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BanzaiBonnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:26 AM
Original message
Ben Stein is a liar
On Sunday Morning he just said, "The Federal Reserve, which is part of the government... " and then he said some other crapola. But my mind shut down at that point. Ben Stein is a liar and I've heard enough nonsense from him over the years to be pretty sure he's also another Ayn Rand fan.


Since WHEN is the Fedral Reserve part of the government. It is a privately held, for profit, institution.

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but that's my understanding.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
1. You are correct
But of course the Ben Stein fans will disagree.
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. I like Ben Stein the celebrity, but I don't like his politics.
I watched "Ben Stein's Money" religiously (the birthplace for Jimmy Kimmel's career), and I have enjoyed his various acting careers.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #1
10. I'm no fan of Ben Stein, but...
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. The first sentence of your link:
"Yes, the Federal Reserve banks are privately owned, but they are controlled by the publically-appointed Board of Governors. "
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Exactly...
keywords being: controlled by the publicly appointed Board of Governors. Does that sound like "ownership" to you? The member banks are required to buy subscription stock which confers virtually none of the benefits of ownership as one would normally regard it.

Next time, read more deeply before exercising your confirmation bias.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #16
40. "privately owned"
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #40
43. I have explained this repeatedly...
You choose to ignore it. There is a difference between the Federal Reserve, which is an agency of the U.S. Government and the regional banks, which are "owned" by the member banks, but are controlled by the Fed's board of governors.

I'm not explaining this again.
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daggahead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
2. Just remember ...
It is part of the government when it is being used to criticize a Democratic President.
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
3. It is neither part of the government nor is it separate from the government.
It is our chartered central bank. Not exactly part of the government, not a privately held for profit institution either. The Fed's Board of Governors is appointed by the president.

Stein is a liar and an idiot, but not completely wrong on this topic.
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
4. Actually, it is a part of the US Government, but it acts independently.
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 10:31 AM by Buzz Clik
They don't have to have their actions approved by the president or Congress, although the Federal Reserve Board must give reports to Congress and the members are presidential appointees.
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Correctamundo. And members go through a senate confirmation process. nt
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #6
15. But every governor is only nominated by the members.
It's a crooked game when all the players on the field are also on the same team.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Huh?
The governors are nominated by the President, not the members.
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. You are wrong. Ben Stein's dad was G. Ford's top economic adviser.
He knows that kind of stuff.
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MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. So he comes by his lying 'honestly'?
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 10:38 AM by MinM
:eyes:
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
23. He's correct on the Federal Reserve and his father was progressive by today's standards. nt
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MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. Right. Speaking more to the intellectual dishonesty displayed in "Expelled"

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=ben-steins-expelled-review-john-rennie

More specifically an argument Ben Stein made equating the struggle of Southern Religious leaders of today, i.e., Terry Jones, to that of Martin Luther King, Jr. This was also during one of his commentaries for CBS Sunday Morning. Of course he conveniently leaves out the part that those same Southern White Christian Fundamentalists were violently opposed to Dr. King.
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #29
50. We're talking about the structure of the Federal Reserve, and he is correct. nt
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MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #50
56. I'm going by the title of the thread - "Ben Stein is a Liar" - which is correct.
I couldn't care less about the Fed for the purpose of this debate. Ben Stein is a lying sack of shit. That's the title of the thread and that's the point that should not be lost.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #23
48. he's an ass
'If there is such a thing as karma, if there is such a thing as justice in this life or the next, Mark Felt has bought himself the worst future of any man on this earth. And Bob Woodward is right behind him, with Ben Bradlee bringing up the rear. Out of their smug arrogance and contempt, they hatched the worst nightmare imaginable: genocide.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Stein
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. I didn't say he was not an ass. I said he was correct on the Federal Reserve. nt
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Mrs. Ted Nancy Donating Member (303 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #48
67. and a bad financial advisor
He's just as bad as Jim Cramer

Financial advice prior to 2008 stock market crash

On March 18, 2007, in a column for CBS News' online version of CBS News Sunday Morning, Stein famously proclaimed in the beginning of the subprime mortgage crisis that the foreclosure problem would "blow over and the people who buy now, in due time, will be glad they did," the economy was "still very strong," and the "smart money" was "now trying to buy not sell as much distressed merchandise" in mortgages as possible.<25>

