Rhode Island teachers are facing a huge fight..loss of union rights, tenure, job security.

[madfloridian]

Not surprisingly this is happening under a superintendent from the Eli Broad Superintendents Academy. Amazing how often teachers' rights disappear more quickly under the leadership of these superintendents.

From the Providence Journal:

New regulations in R.I. will change face of teacher contract talks


Education Commissioner Deborah Gist wants contracts to change.
The Providence Journal / Connie Grosch

Education Commissioner Deborah A. Gist is on a collision course with Rhode Island’s teacher unions over new orders about what must be included –– and what is no longer allowed –– in teacher contracts.

The clash could soon affect as many as 15 Rhode Island school districts, including Providence, Warwick, East Providence and Central Falls, as they attempt to hash out new contracts under markedly different rules.

A series of new state regulations pose a direct challenge to cherished union rights, in particular seniority and long-term job security. They require that all administrators and teachers be rigorously evaluated every year. Those found to be ineffective are given help and, if necessary, removed.

.."According to Gist, “When we say we are going to make every decision in the best interest of students in Rhode Island, that’s not just a motto.”

Here is Deborah Gist's page from the Broad website.

Deborah Gist

Her bio is impressive, her respect and caring for public school teachers is not impressive at all.

And there's that talking point again...about being for the students. I resent that because it sounds like teachers don't care about students. It's a meme from the "reformers".

Besides, it's not about the kids to them at all....it's about profit and privatizing.

Another well-known Broad superintendent grad is John Deasy in Los Angeles. He has moved up the ladder quickly in spite of questions about his masters and his time in Maryland.

From Mike Klonsky's blog:

Gates' man in L. A.

Actually he is already Superintendent, I believe.

His title is Dept. Supt., but there's little doubt that Broad Fellow and Gates Foundation implant, John Deasy is running the show in L.A. Supt. Ramon Cortines can hardly be found in the latest controversy around the L.A. Times public ranking of individual teachers based solely on student test scores. Deasy is all over it.

During a presentation to the board, recently appointed Deputy Supt. John Deasy said the district would move quickly and planned by October to begin issuing confidential scores to employees that would be based on a "value-added" analysis of student scores on standardized tests. He also said the district would include value-added scores for schools on campus report cards that are issued to the public. (L.A. Times).

Here's my post about Deasy, after he he bailed out of Prince Georges County, Md. two years ago for a soft landing at Gates. I guess they felt he was ready to go back on the field. Most interestingly, they have the power to decide when and where.

Here is a page full of links about Deasy and things that should have factored into his choice as school superintendent.

Links about John Deasy

Need more of a refresher? Here:

Explosive New Robert Felner Scandal Brewing
Update On the Deasy Shenanigans at UofL
Breaking Deasy Update: Ramsey Appoints Review Committee
The Robert Felner Story Hits the WaPo
Felner-Deasy Update — Petrosko Off & More
Felner Speaks, Ramsey Has Foot-in-Mouth Disease
Update: John Deasy’s Resume Is Jacked Up
New Robert Felner Tidbits Re: UofL
Breaking: Deasy Steps Down From Sup. Job
More on the Faux PhD Snafu at UofL
The Robert Felner Scandal and Internal Damage Control at the University of Louisville
Update on Alleged Degree Fraud at UofL
Thoughts on UofL’s Unfortunate Degree Scandal

The links lead to articles. None of these mattered. He is boss of L. A. teachers.

The Perimeter Primate blogger has written a lot about the Broad effect on public educations. This type of superintendent is often harming teachers. You can click the link of their names for the status now.

Broad featured superintendents

"Featured graduates"

Bobb, Robert (Class of 2005)
Brizard, Jean-Claude (Class of 2007)
Carter, Arnold "Woody" (Class of 2002)
Cerf, Chris (Class of 2004)
Deasy, John (Class of 2006)
Gist, Deborah (Class of 2008)
Goodloe-Johnson, Maria (Class of 2003)
Levenson, Nate (Class of 2004)
Malone, Matthew (Class of 2003)
Melendez de Santa Ana, Thelma (Class of 2006)
Olson, Kimberly (Class of 2005)
Peebles, Thandiwee (Class of 2002)
Porter, John Q. (Class of 2006)
Sheffield, LaVonne (Class of 2002)
Sims, Deborah A. (Class of 2005)
Ward, Randolph (Class of 2003)
Wise, Joseph (Class of 2003)

Several are having questionable results, are alienating teachers, and I believe a couple have been asked to leave...Goodloe-Johnson is one. Joseph Wise parted ways with his district and is now with Edison Learning. Bobb is doing harm in Detroit as emergency financial manager who is given academic power.

Rhode Island teachers have been treated so badly, a whole school was fired. Those who were hired back were still not given respect.

RI teachers who were fired had to assemble and listen to their names read out loud.


Dale Dearnley has taught science at the high school for the past four years. Earlier this year, she was fired from her job

Last February, the board of trustees for Central Falls, Rhode Island, voted to fire all of the teachers and staff of Central Falls High School after the school had been persistently labeled as low achieving.

..."In total, 93 members of the faculty at Central Falls High School were laid off. They gathered in the school auditorium and listened to the Executive Board call there names out, one by one. They wore red, the school color, as a sign of unity, but for the teachers it was a demoralizing moment.

..""The people that agreed that I needed to be fired have never been in my classroom, never spoken to me" Dearnley said. "As a matter of fact, my name was pronounced wrong....It was just so devastating to hear all these teachers that have been dedicated and I know and love and their names aren't even being pronounced right. It was devastating," Dearnley added.

Shamefully, President Obama and Arne Duncan praised this move to fire good teachers.

President Obama thought it was wonderful that every educator at Central Falls High School was fired. At an appearance before the U.S. Chamber of Commerce on March 1, the President applauded the idea of closing the school and getting rid of everyone in it. At the same meeting, President Obama acknowledged Margaret Spellings, who was President George W. Bush's Education Secretary, because she "helped to lead a lot of the improvement that's been taking place and we're building on."

Well, yes, the President is right; his own education reform plans are built right on top of the shaky foundation of President Bush's No Child Left Behind program.

I do not believe teachers would be subjected to these humiliations around the country if there were a political party standing up for public education.

[msongs]

1. so what are people in RI doing to stop this? nt

[madfloridian]

2. Not sure. What can you do when there are no national voices standing with you?

That's the problem.

[trud]

14. the people of RI love this.

See my post below.

[NoBlueDogs]

154. You can strike.

All teachers in RI should walk out.

Who's going to replace them? A bunch of unqualified scabs? Good luck with that.

R.I. citizens can get mad all day long about striking teachers but they can't do squat about it. What can they do, drag the teachers in and make them teach? LOL!

