened up for him and is good at taking instructions.

I think its more about what small tidbits he can throw his left wing base in order to keep enough of them on board to grant him a second term. That is what repealing DADT was for. Victories like that are great, and would never happen in a Repuke admin, but it is something that would've happened eventually anyways. It does nothing to advance the overall system of corporate greed and the further redistribution of wealth upwards. All it means is openly gay or lesbian service people will now be on the front lines defending that corrupt system. It is used as a stop gap until he gets through the next election cycle. After which I'm sure we will be told that the war in Afghanistan must continue, and troops in Iraq, and making Bush tax cuts permanent, and dismantling SS, and the public school system, but don't worry, the DLC will hum and haw and decide which small bone to throw "the fucking retards" in order to keep the Dems afloat.

[The Doctor.]

60. I hear tell the DLC is no more.

Doesn't mean there aren't any clones floating around.

[creon]

83. True

If you want progressive laws and progressive policies, progressives have to be elected to Congress.

Anyone who runs for president, and anyone who is elected president is an 'insider'.

And,he must deal with the political realities: he has to deal with the Congress that he has; he has to deal with the economists and political and military advisors that has has.

He has to work within the system. Whether he wants to or not.

And: 40 to 60% of the eligible voters do not vote and know little or nothing abiut politics, government or current affairs. That is the reality of it. Sad and true.

[bighart]

86. I have become convinced that the whole bunch in DC, regardless of the letter

behind their name, are nothing more and nothing less than politicians. I would love to see a real statesman or leader in power but I don't know if that would be allowed to happen.

[orleans]

62. he should be trying a little harder to win OUR love back

because i've definately lost that lovin feeling.

[Chris_Texas]

9. ah....

The dialog from the pundits from both sides (ours and theirs) is that one side is good and the other bad. These pundits, regardless of party, tell their followers that they are victims of both the evil other guys, but also the well-meaning but ineffectual bumblings of their own representatives. And the beat goes on.

The REALITY is different.

Let me ask you... do you really believe that a man working 30 hours a week at Walmart driving a decaying chevy he cannot afford to fix or replace, a man who wakes up every morning feeling guilty because he cannot begin to send his kids to school in the cool fashions let alone pay for college, a man who watched his job get outsourced and his home value trashed, is automatically a democrat or even particularly different (in philosophy and desires) from most of the people posting here? The answer is NO.

He listens to pundits and parrots the things that seem to make the most sense to him.

The people he voted for do not respect him or represent him. To them he is a useful idiot, and they as much as tell him this every day by doing the exact opposite of what they promised when running. These representatives get up in the morning and go for coffee with their political "enemies" on the other side. They shoot the shit over croisants and laugh and commiserate over the noise of the rabble back home. They are "enemies" in public because that's the role they play on TV.

The politicians of BOTH parties are paid by the same corporations. Their leaders are selected by those corporations, their campaigns financed by those same corporations, they are interviewed by media owned by those same corporations, their books (best sellers all-- though you have never seen one) are purchassed by those corporations, and when they leave office they are hired by the same corporations.

Obama is a brilliant guy doing a fantastic job. Like Bush before him, he was selected by these mega-corporations; he is doing exactly what he is told. They want the Patriot Act, they want more war, they want GITMO open, they want a mandate for you to buy health insurance from them, they want tax breaks for themselves, they want social programs scrapped and entitlements destroyed, they want woirkplace safety and minimum wage and workers rights and child labor laws abolished, they want to trash the planet and poison the oceans, they want more money, more power, everything.

And their representitives are fighting hard to give it to them while we, the peasants, argue back and forth over which actor pretends to like us best.

[rusty fender]

10. Wow!

That is the best analysis of the political kabuki dance I've read on DU!:yourock:

[Scottybeamer70]

17. Beatifully said.......

thank you!

[bighart]

21. You summed it all up so well!

[sabrina 1]

24. Excellent post ~

[tpsbmam]

31. Brilliant again, CT! That about says it all.

Welcome again!


:toast: :hi:

[OneGrassRoot]

33. Dang, may I share this?

:applause:

:hi:

[FiveGoodMen]

34. "argue back and forth over which actor pretends to like us best"

VERY well put!

[SammyWinstonJack]

35. ah....Yep!

:applause:

[Kurovski]

37. Welcome to DU. Chris_Texas.

[riderinthestorm]

39. A big K & R. Welcome Chris! nt

[SHRED]

40. BAM...OUTTA THE PARK!

Welcome to the DU and what a way to start.
Wow.

