18 years (and counting) of "compromise", and here we are

[MannyGoldstein]

Discretionary federal spending is already at a 50-year low, and it's being slashed even more, but in a responsible, serious, adult way: always enough money for wars, and for tax cuts for the wealthiest.

Is America better off?
Are we at peace?
Is the economy thriving?
Is the middle class vibrant?

18 years of craven triangulation, and here we are: "It's us or Sarah Palin, chumps!"

[sfwriter]

1. "It's us or Sarah Palin, chumps!"

Indeed...

[Logical]

2. The GOP is winning the battle I think. I just hope Obama wins or we are done! n-t

[SidDithers]

3. But you actually would have preferred McCain and Palin to Obama...

You indicated that a couple of weeks ago.

"It's us or Sarah Palin, chumps!" is pretty funny coming from you.

Sid

[leftstreet]

4. God no! We'd be at war and have mandated insurance payments n/t

[SidDithers]

5. But no Elena Kagen or Sonia Sotomayor...nt

Sid

[leftstreet]

6. Who?

[Art_from_Ark]

12. The newest Supreme Court justices

appointed by Obama

[Forkboy]

7. Ok, so that discounts Manny in your eyes.

What about the rest of us who are disappointed? I certainly don't prefer McCain or Palin over Obama, but I'm not going to get on my knees and chug cock either. Do you have a middle ground between these two options, or are you just taking the chance to land a blow on Manny?

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

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[Forkboy]

9. I find it funny that your displeasure seems to be related to personalities instead of issues.

And you don't have to sign your posts...I know who you are.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

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[dionysus]

32. "but I'm not going to get on my knees and ..."

well played.

:rofl:

[MannyGoldstein]

11. I said that if McCain had won we'd have a chance at putting a Democrat in office in 2012

Now it will be at least another 6-10 years before we have a Democrat in the White House.

Who ever heard of a Democrat appointing a commission to slash Social Security by $50,000 per recipient in lifetime benefits? Or cutting heating assistance during a depression? Or "extraordinary" rendition, warrantless wiretapping, or War! War! War!?

Sounds like you think Obama's far-right policies are cool, but many of us don't.

[COLGATE4]

13. K&R. It's good to hear someone make sense of this.

[JoePhilly]

14. Sure you would.

You had 8 years of Clinton, followed by 8 years of Bush and you couldn't build a serious candidate that you would have liked.

How exactly were you going to create one in just 4 years under McCain. Pure fantasy.

What you could do, is get busy creating one for 2016, or 2020.

[MannyGoldstein]

18. Obama and his third-way posse have stashed Democrats far under the bus

"Where have you gone, Dr. Howard Dean, a Party turns its tired eyes to you... woo woo woo..."

[SidDithers]

20. Yeah, sure...

Whatever your reasons, you still would have liked the 2008 election to have gone the other way, which is crazy.

Sid

[MannyGoldstein]

22. A commission to slash Social Security benefits by 22%

http://fdrdemocrats.org/the-common-sense-guide-to-social-security/6/

Gotta admit, not even Dim Son had the balls to pull that.

And Obama's leading the way, cheering it on with lie after lie:

http://fdrdemocrats.org/the-common-sense-guide-to-social-security/5/

[SidDithers]

24. Is that the SS cut Obama put through as part of the tax cut extension?...

Oh wait, he didn't do that.

Maybe it's the one he announced in the State of the Union. Oh wait, he didn't do that.
Maybe it's the one he announced in his budget proposal? Oh wait, not in there either.

Where, exactly, is this phantom bill to slash SS by 25% that been introduced in Congress?


Given that you'd have preferred McCain and Palin in 2008, I don't put a whole lot of faith in whatever analysis you bring to the table.

Sid

Edit: typo

[MannyGoldstein]

25. You deny that he designed a commission to recommend slashing Social Security?

Or that the commission approved 22% in cuts for the average recipient?

Or that in the SOTU, Obama referred to not "cutting" Social Security for current recipients but not "slashing" it for future recipients?

Really? You deny these?

[SidDithers]

26. I deny that it's gone any further than words...

there's no proposal in committee, there's no bill before Congress, there's no bill for Obama to sign.

The commission didn't even produce a final report.

Sid

[MannyGoldstein]

27. The committee produced and voted for a final proposal

And Obama implied that cuts were coming in the SOTU. We know how this plays out.

[SidDithers]

28. You apparently think you know how it plays out...

but, as we've seen from your newly discovered preference of McCain / Palin over Obama, your judgement is suspect at best.

Sid

[MannyGoldstein]

29. Now we're getting somewhere

Seems like we both agree that:

1. Obama created a commission to recommend deep cuts in Social Security
2. The commission voted to recommend deep cuts in Social Security - 22% for the average recipient, more than $50,000 in lifetime benefits
3. Obama signaled his willingness to cut Social Security for future retirees.

Did you also know that Obama keeps parroting the fringe-right lie that FDR did not start Social Security for retirees?

In any case, given the above: why would Obama do these things other than to help him slash Social Security? Nothing else makes sense to me, but perhaps you have a good hypothesis.

[SidDithers]

30. I don't agree with anything you post...

1. Obama created a commission. You're the one ascribing a motive to his action.
2. The commission couldn't agree on a final report, so they didn't officially recommend anything.
3. Whatever imagined willingness you see isn't backed up by a bill in Congress. Without that bill, there is no SS cut.

What was McCain / Palin's plan for SS?

Sid

[MannyGoldstein]

31. Why put Simpson and Bowles in charge of a commision?

The two single most accomplished Social Security attackers in their respective parties - Bowles even cut a deal with Gingrich to cut Social Security under Clinton, but Congress refused to go along.

One of us is delusional, and it's clear we won't agree.

[Armstead]

15. It is frustrating that the Democrats are complicit in the national move to the right

[Chorophyll]

16. Succinct, well-said, and utterly depressing.

The thing about "compromise" is that *both* sides are supposed to do it.

We have to take back our party. I don't know how we can do it against that onslaught of corporate money, but dammit, we have to.

[treestar]

17. 18 years of fired up right wingers

and lackadaisical liberals.

We just don't have their energy. We apparently don't believe in our positions as much as they believe in theirs.

We complain rather than get out there and do things.

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

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[SidDithers]

21. Welcome to DU...

:rofl:

Sid

[MannyGoldstein]

23. Actually, Obama is leading the way in making cuts possible

Here's a piece that I wrote:

http://fdrdemocrats.org/the-common-sense-guide-to-social-security/6/