[madfloridian]

171. Florida teachers can't strike. Against the law.

I don't know about RI.

I can tell from this thread that the harm is done there, and most simply blame the teachers.

That is not what I expected from a Democratic president.

[Broderick]

38. Wisconsin has become a diversion

Everyone is paying attention to what is happening there, meanwhile behind the curtain in other states things go unnoticed - at a much faster pace and by more draconian ways... Sigh.

[hack89]

43. Don't assume we want to stop it.

We are tired of paying a lot of money for a broken education system.

[theaocp]

47. No assumption necessary.

I'm sure you're on the right track. Make sure to ignore the impoverished masses of students that will experience success under your indifference.

[hack89]

50. They are impoverished and ill educated right now

why do you think many people here support Gist? We are tired of spending a lot of money on a system that is failing our kids. By any measurable standard education in RI is sub-standard compared to the rest of the US.

[theaocp]

53. Poverty = poor education

But, hey, get rid of the unions and I'm sure it will all work out for the best. Good luck.

[hack89]

59. Can't be any worse. nt

[theaocp]

61. Sounds like you should be homeschooling. n/t

[hack89]

72. No - I support public education. nt

[Name removed]

121. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[coalition_unwilling]

185. You "support" public education but you are clearly anti-worker - n/t

[hack89]

194. I am a worker. nt

[olegramps]

149. The real problem is the one that you conveniently ignore.

POVERTY. That is core basis for the lack of success in poor districts. I will challenge you to find any school district that is populated by the upper middle class and wealthy that is failing. In fact they score in the top range. When this nation chooses to address the problem of poverty and all of its dimensions, including crime, gangs, and failing students you will see improvement. Parental involvement is mandatory and if that is not a possibility then mentors have to be provided to break the cycle. How many of those demanding that the teachers magically produce 100% winners from 5 classes of 40 students each who only attend class periodically have ever stepped inside a classroom let alone volunteer to assist them in this formidable task?

[Rex]

196. If you think money is the problem, you obviously never worked

in the public education sector. That is the LAST thing it is, you should talk to teachers and find out their reasons personally. RI is head and shoulders above a lot of states, including mine. You see private education as an answer to something you don't really understand. IMO, big mistake.

[rpannier]

122. Broken... I see

Your state ranks 14th in education rankings
You are 10th in spending

That hardly qualifies as broken

[hack89]

132. Look harder at the urban schools

like Providence and Central Falls. They have drop out rates approaching 50 percent. The state stats are skewed by the suburban schools - they have further to fall. The poor school districts have hit rock bottom.

[Name removed]

150. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[proud2BlibKansan]

123. So go after the teachers and ignore the administrators who screwed it up

Sounds like a plan.

Be sure and let us know how well it works for ya.

[hack89]

133. I agree that administrators need the powers to properly administer their schools

guess what - the teachers disagree.

[proud2BlibKansan]

134. Bullshit

I'm a teacher. The RI teachers belong to the same union I do. I KNOW where they stand. You are making assumptions. And you're wrong.

[hack89]

136. Of course you do

here I am living in a small community with teachers as my neighbors - of course you would know much more about what they think then I do.

I understand much better why kids nowadays can't express a thought without swearing - they have great role models.

[proud2BlibKansan]

139. OMG cuss words on the internet!

:rofl:

Don't come into threads bashing teachers and perhaps you won't have to read bad words that offend you. :eyes:

[hack89]

142. Cuss words instead of logic is what offends me. nt

[teacher gal]

190. Those whom you are apparently supporting

have been making darn sure it's broken! Public education has been under attack for 30 years, with more recent reforms like NCLB and RTtT literally designed to manufacture "failure" and undermine public support for our schools.

Yet for decades, our public schools have been performing far better than the public has been led to believe. When apples to apples comparisons are made with other countries, controlling for poverty, we're at the top. Read Gerald Bracey, Richard Rothstein, Susan Ohanian, Diane Ravitch...

I think it is more accurate to say that our NATION is broken and public schools have been the convenient dumping ground and scapegoat. Where help to help children has been desperately needed, schools have been punished and put down rather than strengthened and built up.

[madfloridian]

3. More about the Broad superintendents listed above. Not doing so well.

Deborah Sims

From the Perimeter Primate:

http://thebroadreport.blogspot.com/2010/07/deborah-sims-broad-superintendents.html

Deborah Sims completed her training at the Broad Superintendents Academy in November 2005 and was appointed superintendent of the Antioch Unified School District (AUSD) in California in August 2006. Amidst controversy, she announced her resignation in May 2009.

Before arriving in Antioch, Sims had been a deputy superintendent and chief of K-12 school operations for the San Francisco Unified School District (SFUSD).

-----

SCHOOLS CHIEF'S CANDOR A WELCOME CHANGE IN ANTIOCH DISTRICT, February 27, 2010, Oakland Tribune

…Gill's style is in stark contrast from that of his predecessor, many in the district say. The tenure of Deborah Sims was beset by controversy. It included a vote of no confidence by district teachers in fall 2008, the district's handling of a teacher suspected of accessing child pornography at school last spring, and her sudden resignation announcement in May…

And NJ education chief Chris Cerf:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/02/acting_nj_education_chief_cerf.html

A controversial consultant’s report recommending that some of Newark’s worst public schools be replaced with charter schools was funded by a $500,000 grant from a California educational foundation at the behest of Mayor Cory Booker.

The revelation came in an interview with officials at the foundation late Wednesday. It followed two days in which the mayor declined to provide details about the report: who funded it or the amount spent on it.

Contacted by the Star-Ledger, the spokeswoman for the Broad Foundation in Los Angeles readily acknowledged it put up the money that was used to retain Global Education Advisors to conduct an audit of the city’s schools. The spokeswoman said she wondered why the grant was kept secret.

The consulting firm, incorporated by Christopher D. Cerf before he was named the state’s acting education commissioner, has itself become the focus of growing questions over its ties to the commissioner and the mysterious way it was selected.

Jean Claude Brizard of Rochester, a no confidence vote.

http://thebroadreport.blogspot.com/2010/07/jean-claude-brizard-broad.html

An overwhelming number of Rochester teachers take a stand against their superintendent.

In a lopsided vote, some educators are telling Jean-Claude Brizard change your ways or change your job.

Nearly 82-percent of eligible teachers took part in today's vote. The ballot was simple: “Yes, I have confidence in Superintendent Brizard" or "No, I don’t.”

It took hours to sort through boxes of ballots. Here are the results: just 140 teachers said they do have confidence in Brizard, compared to the more than 2713 who said they don't. A vote like this has never happened in the history of the Rochester City School District…

[Smarmie Doofus]

4. She's right. It's not a"motto". It's a lie.

"According to Gist, “When we say we are going to make every decision in the best interest of students in Rhode Island, that’s not just a motto.”