:hug:

[LibDemAlways]

43. Welcome to DU! Nailed it again.

[obxhead]

49. Please make this an OP.

I see your new (welcome to DU) and might not be able to start an original OP yet, but soon you will be able to. Please expand on this well written response and make it alone a topic of discussion. Many here need to see it.

[laundry_queen]

51. I'm still waiting for an individual post rec button

for posts like this. Thank you for that post.

[Oilwellian]

52. Well, that was refreshingly honest

Thanks. I needed that. Welcome to DU.

[Foo Fighter]

53. That's the American two-party system in a nutshell.

You nailed it. Great post.

[Robeson]

54. Beautiful.

[Raksha]

56. Wow...you really nailed it!!!

That's the most direct statement of The Way Things Are in Washington I've seen in a long time.

And welcome to DU!!! :toast:

[The Doctor.]

59. Post of the day.

The Week.

The Month.

We'll have to see about the year.

The Dog + Pony show goes on, and anyone who's bought into it is lost.

Thanks for passing out red pills, and 'welcome'... to DU.

[grahamhgreen]

64. Welcome to DU!

[Name removed]

65. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ReggieVeggie]

66. ++++++

well said

[Mimosa]

67. "...the peasants, argue back and forth over which actor pretends to like us best."

Chris from Texas, you have well expressed what many of us have been seeing. And other Dems sometimes think we are 'bad' to give voice to the truth.

What you wrote is amazing and true.

[Raster]

68. This is the post I want to recommend a thousand times over!

...we, the peasants, argue back and forth over which actor pretends to like us best."

We're all just puppets dancing on strings at the whims of the Lords of Money.

[Mojeoux]

70. These people are "Rapture-ists." They have NO incentive to

clean up the environment, or help the poor or heal the sick. They are done with this planet and they think God is too. They can't wait for the "End Times."
Every flood, volcano, earthquake, war, and crisis "revs" them up. They don't care if somebody nukes Mecca or Israel.

Welcome to DU Cris!

[Bonobo]

74. One of the best post ever. I think you should copy and paste as an OP (or a sticky!) nt

[tomp]

76. agreed. however, if obama's job is to look like he's on our side....

....he's failing. his purty words cannot keep up with his ugly actions.

[sendero]

77. Eggss.....

... freaking zactly. And it's AMAZING how many just refuse to see it, it is right in your face every day.

There is no real difference between Dems and Reps any more beyond rhetoric. And the rhetoric is nothing but talk and that is all it will ever be.

[DawgHouse]

79. I think I love you a little bit. n/t

[mdmc]

81. yyyeeeaahh booooooooooooooooy!

welcome to du

[Javaman]

85. "the peasants, argue back and forth over which actor pretends to like us best."

I've been saying that for a long time.

The public gets so sucked in by the off key kabuki theatrics, that any issue of actual importance never is brought up.

The big machine of distraction for profit keeps a rollin' along.

As long as the people are kept divided, the politicians will never ever have to answer a single question.

[uponit7771]

87. You're right, there's NO difference at ALL between dem or rep...I'll just vote rep next time cause..

...they're the same actor.

Facts have proven this not to be true <---- yes, that needs to be said here.

[Phlem]

42. That would mean

concessions to their plundering. You can squeeze more blood out of a rock if you keep the pressure up. They don't want to like the guy cause they can get more from him by hating him.

IMHO

-p

[obxhead]

48. They see an opportunity to take the goal post down

and move it into a new field while changing all of the rules at the same time.

It is a more dangerous time for us than ever. We have solid life long Democrats cheering for every GOP move that Obama makes. At the same time we have a newly formed "party" screaming for corporate benefits in our streets at the cost of anything helpful to the people. They (all of our leaders on the corporate teet) will not miss this opportunity to redefine the 90's right as the extreme left.

We will suffer greatly from the Obama admin. No matter how much good can come from it (and some is) the moving of things to the extreme right by his bipartisanship will advance the destruction of the people at a very rapid rate. I weep for the real stakeholders of our country.... us.

[liberation]

50. Kabuki theater...

or "good cop/bad cop" for us gringoes. Even though the "bad cop" seems to not like the "good cop" very much because he is your "friend" one should not forget that they both work for the same police department ;-)

[pam4water]

75. Clinton gave conservatives 60% of what they wanted and they didn't embrace him either.

[somone]

2. Corporations Uber Alles

is what this administration is all about

[LiberalEsto]

4. +10000

[disillusioned73]

5. Sickening..

:mad:

[Statistical]

7. The govt shouldn't be pushing to increase home ownership.

Sorry.