On August 18, 2007, on Fox News Channel's Cavuto on Business, Stein appeared with other financial experts dismissing worries of a coming credit crunch.<26> The lone dissenter was Peter Schiff, who predicted that the mortgage sector would create a crisis leading to massive recession, a view that produced laughter from the other experts. Stein strongly recommended investing in then-troubled financial institutions.<26>

Ben Stein: The credit crunch is way overblown. The are being given away; they're so unbelievably cheap...The subprime problem is a problem, but it's a tiny problem in the context of this economy...It's a buying opportunity, especially for the financials, maybe like I've never seen before in my entire life.
<...>

Peter Schiff: This is just getting started. It's not just subprimes. This is a problem for the entire mortgage industry. It's not just people with bad credit that committed to mortgages they couldn't afford. It's not just people with bad credit who are going to see their home equity vanish... This is going to be an enormous credit crunch...

Neil Cavuto: You must be a laugh-riot at parties.
(LAUGHTER)

<...>
Ben Stein: ...subprime is tiny. Subprime is a tiny, tiny blip.

Peter Schiff: It's not tiny. And again, it's not just subprime. It's the entire mortgage market.

Ben Stein: You're simply wrong about that... Defaults for the whole mortgage market are tiny.
<...>
Ben Stein: I think stocks will be a heck of a lot higher a year from now than they are now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Stein
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
8. The Federal Reserve is...
an independent federal agency and it really isn't "owned" by anyone. The member banks are required to purchase subscription stock, which confers almost nothing in the way of "ownership" as it is commonly understood.

http://www.oswego.edu/~edunne/fedmyths.html

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/Federal_Reserve.html

It should be noted that virtually all the conspiracy theories about the Federal Reserve are RW in nature.

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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #8
38. ^^^ That is correct.
And to elaborate: the reason that the Fed is created as an independent agency is so that political concerns don't interfere with good long-term policy. In countries where the central bank answers to the government directly, you get things like vastly increasing the money supply in the run-up to elections in order to jolt the economy into action.
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #8
73. Correct, I never understood people complaining about the reserve charging interest.
Money would have no value if it did not have interest.
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CanSocDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
11. If I'm not mistaken...


...Ben Stein is Canadian. Moved to Hollywood in the 60's to work as a TV writer. Drank the kool-aid. Wrote a book about an exotic cat he owned. Lost all credibility....

.
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Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Born in Wash DC
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 10:54 AM by Buzz Clik
But you can have him.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. In addition to his movie
Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed.

This movie actually promotes ignorance.
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Fuddnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #22
55. The sequel just came out. "Atlas Shrugged. Pt1".
Promotes ignorance and greed.
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GKirk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
12. Now does Ben get to call you
a liar for your statement? :)
"Since WHEN is the Fedral Reserve part of the government. It is a privately held, for profit, institution."

A quick Wiki check produces:

>>> The Federal Reserve System's structure is composed of the presidentially appointed Board of Governors (or Federal Reserve Board)

>>> the Federal Reserve is independent within government in that "its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government." However, its authority is derived from the U.S. Congress and is subject to congressional oversight.

>>> Thus the Federal Reserve has both private and public aspects

Or maybe you're both incorrect.

And this is something interesting I didn't know:

>>>The U.S. Government receives all of the system's annual profits, after a statutory dividend of 6% on member banks' capital investment is paid, and an account surplus is maintained. In 2010, the Federal Reserve made a profit of $82 billion and transferred $79 billion to the U.S. Treasury
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Keith Bee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
17. Fish are wet
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
19. Ben Stein, erstwhile Nixon economist, is a LIAR?! I'm shocked!
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. He didn't lie...
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 11:49 AM by SDuderstadt
he also was not an "erstwhile Nixon economist". You've got him mixed up with his father, Herbert Stein.
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. I can't believe how doggedly ignorant people here are about facts.
And Herbert Stein would be considered a progressive today.