[madfloridian]

9. Exactly right. They have another agenda.

I can't believe this is happening.

[badhair77]

5. thanks for all your work

your thoroughness is appreciated, madfloridian

[madfloridian]

7. I guess you can tell the attacks on teachers are making me angry.

I find myself just overwhelmed by the fact that teachers are being treated so shabbily with not a single leader standing up for them.

I appreciate the comments. :hi:

[madrchsod]

6. yes the unions have no political party to stand up for them.....

until they need our money and votes.

[madfloridian]

8. Very true..

[hack89]

58. Not in Rhode Island

The Democrats have built their political dominance on public service unions. Union officials are everywhere on political staffs and government agencies. At least one is an state legislator.

[liberation]

88. The major of Providence who did all the firings is a Democrat, BTW

[hack89]

108. Now do you appreciate the depth of the voter's disgust?

he was forced to betray his backers by the citizens of his city.

[liberation]

115. No, but I appreciate the level of hypocrisy

as per when someone claims that Dems are the party of "unions," while at the same time it is a Dem who is doing all the firings to undermine the teacher's union.

[proud2BlibKansan]

125. +1

[hack89]

128. The city has a two billion dollar unfunded pension and healthcare liability

his town is so broke it isn't even funny.

[olegramps]

151. Isn't that the truth.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

10. K & R

[madfloridian]

11. Providence mayor closes 4 schools and fires all the teachers?

The article is dated March 22, 2011.
This is so tragic.

http://www.examiner.com/k-12-in-providence/providence-mayor-closes-schools-and-fired-teachers

"Monday, March 14, 2011, the Providence Journal reported that the Mayor of Providence decided to close four elementary schools after he sent out termination letters on March 1 to all of its teachers hoping that it will off set its $180 million deficit for this year and for the next fiscal year. Mayor Tavares’ decision devastated the teachers and families of Providence to the point where they rallied at City Hall and organized many community meetings to voice their opposition to his action. Ernest Almonte, the former state auditorgeneral and a member of the Mayor’s newly appointed review panel, said pensions and retiree benefits, along with a lack of flexibility in union contracts, are to blame for the problems, as is the city's failure to act sooner.

As a result, Mayor Tavares attacked teachers by firing each and every one of them in order to absorb some of this deficit. Why just teacher jobs? If an individual were to go down to the administration building and walk through all four floors of offices, they would see many cubicles that could be eliminated or consolidated. This would trim up that deficit without disrupting the lives of teachers, children, and families. Providence Schools believes it is all about “learning and teaching” but is it really? This action says it is about dollars and cents.

"It's really all about eliminating seniority," said teacherMaureen Miranda. "When you terminate people, they can hire back whoever they please."

[madfloridian]

12. RI Labor Relations board issues complaint against Gist. Threats against employees.

http://www.projo.com/news/content/complaint_against_gist_03-15-11_3AN0IE7_v28.1af893b.html

"PROVIDENCE — The state Labor Relations Board has issued a complaint against Education Commissioner Deborah A. Gist for “creating an atmosphere of fear and intimidation” at the state Department of Education during the tumult in Central Falls last year. The board is holding a hearing at 9 a.m. Tuesday at its Cranston headquarters.

According to the complaint, Gist violated state labor laws when she sent an e-mail on Feb. 19, 2010, to all employees at the state Department of Education after she heard some were planning on attending a rally to support the teachers at Central Falls High School. The teachers were terminated Feb. 23.

In her e-mail, the commissioner stated that she would “not hesitate to take action against any employee of RIDE who purposefully works to thwart RIDE policy.”

Gist’s e-mail “interfered with, restrained and coerced members … in exercising their rights,” the complaint states. And her failure to clarify her e-mail to her employees after being asked to do so created “an atmosphere of fear and intimidation."

[Doctor_J]

172. Fear and intimidation - the Repuke mantra

Jeezus, I hope we fight back soon.

[trud]

13. Every taxpayer in RI who is not a teacher cheers Gist on.

We're the ones paying crippling property taxes so RI teachers can retire in their 40s with pensions of 80% of their last salary and nearly free health care.

The towns and cities are going broke trying to support this, but before they fail, the taxpayers employed in private industry or living on Social Security will be crushed by property taxes.

Hurray for Gist! More power to her.

And by the way, the reason the entire "school" (and it wasn't the school, it was every teacher in the town, please get your facts straight) was fired was that was the only way to avoid the seniority system which kept incompetent teachers in place and let competent ones go.

[madfloridian]

16. Well, come to Florida. Rick Scott is cutting taxes to the bone here.

Property taxes, corporate taxes.

Pretty soon, we won't be worried about all those pesky effing public school teachers here, cause there won't be any.

Don't tell me to get my facts straight. I have written much about this, and I source it well.

Your attitude is very typical since Obama became president and appointed Arne.

Who needs public schools anyway? Let Bill Gates take them over.

Right?

[madfloridian]

17. And a good bye to you.

Not going to waste precious time on people with contempt for school teachers.

[Chris_Texas]

28. I suspect that this is correct

[Dappleganger]

31. lol

I see the sockpuppets are hard at work.

[chervilant]

57. Shall we test that premise?

Look at a nation whose students score highest in math and science: Finland. Teachers in Finland are well paid, well educated, and supported by strong unions. The citizens of Finland have the deepest respect for their teachers.

We could have the same scenario here, but for the corporatists and their easily-manipulated water carriers.

You hail from Texas, a state which routinely performs poorly with regards to educating its citizens. Why am I not surprised?

[trud]

77. chervilant

Are you talking to me? I'm not from Texas. I'm from Rhode Island, so I know exactly where of I speak.

I suspect teachers in Finland are not making out like bandits compared to people working in the private sector, and possibly they are even turning out literate students, which teachers in Rhode Island certainly are not.

[chervilant]

82. Nope,

I was responding to the guy from Texas.

[chervilant]

98. However,

the majority of my comment applies to your post, so maybe it's just as well I clicked on it instead of the one I had intended.

BTW, teachers in Finland earn an enviable salary. Furthermore, they work shorter hours than teachers in the US. Teaching in Finland is a prestigious, profitable discipline--as it should be here. Sad that anyone in the US would snark that our teachers are 'making out like bandits,' while 'certainly...not' turning out literate students.

[LanternWaste]

118. It's conveneient to blame, difficult to analyze.

I've always found it odd that we blame students on the one hand for not learning... when it's convenient. And then we turn around and place the blame on the teacher... when it's convenient. (You should do better to validate your suspicions... I believe they quite are wrong re: Finnish teacher pay compared to those in the Finnish private markets...)