People longingly look back the the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s however home ownership remained relatively stable durring those decades. It only began to increase in late 1980s when fueled by govt mandate to artificially increase home ownership rates.

Now the banks were fraudulent as were the mortgage brokers, the underwriters, the builders, the apraisers, basically everyone who touched the mortgage system but the fuel was the govt mandate and Fannie and Freddie unlimited balance sheets. Without that there would have been no mortgage boom.


What people need is jobs paying a living wage, ability and willingness to save (kill consumerism in this country). Those are things the govt can encourage. Encouraging home ownership directly is a foolish gamble.


"Half of all renters spend more than a third of their income on housing"
Home ownership doesn't change that. Certainly not when you consider true cost (mortgage, insurance, repairs, maintenance, upgrades, real estate taxes, and insurance).

[JuniperLea]

18. Yep...

That's part of what got us into this mess in the first place. I still remember Bush's speech in October 2002... the beginning of the end. I bet it's still in the YouTubes.

[Waiting For Everyman]

19. Not to burst your bubble but the govt didn't START pushing it in the 1980s

That push to increase ownership was at fever pitch from the 1950s onward. Don't even try to tell me some bullshit because I was alive and aware during those times. I frigging remember it - without the help of some pundit or so-called history book.

And back then there were usury limits of 7% which worked great too. Until Nixon repealed it.

[hfojvt]

28. yeah, that's ridiculous

my neighbor pays $500 a month to rent the little shack next to me with the tiny yard.

"Homeownership does not change that?" When I had mortgage payments, they were only $225 a month, plus another $74 a month for insurance. I got a much bigger place, a much nicer place for 60% of the cost he pays to rent. Not only that, I have, presumably $45,000 in home equity. What is he gonna have after 9 years of renting? Besides a lot less money?

Now, my home has been paid off since 2005, I think it was, and I only pay $150 a month in insurance and taxes. Less than that, actually, since I have not had insurance for over a year now. (Crossing my fingers)

[Go2Peace]

55. Most of the "bubble" is due to capital gains reductions allowing rampant speculation.

There is so much misinformation around the home industry blowup.

[treestar]

89. You are deliberately interpreting yet another thing

the same way.

Nothing proves your interpretation - which is determined to be negative beforehand.

[mmonk]

8. There isn't anymore to say.

It speaks for itself like so many other things. There are those that still see all this as progressives doing the best the can. Those of us not influenced by words see it as carrying the water for ideas we oppose.

[nashville_brook]

11. k and r

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TBF]

13. Why do you hate Obama - Bush caused all that. *sarcasm tag* nt

[Godhumor]

14. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were managed right into receivership

This has nothing to do with corporations per se (Freddie and Fannie are, for all purposes corporations but with government backing, among other things) and everything to do with the fact that Freddie and Fannie cratered and burned before the government stepped in and took them over. The cost to the government/tax payers was staggering, and I really have no problem at all with the government saying they will no longer support them.

That said, the government would not stop FHA or VA loans and there have been 2 other proposals for "replacing" Freddie and Fannie.

They really needed to go.

[ProSense]

15. Much needed reform. These

organizations are nothing like the entities they were originally.

Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac could be wound down

<...>

Fannie Mae was founded in 1938 at a time when millions of families could not become homeowners, or faced losing their homes, because of a lack of mortgage funds. It was a government agency until 1968.

Freddie Mac was created in 1970 to provide competition to Fannie Mae.

The firms do not lend directly to homebuyers, but buy mortgages from approved lenders and then sell them on to investors.

<...>

<...>

It is true that pay at Fannie and Freddie used to be even more criminogenic. According to the Los Angeles Times:

In 2007, then-Freddie Mac CEO Richard F. Syron had a base salary of $1.2 million and total compensation of $18.3 million, according to SEC filings. In the same year, Daniel Mudd, the chief executive of Fannie Mae, had a base salary of $987,000 and total compensation of $11.7 million.

Those were the days, when you could in a single year be made wealthy for destroying a company and causing scores of billions of dollars of losses to the taxpayers. The title of Akerlof & Romer's famous 1993 article has never looked more prescient -- "Looting: the Economic Underworld of Bankruptcy for Profit."