He said that the wealth gap was THE biggest economic problem of the '80s and '90s.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. DU's...
shoot-first, ask-questions-later brigade is a hoot.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #25
75. Excuse me; I goofed. See CORRECTION below.
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 10:01 PM by WinkyDink
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #25
76. Amazing how ignorant some can be about staying on topic.
Which is: Ben Stein and prevaricating.
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Fuddnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #20
57. I think at that time, Benji was one of Nixswine's speechwriters.
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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #20
69. He was a GOP speechwriter and he is a liar.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
74. Right; he was worse: "In 1973 and 1974, he was a speech writer and lawyer for Richard Nixon at The
The White House...."
http://www.benstein.com/bio.html

Like I said, SHOCKED.
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Schema Thing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
21. Odd, because most Rand fans don't openly call for higher taxes on the wealthy


And just this morning, on DU, I read where Stein had called for a return to Bill Clinton era economic policies and derided "voo-doo" economics.
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
24. Technically it has the same relationship to the US Gov. as, say, NASA or the NSF.
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customerserviceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 01:29 PM
Response to Original message
27. It's in that 'gray' area
Like the Postal Service or Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac. It has aspects of both a private business, and of a government agency. I can see people calling it one thing or the other, it's all a matter of what attributes you look at.

But in the case of the Postal Service, we have private delivery services that compete on a limited basis, and with Fannie/Freddie, we have independent banking organizations that fund home loans. Does any other entity operate in any sort of competitive business in the same things the Federal Reserve has reserved to it? That makes it look more like a part of the government, to me.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
28. if its part of the US govt
then I suggest we stop paying the interest of the debt we owe them NOW. At least lest pay off the SS trust fund 1st before putting anymore money into that hell hole.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. More Federal Reserve myth...
The Federal Reserve is required by federal law to remit all of its revenues minus operating costs, reserve provisions and dividends (6% of capital invested in subscription stock) to the U.S. Treasury. In 2010, the Fed made a profit of $82B and rebated $79B to the U.S. Treasury.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. So are you saying that it is a myth that the US
owes money to the Federal reserve?
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. No
Duh.

However, did you skip over the part about the Federal Reserve being required by Federal law to rebate all but a very small portion of its profits back to the U.S. Treasury? Hint: the Federal Reserve pays us all that interest back.

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/flaherty8.html
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. I am not exactly sure what it means
especially since about 45% of the US national debt is owed to the Federal reserve. Does it mean that when we pay it off, they can only keep a small portion of the money collected and return the rest to the treasury?
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MrMickeysMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
30. No kidding? What a joke Ben Stein is...
Anyone think this guy did anything other than.... Buhler?

Anybody???
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
34. You're both wrong.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. Stein is correct...
the Federal Reserve is an independent federal agency.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. It isn't part of the government, it's autonomous.
I would say that it is born of the government, and that it is associated, but not that it's part. This is not like the DOD.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. We slightly disagree...
It is an independent federal agency much like the USPS. Among other things, independent federal agencies do not report to a cabinet secretary. The Federal Reserve is part of the U.S. government.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. I say if they
make their own budget independent of the US budget, they are nothing like USPS
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. Take a civics or...
macroeconomics class.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. Nice
You are still avoiding my question. In one post you act as if the majority of the profit (our debt payment included) is passed back to the federal reserve. So my question again is, how much of the principal/interest owed to them would be returned back to the US treasury after we have paid it off?

Also what kind of govt agency doesn't combined its books with the US treasury? we are running a deficit and they are running a surplus. What gives?
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #49
54. Dude...
Do you understand what principal is?

If I loan you $1000 and you pay me back, did I just profit by $1000? Perhaps an accounting class might help.

And, for the last fucking time, the Federal Reserve rebates ALL of its profits after operating expenses and reserves back to the U.S. Treasury. In 2010, they rebated $79B out of $82B.

I'm not explaining this further.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #54
58. Dude
The federal reserve prints money out of thin air, they can print $100 or $1000 notes for 10c. So do u really think a sector of the govt should be charging the US govt and its citizens $100/ $1000 plus interest, plus whatever portion they keep to themselves for lending us $100 /$1000? If you ask me, in this case theres no difference between the principal and the profit. And if you calc the profit correctly, most of the $100 or $1000 originally lent to US govt is profit since its cost a tiny fraction of cents in labor and material to produce it.

So how much of the true profit are they really returning back to us? I bet you cannot answer it because its answer reveals the true owners of the FED and that is the people collecting the so called principal
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #58
59. Dude...
you are like a walking anti-Fed misinformation site. I'm not going to keep going over these basics with you.

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/flaherty7.html
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #59
60. I understand how the scheme works
Its just that I was trying to point out to you how the fed screws the little guy. Yes the trillions we owe the fed comes from the principal they printed out of nothing and some reason is not counted as profits. Why the treasury cannot print this notes themselves is beyond me
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #60
61. Take a civics and/or...
a macroeconomics class, dude.
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. The last resort of a cornered man
I just dont think its fair for a bunch of bankers (read: true owners) to be charging the country for the face value of the notes they print. I am very proud if that makes me anti fed, someone has to argue for the little guy left paying the feds bill
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #62
64. Dude...
Do you realize that the anti-Fed nonsense you are spreading is RW?
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #64
65. tell that to Bernie
he is so right wing, his head is popping out of the left wing. Btw just because the RW supports an idea doesn't automatically mean I should discard it. Maybe if you can tell me why its ok for private bankers to charge the US govt and its citizens $1000 plus interest to print a $1000 note instead trying to play the guilt by association game, maybe just maybe I will come around to your pro fed stance.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. They don't...
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 05:52 PM by SDuderstadt
I have tried to explain this to you repeatedly. With all due respect, this is over your head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_creation
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #66
68. I have read most of the article posted in the link
And I have 2 simple questions for u

1: Who gets to keep the trillions of dollars owed to the federal reserve?
Yes they sometimes contract the money supply but who takes the whatever is left (so called principal)?

2: Also since the Federal reserve is part of the US govt, can we default on our payment to them?
i.e combined balance sheets and make the debt go away just like we balanced the budget partly with SS surplus in 1999
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #68
70. Dude...
since you don't remotely understand the concept of central banking, this is a rather pointless "debate".

Do you understand what reserves are?
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. Dupe
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 05:29 PM by Dokkie
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
36. The federal reserve board of governors is appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate
And while the Federal Reserve does often make profits, these profits are returned to the US Treasury at the end of the year.

Ben Stein is still a lying asshat, though...
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Dokkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. so mos of the almost $4 trillion (2007)
we owe the federal reserve would be returned to us once we pay off out debt to them? I would like to know cos that would seriously cut into out debt if we can just wipe out trillions in one fell swoop.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #42
46. Study the difference between...
principal and interest and you'll have your answer.
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Blue-Jay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 03:11 PM
Response to Original message
45. Duh. Of course he's a big fat fuckin' liar.
This is not news.
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P. Galore Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #45
53. He is correct in this case. nt
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ddeclue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
52. Sun rises in East..sets in West... film at 11..
Oh wait.. I thought we were having a state the obvious contest..

:rofl:
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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
71. Nixon's former speechwriter? A liar!?!
Edited on Sun Apr-17-11 08:57 PM by Recursion
How can this be?

Decent comic actor (that straight man schtick isn't as easy to do as it looks), but certainly not an honest person.
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deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-17-11 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
72. You can say it isn't part of the government but:
According to the Board of Governors, the Federal Reserve is independent within government in that "its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government." However, its authority is derived from the U.S. Congress and is subject to congressional oversight. Additionally, the members of the Board of Governors, including its chairman and vice-chairman, are chosen by the President and confirmed by Congress. The government also exercises some control over the Federal Reserve by appointing and setting the salaries of the system's highest-level employees. Thus the Federal Reserve has both private and public aspects.<12><13><14><15> The U.S. Government receives all of the system's annual profits, after a statutory dividend of 6% on member banks' capital investment is paid, and an account surplus is maintained. In 2010, the Federal Reserve made a profit of $82 billion and transferred $79 billion to the U.S. Treasury.<16>

It pretty much is.
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Search4Justice Donating Member (104 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-18-11 09:00 AM
Response to Original message
77. Stein is just another..
... selfish, greedy. egotistical crapball.

meh.
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