[chervilant]

35. hmph...

"EVERY" taxpayer?!?

Your entire post smacks of the anti-teacher meme promoted by the corporatists and the 'reformers' who plan to privatize public education and destroy unions. This IS most assuredly about money, but it's NOT the teachers' salaries that are causing 'crippling property taxes.'

There is not a 'seniority system' that keeps 'incompetent teachers in place' and lets 'competent ones' go. This is one of the most egregious examples of the corporatists' mendacity.

You owe madfloridian and the teachers in your state an apology, and you would better use your time and energy advocating for teachers and NOT the corporatists.

[hack89]

44. We owe madfloridian and the teachers nothing

we pay a lot of money for a crappy educational system. If the unions can't get it right then they need to move aside.

[theaocp]

48. You're unreal.

Go back to freeperville.

[hack89]

51. I send my kids to a RI public school every day

I want the system fixed. It is failing our kids.

[theaocp]

55. Then attack the real problems.

Start with poverty and social inequity. Otherwise, you're advocating against your own children. Good luck.

[madfloridian]

62. Turn it over to Bill Gates and Walmart. Right?

[hack89]

68. No - to the parents. We want a voice since we pay the bills. nt

[theaocp]

69. School board? n/t

[hack89]

71. Our school board supports Gist. That's why we voted for them. nt

[theaocp]

73. I wish you the best.

I hope your board is able to turn around the schools for your children's benefit. :hug:

[hack89]

75. We'll do fine. We are an educated, liberal town

we know how to solve problems.

[theaocp]

76. Keep me updated on your progress. n/t

[olegramps]

152. If you are an example, I am not impressed.

[hack89]

173. I am crushed. nt

[olegramps]

179. Right Wingers are easily crushed.

[hack89]

181. I like you - you make me laugh. nt

[bdamomma]

164. right on, the people need to be vocal on this issue.

proud to be ex pat RI'der!!

[Name removed]

101. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[teacher gal]

191. In my opinion, the best parent voice out there

is Parents Across America. Check them out if you haven't.

[chervilant]

64. Wow.

The 'crappy' system of public education you deride is a product of rampant poverty, limited funding, and partisan politics. Since the era of St. Ronnie ("Catsup is a vegetable"), corporatists have steadily assaulted public education--both to insure a steady supply of under-educated factory fodder and service industry workers, AND to privatize the system so that they can make even more money.

Of late, the corporatists have worked hard to manipulate public perception, so that they can convince the hoi polloi that 'bad teachers' and 'villainous unions' are the reasons our system of public education is among the worst on the planet. That you've swallowed their red herrings is not surprising; given the amount of time, money and energy they've devoted to promoting their agenda. However, you're doing your children a grave disservice.

If you ARE concerned about your children's education, you owe it to them to be informed. Please, be an advocate for public education by supporting our teachers and our children.

[hack89]

70. Cut the patronizing bullshit

hate to break it to you but there are other reasons beside ignorance that people disagree with you. I am not only informed I am involved. A week doesn't go by that either myself or my wife are at my kid's schools doing volunteer work. I spent two years as the chair of a school improvement team.

One reason teacher unions have lost the support of parents in RI is patronizing, insulting lectures like yours. The teachers are soon to discover that they are not the only ones smart enough to make education work in RI.

[chervilant]

85. Oh, my

I must have struck a nerve...

Until you've been a TEACHER, you have no frame of reference for the amount of hard work and dedication teachers devote to their students. If, as you say, you've been informed and involved in your kids' schools, then I cannot begin to understand why you bash teachers.

[hack89]

100. Failure takes a lot of hard work and effort too.

I don't bash teachers - I bash the union rules that hurt children.

[proud2BlibKansan]

127. Bullshit

Go back and read your own posts in this thread before you claim you don't bash teachers.

[kwassa]

145. and what union rules in your school district hurt children?

As a member of the school improvement committee, you must have some specifics about this.

What rules hurt children?

[hack89]

195. Their instance on strict seniority for one.

When the state teacher of the year gets layed off, there is a problem don't you think?

There is a constant yearly shuffle as teachers bump less senior teachers. Not only do teachers change schools, they change grades and subjects. So one year a teacher is teaching 4th grade and next year they are at the high school. The problems here are obvious:

1. The teachers never master the curriculum.
2. Elementary and high school require different teaching skills and temperament - constant moving places teachers in positions where they are effective.
3. All the new ideas and enthusiasm that comes with young teachers gets flushed away on a regular basis.

[liberation]

90. "The teachers are soon to discover that they are not the only ones smart enough to make education.."

Speaking of patronizing, insulting lectures...

[hack89]

97. When you are surrounded by failure

you are in no position to lecture anyone.

[Name removed]

114. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[olegramps]

153. I think you a pushing bull now to protect your unsupported stance.

[LanternWaste]

119. I imagine many people believe...

I imagine many people believe the educational system is crappy-- I imagine the majority of those making that assertion did quite poorly in school (however, I'm quite confident you are the exception to the rule...)

[hack89]

135. Good enough to get a masters degree.

my wife did the same. But then neither of us went to school in RI. We know from personal experience what great public education is like. We want RI to be like Washington State and Massachusetts.

[olegramps]

155. While you applaud yourself, you fail to acknowledge the real reason for your success.

If indeed you have achieved the level you claim, I will venture to say that it is primarily do to your parents support, encouragement and economics. I can only conclude that you have absolutely no empathy for the minority child that comes to school poorly dressed, underfeed and without motivation because the child is surrounded by poverty and all of it deleterious affects. AS I previously challenged you, I again ask you to provide any example of a failing school in a wealthy district.

[hack89]

166. You mean the schools in the cities that are broke

due to massive unfunded pension and retiree health care liabilities? The cities that don't have the flexibility to manage their budgets to the benefit of the students?

Rhode Island ranks 5th in the nation in per student spending. More to the point - wealthy districts spend less per student than urban districts because they are not eligible for Federal education funds.

I have plenty of empathy for that minority student - that's why the system that is failing them needs to be changed.

[madfloridian]

167. The cities are not "broke" because of education. Sending jobs overseas...

is more likely a cause.

It is poverty that is failing the students.

I must congratulate you. I really must. You have managed along with others to get two subthreads deleted because you angered people so much.

And you actually blame the schools for the poverty in this country????

[hack89]

169. Providence has a $2 billion dollar

unfunded public employee pension and retiree health care liability. Even when times were good they couldn't fund it adequately.

I am not responsibly for others irrational responses to what is happening in RI.

[Name removed]

178. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LanternWaste]

174. I imagine many people feel they themselves know who to blame

I imagine many people feel they themselves know who to blame, regardless of whether they know what the precise, relevant and objective problems are.

I also imagine many people believe personal experience is a fantastic foundation on which to lay a negative opinion of something.

[hack89]

175. Personal experience in school improvement is a great foundation

for understanding the problems facing schools. I chaired a school improvement team for two years - I have that experience. Do you?

[trud]

78. The only ones owing anyone an apology

are the teachers and other RI state employee hacks who owe apologies to the taxpayers and students.

In my town, 60% of the budget goes to the schools, and its been getting worse every year. They certainly are the primary source of the crippling property taxes.

[theaocp]

83. You're right!

Teachers should APOLOGIZE to the taxpayers! They're "hacks" and deserve all the scorn they get! Throw all of us out and let Rhee fill in the gaps!

You "people" amaze me. You get the society you deserve, I guess. I'm sure your children will thank you for all the opportunities you're leaving them. Cheers.

[joeglow3]

162. There are MULTIPLE issues

I agree with most of what you said, but the things you dismissed are also issues. A friend of mine is a school teachers in a suburbian Kansas City school district. He had worked there for 4 years and was even voted teacher of the year for the DISTRICT. That summer, layoffs came and his seniority (or, lack thereof) cost him his job. Fortunately, he found a job in another school district, but there is NO doubt in my mind that his former school district was worse off because their seniority system.

If we want to be honest about fixing a system that is failing out children, people need to be vulnerable and willing to discuss all things affecting education.

[liberation]

89. What about those crippling sales taxes in RI?

LOL, 5 paragraphs and not a single correct fact. Is that a record in this site or something?

[proud2BlibKansan]

126. Sounds like you should be thankful you don't live in Wisconsin

Teachers there make $160K a year.

Count your blessings.

[distilledvinegar]

146. 80%?? Where exactly did you find this info?

I can't find anything that backs up your claim that RI teachers can retire in their 40s with 80% of their last salary. Perhaps that was once the case, I don't know, but it is most definitely is false now. The absolute highest percentage for which a teacher can qualify is 75%. To get the 75%, a teacher must not retire until they are 75 years old, with at least 10 years of service credit. The percentage is calculated based on the highest five consecutive years salary.
According to this http://politicsblog.projo.com/2011/03/taxpayer-tab-up.html">Projo Politics Blog, "public employees here already pay among the highest contribution rates in the country."

The same blog states:

As a result of recent changes, state workers and teachers who could until just recently retire at any age -- and begin to collect a pension immediately -- after 28 years of work must now wait until age 62. Their maximum pension has been reduced from 80 percent to 75 percent of their average pay, nearing retirement. The annual COLAs paid new retirees were limited just last year to their first $35,000 in pension benefits.

The numbers you quote certainly do sound ridiculous - unfortunately for you they are also false.

[Doctor_J]

15. I don't understand why every teacher in America isn't on strike

Bring the country to its knees.

[msanthrope]

18. Your OP contains a serious error--you claim, falsely, that the RI teachers 'had to assemble'

to hear their names called out.

That is untrue. They chose to go to a school board executive meeting in the evening, after a rally, and their names were part of a resolution passed.

No one forced them to go, or to assemble.

And frankly, they deserved to be fired for refusing to accept a reasonable wage for their continuing education--their union was offered $30 an hour, and they demanded $90 an hour for 'professional development.'

90 bucks an hour to improve their skills???? Nice work if you can get it.

"Gallo and the teachers initially agreed they wanted the transformation model, which would protect the teachers’ jobs.

But talks broke down when the two sides could not agree on what transformation entailed.

Gallo wanted teachers to agree to a set of six conditions she said were crucial to improving the school. Teachers would have to spend more time with students in and out of the classroom and commit to training sessions after school with other teachers.

But Gallo said she could pay teachers for only some of the extra duties. Union leaders said they wanted teachers to be paid for more of the additional work and at a higher pay rate — $90 per hour rather than the $30 per hour offered by Gallo."

http://www.projo.com/news/content/central_falls_trustees_vote_02-24-10_EOHI83C_v59.3c21342.html

[chervilant]

65. Gosh...

Yet again, you show up to denigrate those of us who continue to advocate for true reform of public education.

Why are you slavishly supporting the corporatists who are consistently attacking teachers' salaries and benefits? Can you present a cogent argument in support of this assault on teachers?

In nations where teaching is a respected discipline--where teachers are well paid, and enjoy the support of strong unions--students routinely score highest in math and science (and other core subjects). Do you think our nation incapable of a comparable system of public education?

[msanthrope]

160. I'm sorry, but demanding $90/hr to learn how to become an effective teacher isn't supporting reform.

It's screwing the taxpayers.

You and others keep citing Finland as an example of strong union/good educational output, but you fail to cite the key difference between Finnish teachers and American ones--they are better educated.

Finland demands the equivalent of a master's before you ever step foot in a classroom. It also mandates a heavy load of mentoring and professional development. And--and here's the kicker--Finnish teacher training programs are highly competetive, and tough to get into.

Further, the Finnish model relies on testing to 'track' students--only the smartest go to high school, the rest to vocational schools. You want that for American kids? Change the Equal Protection clause.

[chervilant]

182. Taxpayers

who target teachers and their unions as a primary cause of the economic distress now rampant throughout the US have been snarfing the corporatists' red herrings.

Virtually everyone in Finland is better educated than us, msanthrope. If the US demanded of its teachers at least one graduate degree, the salaries commensurate with teaching would have to reflect the increased costs of becoming a teacher. Now, isn't that the big rub for you and your ilk--we teachers 'cost' too much? (BTW, I put myself through graduate school, AND paid off all my school loans on time--something I could no longer do in today's economy.)

I've watched the steady and deliberate 'dumbing down' of US citizens. I've watched as corporatists have skillfully implemented Bernays' manipulative strategies to control what we believe. Clearly, some individuals who are products of these initiatives are up in arms about the 'ginormous salaries and benefits' paid to all of us 'selfish, greedy' teachers. I will support these pathetic people on the very day I and my fellow teachers get annual bonuses commensurate with those paid to the vile corporatists who actually put our global economy in the crapper.

[Starry Messenger]

19. Who the heck is going to want to become a teacher in this atmosphere?

It's going to become a service industry type job.

[madfloridian]

20. Yes, the fired teachers had to assemble. Per CNN last year.

I notice that there is even disrespect for the RI teachers in this thread.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/LIVING/08/27/rhode.island.teacher.fired/index.html?iref=obinsite

"In total, 93 members of the faculty at Central Falls High School were laid off. They gathered in the school auditorium and listened to the Executive Board call there names out, one by one. They wore red, the school color, as a sign of unity, but for the teachers it was a demoralizing moment."