<...>

The proverbial bottom line is that a global search for talent, after Fannie and Freddie's second descent into accounting control fraud bankrupted both firms, Fannie and Freddie (with its regulators' blessing, chose Witherell. (Heidrick & Struggles, which describes itself as the leading executive search firm, issued a press release praising itself for finding Witherell.) When Obama knew he had to clean up the Stygian Stables that were Fannie and Freddie -- knew that their senior managers and their regulators had failed catastrophically -- he left in charge the failed regulatory leadership team. The regulator team allowed Freddie to select as its COO one of the leaders in the creation of the liar's loans that were the greatest single contributor to Freddie's failure and the financial crisis. This was bizarre politics -- the senior regulator Obama left in power until his voluntary resignation was a Republican chosen because he was George Bush's close friend since their days together in prep school. It was even more insane regulatory policy.

<...>

Fannie and Freddie have no need to pay these high salaries to senior managers. It was the perverse executive compensation that drove the accounting control frauds at Fannie and Freddie -- as the SEC explicitly charged. Executive compensation created the perverse managerial incentives that destroyed Fannie and Freddie. This was an unanticipated consequence of their privatization. Because Fannie and Freddie were privatized, their officers designed their compensation system in the same perverse manner as most firms (Bebchuk & Fried 2004). The mangers stood to gain enormous compensation if they inflated short-term accounting income, and as Akerlof & Romer famously observed, accounting fraud is a "sure thing." Mr. Raines explained in response to a media question what was causing the repeated scandals at elite financial institutions:

link

Privatization turned them into large out-of-control entities that did nothing but funnel money to financial institutions. Add to that the fact that the CEOs of those agencies were earning tens of millions each year.

Obama Administration Plan Provides Path Forward for Reforming America’s Housing Finance Market, Winding down Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

[JoseGaspar]

16. Fannie was only second in importance to Social Security amongst...

... the New Deal impacts. The discussion around it is irrelevant. Dismantling it is a major change in the status of the American middle-class. That it is being proposed in this quasi-silent way - a debate between "professionals" - is the height of political cynicism and cowardice.

That it is being done by a Democratic president is less shocking. LBJ started on this particular path... and for no other reason than to hide the cost of the Vietnam War. Why shouldn't Obama blow up the ruins in order to reduce the political impacts of his budget?

The overall cynicism level has passed way above flood stage. Why Fannie? Because it impacts future generations and does not instantly produce town halls full of panicked pensioners.

"I fear that the crimes of this guilty land...", etc.

[no limit]

22. Nothing really suprises me at this point.

[lunatica]

23. I believe President Obama is the smartest man in the room

So I also believe he knows exactly what he's doing and if that is hurting us, the middle class and the poor, I believe he knows that. Thus, I can only believe it's OK with him. Maybe even deliberate.

[Godhumor]

25. Fannie and Freddie have failed in their missions

It is not about hurting the middle class, but it is about the sheer incompetance of two institutions that lead to receivership for both.

[jtuck004]

30. As opposed to the private firms this has been handed to, who have

destroyed millions of lives. The GSEs served this nation well for 50 years, insuring loans that others wouldn't touch and bringing housing to millions of people who would otherwise have had no shot.

For example, the recent FCIC report found that

"Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac’s portfolio of subprime loans “performed significantly better” than those packaged into mortgage-backed securities by private issuers, the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission found in a report."

Here...

That is an incontrovertible fact, in black and white, on paper.

The only thing that has permanently changed is the destruction of our economic security by the greed and recklessness of the private sector. F&F's real problems came about trying to open themselves up to that. Those managers are gone now, and the GSE's are still the safest and best alternative, and in some cases the ONLY place, that people will be able to go for financing.

Because business is private, and if they don't like your skin color, they tell you to go away. Note that the direction to increase home loans in black neighborhoods with the help of the GSE's came years after redlining was made illegal, but not non-existent.

And now they want to give it to the designers of the big Ponzi scheme we are ALL paying for now. Bad policy.

[xchrom]

27. recommend

[cate94]

29. K & R

[defendandprotect]

32. Geithner should be in jail -- but Obama seems perfectly happy with him -- !!!

[Starry Messenger]

36. k&r

[OhioChick]

38. Rec n/t

[russspeakeasy]

41. It is not what I voted for. And I do not forgive, or forget.

[femrap]

44. I don't care....

go ahead and delete this:

I really, really, really am starting to detest this administration. REALLY.:mad: :puke: :wtf: :argh: :hurts: (never used that one before):grr: :nuke: :thumbsdown: :cry: :rant:

I guess that's all the emotions I can find for today.