"For Boss, the moment when she heard her name called is a memory that sticks with her, even as she moves forward. "The first time I've ever gotten my name called out in that auditorium was when I graduated from there. So, to have my name called out for doing something that was wrong," she said, "it was, like, surreal."

"The people that agreed that I needed to be fired have never been in my classroom, never spoken to me" Dearnley said. "As a matter of fact, my name was pronounced wrong."

"It was just so devastating to hear all these teachers that have been dedicated and I know and love and their names aren't even being pronounced right. It was devastating," Dearnley added."

[msanthrope]

56. No--they did NOT have to assemble. Read your own link!!!!

They went to a night time meeting of the School Board, after a rally. It was an open meeting.

[chervilant]

79. Puh-leeeeeeeeeze!

let's cut to the chase here, shall we?

First and foremost, the deliberately informed among us are well aware of the economics of this assault on teachers and unions, and who stands to benefit. However, the corporatists and their water carriers consider this particular aspect a 'verboten' topic. To whit: advocates for teachers--and for TRUE reform of public education--are quickly redirected away from this topic of 'who benefits' with the adjuration, "don't come across as a nutty conspiracy theorist!" Thus, we're having a difficult time helping others understand that the current assault on teachers and unions is conflated with exactly who profits from privatization.

Second, most of the REAL problems in public education stem from federal legislation (NCLB, now RTTT), and from the severe and worsening decrease in funding for our schools, libraries, head start programs, free meals, field trips, and ALL the measurable, tangible resources required to provide a quality education for our children. Of course, the corporatists (and their political lackeys--headed up by our current POTUS) don't want the hoi polloi to get a clue about this, so the well-paid media propagandists have identified and vilified the 'common enemy': those mean, selfish, lazy, narcissistic, BAD TEACHERS and EVIL UNIONS!

Third, almost half (42%) of all children in the United States live in low-income households, where their parent(s) earn just enough to cover basic expenses (current data from NCCP). Personally, I think this is an under-representation of the number of children who live in households defined as 'low-income,' given that less than 400 people in the US own and control better than 95% of our nation's wealth. Nevertheless, 'low-income household' is synonymous with precarious employment, frequent moves, poor nutrition, and a multitude of other threats to our childrens' well-being, not to mention their ability to LEARN.

In short, children of low-income households must contend with a host of social, behavioral and psychological issues, all of which impede a child's ability to learn. And, for children in poverty level households (about 21%), mere survival trumps education every time. These seldom mentioned facts are clearly antithetical to the corporatists' current assault on teachers and unions, so we activists are shouted down or diminished whenever we bring up poverty and its measurable impact on our children AND on public education.

How do we convey these CRITICAL facts, so that parents (and the DUers who are on the "BASH TEACHERS BANDWAGON") will rise up in support of teachers?!?! (BTW, are you equally active in denigrating the Wall Street Wankers who've cost us BILLIONS over the past two years?!?)

[madfloridian]

21. Obama and Duncan have accomplished something Bush did not.

Contempt for teachers. It shows in this thread, it shows all over the forum.

I never saw that to this extent, ever.

[border_town]

22. I live in a Mass, on the RI border

so all my news is based out of Providence, RI. I cannot believe the lack of emotion in RI over this issue. I want to feel bad for them, but if they are not willing to show their disgust with what is going on, what's the point of me getting worked up? Motivation has left the state of RI.

[madfloridian]

23. Perhaps they feel helpless to fight it.

When your president and education secretary won't stand up for you, when people are posting at Democratic forums about how the bad teachers get too much pay, and how they are tired of the taxes to pay them.....maybe it takes the fight away.

[border_town]

25. That's just it

they never attempted to fight. I went to a rally in providence shortly after they announced this and hardly any of the teachers showed up. I don't know what it is. People can't be bothered? I don't know. I think it is very sad. Thank God for the people of WI for giving this amazing energy to the rest of the country.

[madfloridian]

36. I do know that in our area teachers can be marked down for stuff like that.

If a principal doesn't like what a teacher says or does, it can go down against them on performance reviews.

This might be the case in RI..it sounds very punitive there right now.

[proud2BlibKansan]

141. They may have not felt safe enough to attend

We had a solidarity rally today. Over 100 people but very few teachers. As bad as they are being treated, they didn't show up. They just don't feel safe taking to the streets.

[WinkyDink]

24. This country deserves NOBODY studying to become a teacher.

Oh, the children? Let me know when their PARENTS take to the streets and state-houses.

[Chris_Texas]

27. Then don't. It is not some nobel crusade to slay ignorance, it is a job,

[Name removed]

34. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WinkyDink]

110. FYI: I TAUGHT for 30 years.

So do NOT lecture me.
Retired in 2002; Master's plus 18 credits. Salary at retirement: $63,000.

Are you envious yet?

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hestia]

39. I really do hope that you forgot the sarcasm emote because you are on the wrong board

if you really believe this. You are the problem with what is wrong with schools in this country, not the teachers unless of course you were homeschooled. Maybe that explains where all this hate on the teachers is coming from.

[madfloridian]

40. I attract them when I post about attacks on teachers.

It's becoming an organized thing.

[theaocp]

41. Maybe they should start a union?

Much love atcha, Mad'. :hi:

[TheManInTheMac]

67. I see what you did there.

:rofl:

[Marrah_G]

193. Mad- Thank you for all you do

My father was a teacher for 45 years. Watching all this just breaks his heart. We were never "rich" but we lived a comfortable middle class life. My father worked MANY hours off the clock. He taught night school and drivers ed so we could afford "extras". He is a brilliant manand frankly could have made alot of money in the private sector, but he loved teaching and he was very good at it. It shocks and saddens me to see members of DU who would rather take away workers rights instead of working to make sure everyone gets raised up.

I hope you know that the VAST majority of DU is behind you and all of our hard working educators.

[chervilant]

66. Ta-Ta.

My ignore list gets longer each and every day...

[hack89]

74. It is hard work to keep a beautiful mind beautiful, isn't it?

Do you understand now why your side is losing?

[chervilant]

81. Yes,

and, clearly, you don't. Your children have my DEEPEST sympathy.

[hack89]

84. They are doing just fine

Eldest just got accepted into the college of her choice - she's off to be a vet.

[theaocp]

86. Interesting

I'm curious: how does this happen in a failing public school system?

[liberation]

91. Due to exceptional genetics and individual characteristics of course.

Remember the libertarian mantra is that success is individual, failure collective. It makes it easier for them to be able to shovel personal responsibility down other people's throats while completely ignoring theirs.

[hack89]

92. Every year the choices are fewer and fewer

they are running on empty. My daughter is getting out just in time.

The real problem in RI are the urban schools - they are true disaster areas. Wealthier suburban schools have further to fall.

[theaocp]

96. Now we get to the meat of it.

It's not about the unions or teachers. It's really about the money and how it's appropriated.

[hack89]

104. Not really

Tiny RI has 38 separate school districts - we could save a ton of money with consolidation but the unions resist. Instead, they support local politicians in exchange for juicy contracts that the public can't afford. Newport, for example, provides lifetime family healthcare for retired teachers. Any reasonable person knew that the tax base couldn't support such money - property taxes have skyrocketed. Yet as the school budget goes up none of the money goes to the students - it goes to teacher benefits. So the people of Newport are paying outragous taxes so that less and less money can be spent on students. The teachers have benefits that the average person will never see yet refuse to accept any changes to their retirement plan. So people have had enough. You are right - there is plenty of money. It is just going to the wrong people.

[Name removed]

156. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[coalition_unwilling]

186. Note this poster's use of various right-wing 'code words' like

"urban schools". That's code for black and poor, all of which makes me think that hack89 is really a covert (or not so covert) racist, using public education as a facade behind which to vent his resentment at blacks and other minorities and the teachers who serve them.

Just a thought.

[hack89]

188. If I was a racist, I would support the status quo

by every measurable standard - graduation rates, drop out rates, literacy rates, test scores, etc inner city schools have been failing for decades. This is despite the fact that in RI they have the highest rate of spending per student.

If I was a racist, why would I want to interfere with such a unblemished record of failure? I can't see how the KKK could screw up education for minorities any more than it is.

[chervilant]

87. Really?!?!

Her teachers must not have had a THING to do with that, huh?!

[hack89]

95. Every year there is less and less spent on the students

no new books; filthy disgusting class rooms. We are running on empty and yet the unions refuse to budge an inch. Every cut is taken out on the students.

The teachers are excellent - we are talking about the unions.

[theaocp]

102. Take away the unions, then.

I'm sure you'll still have excellent teachers. :eyes: They can be hired and fired at the administration's whims. Hell, even Gates sez teachers' shelf-life is only three years. I guess then they can just become unemployed or something. All for the kidz!!!!1!

[hack89]

105. No - they just need to accept change

a single state teacher contract would be a good start. A 401 type retirement plan. Just bring their benefits in line with private business.

[olegramps]

157. You mean those 401 plans that just tanked when the economy went into the toilet.?

The 401 plans that corporations used to replace pensions plans because they allowed the companies the way-for-all to transfer retirement financing to the employee. These plans firstly offer generous matching funds that included caveats to allowed the company to reduce their contribution at will which they did when ever the CEO's compensation needed a boost. Of course you know that.

[hack89]

168. You mean those 401 plans that everyone else has? nt

[Name removed]

177. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Iris]

180. Sure. As long as you bring their salaries in line with private industry as well. n/t

[hack89]

192. Not a problem in RI - experienced teachers are well paid.

http://www.neari.org/Portals/0/Uploads/Documents/Public/Salaries2000-2009.pdf

[chervilant]

103. Sigh...

The current assault on teachers and unions is an accountability movement. Arne Duncan, Michelle Rhee, and the fat cat philanthropists who are driving a stake into the dying heart of public education want someone or something to BLAME for the 'failure' of the system, so they can destroy our unions, and justify privatization.

Time to STOP this assault on teachers and unions.

[hack89]

106. Time to stop the assault on the tax payer. nt

[chervilant]

112. Hopeless...

The Corporate Megalomaniacs are thrilled when the hoi polloi snarfs their red herrings...

I cannot comprehend why you think teachers and unions are to blame for your high taxes. I have to wonder if you have a comparable level of disdain for the bankers and other corporatists who've actually cost US taxpayers BILLIONS of dollars.

I've got to go teach college algebra now, and I probably won't return to this thread. I am deeply saddened that you, and so many other DUers, are denigrating teachers and unions. I will continue to oppose such attacks, just as I will continue to teach. Our children deserve our advocacy.

[hack89]

113. 95 percent of our school budget is funded by local property taxes

the school budget is 80% of the town budget. So yes - school contracts are to blame for my high taxes.

[liberation]

120. "The teachers are excellent - we are talking about the unions. "

So what is the problem with unions exactly, if said teachers are excellent?

I find it ironic you consider the teacher's attitude intolerable because they are not willing "budge an inch" and yet you refuse to pay more in taxes to finance the cost of education.

I do, however, understand where you are coming from, your kids being god's gift to the world and all. But believe it or not those in charge of educating them need to feed their families... and apparently the stores in Rhode Island do not take the fact of how awesome your children are as a possible payment method for life's basic necessities. Maybe you should lobby the state to pass a resolution to make teaching your children an execption so that maybe then you can take applications of people who are willing to pay you for the privilege of educating them? Win-win, no?

[hack89]

129. We are one of the heaviest taxed states in the nation

with no end in sight. It is not like we have a problem with paying taxes - but there are limits to what people can afford. I don't get 4 percent pay raises every year yet I shouldn't complain when my taxes go up 4 percent every year? We are not all rich like you.

[proud2BlibKansan]

130. But her teachers failed her

Riiiight.

[hack89]

131. No - they just took from her

she had to learn in squalid conditions with not enough school books. Teachers got their pay raises - programs got cut.

[rpannier]

117. Spoken like a true boat sinker nt

[liberation]

124. Ah yes, here comes the "I am not racist, I just don't want my daughter to date a...."

If only life was that simple as to have it all both ways: naming oneself a liberal for the positive connotations while not having to give any of those reactionary talking points you just wrote. Alas...

[liberal life]

29. This is really out of control

Raise your hand if your state is not being attacked by Nazis?



http://fucorporatemedia.com/

[russspeakeasy]

32. Where is President Obama on this attack on teachers and

other public employees. If he does not stand up for education,
what the hell will he stand up for?
More wars? Find your "comfortable shoes" yet, Mr.
President?

[theaocp]

33. Doesn't Obama send his girls to Sidwell Friends School?

Tuition for next year is over 30k/year. Must be nice. I wonder what their class sizes are?

[Hestia]

37. Why hasn't a personal property tax revolt not been discussed? It is how schools are funded

to a certain extent. Pay your taxes except for the school portion of your tax bill. Enough people do it, but might catch their attention. When you speak to you, hopefully as a group so you won't have to do this alone, explain how you are paying for a private corporation to educate your children on your public dime. If the privatization is the way to go, they can pay for that system by themselves. It's six months to PP tax payment. Get enough people and really show "them" what you can do. It's a meme that needs to get started. Go!

[hack89]

137. State is too fragmented

38 separate school districts. Where do you get that privatization nonsense? It is not what the fight is about. The issue is that the state is going bankrupt and the teachers refuse to help fix the problem.

[Name removed]

158. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hack89]

42. She is the best thing to happen to RI in a long time.

Education in RI is broken.

[theaocp]

45. I hear TFA's got some highly-qualified drones available. You interested? n/t

[hack89]

46. You sound like a product of RI public schools. nt

[theaocp]

49. See, in Michigan, I was taught

critical thinking skills. My PUBLIC schools were awesome and I learned enough to gain degrees from three universities. My teachers were unionized "thugs" who loved education and helped me succeed. You must have a vested interest in privatized education, as otherwise, you'd have closed your mouth long ago. :hi:

[hack89]

52. I send my kids to a RI public school every day

I want my kid's schools to be just like the ones you went to. Why do you want to deny my kid's that opportunity?

[theaocp]

60. It ain't me.

My teachers worked with and for a union. When I worked for a charter school, they were unabashedly proud of telling us how great it was to be able to hire and fire at their leisure. I just love having to worry about my livelihood on top of student success, parents non-withstanding. I cannot abide people bashing public school teachers. We cannot succeed without help from factions outside of our control, yet everyone expects us to. I will not be the whipping boy for those who live and die by personal projection of woe. All that, and I'll be taking on three new middle school periods next week. Let me know when you have something of substance to offer. It's back to my graduate work for me, then lesson planning. Or should I eat bon-bons? You be the judge.

[coalition_unwilling]

187. If you're so well educated with a Master's degree and what-not, how

come you keep mis-using apostrophes? The plural of 'kid' is 'kids' and not 'kid's' No apostrophe is required to form a plural noun.

[YvonneCa]

54. "I do not believe teachers would be subjected to these humiliations around the country if...

... there were a political party standing up for public education." Your words are excellent. As a teacher, I need my Democratic Party to do just that. :)

[madfloridian]

116. But they are not going to stand up for us.

They are going to give it all to the reformers.

I thought for a while they might start speaking up for us, but I don't think so anymore.

[YvonneCa]

143. I know...

...and I'm pretty sad about it.

[madfloridian]

63. Posting about public school teachers here is a dangerous thing.

The vitriol is getting worse every time.

:shrug:

[russspeakeasy]

80. This is not about the students..This is about money. Follow the

money..

[chervilant]

184. What do 'Executive Directors' make?

“You can only hope that there is an enlightened school committee and union that can come to terms with all of these regulations {the 'new' BEP}, and serve as a model.”

--Tim Duffy, executive director of the Rhode Island Association of School Committees.

This is corporatist-speak for 'bend over and grab your ankles.'

“I think they could lead to a lot of contentious negotiations and even litigation, even though they are supposed to do the opposite...”

This is Duffy acknowledging what will be the actual results of the new BEP.

What a vacuous, mendacious bunch of corporate shills!

[madfloridian]

93. I believe a lasting legacy of the Obama administration ..

will be the way public school teachers became scapegoats so suddenly. He is either unaware of it, or he condones it. I am not sure which.

This thread is an example of what I mean.

[Biker13]

94. madfloridian....

Have been made aware of what has happened in Idaho? I would provide links, but I'm on dial-up and The Idaho State Journal's web site in very video embedded. But long story short, they have eliminated tenure, begun merit pay, and they are issuing lap-tops to all 9th graders so they can take online courses, which will be required in order to graduate. To pay for all this, they are eliminating 770 teachers!

Of course, this had NOTHING to do with the fact that one of Gov. Otto's biggest contributers owns a large share of the company which develops these online courses! No, this is for the kids! After all, they estimate that eliminating 770 teachers will only increase class size by 25%, and that's not a problem, right? But no matter, they took away collective bargaining too, so no one is listening to the teachers...

Biker's Old Lady

[madfloridian]

99. Yes, I know. Same thing is happening in Florida right now.

It's terrible. I have several other states I am going to try to write about, but the attacks get so bad here I wonder if it is worth it.

[chervilant]

107. Well, madfloridian,

for a while there, I thought you were making significant headway helping DUers recognize the ongoing assault on teachers and unions. I am deeply saddened by the number of people on this site who get abusively defensive, and work so VERY hard to denigrate your efforts.

If it weren't for my students, I'd be leaving this discipline. I hope that when you doubt the merit of your efforts, madfloridian, you will think of what your efforts mean for our children. They-- WE --really, really, really, really need you.

(edited for punctuation)

[theaocp]

109. I'd like to add something to this

but I can't. Madfloridian, your efforts are both timeless and epic. Please keep doing what you're doing. We need it. We need it.

[YvonneCa]

140. Are they for real? Did anyone here see...

...Keith Olbermann speak about generating fake posters? (I think he called them 'managed persona' programs).


http://foknewschannel.com/video/cornell-speech-part-3-questions-and-answers/ 10:16 into the Q and A

[madfloridian]

144. When one topic which Democrats should support is targeted....

then I expect there is some of that going on.

I miss Keith on MSNBC.

[YvonneCa]

163. Do you get Current TV? He'll be on...

...soon. :)

[madfloridian]

165. Yes. we do get Current.

But I miss him in MSNBC Hd

[Biker13]

111. Don't Give Up madfloridian!

I'll respond more to your posts to give you encouragement! I'm sorry I haven't in the past, but I'll change that now.

I believe you have much more support here than you know, and people must be made aware of what's happening to our teachers.

Thank you for all your hard work.

Biker's Old Lady

[YvonneCa]

138. Been saying that for a while...

...not listening because they can't afford to pay teachers anymore.

[Doctor_J]

147. Hate radio has taken over even the blue states

must be destroyed, or we're finished as a country

[Doctor_J]

148. the privatizers and corporatists want the US education system to be like the health care

Most expensive and least effective in the world.

[Harmony Blue]

159. Blunt...

but to the point. They want education to be separate tiers you have to pay into. A learning environment should be a leveled playing field regardless of socio-economic background. I made many friends in public school who had parents who were wealthy, but also poor. Such relationships last, and allow also understanding between different segements of society. When the rich kids are only around rich kids, they simply are shaped by the environment they are around, and never see the true world around them. As a result, as adults they have a hard time sympathizing for the plight of Americans lower on the economic ladder.

Worst of all with education being taken over by tiers you have to pay into, is that, test scores can be quantified to show the results for the parents investment. But test scores don't offer much room for critical thinking which is paramount at the collegiate level. Vast majority of tests at the collegiate level require critical thinking, and isn't merely plug and play.

[inna]

161. Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours

Another great post, thank you for this!

[Name removed]

170. Deleted message

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[Michigan-Arizona]

176. K& R

Thanks madfloridian once again for all the hard work you do & please never, never give up!

[Name removed]

183. Deleted sub-thread

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[Snoutport]

189. There is no state blue enough to be safe from these people!

:0(

[hack89]

197. Who? Those evil taxpayers? nt