[kath]

61. I am detesting this administration as well.

It gets more and more disgusting by the week.

[chervilant]

71. By the day...

By the hour...

By the minute...

[MissDeeds]

90. Sadly, I'm at that point too

I can hardly stand to listen to the news anymore - another day, another disappointment.

[bertman]

45. Privatize, privatize, privatize. That's what this is all about. RECCED. nt

[MissDeeds]

46. "Is this really what we thought we voted for?"

And is this really what we want to vote for again? Come on people, the Democratic Party can/must do better than this.

[MissDeeds]

47. Dupe

Self delete

[Q3JR4]

57. Not at all, but here's the thing;

this administration knows it can do whatever it wants because most democrats will vote for him in the next election.

Period.

And that, if you ask me, is a sad state of affairs.

Q3JR4.

[TxVietVet]

58. Un-fucking-believable, eh?

How fucking sick is this country getting? They will crater the housing industry for sure now. So much for the home ownership dream. .

[grahamhgreen]

63. Obama! What a sad legacy.

[Name removed]

69. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Volaris]

72. Of all the people this President chose to put in the Brain Trust

its Geithner I loathe the most. Why? Demonstrably (based on what he has accomplished for those whom he REALLY works) he is for damn-sure the smartest of the Rattlesnakes.

If institutions like Fannie go under, what is the possibility that people will begin paying CASH for the homes they NEED, rather than Compound Interest for the McMansions they don't...

[chervilant]

73. hmm...

Less the 400 people worldwide own and control better than 45% of this planet's resources, including HUMAN resources. These uber wealthy corporatists have their own PRIVATE systems of education, transportation, and leisure activities, the likes of which we will NEVER experience. They LOVE Milton Friedman, whose hedonistic and sociopathic 'disaster' capitalism is handily exposed in Naomi Klein's Shock Doctrine. The uber wealthy consider themselves the 'Captains of Industry' and evince a patronizing, often condescending attitude toward the hoi polloi (that would be us common folk).

Every president since the vaunted St. Ronnie has kowtowed to the Corporate Megalomaniacs, including Bill Clinton (need I mention NAFTA? ...although Clinton did manage to draw a rather modest line in the sand for the hoi polloi). Virtually all of our politicians du jour are bought and paid for by these vile corporatists.

Until and unless we collectively identify the corporatists' game and stop them, they win.

[Paper Roses]

78. Great post, fantastic comments. 'Bout sums it up.

[Ganja Ninja]

80. I voted for Obama because I thought he would be good for the party.

I saw the enthusiasm of the young people and really thought he would bring more people into the party. I never suspected he would drive me out of the party the way he has. I am to the point where I may just give up and not bother next election day. I have no interest in supporting his re-election.

Frankly I wonder if the Democratic party will ever run someone that I feel would be worth the time and trouble to vote for. I am beyond disgust and tired of fighting. I am ready to let the insane run this asylum into the ground. The brush with disaster know as the Bush administration apparently wasn't enough. This country has to experience a total catastrophic collapse and worse before it can reform itself. Voting will not change things anymore.

[BlueJac]

82. Again, Obama=Disappointment

[Dessalines]

93. Whiney Fake Libs = More Disappointing.

[Badfish]

84. More knee jerking.

[uponit7771]

88. The more the banks take over housing the more they're answerable to the government. I don't see the

...sky falling as fast as some here do.

Right now they can truly screw us over and little to nothing can be done about it. I'd rather be pissing in their tent than be pissing on their elephant right now

[EndElectoral]

91. I knew FDR, and Mr. Obama you are no FDR.

[Dessalines]

92. My GOD I Hate Whiny Ass Liberals More then Teabaggers.

[xphile]

95. Funny. I hate DLC right wing ass kissing suck ups more than Teabaggers.

At least Teabaggers are honest about what they are. DLC booklickers pretend to be on your side then work against you.

[midnight]

94. I find myself asking similar questions....

[leeroysphitz]

96. Maybe you shouldn't SAY anything. Maybe the time for talking is over. n/t

[AzDar]

97. Un. Freaking. Believable. Would make it easy for the Rich to swoop

in and buy properties at fire-sale prices...they would be pretty much the only people who could secure financing, no? :nuke: